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Bandai DX Chogokin 1/48 VF-1


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9 hours ago, sqidd said:

Just slightly below eBay pricing. Man, the Roy's are shelf warmers. Who would have thought?

 

18 minutes ago, Slave IV said:

I really doubt this is a case of not as many people buying Roys though. I think it might be a perfect example of how small the real Macross collecting community is. People always complain about how hard it is to get preorders and it's true but I don't think the easy answer many people express of "make more" works. I'm willing to bet Bandai does look at sales numbers and makes adjustments based on projected sales and they probably did produce more Roys than they did for some others. It's just such a small community that even if they made a relatively small amount more for the production world, like let's say 1000 more units than usual, that makes a huge difference in how long stock lingers and all the people who collect Macross and want the figure to end up getting it. When you calculate the extra amount of profit the small numbers generate for Bandai, I think it is easy to see why they will usually tend towards producing less. It's much easier and more profitable for them to free up factory resources for things that sell in greater numbers with higher profit margins.

 

Yeah.

I don't think "shelf warmer" can be applied to the DX Roy at all.

Shelf-Warmer usually indicates item is still readily available in regular import shops like Ami or HobbySearch or HLJ as "new".

DX-Roy just ain't available as "new" from the regular import shops right now, so it ain't actually shelf-warming per se.

As far as we know, it seems only the secondary-market have some sort of DX-Roy glut.  

 

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10 hours ago, sqidd said:

Just slightly below eBay pricing. Man, the Roy's are shelf warmers. Who would have thought?

above msrp is not shelf warming.   :ph34r:   

Also if you recall the VF-1A TV max.   That was around MSRP for a long while before jump over 30000 yen.

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Pretty much as the last two posts pointed out. I think the numbers are so low for Macross that any excess produced will lead to a period where either retailers have stock sitting around (Arcadia) or resellers not being able to move at higher prices. Once that initial stock dries up, Macross items become rare due to the low numbers to begin with so anyone who missed out is looking at prices inflating significantly. This market is too niche for anyone to expect companies to just "make more" whenever they fail to secure a preorder.

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1 hour ago, F360 said:

above msrp is not shelf warming.   :ph34r:   

Also if you recall the VF-1A TV max.   That was around MSRP for a long while before jump over 30000 yen.

I do think that Roy will join the 30K Club this year. Probably a similar timeline to when it happened for the 1A Max. 

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1 hour ago, Lolicon said:

Bandai creates artificial scarcity to increase demand. It's nothing new.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_scarcity

Well, considering all our toys are artificial, their abundance or scarcity is also always artificial. The point is, there is no reason for Bandai to make more than they are in the current market unless the reason is so collectors can get the items easier at the expense of Bandai losing profits from other products they could be making more money off of. Somehow, I don’t think many successful companies would go that route to please a minute fraction of their customers. 

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Ya know we have this same conversation over and over. I love it. We’re such nerds.

It would be interesting to actually see production numbers, revenue and profit on this line and then compare it to the profitability of let’s say Gundam. If I were a product manager for the Macross line or even product marketing, I would be interested in trying to pull sales by region from my resellers to project the opportunity size outside of Japan.

Edited by DYRL VF-1S
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14 hours ago, Slave IV said:

I really doubt this is a case of not as many people buying Roys though. I think it might be a perfect example of how small the real Macross collecting community is. People always complain about how hard it is to get preorders and it's true but I don't think the easy answer many people express of "make more" works. I'm willing to bet Bandai does look at sales numbers and makes adjustments based on projected sales and they probably did produce more Roys than they did for some others. It's just such a small community that even if they made a relatively small amount more for the production world, like let's say 1000 more units than usual, that makes a huge difference in how long stock lingers and all the people who collect Macross and want the figure to end up getting it. When you calculate the extra amount of profit the small numbers generate for Bandai, I think it is easy to see why they will usually tend towards producing less. It's much easier and more profitable for them to free up factory resources for things that sell in greater numbers with higher profit margins.

I suppose the tell tale will be the GBP release. Will they be the normal hard to find at reasonable pricing? Or will they be available for 6+mo like the Roy's are?

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12 hours ago, Slave IV said:

Well, considering all our toys are artificial, their abundance or scarcity is also always artificial. The point is, there is no reason for Bandai to make more than they are in the current market unless the reason is so collectors can get the items easier at the expense of Bandai losing profits from other products they could be making more money off of. Somehow, I don’t think many successful companies would go that route to please a minute fraction of their customers. 

Not quite.

Bandai seems the only toy-company that regularly uses strict artificial scarcity on almost all their popular lines (Metal Builds, SOCs, SHFs, etc.) and licenses (Gundam, Mazinger, EVA, Macross, etc, etc).

Especially when  a particular item(s) is/are in heavy demand.

On the flip-side, they'll almost always totally glut their market with several Mazinger variations...

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, treatment said:

Not quite.

Bandai seems the only toy-company that regularly uses strict artificial scarcity on almost all their popular lines (Metal Builds, SOCs, SHFs, etc.) and licenses (Gundam, Mazinger, EVA, Macross, etc, etc).

Especially when  a particular item(s) is/are in heavy demand.

On the flip-side, they'll almost always totally glut their market with several Mazinger variations...

 

Bandai is the second largest toy manufacturer with $6.5B in sales (1st is Lego). It's hard to argue that they don't have it figured out. Or that us Plebs know how to do it better.:D

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43 minutes ago, sqidd said:

Bandai is the second largest toy manufacturer with $6.5B in sales (1st is Lego). It's hard to argue that they don't have it figured out. Or that us Plebs know how to do it better.:D

It's not outright sales they're worried about, it's profit margins.  They purposefully leave short-term money on the table by not supplying enough product to satisfy demand, but that also grants them a long-term ace in the hole if they ever decide to make more.  They've been in business long enough to have a lot of numbers to plug into whatever mathematical algorithm they use to determine the most profitable and least risky production numbers and schedules.

As painful as it is for the people who just want to buy toys, it means there's going to be continual demand for their products for decades to come.  They're in it for the long haul.

To clarify, this still doesn't in the slightest excuse how much of a dick move it is for them to STILL not have re-released Ozma's armor pack.  I think somewhere in the back offices of Bandai there's a hidden executive suite where the big wigs sit around and watch ebay prices climb on giant monitors, basking in the inflated demand they've generated for things they just refuse to produce. :p 

Edited by Chronocidal
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17 minutes ago, Chronocidal said:

It's not outright sales they're worried about, it's profit margins.  They purposefully leave short-term money on the table by not supplying enough product to satisfy demand, but that also grants them a long-term ace in the hole if they ever decide to make more.  They've been in business long enough to have a lot of numbers to plug into whatever mathematical algorithm they use to determine the most profitable and least risky production numbers and schedules.

As painful as it is for the people who just want to buy toys, it means there's going to be continual demand for their products for decades to come.  They're in it for the long haul.

To clarify, this still doesn't in the slightest excuse how much of a dick move it is for them to STILL not have re-released Ozma's armor pack.  I think somewhere in the back offices of Bandai there's a hidden executive suite where the big wigs sit around and watch ebay prices climb on giant monitors, basking in the inflated demand they've generated for things they just refuse to produce. :p 

They're risk averse. They'd rather accept the deadweight loss than try to increase sales (and profits) but at increased risk of having even one unit of unsold stock.

Bandai can run their business however they want. It doesn't mean we have to like it or withhold criticisms.

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45 minutes ago, Chronocidal said:

It's not outright sales they're worried about, it's profit margins.  They purposefully leave short-term money on the table by not supplying enough product to satisfy demand, but that also grants them a long-term ace in the hole if they ever decide to make more.  They've been in business long enough to have a lot of numbers to plug into whatever mathematical algorithm they use to determine the most profitable and least risky production numbers and schedules.

As painful as it is for the people who just want to buy toys, it means there's going to be continual demand for their products for decades to come.  They're in it for the long haul.

To clarify, this still doesn't in the slightest excuse how much of a dick move it is for them to STILL not have re-released Ozma's armor pack.  I think somewhere in the back offices of Bandai there's a hidden executive suite where the big wigs sit around and watch ebay prices climb on giant monitors, basking in the inflated demand they've generated for things they just refuse to produce. :p 

 

23 minutes ago, Lolicon said:

They're risk averse. They'd rather accept the deadweight loss than try to increase sales (and profits) but at increased risk of having even one unit of unsold stock.

Bandai can run their business however they want. It doesn't mean we have to like it or withhold criticisms.

It's not a bad strategy. Ford Performance (formerly known as SVT) production numbers are based off of making one less than demand (that's theory though). In reality they make a few more than one less than demand. That creates the same kind of "street values" that we see from Bandai. The new 2020+ GT500 is a perfect example. Getting on the list to get one was a lot like betting in on a PO. And most of those people still paid a hefty dealer markup. The secondary market is even crazier. The GT500 Track Pack cars go for $30K over retail....used. And sell.

I even do it with a couple of my products I manufacture. They are pre-order only. They are never on the shelf. And I always have a waiting list. I'd rather lose a few sales over tying up a ton of money in inventory. Or having to do things like Black Friday sales to get rid of it.

I agree that Bandai is frustrating though. On the upside in general your toy collection appreciates in value.

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3 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

To clarify, this still doesn't in the slightest excuse how much of a dick move it is for them to STILL not have re-released Ozma's armor pack.  I think somewhere in the back offices of Bandai there's a hidden executive suite where the big wigs sit around and watch ebay prices climb on giant monitors, basking in the inflated demand they've generated for things they just refuse to produce. :p 

I would add the Alto armor pack to the list as well. It so damned expensive in the secondary market ... :(

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3 hours ago, Lolicon said:

They're risk averse. They'd rather accept the deadweight loss than try to increase sales (and profits) but at increased risk of having even one unit of unsold stock.

Bandai can run their business however they want. It doesn't mean we have to like it or withhold criticisms.

Pretty much every Japanese company is risk averse.

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1 hour ago, Sanity is Optional said:

Pretty much every Japanese company is risk averse.

Yes they are and I originally typed that, but decided against make such a blanket statement covering every company in an entire country.

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3 hours ago, Lolicon said:

Yes they are and I originally typed that, but decided against make such a blanket statement covering every company in an entire country.

Nothing weird about a culture having tendencies in various areas.

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On 8/17/2021 at 6:31 PM, Lolicon said:

Bandai creates artificial scarcity to increase demand. It's nothing new.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_scarcity

I'm not so sure that is always true.  I remember they flooded the market with 1/55 so much that they cut back by the time max and mirya were out which caused a shortage of those, hence the $300+ price tag of them new later on.

Also chogokin roy focker is really easy to get and costs less than most of the other chogokin.  I thought they would be pretty balanced in price but I'm just guessing here but I think they flooded out the market with that one particular valkyrie.

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17 minutes ago, rocketblast said:

I'm not so sure that is always true.  I remember they flooded the market with 1/55 so much that they cut back by the time max and mirya were out which caused a shortage of those, hence the $300+ price tag of them new later on.

Also chogokin roy focker is really easy to get and costs less than most of the other chogokin.  I thought they would be pretty balanced in price but I'm just guessing here but I think they flooded out the market with that one particular valkyrie.

A unit available on the secondary market like Mandarake or wherever is a unit that Bandai has already sold. 

There are none available from regular retailers at MSRP. They're all secondary sales or sellers marking up the few remaining units. Either way the supply is constrained by Bandai. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 3 weeks later...

Well, now that the GBP are shipped/shipping................................and there are no VF-1's we are currently on PO............................................when do we get more?!?!?!:unknw:

What do you guys thing the timeline looks like on the next release/PO? December?

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2 minutes ago, sqidd said:

Well, now that the GBP are shipped/shipping................................and there are no VF-1's we are currently on PO............................................when do we get more?!?!?!:unknw:

What do you guys thing the timeline looks like on the next release/PO? December?

The DX December release is taken up by the VF-31AX.

Whether its going to be a DX as a first macross release next year, i think that would be answered by the upcoming TN2021 event in early November. Will have to see what else bandai would tease in the macross series.

Maybe HMR? or not.

On the DX front, with the new delta movie coming out, quite likely there would be delta valks again.

Wallet is still holding out for the YF-21 tho. 

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7 minutes ago, sqidd said:

Well, now that the GBP are shipped/shipping................................and there are no VF-1's we are currently on PO............................................when do we get more?!?!?!:unknw:

What do you guys thing the timeline looks like on the next release/PO? December?

Well, next 2 DX releases are the VF-31J Speakerpods in Oct, and the VF-31AX in Dec.

Going by previous years, the next DX release likely to be only in April 2022. Whether it will be another VF-1 at that time is up to speculation, but since the new Delta movie is coming out next month, I think it'll likely be another Delta valk release.

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43 minutes ago, seti88 said:

The DX December release is taken up by the VF-31AX.

Whether its going to be a DX as a first macross release next year, i think that would be answered by the upcoming TN2021 event in early November. Will have to see what else bandai would tease in the macross series.

Maybe HMR? or not.

On the DX front, with the new delta movie coming out, quite likely there would be delta valks again.

Wallet is still holding out for the YF-21 tho. 

Delta Valks don't count!:D

A 21 release would be cool. I'm not holding my breath though.:(

HMR? LOL!!!:rofl:

38 minutes ago, MKT said:

Well, next 2 DX releases are the VF-31J Speakerpods in Oct, and the VF-31AX in Dec.

Going by previous years, the next DX release likely to be only in April 2022. Whether it will be another VF-1 at that time is up to speculation, but since the new Delta movie is coming out next month, I think it'll likely be another Delta valk release.

I don't want to wait that long! MOAR VF-1's!!!:lol:

23 minutes ago, Dirtyboy said:

TV Kakizaki in April Next year. Followed by Max In Miria in September. I guess. 

Is that a wish.....or a guess?;)

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1 hour ago, sqidd said:

Delta Valks don't count!:D

A 21 release would be cool. I'm not holding my breath though.:(

HMR? LOL!!!:rofl:

Lol gotta have delta valks for bandai to milk the delta crowd. 🤣

How abt franken HMR...HMR-R? Renewerest renewal 🤑 Now with improved tampo all over! 

Oops I need to say I don’t want no DX YF-21. Ya hear me bandai!!🤪

Edited by seti88
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We all know that Bandai have a penchant for Hikaru, and based on 2 straight Hikaru releases I’m going to speculate it will be more Hikaru 😂

VF-1S TV Hikaru with Super Pack bundle TWE 

VF-1A DYRL Hikaru

VF-1J TV Trainer with Hikaru pilot TWE

VT-1 with Hikaru and Minmay pilot

😅

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