Lupin The Third Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) I think we can all agreed that the Chogokin Renewal situation is completely beyond ridiculous with the YF-29 30th Version already being marked up over $400 in some cases being the most absurd yet. Can someone in Japan just ask Bandai "Hey? Why are you guys being such dicks? People are trying to throw money at you and you're ignoring it." Maybe one of the Japanese toy sites has contacts or maybe someone here in Japan with contacts could just find out why they act like they're acting as if allergic to money? Personally I'm really tired of the hoops we're jumping through to make a purchase and I own far more rare and valuable items in my gaming and anime collections that didn't require 1/10th the effort to obtain. Maybe someone could shed some light on the situation? Is there only one factory in China that can make these and all the employees are jumping off the roof tops like at the Apple factory? Did Bandai's president have a vision of Buddah in which he was told to only make 12 of each new figure so that the unenlightened couldn't get them? Or are they just a bunch of sadist jerks? None of their other lines are getting this treatment. Why is Macross, and it's fans, receiving such a complete disregard? Edited July 12, 2012 by Lupin The Third Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Considering jenius seems to be very in the know about Bandai's Macross stuff (he even knew about the 171 and claims it was developed BEFORE the 17 in his review) perhaps one of his contacts would know why Bandai are being pricks about their Macross releases? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyp Durron Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) I think we can all agreed that the Chogokin Renewal situation is completely beyond ridiculous with the YF-29 30th Version already being marked up over $400 in some cases being the most absurd yet. Can someone in Japan just ask Bandai "Hey? Why are you guys being such dicks? People are trying to throw money at you and you're ignoring it." Maybe one of the Japanese toy sites has contacts or maybe someone here in Japan with contacts could just find out why they act like they're acting as if allergic to money? Personally I'm really tired of the hoops we're jumping through to make a purchase and I own far more rare and valuable items in my gaming and anime collections that didn't require 1/10th the effort to obtain. Maybe someone could shed some light on the situation? Is there only one factory in China that can make these and all the employees are jumping off the roof tops like at the Apple factory? Did Bandai's president have a vision of Buddah in which he was told to only make 12 of each new figure so that the unenlightened couldn't get them? Or are they just a bunch of sadist jerks? None of their other lines are getting this treatment. Why is Macross, and it's fans, receiving such a complete disregard? +1,000,000 I don't get it, I really don't. While I can understand limiting the production to a degree to keep from having excess product becoming shelf warmers, I cannot for the life of me understand Bandai's reasoning for limiting their production runs to this extent. -Kyp Edited July 12, 2012 by Kyp Durron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabidweezil Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 In regards to the 30th anniv YF-29. Seems kind of crazy to make a celebration Valkyrie that no one can get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takatoys Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Someone tells Bandai that I was a potential buyer of all the renewals. But thanks to the absurd production shortage, my money is going to Hot Toys figures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Negotiator Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Maybe they are just selling more because they are cheaper. I've had to pass on all the vf-19 and vf-17 releases for now because $300+ is just too much. I'm sure I'm not the only one that's feels this way. Scalpers usually want to double their profits too and at $300+ retail, its a bigger chance to take on buying up yammies. When I'm done with this dx line I plan to catch up on the yammies through a sale tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 In regards to the 30th anniv YF-29. Seems kind of crazy to make a celebration Valkyrie that no one can get. It's like serving one of those $1 single serve pieces of cake to a room full of people. You cut it in half and that's pretty much it. The rest of you can f**k off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurance Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 It's a big company making money in a way its analysts think is most effective. We can argue whether or not it's annoying to the consumer but you're fooling yourself if you think Bandai or any for-profit large company has any motive, for ill or for good, other than maximum profits. The "I'm going to take my business elsewhere" thing is pretty irrelevant; aggregates are important for profit, not individuals. I guess a more pertinent question is "how does Bandai's current strategy maximize their bottom line?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kicker773 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 It's going to ne strange for me to say this, but i guess everyone hits a wall. But with most of these toys being unattainable, macross whether it be yamato or bandai, me a anal completist has slowly shifted his funds elsewhere. Just like what takatoys said, hot toys has slowly been making it more appealing for me. I'm going to pick up the camo tumbler, another tumbler for custom work, another batpod to display with catwoman, and the bat. I already have the TIM Burton batmobile on pre order. That would have been some revenue for them. I don't have time to jump through hoops for these amymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treatment Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 you know. maybe. just maybe. non-Japan-based fans are simply just not Bandai's marketing-demographic for their Macross merchandizes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceCowboy Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 "non-Japan-based fans are simply just not Bandai's marketing-demographic for their Macross merchandizes" True - but the inability to get these products here (via shops that sell to international markets) tells me that they are even hard to come by for Japanese consumers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logos Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) I posted this in the YF-29 anniverserty thread before reading this one otherwise I would have posted it here so...... This crap makes me wish Bandai had a kickstarter or something. We all kick in some money to get a preorder voucher (and maybe other things) that is valid for HLJ, AmiAmi, HobbySearch and a few other venders. This way they make extra units and because we have paid some money we would be more likely to pick it up at release time so Bandai dosen't loose out. There are some companies that I buy products from that do something similar to this already although they are based out of the US.Maybe Yamato could do this for the VF-4s and even a Regault? If they meet the dollar or a number of purchasers target we could finally get the toys we want and for a reasonalble or unstandable price. Also maybe they can finally prove that there is no real interest in the item and we can all stop b*thching about it. Just an idea. But hey this preorder BullS**t is getting out of hand. Crap it's been out of hand since the release of the Renewal VF-25s. Edited July 12, 2012 by logos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knightdramon Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 It's not just with macross frontier. Every line of theirs that features items over 10.000 is the same. Take for instance, SOC. There used to be an abundance in hobby stores [online stores like HLJ] that I could find, in stock or backordered, a catalogue of like two years old of available figures from that line. Even Macross Quarter was available for so long it was marked down to 60% last I saw it available. Same as with the Koenig Monster. Yet in the past few years, their regular SOC releases have crawled down to 1-2 per year, with costs over 20.000 yen that sell out almost immediately or on release day. Even more ridiculous is the Renewal line fiasco. Perhaps Bandai saw fit to release a very limited amount of valks\items in order not to have stores needing to mark things down to 60% to sell? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultraman zoffy Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 you know. maybe. just maybe. non-Japan-based fans are simply just not Bandai's marketing-demographic for their Macross merchandizes. I would think this makes the most sense, as opposed to the conspiracy vibe that Bandai is some evil corporation that hates American fans. Frontier has never officially been released or aired in the U.S., right? So it stands that they wouldn't expect there to be much of a market out here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaginpit Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I think we can all agreed that the Chogokin Renewal situation is completely beyond ridiculous with the YF-29 30th Version already being marked up over $400 in some cases being the most absurd yet. Can someone in Japan just ask Bandai "Hey? Why are you guys being such dicks? People are trying to throw money at you and you're ignoring it." Maybe one of the Japanese toy sites has contacts or maybe someone here in Japan with contacts could just find out why they act like they're acting as if allergic to money? Personally I'm really tired of the hoops we're jumping through to make a purchase and I own far more rare and valuable items in my gaming and anime collections that didn't require 1/10th the effort to obtain. Maybe someone could shed some light on the situation? Is there only one factory in China that can make these and all the employees are jumping off the roof tops like at the Apple factory? Did Bandai's president have a vision of Buddah in which he was told to only make 12 of each new figure so that the unenlightened couldn't get them? Or are they just a bunch of sadist jerks? None of their other lines are getting this treatment. Why is Macross, and it's fans, receiving such a complete disregard? I would like to add something to your comment. YOUR ABSOLUTELY frakkING RIGHT!~! HOLLY MOLLY http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Bandai-Macross-Frontier-DX-Chogokin-VF-25F-Messiah-Valkyrie-Alto-Renewal-Version-/261062321737?pt=US_Action_Figures&hash=item3cc886e649 WTF! And yet I have my full armor one at BBTS for $$$ http://www.bigbadtoystore.com/bbts/product.aspx?product=BAN14153&mode=retail Someone explain that logic to me. Its like the mystery to whats beyond the higs Boson answers lies here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mechapilot77 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 yeah i'm fricken annoyed at the situation. frustratingly, i can understand it. how it it more profitable to release so few toys that they sell out instantly. i get that there is a balance between having to mark things off to sell and having things impossible to get and somewhere between those two you will have a max profit...but Bandai...THIS CANNOT BE IT. seriously. i think people inside japan wouod likely have issues getting these things. sheesh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatalist Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I would like to add something to your comment. YOUR ABSOLUTELY frakkING RIGHT!~! HOLLY MOLLY http://www.ebay.ca/i...=item3cc886e649 WTF! And yet I have my full armor one at BBTS for $$$ http://www.bigbadtoy...153&mode=retail Someone explain that logic to me. Its like the mystery to whats beyond the higs Boson answers lies here! $209 for JUST the armor?!?!?!? What the hell has this hobby come to? Honestly, it sucks what you all are going through. I really hope this scenario doesn't happen to the VF-4, because thats the holy grail right there, and I will be furious if I have to jump through similar hoops. At least Yamato likes us somewhat, right? /fingers crossed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaginpit Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 $209 for JUST the armor?!?!?!? What the hell has this hobby come to? Honestly, it sucks what you all are going through. I really hope this scenario doesn't happen to the VF-4, because thats the holy grail right there, and I will be furious if I have to jump through similar hoops. At least Yamato likes us somewhat, right? /fingers crossed Oh man I just noticed its just the armor parts CANCELLLED! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reeoyuy Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) Does anyone here worked on manufacturing industry? I do, and although mine isn't toys, the whole concept is pretty much the same. My theory is that the DXs shared the same factory or even same assembly line with other Bandai toys line like, maybe, similar stuff like SOC or even radically different SH.Figuarts. Therefore the production must be scheduled accordingly far ahead. And as the line will be used for another product, the production will be stop when it's scheduled to stop. Changing the molds and adjusting the machines are hard, even more so for toys which have assembly and painting by hands ( as you need to "adjust" the workers too ). So you can't just change the schedule or product quantity on the fly. This is also why re-release took months, instead of just mere days after the sales number from pre-order or launching day confirmed that the product is selling well and fans demand more. One might notice that Yamato doesn't suffer the same problem as Bandai. I'll just point out that toy line variety of Yamato is nothing like Bandai; so they don't have to cram so many different things in tight schedule. As big as Bandai is, I don't think they can afford one factory per each toy line, or even specialized assembly line for each separate toy line. Not in this economy. I'm sure that the designers and everyone involved in creation (NOT production) of the toys are also fellow hobbyists and really care what fans and customers want. But once the design leave the office and entering the production phase, it's all getting industrial there. Just what I thought based on my experience as human cog in assembly line . And before someone blame Gundam for this, it's the same for Gundam figures too. Model kits are different as they are made by different division in Japan factory, not made in China like Tamashii division figures. Edited July 12, 2012 by reeoyuy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bariaburu Faita Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 Does anyone here worked on manufacturing industry? I do, and although mine isn't toys, the whole concept is pretty much the same. My theory is that the DXs shared the same factory or even same assembly line with other Bandai toys line like, maybe, similar stuff like SOC or even radically different SH.Figuarts. Therefore the production must be scheduled accordingly far ahead. And as the line will be used for another product, the production will be stop when it's scheduled to stop. Changing the molds and adjusting the machines are hard, even more so for toys which have assembly and painting by hands ( as you need to "adjust" the workers too ). So you can't just change the schedule or product quantity on the fly. This is also why re-release took months, instead of just mere days after the sales number from pre-order or launching day confirmed that the product is selling well and fans demand more. One might notice that Yamato doesn't suffer the same problem as Bandai. I'll just point out that toy line variety of Yamato is nothing like Bandai; so they don't have to cram so many different things in tight schedule. As big as Bandai is, I don't think they can afford one factory per each toy line, or even specialized assembly line for each separate toy line. Not in this economy. I'm sure that the designers and everyone involved in creation (NOT production) of the toys are also fellow hobbyists and really care what fans and customers want. But once the design leave the office and entering the production phase, it's all getting industrial there. Just what I thought based on my experience as human cog in assembly line . And before someone blame Gundam for this, it's the same for Gundam figures too. Model kits are different as they are made by different division in Japan factory, not made in China like Tamashii division figures. This is true for Japan also. I worked at a Panasonic factory for 5 years. There is large interval between when you make a new product and when you get marketing feedback about actual demand for such product. Overproducing can have catastrophic consequences resulting in whole factories getting shuttered and people laid off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CF18 Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 Perhaps Bandai saw fit to release a very limited amount of valks\items in order not to have stores needing to mark things down to 60% to sell? That's basically it. After the economy meltdown and seeing all those VF-22 and Gundam Fix linger in the 50% off bin for like years, all high priced toys are high risk. Bandai is rather conservative in the last few years and prefer to just keep making Gundam, Saint Saiya, One Piece and Kamen Rider. Now about the Macross DX situation here is some thing that should make some scream: It was posted a week ago in HK forum. Apparently the VF-171EX is very well supplied in retail stores in Japan and most stores have them at full retail or standard discount. It's probably why Nippon-Yasan can keep selling them at 16000 yen - their staff can still get them from their neighbors at 2000+ yen less. Yahoo Japan Auction search of DX VF-171EX right now shows 40 units with buy it now price near full retail - it is no where near the eBay level scalping. So how come AmiAmi etc can't get more? Well Bandai probably just treat each store as the same despite bigger market reach by online stores. It is fair in a sense, instead of letting a few big stores getting 80% stocks, each individual store get 24 units. Bandai still don't want to piss off their traditional retail store partners, since it is probably still where most of their income comes from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenius Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 Considering jenius seems to be very in the know about Bandai's Macross stuff (he even knew about the 171 and claims it was developed BEFORE the 17 in his review) perhaps one of his contacts would know why Bandai are being pricks about their Macross releases? Sorry, I don't know anyone who actually works for Bandai. It sounded like a friend of mine was out drinking with either people from Yamato or people from FREX or TREX or whoever it is that did the designing. Even my buddies in Japan have had a hard time preordering some of the newer Bandai items. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bariaburu Faita Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 As of this weekend, I saw the VF-171EX on sale at normal retail price or slightly lower on shelves. This shortage is mainly for overseas customers, which is not who its intended for. Bandai is the manufacturer, not the owner of the IP. For other Bandai products like Saint Saiya they aggressively promote and sell to overseas customers because they are allowed by the IP owners. I do not think they are at fault for supply outside of Japan to be low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UN Spacy Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 I blame Harmony Gold...they're my go to scapegoats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMANIFESS Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 SO...... in summary: -Bandai is inadvertantly short-stocking online stores to be fair to all of them, while the focus is on the local retail brick-n-mortar shops in Japan? -The few online stores that are restocking are raising their prices because they just will go down the street to buy it from an actual store then sell it to us. -And Bandai being only the manufacturer of Macross DX doesn't push overseas sales as Big West owns the IP & has no interest in overseas sales because of Harmony Gold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrentonx Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 Pretty much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anime52k8 Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 SO...... in summary: -Bandai is inadvertantly short-stocking online stores to be fair to all of them, while the focus is on the local retail brick-n-mortar shops in Japan? -The few online stores that are restocking are raising their prices because they just will go down the street to buy it from an actual store then sell it to us. -And Bandai being only the manufacturer of Macross DX doesn't push overseas sales as Big West owns the IP & has no interest in overseas sales because of Harmony Gold? also: -Bandai doesn't have the power to instantly produce toys and make them appear in retailers' warehouses just because people on the internet can't order form their preferred web store, even if Bandai wanted to. -Early uncertainty about stock availability and rampant speculation creates artificial scarcity that doesn't accurately reflect real world availability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firefox Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 It seems that only the online stores are hit with this limitation. May be Bandai afraid Macross will out sell Gundam or become very well known in overseas market if the produce it more? After all, Bandai owns full right on Gundam and it takes them a lot of effort to make Gundam well known and accepted by many cultures and countries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) Does anyone here worked on manufacturing industry? I do, and although mine isn't toys, the whole concept is pretty much the same. My theory is that the DXs shared the same factory or even same assembly line with other Bandai toys line like, maybe, similar stuff like SOC or even radically different SH.Figuarts. Therefore the production must be scheduled accordingly far ahead. And as the line will be used for another product, the production will be stop when it's scheduled to stop. Changing the molds and adjusting the machines are hard, even more so for toys which have assembly and painting by hands ( as you need to "adjust" the workers too ). So you can't just change the schedule or product quantity on the fly. This is also why re-release took months, instead of just mere days after the sales number from pre-order or launching day confirmed that the product is selling well and fans demand more. One might notice that Yamato doesn't suffer the same problem as Bandai. I'll just point out that toy line variety of Yamato is nothing like Bandai; so they don't have to cram so many different things in tight schedule. As big as Bandai is, I don't think they can afford one factory per each toy line, or even specialized assembly line for each separate toy line. Not in this economy. I'm sure that the designers and everyone involved in creation (NOT production) of the toys are also fellow hobbyists and really care what fans and customers want. But once the design leave the office and entering the production phase, it's all getting industrial there. Just what I thought based on my experience as human cog in assembly line . And before someone blame Gundam for this, it's the same for Gundam figures too. Model kits are different as they are made by different division in Japan factory, not made in China like Tamashii division figures. Good post, what I foresee as a problem though is that that they doen't build enough time in for the initial release of the item, it sells REALLY well, but then they get "gun shy" about how much to produce for a rerelease because they figure most people already got one, so the cycle continues. It seems that only the online stores are hit with this limitation. May be Bandai afraid Macross will out sell Gundam or become very well known in overseas market if the produce it more? After all, Bandai owns full right on Gundam and it takes them a lot of effort to make Gundam well known and accepted by many cultures and countries. I though Jenius said his friends in Japan were having a hard time tracking 1 down too. If they are so easy to find in Japan why wouldn't places like HLJ just go out and buy more s they could sell them to their customers instead of placing the dreaded skull and cross bones of discontinued on the item page? Seems like no one wins this way customers or retailers. Chris Edited July 13, 2012 by Dobber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMANIFESS Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) Seems like Macross collectors are just getting shitted on worldwide. Like the manufacturers are really underestimating the lust of the fans all over the globe. Edited July 13, 2012 by GMANIFESS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bariaburu Faita Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 They are not easy to get, in quantity. The note on the VF-171 in the picture says that it is limited to 1 per customer, which is not a universal practice but happens often enough for items that are in high demand. Places that sell unlimited numbers of them sold out first. So now places that still have them would be likely to have su ch limits, which limits the number of online resellers can get ahold of. But it is still possible, and Bandai has a established pattern of producing additional production runs of items that are this popular. But it will take time before a production que opens up in a factory, and more time to start a new production run. There is a light at the end of the tunnel. Another possibility is that due to the popularity Bandai may release additional color variations. Im hoping for a green CF. That's basically it. After the economy meltdown and seeing all those VF-22 and Gundam Fix linger in the 50% off bin for like years, all high priced toys are high risk. Bandai is rather conservative in the last few years and prefer to just keep making Gundam, Saint Saiya, One Piece and Kamen Rider. Now about the Macross DX situation here is some thing that should make some scream: It was posted a week ago in HK forum. Apparently the VF-171EX is very well supplied in retail stores in Japan and most stores have them at full retail or standard discount. It's probably why Nippon-Yasan can keep selling them at 16000 yen - their staff can still get them from their neighbors at 2000+ yen less. Yahoo Japan Auction search of DX VF-171EX right now shows 40 units with buy it now price near full retail - it is no where near the eBay level scalping. So how come AmiAmi etc can't get more? Well Bandai probably just treat each store as the same despite bigger market reach by online stores. It is fair in a sense, instead of letting a few big stores getting 80% stocks, each individual store get 24 units. Bandai still don't want to piss off their traditional retail store partners, since it is probably still where most of their income comes from. Good post, what I foresee as a problem though is that that they doen't build enough time in for the initial release of the item, it sells REALLY well, but then they get "gun shy" about how much to produce for a rerelease because they figure most people already got one, so the cycle continues. I though Jenius said his friends in Japan were having a hard time tracking 1 down too. If they are so easy to find in Japan why wouldn't places like HLJ just go out and buy more s they could sell them to their customers instead of placing the dreaded skull and cross bones of discontinued on the item page? Seems like no one wins this way customers or retailers. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptormesh Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 I would like the teal CF 171 as well but its going to be another exercise in frustration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaginpit Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) Seems like Macross collectors are just getting shitted on worldwide. Like the manufacturers are really underestimating the lust of the fans all over the globe. QFT Question Would it be in HGs best interest to expand the IP over a broader customer base. UM MARKET PENETRATION??? = more $$$ Sometimes its easier to understand the physics behind the Higs Boson than Business decisions Edited July 13, 2012 by slaginpit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptormesh Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 I think HG is too lazy to do anything but to troll an entire fanbase for decades on end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaginpit Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 I think HG is too lazy to do anything but to troll an entire fanbase for decades on end. That is just so twisted. really! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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