Whats Lying on your Workbench MK IV

[Sanity is Optional]

Dang, that some nice detailing both on the CAD and the print.

[peter]

On 8/17/2021 at 7:12 PM, Chronocidal said:

So, as far as I understand, all of these extra pieces are to cover all of the variants that the Excelsior went through (short of the upgraded impulse engines that the Enterprise B got, but that's another kit).  The model used in Star Trek III was very different from ST VI, including those different shuttle bay details, different impulse dome, and bridge.  I'd expect all those tiny detail parts were also related to that refit.

Edit - Actually, unless you have two separate upper saucer halves, I think you're locked into making the ST:III NX-2000 version.  The refit for ST:VI had a dual set of impulse domes at the back of the saucer.

Looks to be a nice breakdown of the distinguishing details in this discussion: http://www.trektoy.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2420&page=7

 

Actually, it comes with an insert for the dual impulse domes, but truth be told, I prefer the larger single one. 

 

[peter]

This was fun lining up. 

Stealing the shuttle for later use.  Not going to see this behind the closed bay doors anyway. 

This three piece neck is the only thing attaching the saucer to the secondary hull.  Sounds like a job for super glue or epoxy. 

There is nothing marking the alignment of the shuttle bay doors.... Just going to have to eyeball it and hope for the best. 

It's a bit off but close enough. 

A little trimming, and maybe a bucket of bondo. 

Good place to put a seam.... Took forever trying to make it less obvious. 

More filing and sanding..... 

 

[MechTech]

@arbit I hope you had a good vacation! Thank you! I did like Nadesico, but never got to see the whole thing. Long story short, only the first couple of VCR tapes (yes tapes) were available at the store. The models are really a kit reconfigure because it looks nothing like the original now - except bits of it.

Another GREAT print! Yes, show us your process along the way. We might learn something

@peter Peter says to himself, "HMMmmm, what are some of the most jacked-up kits I can buy and build to challenge myself? I know, all those old Star Trek kits that helped kill the hobby back in the day." But it's only making you a better builder (and more patient person) for doing it! - MT

[electric indigo]

Yeah, even as a youngster I felt the huge discrepancy of the elegant Trek ships from the show and the reaaally crappy plastic you got in the box.

_

Can't stop looking at the Siren.

[David Hingtgen]

Something that 99% of people miss, on the standard Excelsior vs the Refits:

The outboard nacelle fins.  (not the new ones, the ones that are ALWAYS present on ALL versions).   The refits, have longer fins there.  They're extended rearwards a bit, so that their rear edge now lines up with the rear edge of the new fin that was added on top.   (the original fins would otherwise stop ahead of the trailing edge of the new fins---this way all the fins "end at the same spot")   Or to put it another way---the original fins do not extend rearward beyond the rear end of nacelle itself.  The Refit's do.   (I believe the "new" Excelsior model built for the Voyager episode got this wrong---it has the extended fins)   

It's basically a small parallelogram-shaped extension.  The original Ertl kit of the 1701-B included the extensions as extra parts to add.  (no tabs/slots or anything, you just had to butt-join and putty them on).   But I think like every other model/toy/diecast just gives the Refit version the same "rear outboard fins" as the regular version.  

:;edit:;  Found a pic of the kit's sprues, I circled the fin extensions (they're right next to the all-new fins)  

[peter]

10 hours ago, David Hingtgen said:

Something that 99% of people miss, on the standard Excelsior vs the Refits:

The outboard nacelle fins.  (not the new ones, the ones that are ALWAYS present on ALL versions).   The refits, have longer fins there.  They're extended rearwards a bit, so that their rear edge now lines up with the rear edge of the new fin that was added on top.   (the original fins would otherwise stop ahead of the trailing edge of the new fins---this way all the fins "end at the same spot")   Or to put it another way---the original fins do not extend rearward beyond the rear end of nacelle itself.  The Refit's do.   (I believe the "new" Excelsior model built for the Voyager episode got this wrong---it has the extended fins)   

It's basically a small parallelogram-shaped extension.  The original Ertl kit of the 1701-B included the extensions as extra parts to add.  (no tabs/slots or anything, you just had to butt-join and putty them on).   But I think like every other model/toy/diecast just gives the Refit version the same "rear outboard fins" as the regular version.  

:;edit:;  Found a pic of the kit's sprues, I circled the fin extensions (they're right next to the all-new fins)  

Interesting.  The instructions for this version don't call for them, but they are in the parts pile

[peter]

The nacelle assembly is bonkers just like the rest of this kit.

There are no reference tabs of any sort for these parts. 

The chillers have small pegs, but that's it.  My hats off to anyone who not only builds these but lights them as well. 

Mocked it up, but there is nothing locking down any of these parts, they're just sort of free floating and I have to eyeball whee to glue them down. 

I don't feel a tremendous amount of motivation to finish this thing, lol! 

I'll git 'er done though eventually. 

Lots of filling.... Lots. 

 

 

[Chronocidal]

The clear parts are pretty much adding insult to injury there, since the original Excelsior nacelles didn't even light up.  

[arbit]

21 hours ago, MechTech said:

@arbit I hope you had a good vacation! Thank you! I did like Nadesico, but never got to see the whole thing. Long story short, only the first couple of VCR tapes (yes tapes) were available at the store. The models are really a kit reconfigure because it looks nothing like the original now - except bits of it.

I am not sure how well Nadesico holds up after all these years, but it was a blast back in the day.

21 hours ago, MechTech said:

Another GREAT print! Yes, show us your process along the way. We might learn something

I don't want to turn this into a 3D Printing thread, and I am also fearful that people will try to monetize Macross intellectual property. The pandora's box of 3D printing is open, anyone can search the web and learn how to do this.

But if you want to know more about the process, I will try to give some details with each figure, because the process always differs. 

To start with, I will give some steps on my next Ranka figure to go with Sheryl.  Keep in mind that my 3D Design skill level is zero, so any feedback is welcomed.

Ranka is an MMD file. This is how she looks before processing. With MMD  files you can apply pose libraries, because MMD files use standard bone armature naming. Other files like STL and XPS, you have to pose yourself with an armature or posing app like Mixamo. But those tend to cause a lot of deformations that need to be resculpted later. With MMD pose libraries, the poses are cleaner and require less work.

With this pose, I needed to consider how it will print, so I put the fingers together as much as possible to make solid objects for printing, and avoid very thin parts that will easily break off. I also changed the pose to hold a microphone, and imported an UTA Macross mic.

Ranka is still low poly, and at some stage I will smooth the surface. When depends on if I get any distortion, if I do, I delay processing to a later stage.  The same goes for all my processing, the order depends on a visual check of results.  There is no set order.

I scale the figure to my size of 3.6 cm, then I run a thickness inspection to see where I have problems. I want most parts to be at least 0.2-0.3mm thick. The red parts don't pass the test, and I will try to thicken them. Some edges will remain too thin and not form during printing, but that's okay with me.

Visual inspection shows that the hair bangs are too thin, so those need thickening. As do all the little ribbons she is wearing.

Checking this ribbon on her wrist we see that many of these details are not actually attached to the model, so I need to push them in.

After exporting the model to STL and repairing in 3D Builder, a lot of the thickness problems are already solved. Every 3D model needs to be repaired to make it manifold and printable, you can do this with Netfabb, Microsoft 3D Builder or Microsoft 3D Repair.  Ranka is one simple model, so I had to repair her only once. Other models made out of disparate parts kitbashed together may need to be repaired separately then brought together.

Before Thickening Parts:

After Thickening Parts:

These Before and After shots show the results of thickening her hair, ribbons and dress parts.

I also made the object "solid" in Meshmixer, which further prepares it for printing and adds some thickness everywhere, it has the drawback of also losing small details like on the face, as you can see.

She is ready for supports and printing at this stage.  But these designs are very delicate, so you have to be very careful removing from the sprues, I don't rip them off like on large prints, I snip each one off carefully with nippers and model blade and magnifier to avoid causing any tension.

Years of hobbying experience helps me get them off without damaging weak thin parts, but I always lose a finger or two that need remolding and sculpting.

For this size figure, I use 0.3mm support contacts points, which are strong enough to anchor the model.  For thin parts like fingers, hair and delicate dress edges, I use 0.2mm-0.25mm contact points to not damage the features, but I have to be sure to anchor them with a 0.3mm support very nearby, or they will rip off during printing and result in a failed print.

As you can see above, my biggest concern is the fingers and ribbons and dress edges. Due to good pre-planning, each hand only needed two supports to print correctly, without each finger needing a support. I angle the figure to build on itself, and avoid any supports on the front of the figure.

The final result after postprocessing and curing. No sanding involved with these two, I will deal with imperfections after priming.

Credits: Models by DeNA and PON. Conversion and edit by makochips. Pose by snorlaxin. Resculpting, posing, editing, printing by me.

This is fan art for personal use, not for sale or distribution.

 

 

[MechTech]

@arbit That's AWESOME Arbit! It's cool to see what you did and how you did it. Thanks for sharing your process! Your models look great too! Thanks for taking the "mystery" out of it. Someday I'll have to start doing this - or get REALLY good with Milliput (which is probably not going to happen)😄

@peter That kit looks like you have to scratch build 25% of it! - MT

[Thom]

@arbit Those are some lovely little figures.

@peter Keep at her, she's looking good from here.

[arbit]

13 hours ago, Thom said:

@arbit Those are some lovely little figures.

 

On 8/18/2021 at 10:23 PM, Sanity is Optional said:

Dang, that some nice detailing both on the CAD and the print.

Thanks guys. My goal is to have every Macross idol up on my stage. Delta is in question though. I may just do Freyja out of the goodness of my heart.

[Sanity is Optional]

28 minutes ago, arbit said:

Thanks guys. My goal is to have every Macross idol up on my stage. Delta is in question though. I may just do Freyja out of the goodness of my heart.

Just do Mirage, she's best girl (in that series) anyway. 😁

[Thom]

9 hours ago, Sanity is Optional said:

Just do Mirage, she's best girl (in that series) anyway. 😁

Agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

[derex3592]

BDay haul of hobby stuff came in! Still waiting for my Mr. Surfacer 1500 Black. Trying Humbrol enamels from good ole England land for the first time, see if they brush paint worth a crap.... 

[Chronocidal]

Oh, now those I remember.. my dad had a few of those from ages ago, and if my memory serves me correctly, they should brush beautifully.  Those old metal pop-caps bring back some good memories.  

I've still got a fair stash of Model Masters and normal Testors paints to go through, but you're right, my brushing experience with Tamiya acrylics hasn't been anything impressive so far.  I might have to start importing more enamels.

[derex3592]

Well @Chronocidal, I can report that my absolute favorites are still Model Master enamels for brushing, I picked up a jar of Brass the other week at the hobby shop, one of the few colors left, and it just lays down absolutely beautiful with a brush. Just like I remember it doing. The Humbrols, with just a quick 5 minute brush on a plastic spoon test I can report are pretty good...depending on the color....oddly the yellow and white did the best! Go figure. The grays and greens not so much, (and yes, I did stir them up adequately).  I know I'm gonna have to try Tamiya enamels at some point, just so hard to get at the moment unless you pay stupid prices for shipping from overseas. 

[MechTech]

@derex3592 Heh heh, Humbrol! I hope they work for you. Some need some thinning.

 

Got some more detailing done, but there is still a TON left to do and clean up! Then a matt clear coat to cover it all. Also working on the base...

Decals - Check! Made some custom and repurposed some more.

Ammo - Check! The 75mm brass is painted and coated. The defensive units are decalled and painted (two decals each, one on each side - I don't know why!).

Yes, Air Force! OK, I may be slightly biased, but who had the first robot dogs? https://www.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/2551037/robot-dogs-arrive-at-tyndall-afb/

These of course are a manned design. Thanks for checking in! - MT

[derex3592]

@MechTech - Loving the decals and ammo! 

[pengbuzz]

Just to let folks know: depending upon how the next 24-48 hours go, I may not be able to get onto here.

We are right in the path of hurricane Henri.

Edited August 22, 2021 by pengbuzz

[arbit]

Derex3592,

I have a question about the head magnifier you are using. The one I have I need to hold the objects just 4 or 5 inches away from the glasses, which is not practical. I cant really work with both hands so close to my face. Is it the same with yours?

Any recommemdations appreciated.

[Thom]

@MechTech The paint, the weathering, the decals and details, they look super!

@pengbuzz Take care and stay safe!

[Salamander]

Regarding the Humbrol paints, they changed the formulation a few times over the last couple of years, and some colors (especially metallics) did not fare very well. So be sure to test them on some scrap plastic, in case they don't dry well.

[derex3592]

@arbit - These are what I use, you get 4 different lenses and the LED lamp part comes out, which is good, I don't use it and it makes it way to heavy! 

 

Amazon.com : MagniVisor Deluxe Head Visor/Magnifier : Sports & Outdoors

Edited August 22, 2021 by derex3592

[arbit]

11 minutes ago, derex3592 said:

@arbit - These are what I use, you get 4 different lenses and the LED lamp part comes out, which is good, I don't use it and it makes it way to heavy! 

 

Amazon.com : MagniVisor Deluxe Head Visor/Magnifier : Sports & Outdoors

Thanks Derex. How close do you have to hold the objects to focus is?

[Rock]

In an attempt to clear out some big boxes in the basement I brought these old kits back into the daylight after 10+ years to finish them. Just need that "I finished a kit" high to ride into my next clear valk project which will be a first time experience! Trying to match the paints to what I mixed long ago should prove interesting...

[derex3592]

1 hour ago, arbit said:

Thanks Derex. How close do you have to hold the objects to focus is?

@arbitI guess I never really thought about it, I guess 6 to 8 inches or so??? Maybe closer, BUT I'm now 46 and just got a new glasses prescription for my 1st pair of BIFOCULS...eeekkk!!!.. I'm old! So with that being said, when I get those new glasses in in a couple of weeks, things may change for me for the better with the working distance to small parts..I'll keep you posted! 

Edited August 22, 2021 by derex3592

[Urashiman]

On 8/21/2021 at 10:49 PM, derex3592 said:

BDay haul of hobby stuff came in! Still waiting for my Mr. Surfacer 1500 Black. Trying Humbrol enamels from good ole England land for the first time, see if they brush paint worth a crap.... 

The humbrol enamels are almost like the revell ones but a bit thinner. I think they are really good for airbrushing purposes. I use the from time to time, as humbrol has different colors than revell which really add up, e.g. purple and yellow tones.

[arbit]

 @MechTech You had asked me if I can add detail to clothing to make painting easier. I just figured out a method based on traditional scultping. I'm not sure how pros do it, but this is simple and effective. 

First I draw the shape I want directly on the figure's pixels.

Then straighten the lines.

Then I fatten or extrude the section to get a body hugging design detail.

Then we smooth everything out to get a better shape.

Now it looks like it will be a ton of fun to paint!

I have a lot of ideas for Macross figures now that I can add some details.

Edited August 23, 2021 by arbit

[Gabe Q]

19 hours ago, Rock said:

In an attempt to clear out some big boxes in the basement I brought these old kits back into the daylight after 10+ years to finish them. Just need that "I finished a kit" high to ride into my next clear valk project which will be a first time experience! Trying to match the paints to what I mixed long ago should prove interesting...

I've been patching up my old kits lately, too. Trying to match paint is tricky! Good luck! 

@arbit that 3D figure looks amazing. The whole process seems very complicated. Very impressive. 

[Gabe Q]

I'm working on the battroid still. Also, I built a small 1D fighter in the meantime. Just need to paint the lights. 

[pengbuzz]

20 hours ago, derex3592 said:

@arbitI guess I never really thought about it, I guess 6 to 8 inches or so??? Maybe closer, BUT I'm now 46 and just got a new glasses prescription for my 1st pair of BIFOCULS...eeekkk!!!.. I'm old! So with that being said, when I get those new glasses in in a couple of weeks, things may change for me for the better with the working distance to small parts..I'll keep you posted! 

I'm 47...ya wanna get me my walker sonny? 😛

 

[MechTech]

@derex3592 @Thom Thank you guys! Its getting there...

@arbit I think someone asked you about modding the clothing; but thanks for showing us how you did it! He looks great! Is he going to be one of your idols on stage!?

@Gabe Q Your paint is nice and clean looking!

@pengbuzz Do we need to get a walker or life raft for you? Did you guys fair alright in Hurricane Henri (according to your post)? - MT

[Gabe Q]

Thanks @MechTech. I want to get into fabricating parts like you. What's the absolute minimum set of equipment to get started?

I'm thinking a set of very small lathe, table saw, and drill press would do it? I dunno...