Macross Δ (Delta) Movie Gekijō no Walkūre (Passionate Walkure)

[SMS007]

Well unless Gekijō no Walküre somehow delivers a resolution to the Vár syndrome problem, it should be interesting to see how the next TV anime tries to deal with it.

I wonder. It seems fitting enough to me that when the 50th anniversary rolls around, the story could be the return of the Protoculture. Kawamori-sensei is know for developing things in the long run. Perhaps if this is where he is taking the franchise's story, then maybe Vár syndrome is in fact an intentional biological experiment by surviving hidden Protohumanoids who are preparing the galaxy for conquest.

[Seto Kaiba]

2 hours ago, SMS007 said:

Well unless Gekijō no Walküre somehow delivers a resolution to the Vár syndrome problem, it should be interesting to see how the next TV anime tries to deal with it.

Considering the Var syndrome problem seems to have been caused principally by Windermere IV's deliberate efforts to trigger the disease and control the afflicted, the problem will probably go away with the end of Macross Delta.

 

2 hours ago, SMS007 said:

I wonder. It seems fitting enough to me that when the 50th anniversary rolls around, the story could be the return of the Protoculture. Kawamori-sensei is know for developing things in the long run. Perhaps if this is where he is taking the franchise's story, then maybe Vár syndrome is in fact an intentional biological experiment by surviving hidden Protohumanoids who are preparing the galaxy for conquest.

At that point, fans would be well entitled to ask Kawamori if he's taking the piss when he says he hasn't seen Macross II... because ancient Protoculture survivors using songs to create a brainwashed army with controllable berserk aggression with an eye toward destroying that which they find displeases them or is incompatible with their culture is basically a quick description of the Mardook and their raison d'etre.

[SMS007]

1 hour ago, Seto Kaiba said:

At that point, fans would be well entitled to ask Kawamori if he's taking the piss when he says he hasn't seen Macross II... because ancient Protoculture survivors using songs to create a brainwashed army with controllable berserk aggression with an eye toward destroying that which they find displeases them or is incompatible with their culture is basically a quick description of the Mardook and their raison d'etre.

The creators have confirmed that the Marduk are Protoculture survivors?

[Seto Kaiba]

11 minutes ago, SMS007 said:

The creators have confirmed that the Marduk are Protoculture survivors?

They've stopped just short of stating it in plain, simple terms... but they've pretty thoroughly ruled out every other option except the Mardook being a surviving group of Protoculture descendants.

[UN Spacy]

This movie has EIGHT weeks before premiere. I wouldn't expect too much new footage.

[no3Ljm]

I'm just happy to know that Arad will have Armored Parts to this movie. Hence the chance of his Valk to made it to DX form is enough for me.

 

[Sildani]

Hopefully his Armored parts get released separately, so I can repaint them to match Mirage’s 31. 

[Chronocidal]

Honestly, the whole "failsafe" theory of Var syndrome sounds like an obvious thing to me.  Protoculture get smart about manufacturing their minions, and decide, "Hey, we need an easy way to control these masses in case they get uppity."  So they leave the Protoculture ruins throughout that little cluster of space to manage the races in that particular area.

The question that begs though is what changed between the development of the cluster in Delta, and Earth?  And which one actually happened first?  Earth obviously got the bird-human, and there's no way the resemblance to the Protoculture ship Windermere used wasn't on purpose.  But Earth didn't get the ruins used to seize control of the Globular cluster (that we know of), and the bird-human seemed like more of an emergency self destruct mechanism than a control override.

Var syndrome clearly took hold of the human race and Zentraedi right along with everyone originally from the Globular cluster, so it's not like the Protoculture's methods changed that much from one race to another.

[Seto Kaiba]

13 hours ago, UN Spacy said:

This movie has EIGHT weeks before premiere. I wouldn't expect too much new footage.

Keep your hopes low and your expectations lower still, otherwise you're likely to be disappointed.

 

2 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

Honestly, the whole "failsafe" theory of Var syndrome sounds like an obvious thing to me.  Protoculture get smart about manufacturing their minions, and decide, "Hey, we need an easy way to control these masses in case they get uppity."  So they leave the Protoculture ruins throughout that little cluster of space to manage the races in that particular area.

Problem is, that's inconsistent with the depiction of the Protoculture - even by their own intelligent constructs - up thru the end of the Macross Delta series.  The Protoculture haven't been depicted as a race of abusive precursors, they're more along the lines of "brilliant but absentminded".  Several times now Macross titles have featured things the Protoculture made in an attempt to solve the problem of their civilization's collapse and burying them after realizing actually using them would be a terrible idea.  Like their Evil-series super-Zentradi that became the Protodeviln, the Fold Evil with the ability to alter history on Uroboros, or the Star Shrine system's Gundam-esque design intent of eliminating conflict by giving everyone fold wave telepathy.  (Aeolia Schenberg must've been a Protoculture.)

Their wish, as expressed by more than one of their surviving constructs, was for their creations to live together in peace... not for them to be able to micromanage their creations as slaves.

 

2 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

The question that begs though is what changed between the development of the cluster in Delta, and Earth?

The prevailing in-universe theory is that it's because the Brisingr globular cluster was one of the Protoculture's last settlements in the galaxy, while Earth had been inside a region of space controlled by the Zentradi Army for aeons.

 

2 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

And which one actually happened first?

Probably Earth, its society developed to a much more advanced level than the other sub-Protoculture species, and if the theory of the Brisingr cluster being the last Protoculture settlement is true, those sub-Protoculture species are later creations than humans who were engineered during the height of the Protoculture's civilization.

 

2 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

  Earth obviously got the bird-human, and there's no way the resemblance to the Protoculture ship Windermere used wasn't on purpose.

The Birdhuman is explicitly based on the Vajra Queen.  If there's any similarity, it's probably because the Sigur Valens was also based on the Vajra.

 

2 hours ago, Chronocidal said:

Var syndrome clearly took hold of the human race and Zentraedi right along with everyone originally from the Globular cluster, so it's not like the Protoculture's methods changed that much from one race to another.

The obvious problem with that theory being that Var syndrome isn't actually part of the system's function, it was something that Windermere IV cultivated in an attempt to make it easier for them to mind control people using just the Wind Shrine aboard the Sigur Valens.  The Star Shrine was able to link the minds of everyone in the galaxy, including those who had no contact with Var syndrome.

[Chronocidal]

Fair point, maybe it's not exactly on purpose, but rather a side effect of the genetic manipulation processes the Protoculture used.

Guess my knowledge of Var syndrome isn't up to snuff though.  Is it actually a naturally occurring phenomenon among all species that Windermere just exploited, or is it actually something that could only be caused by their interference?  I know Messer seemed to have dealt with it in the past, but I don't recall if Windermere was involved in that case.

Thanks though, that does make sense for Earth to be one of their earlier experiments.  Putting in the bird human as a self destruct mechanism does make more sense if they were in a rush to vacate the area, and not able to build a more substantial failsafe system.

Edited December 14, 2017 by Chronocidal

[SMS007]

1 hour ago, Chronocidal said:

Fair point, maybe it's not exactly on purpose, but rather a side effect of the genetic manipulation processes the Protoculture used.

Guess my knowledge of Var syndrome isn't up to snuff though.  Is it actually a naturally occurring phenomenon among all species that Windermere just exploited, or is it actually something that could only be caused by their interference?  I know Messer seemed to have dealt with it in the past, but I don't recall if Windermere was involved in that case.

Vár syndrome began appearing with no apparent cause across the galaxy in the years following the end of the Vajra War. The Windermerean government merely exploited it to their advantage for their war of aggression. In Δ episode 6, it is mentioned that according to Chaos HQ, only outbreaks with high fold wave levels can be attributed to the Windermereans. 

[Seto Kaiba]

1 hour ago, Chronocidal said:

Guess my knowledge of Var syndrome isn't up to snuff though.  Is it actually a naturally occurring phenomenon among all species that Windermere just exploited, or is it actually something that could only be caused by their interference?

Based on the available information, Var syndrome is a condition that emerged very recently in the New UN Government's sphere of influence, with the first identified cases being after the Vajra war ended in September 2059.  The discovery that the disease was influenced by fold waves occurred sometime in 2062, along with the first efforts to suppress it using fold song.

Berger Stone's explanation that humanity caught the fold bacteria from the Vajra doesn't pan out, which combined with other evidence suggests the fold bacteria responsible for Var syndrome have been part of the human microbiome for tens or even hundreds of thousands of years.  If that's the case, then it strongly suggests Var syndrome would be a very rare or nonexistent condition unless deliberately triggered by consumption of food products that contain the ingredients for seidznol or the use of inimical fold song.  (Xaos didn't yet know about the combination of apples and bottled water when they linked only the incidences involving high levels of fold waves to Windermere.)

 

1 hour ago, Chronocidal said:

I know Messer seemed to have dealt with it in the past, but I don't recall if Windermere was involved in that case.

That was 2065, just two years before the events of Macross Delta... when he was an officer in the local New UN Spacy garrison on Aifheim.  As he and others note when they discover Windermere's apples-and-water scheme, both Windermere Exdel "Galaxy" apples and the bottled water from the ruins had been extensively consumed by the NUNS prior to halting imports from Windermere IV.

 

 

[terry the lone wolf]

Less Freyja.. More Mikumo...

[Convectuoso]

Less Reina... More dogfights

[SMS007]

Less idiocy... More competence...

[Seto Kaiba]

On 12/25/2017 at 9:10 AM, terry the lone wolf said:

Less Freyja.. More Mikumo...

9 hours ago, Convectuoso said:

Less Reina... More dogfights

Less Walkure, more Valkyrie.

 

 

1 hour ago, SMS007 said:

Less idiocy... More competence...

Kinda pissing into the wind there... the only competent factions in Macross Delta are the New UN Forces and Epsilon Foundation, they're both background factions and they're the only ones in this bloody story who have a clue what's actually going on.

Macross Delta's like a mecha version of The Mouse that Roared adapted for screen by Uwe Boll.

[kajnrig]

1 hour ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Less Walkure, more Valkyrie.

Less Macross, more GUNDAM!!!!!

[dizman]

Less Delta.... More Plus!

[Sildani]

Less idols, more Itanos!

[spacemanoeuvres]

22 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Macross Delta's like a mecha version of The Mouse that Roared adapted for screen by Uwe Boll.

omg ahahaha 

[UN Spacy]

NEW TRAILER!!! VERY SURPRISED this isn’t region blocked.

 

 

[Seto Kaiba]

Huh, a few mildly interesting things in the trailer...

Χάος has multiple Macross Elysion-type ships, which I guess isn't surprising given that the Macross Frontier movies did the same thing to the Macross Quarter-class.

Looks like we're also in for Walkure getting the same treatment Sheryl got in the Frontier movies.

Messer's VF-31F Delta 2 equipped with Lilldrakens?  (Odds on a Keith heel-face turn like fans thought would happen in the series?)

Putting Hayate's battroid mode dance routine from the series' first episode in the movie with a VF-31 instead.

Looking more like the twists in the Macross Delta movie will be the exact same twists from the Macross Frontier movies...  

[seti88]

wait...what?!

Spoiler

 

wait....double whaaatttt??!

Spoiler

 

Edited December 29, 2017 by seti88

[seti88]

Bandai is ready to release multiple versions of the macross quarter DX.....

[D-Joe]

Oh, some fights, then everything else is Walkure, because everything/everyone is irrelevant other than Walkure.

RIP Messer again anyway.

[cwmodels]

Looks like a Messer-Fest!

[davidwhangchoi]

messer is alive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

the best character by far. 

let someone else die pls.

[sh9000]

Looks interesting.  Need some new Macross to watch.

[wmkjr]

5 hours ago, seti88 said:

wait...what?!

I'm expecting something similar to a "LISTEN TO MY SONG!" 10 second cameo with a Vf-19Kai advance. Either that or Alto in that Armored VF.

[Mommar]

How will Bandai manage to cludge a 31 with those Mini-Drakkens?

 

Multiple Elysion ships means we'll actually see one get destroyed, which would have made more sense in the series.

Edited December 29, 2017 by Mommar

[Sildani]

Big transparent plastic adapters we’ll all bitch about. 

[no3Ljm]

For sure someone here is already trying their Lil Drakens on their Messer’s.  

Out of curiosity, this changes in Valkyrie’s setups, packs, and whatnot in a summarized movie. Is this more of a creative decision headed by Kawamori or sponsor decision by Bandai? If it’s the latter, is Kawamori being forced to do so? Feel forced to do so? I know he’s being paid and all probably under his contract and such and already did it in Frontier when he designed the Durandals for the movies. But creative direction-wise how does he feel overall?

The reason why I'm asking is that he doesn't want to go back to old series just to redo some stuff nor continue certain stories forward (e.g. SDF). Would that mean if a company tried to pay him a big sum of money, is that the only time he might do it? 

Edited December 29, 2017 by no3Ljm

[Focslain]

So anyone know what's with the angry mob at 0:14?

Also this movie seems to have an Uta Macross tie in? As the cubes at the beginning look just like the memory (plate) gachas. 

Edited December 29, 2017 by Focslain

[Seto Kaiba]

21 minutes ago, Focslain said:

So anyone know what's with the angry mob at 0:14?

Smart money says that, as with the Macross Delta TV series, the writers have decided to copy Macross Frontier... in this case, Walkure will probably be accused of being spies or being behind the Var outbreaks they control.

[Focslain]

4 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Smart money says that, as with the Macross Delta TV series, the writers have decided to copy Macross Frontier... in this case, Walkure will probably be accused of being spies or being behind the Var outbreaks they control.

Considering Freyja was already rumored as a spy in the series it makes sense here due to time crunch.