So Who Actually Likes Macross?

[Noriko Takaya]

A better question would probably be, what keeps you coming back to Macross (and Macross World?)

368277[/snapback]

Well, if you want that answer, I keep coming back to Macross because for one thing, it is a decently written series which was kind of innovative at the time of its conception (transforming planes and such), and that it is one of the first complete anime series that I had seen before American influences turned it into what it should have never been. You can say that while Speed Racer, Astro Boy, and Gigantor may have piqued my curiosity about anime from my early childhood, it was Macross which cemented my dark path down the road of otakudom in my early adulthood.

As for coming to Macross World, I like a lot of the people over here. You guys are so much more classy than the morons and idiots over at some of the other forums. I'm not saying that there aren't some of those here, but at least most of us are well rounded anime nuts who generally like to talk about Macross and other crap that comes up. Now if we could just get our animated avatars back...

[Duke Togo]

SDF Macross A great story heavily flawed by incosistant animation. The non-Anime Friend episodes look fantastic for their day. The mecha sequences in these episodes are more fluid and dynamic than much of what we see over 20 years later. I'd almost call them legendary. The strengths of the story and these brilliant flashes of animation overcome the damage done by a shoddy animation studio (Anime Friend). Its unfortunate that their work make watching an anime classic almost unbearable at times.

Macross DYRL Brilliant work, but as stated already, it cannot stand on its own merits, its needs the original series to make it complete. It may be the best Macross work ever produced. And really, you haven't lived until you've seen the uncut Hong Kong dub in all its glory.

Macross Flashback A nice little add-on to the series and the movie. Essentially a long music video, with some great new animation. Worth seeing just for the Megaroad-01 and the VF-4.

Macross II Oh, how excited I was when this came out. It never comes close to what it should be. Some of the music is fun, and it has some decent to exciting mecha designs. Worth watching as a novelty, but it really has no place amongst the franchise proper.

Macross Plus For me, the true heir to the original series. A tight story, great animation, amazing music, the love triangle, and some top notch mecha combat. No fat, no crap, just a good, hard Macross story. Clearly the direction the franchise should have gone, unfortunately...

Macross 7 I'll never get these hours of my life back again. The story goes nowhere for 50 episodes, the animation is substandard, the music is bad jpop, and it adds several elements to the Macross mythos that have no business being there (effeminate male villians, space monsters, magic, and the like). The Jar Jar Binks of the Macross franchise.

Macross Zero I've watched it twice and I still don't get it. Spinning off of the Macross 7 continuity, it just doesn't seem to fit in with the franchise. The mecha designs that pre-date the original series really seem so far more advanced, they just don't work. I'm left feeling indifferent, and I wonder if this wasn't the last gasp of a franchise that has seen its day.

[Duke Togo]

I think that if it came out that we had seen the last of Macross, I wouldn't have any problem with it. It would take a truly dynamic new Macross production to change my feelings on this.

[Dangard Ace]

SDF Macross A great story heavily flawed by incosistant animation. The non-Anime Friend episodes look fantastic for their day. The mecha sequences in these episodes are more fluid and dynamic than much of what we see over 20 years later. I'd almost call them legendary. The strengths of the story and these brilliant flashes of animation overcome the damage done by a shoddy animation studio (Anime Friend). Its unfortunate that their work make watching an anime classic almost unbearable at times.

Macross DYRL Brilliant work, but as stated already, it cannot stand on its own merits, its needs the original series to make it complete. It may be the best Macross work ever produced. And really, you haven't lived until you've seen the uncut Hong Kong dub in all its glory.

Macross Flashback A nice little add-on to the series and the movie. Essentially a long music video, with some great new animation. Worth seeing just for the Megaroad-01 and the VF-4.

Macross Plus For me, the true heir to the original series. A tight story, great animation, amazing music, the love triangle, and some top notch mecha combat. No fat, no crap, just a good, hard Macross story. Clearly the direction the franchise should have gone, unfortunately...

Macross 7 I'll never get these hours of my life back again. The story goes nowhere for 50 episodes, the animation is substandard, the music is bad jpop, and it adds several elements to the Macross mythos that have no business being there (effeminate male villians, space monsters, magic, and the like). The Jar Jar Binks of the Macross franchise.

368401[/snapback]

Since I'm too lazy, so what DT said except for

Macross II Oh, how excited I was when this came out. It never comes close to what it should be. Some of the music is fun, and it has some decent to exciting mecha designs. If anything it forced Kawamori to make MacPlus(+), Mac7(-), and MacZero(+).

Macross ZeroThe way they should have presented Mac7.

[JsARCLIGHT]

A better question would probably be, what keeps you coming back to Macross (and Macross World?) Nostalgia over a classic favorite, the ongoing new series or something else, like the toys?

368277[/snapback]

What keeps me coming back to the cartoon is nostalgia. It's been 20 years since I originally saw it on TV as Robotech and I have not seen anything that has matched my interest anime-wise since. Everyone holds certain shows on pedistals in their heart, and the original SDFM and DYRL are those shows to me. I can take or leave most of the toys and other collectables, owning them is nice but they do not keep my interest that much anymore. As for my reasons of constantly coming to Macross World I guess the main one is the people here. I originally came for information but stayed for the party if that makes sense. I'd like to think that I "know all I want to know" about Macross at this point unless something new comes out so what ties me here are the shenanigans, the goings-on if you will.

[kanedaestes]

I feel like its the Star Wars series for me. As a whole i love it, there are some parts and sections that weren't all that great sure, but i own all of the macross animes and watch them all at least once or twice a year. Its because of macross, or actually robotech since i was in germany and never knew it as macross as a kid, that i am into anime, and fighters, and all kinds of things.

[RTHK]

SDF TV (10/10)

DYRL (10/10)

FB2012 (10/10)

Mac Plus (8/10)

Mac Zero (0/10)

Mac 7 (-10/10)

Mac II (-10/10)

Edited February 9, 2006 by RTHK

[pfunk]

Series - awesome

DYRL - even more awesomeness

Flashback - never seen

Macross 2 - hated it

Macross 7 - never seen (the only thing in my life which Im afraid to do becides jumping off a perfectly good airplane)

Macross Plus - really liked it

Macross Zero - loved the mech, story line pretty good

[bsu legato]

I'd say that, as a whole, I like Macross. Sure there's chapters that I dislike, a few that actually make me angry, but the good easily outweighs the bad. Like JsARC said, there's been nothing else the the last 20 years that's captured my imagination quite the way the original Macross did.

[JKeats]

Macross' appeal always changes. When I was a kid, I just liked the show for the mecha and the toys. As a teen, I liked it because nobody else knew about it other than "Robotech". And now, I like it because it's such a classic story with a great fandom (you guys, mostly) mixed in with a healthy dose of nostalgia.

[Father Jack]

liked all of it even 7. as for why I come back here, I just like you guys. Macrossworld is truely the show that never ends.

[Final Vegeta]

I just watch everything Kawamori does.

FV

[Duke Togo]

Macross never has been my favorite anime. I wasn't really a fan coming out of Robotech (I fell in love with MOSPEADA). It wasn't until I saw DYRL? in '91 that I really got into Macross. Its also the same time I saw Gunbuster and Nausicaa, my two favorites. Macross really kicked into high gear for me when Plus came out. Its been in a slow decline ever since.

[EXO]

I'm a big SDF/DYRL fan. Flashback is an added bonus...

I don't care about the rest, including M+. I love the animation and the design of the YF-19, but when I think Macross, I want to see huge space battles with an epic story behind it.

Which brings me to M7... I don't want to see singing pilots in those huge battles, especially with reused to death sequences.

M0, like M+, great animation with good battle scenes, unlike M+ the story is completely stupid and the hero was a pansy.

M2 good designs, but more pointless story. I don't really see why they decided it wasn't good enough to be macross when the rest of the sequels fail to live up to the original.

So for me it's only the original saga that I'm interested in. I'll collect the nice looking toys but I can care less about the other serieses.

Edited February 9, 2006 by >EXO<

[yellowlightman]

I think that if it came out that we had seen the last of Macross, I wouldn't have any problem with it. It would take a truly dynamic new Macross production to change my feelings on this.

368404[/snapback]

Agreed. Despite Macross Plus being really enjoyable, it was enjoyable more on an individual level opposed to being part of the Macross continuum. It could have easily been made as a stand alone series and still been just as entertaining.

[Totoro242]

SDF TV (8/10) Awesome story, animation is spotty at times.

DYRL (7.5/10) Awesome animation, story is pretty dumb

FB2012 (7/10) Awesome animation, no story, good songs

Mac Plus (10/10) Awesome animation, awesome story

Mac 7 (7/10) Spotty animation, story drags at first

Mac D7 (7.5/10) Awesome animation, okay story

Mac 7 Movie (6.5/10) Animation could be better for a motion picture, story kinda boring, good songs

Mac Zero (6/10) Mix of CG and cel animation poorly executed, story pretty lame.

Mac 2 (6.5/10) Spotty animation, weak story

Overall, I'd say Macross is 65% collecting (books, toys, posters, etc) and 35% the animation.

Edited February 9, 2006 by Totoro242

[Duke Togo]

M0, like M7, great animation with good battle scenes

368523[/snapback]

LOL, I must have missed the episode of Macross 7 that had those things in them. Which one was it?

[ghostryder]

Love SDF and DYRL, of course DYRL wouldn't have had the same impact if i hadn't watched SDF first.

M+ and M0 didn't do anything for me, but I dont' watch much anime to begin with, beyond the classics. M+ was corny, and M0 just failed to realize it's full potential. Most of the mecha design are cool, but their coolness was augmented by the superior animation and choregraphed fight scenes. Imagine these new mecha done by Animefriend!

Edited February 9, 2006 by ghostryder

[Dante74]

DYRL= (great)

SDF= (really great)

Macross 2012= (nothing special)

Macross II= (haven't seen it)

Macross += (good)

Macross 7= (I've seen episode 1, won't see the rest of it)

Macross Zero= (great battles, stupid hippie story)

I have to admit that I'm mostly in it for the greatest mecha designs ever.

That's why I have to stop myself from FF to the action scenes like it's a porn movie.

[J A Dare]

A better question would probably be, what keeps you coming back to Macross (and Macross World?) Nostalgia over a classic favorite, the ongoing new series or something else, like the toys?

368277[/snapback]

a little bit of everything...but yeah...mostly nostalgia.

[EXO]

M0, like M7, great animation with good battle scenes

368523[/snapback]

LOL, I must have missed the episode of Macross 7 that had those things in them. Which one was it?

368539[/snapback]

Ooops, yeah that was totally ridiculous... I meant like M+...

fixed.

Damn, that whole post was f'd up... I meant M2 when I put M+.

Edited February 9, 2006 by >EXO<

[bsu legato]

Ooops, yeah that was totally ridiculous... I meant like M+...

fixed.

Damn, that whole post was f'd up... I meant M2 when I put M+.

368572[/snapback]

Clearly you're having some sort of alergic reaction to employment.

[areaseven]

Here's how I rank the Macross continuity as a whole (from best to worst):

Macross Plus

Macross TV Series

Macross: Do You Remember Love?

Macross Zero

Macross VF-X2

Macross: Flashback 2012

Macross 7

Macross 7: The Galaxy is Calling Me!

Macross Digital Mission VF-X

Macross M3

Macross II: Lovers Again

Macross Dynamite 7

[Skullsixx]

Being a visually oriented person, I would say that I fell in love with the TV series when I first saw it as RT (age 12). Now that I am older (age 34) I am more critical of it.

I do feel the story is more complete and detailed than DYRL, but I have such a hard time watching the series now due to the quality of animation. I recently re-watched it about 3 yrs. ago. I admit I love that fact that Kawamori always refers back to DYRL as the "official" visuals (mecha/character designs) of the Macross origins.

I absolutely loved Mac Plus and Zero, although I think Zero lacked a bit in story development. As far as Mac 7 and Mac II, I never really bothered because of the negativity in opinion that surrounds them. I do admit when I buy anime I stay away from series and lean more towards OVA and anime movies because I know their overall quality will be better and more consistent. I am also not that enthusuastic about watching Mac II due to Kawamori having nothing to do with it, and Mac 7's whole idea of watching some guy cruise around in his VF-19 while playing guitar is not that appealing to me. Although I am very curious to see what happens to Max and Millia. Unfortunately, the anime DVD rental store near me does not carry Mac 7 and has no plans to. Oh well...

[JB0]

It's kinda funny... so many people in here refused to watch 7 because of the hgih-profile negative feedback, but that's part of why I went to the trouble of finding it. I wanted to have some sort of experience with it so I could judge it myself. And whadda ya know, I DIDN'T get hit with the urge to gouge my eyes out.

[Roy Focker]

Why all the long answers?

Here's a short one.

While not all parts are equal it still gets an "A" on the report card as a whole.

[Mr March]

Why all the long answers?

368629[/snapback]

Because truely constructive, enjoyable discourse about Macross occurs so rarely on this website, I sieze the opportunity to talk extensively about the wonderful merits of this amazing anime franchise.

[Sundown]

Somehow in the sequel series they just manage to lose the grand and epic feel of it all.

368265[/snapback]

I'm of the opposite oipnion. I feel the sequels add to the the epic feel of it all.

Graham

368323[/snapback]

I can understand that. I just find that sometimes I expect things to go a certain way, or retain a certain feel, and the sequels often go in their own direction, and not one that I care for. Sequels and prequels also often explain things you loved about the original away, or cast it in a light that makes it much lesser than what you'd experienced in trying to outdo it. Sometimes the mystery is lost, and is just replaced with, "what, that's it?!"

Not every sequel does that of course, especially those planned from the getgo as a trilogy or part of a comprehensive story arc... but I find that the ones written from a mindset several years or decades removed from the original tend to.

I mean, at the end of SDF, you imagine the protoculture and supervision army as powerful, otherworldly aliens, even more strange and inscrutable than the Zentradi. And then we get Macross 7, which shows them to be hentai monsters or space elves. Zero's presentation of the Aphos is a little better, but the giant purple flower thing at the end isn't something that really put fear into me.

The only exception I can think of offhand are the Star Trek movies with the original crew (or at least the good ones). It added grit along with better special effects and designs to the storytelling, and retained the soul of the original while shedding the campyness. The universe actually felt bigger now that the Klingons wheren't just badly dressed men with evil mustaches. But of course, I'm largely ignoring the odd numbered movies when I say that.

[JB0]

I can understand that.  I just find that sometimes I expect things to go a certain way, or retain a certain feel, and the sequels often go in their own direction, and not one that I care for.  Sequels and prequels also often explain things you loved about the original away, or cast it in a light that makes it much lesser than what you'd experienced in trying to outdo it.  Sometimes the mystery is lost, and is just replaced with, "what, that's it?!"

Or in one word: midochlorians.

I mean, at the end of SDF, you imagine the protoculture and supervision army as powerful, otherworldly aliens, even more strange and inscrutable than the Zentradi.  And then we get Macross 7, which shows them to be hentai monsters or space elves. 

That was the protodeviln, which were next-gen Zentradi(sort of).

The protoculture were represented by one hologram, which looked like a bald human male.

The only exception I can think of offhand are the Star Trek movies with the original crew (or at least the good ones).  It added grit along with better special effects and designs to the storytelling, and retained the soul of the original while shedding the campyness.  The universe actually felt bigger now that the Klingons wheren't just badly dressed men with evil mustaches.  But of course, I'm largely ignoring the odd numbered movies when I say that.

368698[/snapback]

What was wrong with Search for Spock?

And Voyage Home was as campy as any original series episode.

I know it's popular, but the odds rule doesn't really work. Just say 1 and 5 sucked.

[Sundown]

Or in one word: midochlorians.

*shudder*

That was the protodeviln, which were next-gen Zentradi(sort of).

The protoculture were represented by one hologram, which looked like a bald human male.

I haven't watched enough of it, and I'm still kind of confused what's what. But I don't care what they are. Hentai bulldog monsters and space fairies!

What was wrong with Search for Spock?

And Voyage Home was as campy as any original series episode.

I know it's popular, but the odds rule doesn't really work. Just say 1 and 5 sucked.

368727[/snapback]

You know, this is probably the most screwed up thing I'm ever going to say. But I think I actually liked Star Trek TMP. I probably have to watch it again to accurately gauge its actual suckitude, but the idea of V'ger being Voyager meshed with an alien was pretty darn neat.

Search for Spock was watchable, except all that running around on a foggy planet that wasn't Dagobah, and kids ruin movies, even if it's kid Spock. Voyage Home wasn't so much campy as it was Disney and traditionally cheezy. But man, Earth actually gets wasted, and in the end, a good time was had by all.

Yes, 5 (I'm not even going to bother trying to remember its name) was of most extreme suckness. That's undebatable.

Back on topic: Why'm I here? Nostalgia over SDF and related toys. The 1/48 VF-1 is simply an incredible fulfillment of my childhood dream. I'd always wanted a toy that looked and felt like the 1/48 does, and to my continual dismay, none of the toys that were available in my childhood were satisfying enough. The designs had a certain feel that was always lost in toys and most models, but somehow, the 1/48 captured most of that and more. It really blows my mind that anyone ever made such a thing... I'd thought it impossible.

And I stick around for the antics. Even when there's not much Macross news available, MW's still a place to discuss things I enjoy with people who at least have a somewhat like mind, and have at least some of the same tastes. Things usually involve sci-fi, games, and other innane things, although they do veer off into more serious topics that I just have too hard a time resisting the urge to jump into. Anyway, it's a place to chat with folks who've shared a big and somewhat unique chunk of my childhood. So if you liked Macross, you can't be that bad... even if you think boobies on a valk are the greatest things since real ones.

Edited February 10, 2006 by Sundown

[the white drew carey]

I like all Macross and your question is dumb. Go burn in hell!

[the white drew carey]

Haha! Just kidding.

Seriously, although the Macross storyline is a rare gem, only equaled by UC Gundam, and only surpassed by my fave, Patlabor (I can be biased, after all), the biggest attraction to Macross, as with all anime I am interested in, is it's visual appeal.

You see, animation is, after all, a visual medium. And Studio Nue works very hard to be cinematic in scope and detail, with great designs. Even MacII, while somewhat lacking in delivery (although the story isn't bad at all) has great characters (of course, look who did them) and some nifty, sleak, variations on the VF design.

Although I begrudge Shoji's idea of VF's with faces in Mac7, it's still a very deep and well-done anime... with great visuals.

So, yes, I actually like Macross. In visual appeal coupled with story-telling, which is one of my main interests in anime, it ranks at the top with such works as the Patlabor films, Wings of Honneamise, as well as Miyazaki and Ghibli films.

p.s.- Your question is still dumb.

Edited February 10, 2006 by the white drew carey

[JB0]

That was the protodeviln, which were next-gen Zentradi(sort of).

The protoculture were represented by one hologram, which looked like a bald human male.

I haven't watched enough of it, and I'm still kind of confused what's what. But I don't care what they are. Hentai bulldog monsters and space fairies!

Touch-e-with-an-accent.

What was wrong with Search for Spock?

And Voyage Home was as campy as any original series episode.

I know it's popular, but the odds rule doesn't really work. Just say 1 and 5 sucked.

368727[/snapback]

You know, this is probably the most screwed up thing I'm ever going to say. But I think I actually liked Star Trek TMP. I probably have to watch it again to accurately gauge its actual suckitude, but the idea of V'ger being Voyager meshed with an alien was pretty darn neat.

Search for Spock was watchable, except all that running around on a foggy planet that wasn't Dagobah, and kids ruin movies, even if it's kid Spock. Voyage Home wasn't so much campy as it was Disney and traditionally cheezy. But man, Earth actually gets wasted, and in the end, a good time was had by all.

Yes, 5 (I'm not even going to bother trying to remember its name) was of most extreme suckness. That's undebatable.

Oh yeah, the original was quite neat conceptually. It just failed in the execution.

Part of the problem was Paramount was trying to west control from Roddenberry. They forced a cowriter onto the project, and they didn't see eye-to-eye on anything. Both sides were constantly rewriting the script and handing ot off to the actors without passing them by their "partner." Then the other side would find out, change it back, and pass THAT to the actors. They literally didn't know what they were going to be filming until the day of the shoot for any given scene.

Infighting and politics isn't a good way to write a movie.

5 was The Final Frontier. They wasted a perfectly good series catch-phrase on a complete turd.

And I stick around for the antics.  Even when there's not much Macross news available, MW's still a place to discuss things I enjoy with people who at least have a somewhat like mind, and have at least some of the same tastes.  Things usually involve sci-fi, games, and other innane things, although they do veer off into more serious topics that I just have too hard a time resisting the urge to jump into.  

Same here.

MW also has a lower idiot quota than many other groups, both real-world and internet. Makes it a lot easier to have an intelligent conversation.

So if you liked Macross, you can't be that bad... even if you think boobies on a valk are the greatest things since real ones.

But if mechs are good, and boobs are good, then mecha boobs SHOULD be the greatest thing in the world, right?

...

Or does this only apply to Mazinger-style rocket mechboobs?

[Radd]

I love Macross, even the one where they blew up the Enterprise and it turned out Minmay's singing abilities came from medichlorians.

Wait...

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

When you talk about hentai monster what they could have done is make the PD truly evil spirits. Presenting the demonic possession as something horrific.

Mylene (ends up a pilot) gives birth to a demonic child possessed by protodevlin. (rosemary's baby ) The child grows up with superhuman strength and like a dragon ball z character goes out of control and wrecks mecha with his supernatural powers. Scientists are at odds to figure out why this child is so strong.

This becomes the story of macross 7 experiments to uncover the mysteries of the PD and if the legends from ancient accounts are true. Now instead of vampires with strange masks, you have ghosts killing and possessing the crew of the ship and paranoia (like john carpenter's "the thing") between crew members. You have vf11s versus vf17s, vf19s going rogue and killing innocent people, that kind of thing. Put in lots of blood, gore and maybe even gruesome ways of dying like in DYRL. Perhaps have somebody being physically eaten by a monster and having thier body ripped apart because the demons are feeding off life energy and need to become cannibals like what you see in zombie flicks. (ie but make the victims scream in terror from the pain like in jurrassic park or jaws)

If macross 7 had been a sci-fi horror show that would have worked so well with me. (given my love of aliens and how they used that robot to fight the queen) But it wasn't mysterious or serious enough for me to hold my interest and in a sense was too comercial. Sound weapons and sound waves could have been presented in a less cheesy way. (look at spiderman and venom. Venom is essentially a vampiric alien entity but even though he is just a comic character he is really frightening, yet despite being such a bad ass, it is sound waves that is his weakness. That is what I want the vampiric possessed soldier to behave like.

I see the discovery of other dimensions as like opening the gate to hell. (they could portray the aliens in that dimension as being strange HP Lovecraft style creatures with no remorse or care for humans but 10 times more creepy than the ones in the show. If the Zentradi are "Satan's Dolls", soldiers who are slaves and programmed to just kill planets and rape other alien lifeforms by wiping them out of existence, then the protodevlin must be something even more scary than these guys. Especially when you see Exedol's reaction to the word protodevlin even though hes seen it all. The imagery of the protodevlin in macross 7 just didn't warrant exedol's reaction of being scared and comes off as unrealistic.

They could have made the possession of soldiers so much more scary and frightening but they decided not to. It was too commercial, bright, happy, and unrealistic and music took away any sense of danger that was present from the previous tv series where humans were struggling for survival. At no point did you feel basara could be killed off because he was like a super hero in a super robot.

Edited February 12, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker