1/1 LowViz Lurker Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) It kinda looks like it can take a beating more because its squat. As a fan of the tall banpresto style of robot, (where the limbs are allowed to be a little gangly) I think the model kit looks better though. I just think valks are about speed and are more nimble than your typical robot. Only when they have armor can they look tough. If they look a bit bulky in naked form it goes against the idea that the "fighter mode is more important than battroid" which is how I have always felt it should be. (and why I like yamato's focus on that mode for designs that feature lots of anime magick distortion) Edited October 8, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1/1 LowViz Lurker Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) If future bandai macross robots inherit the chunky munky gene, I won't mind so long as they also do 1/72 kits as well. I never thought I would think to buy the kits, but I'm seriously thinking of getting them all now, since I tend to be the type to display my stuff not play with it much. Part of that admitedly is because I am just afriad something will wear or stress, but the other part is that I just like to look at them more than actually whoosh them around the place like a little kid. Bandai made a good decision to make the kits transformable imo. Edited October 8, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfx Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 hmmm~~~ After seeing the final pics, I agree.... This is crap. Too many compromises made for each mode. Ozama's battroid pic (with the ankle joints fully extended) reminds me of Urkel. Funniest post today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted October 8, 2008 Author Share Posted October 8, 2008 Ok, that just sucks. "Hip joint attachment" comparison: That's not bad proportions, that's just flat-out in the wrong spot. That'd be like having the YF-19's wings hanging off the knees instead of the hips, or the YF-21's tailfins on the bicep. If the hips were merely level with the crotch, it'd be bad but acceptable. But this??--they're on either side of the nosecone, yeesh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Arms Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 If the hips weren't attached to the crotch in the wrong place, then the battroid would have a leaner, taller look. The more comparison pics I see, the more upset I get at how Bandai did such a lackluster job with this toy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 If the hips weren't attached to the crotch in the wrong place, then the battroid would have a leaner, taller look. The more comparison pics I see, the more upset I get at how Bandai did such a lackluster job with this toy. yup, and then the chest would be more proportional as would the legs and thus the arms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted October 8, 2008 Author Share Posted October 8, 2008 A hip swingbar like the model would fix 90% of the toy's problems. (Gear would still suck) I mean, it is possible they're keeping it hidden (like Yamato did about the -19's shoulders) but it really doesn't look like there's any way it could happen--no hinge line, joint, or anything is visible. Plus that's such a big thing it really shouldn't be a "bonus surprise" like the -19's shoulders. ::edit:: Hmmn, if the swingbar was actually in the back of the hip itself, instead of in the pelvis, it could exist in the current photos. But that's wishful thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 A hip swingbar like the model would fix 90% of the toy's problems. (Gear would still suck) I mean, it is possible they're keeping it hidden (like Yamato did about the -19's shoulders) but it really doesn't look like there's any way it could happen--no hinge line, joint, or anything is visible. Plus that's such a big thing it really shouldn't be a "bonus surprise" like the -19's shoulders. I'd get one if they fixed the hips. Fighter mode is still a gappy mess so I don't care about the gears but at least battroid would look decent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted October 8, 2008 Author Share Posted October 8, 2008 Late edit: a swingbar would fix 90% of the *battroid* problems. (I don't know how to get the legs above the shield in fighter) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think the gullet on the VF-25 is still larger than on the Yamato YF-19 (the YF-19's isn't large enough to bother me). It's like Ranka's bulge at Sheryl's concert, disturbing... Not defending Bandai, but just to point out that the VF-25 is supposed to have quite a large gullet. The YF-19 isn't supposed to have a large gullet at all, and to me is a lot more bothersome. I'm not pulling punches for each side, I'm calling it like I see it. I'm not even sure if what we are seeing is definitely indicative of the final toy, I'll wait until someone gets the production toy overseas in 2 month and gives us the brutally honest review with pics. The main things I worry about are the hip placement, and landing gear. I want accurate hip placement, perhaps via a sliding, interlocking joint. Then I want landing gear that are not mosquito like. like the ones on the model, and not too short like we saw on a previous test shot. Hell even the guys who built the kits in HLJ cut down some of the insertion tabs for the landing gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Late edit: a swingbar would fix 90% of the *battroid* problems. (I don't know how to get the legs above the shield in fighter) I think the low legs in fighter mode is because there wasn't room to put in decent landing gear so they needed to keep the legs themselves hanging low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anime52k8 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Late edit: a swingbar would fix 90% of the *battroid* problems. (I don't know how to get the legs above the shield in fighter) I don't know why the legs AERN'T above the shield already. they look like they should be able to go up further, but they don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UN Spacy Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 There's no way Kawamori will allow this to be released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruskiiVFaussie Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 There's no way Kawamori will allow this to be released. lol he could always pull a "ohh that's what it's supposed to be as i envisioned after making the series" like he's done for VF-0 CF colour scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anime52k8 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 lol he could always pull a "ohh that's what it's supposed to be as i envisioned after making the series" like he's done for VF-0 CF colour scheme. which is code for "as long as they pay me, I don't give a crap about what they do anymore" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UN Spacy Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 BTW. Are the Japanese fans that aren't on MW aware of the problems with this VF-25? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfx Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 There's no way Kawamori will allow this to be released. For all you know, Bandai does't give a hoot wat Kawamori thinks. Bandai != Yamato. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruskiiVFaussie Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) BTW. Are the Japanese fans that aren't on MW aware of the problems with this VF-25? is it even possible they are that ignorant or uncaring? Wouldn't bandai have feedback branches that can score some much needed customer info on if it's gonna be a seller or if (as it does) suck?? For all you know, Bandai does't give a hoot wat Kawamori thinks. Bandai != Yamato. Nah Yamato atleast strives for perfection, where as Bandai are going for the kiddy grade toy compared. I think we should just fob this off as a second rate and maybe they will do a better version later on before Yamato gets their mits on the license and show them up. Edited October 8, 2008 by ruskiiVFaussie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anime52k8 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) is it even possible they are that ignorant or uncaring? Wouldn't bandai have feedback branches that can score some much needed customer info on if it's gonna be a seller? maybe the Japanese fans actually want a chunkier looking mech. obviously for the most part we here want a anime accurate toy, but since the people on this site are predominantly from area's where Bandai can't officially sell these anyway it would make sence that they aren't too focused on what we want since we're not the primary market for these. Edited October 8, 2008 by anime52k8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickayesou Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badboy00z Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I don't know why the legs AERN'T above the shield already. they look like they should be able to go up further, but they don't. Maybe the lazy photographer just didn't position them right. I really doubt they will release something that has an obvious gap like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vifam7 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) is it even possible they are that ignorant or uncaring? Wouldn't bandai have feedback branches that can score some much needed customer info on if it's gonna be a seller or if (as it does) suck?? The feeling I get from Japanese fans is that - if you want accuracy you build a model kit. And that chogoukins are for kids or nostalgia old-timers. This mindset may be related to how Gundam is also treated. Ever since the advent of Gundam and the "real robot" genre, plastic models have been the backbone of its success. Fans themselves seem to snort at buying a "toy". Perhaps the realism of the mecha and the sophisticated stories suggested that (insert anime title) is more adult-like and thus = kids buy toys - adults build models mindset. Edited October 8, 2008 by Vifam7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) For all you know, Bandai does't give a hoot wat Kawamori thinks. Bandai != Yamato. Kawamori might also not give a hoot what Yamato thinks. The man is hard to track down, it might be because he doesn't want to be bothered making toys. Hell I'd be made if a company that makes toys on my designs keeps making stuff with flawed first releases, with something going wrong nearly all the time, and if a great release has a less than warm reception on account of a dumbass at the factory deciding to put pins in the wrong way resulting in arms falling off. At the same token the VF-25 toy may have turned out the way it did because of his requests. Plus..lately look at the Yamato VF-11 and the tiny tailfins shown in the 1/60 CAD. Those are absolutely terrible, and if he approved those tiny things, well maybe he just doesn't care anymore. Even if Yamato was doing the 25, he may have asked for the same changes he asked from Bandai. Bandai can't officially sell these anyway it would make sence that they aren't too focused on what we want since we're not the primary market for these. Pretty much. Nah Yamato atleast strives for perfection, where as Bandai are going for the kiddy grade toy compared.Perfection my a55, look at the tailfins on the new VF-11 and the broken arm VF-1S 2.0 Maybe perfection in looks, but that's about it, and even then, the only one that aimed for a balanced look was the new VF-1, everything else before emphasized the fighter mode, and the new VF-11's fighter mode is disappointing due to tiny tail fins. To play with the big boys, you have to up the quality control. Yes they have improved. No it still isn't perfect. Yes you can fix an arm but shouldn't have to pay $30 more to do so and fix a new toy out of the box. I hold hopes that the final test shots of the 25 have detailed, longer landing gear, provision for installation of a 2nd cockpit, and of course, accurate hip placement. Edited October 8, 2008 by Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 hah, people bitch about the short tail fins on the 1/60 VF-11 and yet the numerous flaws in every single mode of the VF-25 get a pass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 hah, people bitch about the short tail fins on the 1/60 VF-11 and yet the numerous flaws in every single mode of the VF-25 get a pass? Hey I hope the problems on both toys are fixed. I've already said what I wanted to see fixed on the 25, I'm just hopeful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Hey I hope the problems on both toys are fixed. I've already said what I wanted to see fixed on the 25, I'm just hopeful. after being promised expansive sweeping changes to all of the DX's flaws since the first blurry pics... and after being disappointed time after time... I have zero faith that Bandai will fix those errors. Again, at least with yamato a relatively simple thing like materials changes or better training will fix most of their issues, unfortunately sticking some POM on the hips won't magically properly align them or allow the legs to stow properly in fighter mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Again, at least with yamato a relatively simple thing like materials changes or better training will fix most of their issues, unfortunately sticking some POM on the hips won't magically properly align them or allow the legs to stow properly in fighter mode. None of those will fix the VF-11 stabilizers. The translation vifam provided a while back said that the test shot was early, and that improved ones would be shown later, the full color pics shown yesterday seem to be of the very same test shot, I hold hope that the ones we have seen are not final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Well, I hope that given the price of this thing, it will have the same durability of the Soul of Chogokin. I have plenty of those - er - well, no - I have three of those ... and all of them are in fact perfect in terms of QC. Yamato is improving. But in fairness, Yamato have been doing ONLY the most complicated variable mecha out there (imo). Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 None of those will fix the VF-11 stabilizers. The translation vifam provided a while back said that the test shot was early, and that improved ones would be shown later, the full color pics shown yesterday seem to be of the very same test shot, I hold hope that the ones we have seen are not final. do we even have confirmation that the CAD shot we saw official? There was some debate about that afaik... and I can't believe you seem to consider a partial CAD render to be more final than a painted and transforming plastic prototype, complete with promotional type backgrounds and poses. Yes, bandai has the money and the talent to go back and re-engineer the whole thing to make it work and to make it look like a modern toy, but like I've always said about Bandai and Macross, they just don't care enough to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I can't believe you seem to consider a partial CAD render to be more final than a painted and transforming plastic prototype, complete with promotional type backgrounds and poses. Wasn't there talk not too long ago about how once Yamato puts something into the CAD stage, that what we are seeing is pretty much what we are getting? Yes, bandai has the money and the talent to go back and re-engineer the whole thing to make it work and to make it look like a modern toy, but like I've always said about Bandai and Macross, they just don't care enough to do it. No I think they know what compromises they have to deal with and that is why they are giving us 3 choices, get the model, the 1/100 or the DX. I am glad we have variety. When has any company done that for Macross? None since Takatoku. Now I've already said what I want fixed on this toy, if they don't fix the crotch it's dissapointing, the gaps between the legs make me think that the legs are simply not raised up high enough. Also the fact that we have not seen the refined test shots that have been mentioned. Overall though, it is not enough to prevent me from buying the toys. To me, something can look good even if it is not accurate. Same reason I like the CMS Legioss. No if something is completely off like the DX Macross 7 toys, yes then I have reservations but the DX 25 looks good to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vifam7 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 do we even have confirmation that the CAD shot we saw official? There was some debate about that afaik... and I can't believe you seem to consider a partial CAD render to be more final than a painted and transforming plastic prototype, complete with promotional type backgrounds and poses. Yes, bandai has the money and the talent to go back and re-engineer the whole thing to make it work and to make it look like a modern toy, but like I've always said about Bandai and Macross, they just don't care enough to do it. Please. It's not about caring. It's about what design and direction they decided upon (however wrong it may feel to some of us). And really, if they really didn't care then why did they bother sponsoring Macross Frontier in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nani?! Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) Nothing craptastic gets a pass in my book. Nothing from Bandai or Yamato. There are many of us here who actually looked forward to what Bandai could (as we see with the model vf-25) can bring to the table for the fans... it's unfortunate that their DX team sucked @SS... Money that would have gone to this crap is now being reverted to the 1/60 vf-1 line I always wanted... It's unfortunate... but it still doesnt take away from the fact that had the right people worked on it from Bandai, it'd be a different story. I dont know why comments like "if yamato made it...", "yamato strives for perfection" or "bandai cares to give us options" are being made though..... Yamato only recently reached their A game with valkyries.... It almost took a good decade for them to perfect the craft... Do I think that yamato, with the level they are at now, can do a better job than bandai did with the DX, NO DOUBT... but it took them a while to get to this level. This is also bandai's first attempt at Macross in a while. It's not fair to say they are purposely making crappy inaccurate valks because they can give a rats ass... How is this a valid argument? and How will you prove this? because they made their living off a gundam for a while? Yamato strives for perfection, I agree... Every serious company does... but they've also time and time again made the same dumb mistakes repeatedly and as a result deservedly so.... they've gotten chewed for it. Bandai, I guarantee, will see a greater wrath of fans if they neglect to address the problems they made with this DX release with future releases... if there are any future releases.... And Shin... Bandai simply has the resources and the divisions to make three different lines. It has nothing to do with giving us options with a heart. All the options really served is to show that side by side, even their own product (the model) proved that their DX team underperformed. Eugimon... If anyone else gave just half the amount of criticism you gave the DX to a yamato product, you would have called them a whiney, nit-picking, dead horse beater... Many here, including myself, agree with you, the DX sucks... but you're making it grossly apparent that you're just as biased as all the " yamato-haters" were... If I can only pull up and repost the crap you gave Dave and myself for complaining about the yf-19... hehehehe~ Good thing, I'm lazy.... Edited October 8, 2008 by Nani?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
recon Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 (edited) Hi guys, Im not sure whether these pictures have being posted but anyway here they are: VF-25F VF-25S These pictures defintely looks alot better than the prototype or final version shots posted previously Edited October 8, 2008 by recon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiotheforsaken Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Those were posted a few pages back and are what most of the conversation has been about since. Personally I'm still not impressed, but will wait to pass judgement until I see a review of some kind with definite production images. Still heavily leaning towards pass though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maximilian_jenius Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 bandai is showing only the best... but... WE WANT LANDING GEARS PHOTOS!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts