Do You Want For Japan To Start Producing Original

[Phalanx]

Here's yet another good topic started by me phalanx,.Despite the fact that the FS-X now known as the F-2 is somewhat original even though it resembles the F-16

I was just wondering why doesn't Japan just start producing their own original aircraft, primarily based off of actual designs seen in anime like macross or yukikaze. I think it would be cool to see a fighter like the vf-19 or vf-22 actually made by Mitsubishi heavy industries.

If that were to happen, SK would be boosted like hell and be rich bitch!!!!!

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I would rather see him make specifically toy robots that transform into vehicles than just plain aircraft.

I think Sony's AIBO should have been a transformable dog like the Gaia gundam in Gundam Seed Destiny!

[JB0]

Because there's no market for real planes based on fictional designs that might not even be flyable.

[azrael]

Why? Because they're fictional planes.

[the white drew carey]

I like how you start off with "Here's yet another good topic started by me phalanx..."

Why doesn't Japan start producing and designing their own jets based off of anime? Well, most aircraft designs in anime are aredynamically unfeasible in the real world, and designers who put a lot of thought into their designs, like Kawamori, are at best, amateur aerodynamic engineers.

The reasons are myriad and, in reality, the real question which would spark more discussion is: Why doesn't Japan produce their own original aircraft, primarily based off of actual designs seen in anime like macross or yukikaze?

[Knight26]

*rolls eyes, shakes head and walks away*

[David Hingtgen]

The F-2 doesn't just resemble an F-16, it IS an F-16, with a few changes for the Japanese market. (Wings 25% larger all around, enhanced anti-ship capability, and 1 extra fuselage bay ahead of the fin) It's built under license from Lockheed-Martin, and the engines come straight from the US. Little different from the F-15J---built in Japan, but under license from MDC with engines from the US. The F-16E/F is also basically a custom modification of the design for the UAE, only it's still built in the US.

Japan hasn't done an original design since the NAMC Y-11 I think. (A 1960's turboprop airliner)

[Duke Togo]

[Phyrox]

This is one of the lamest topics we have had here in a while...

[Sdf-1]

Phalanx, you want them to be transformable too, do ya?

[JB0]

This is one of the lamest topics we have had here in a while...

375826[/snapback]

It's all HG's fault.

[Phalanx]

Phyrox, I don't mean to be disrespectful but please tell me what exactly do you find lame about my topic? IMHO, I believe that it is a good question I think that this something that you should think about, who knows maybe you might find it interesting. BTW Sdf-1, I don't really want them to transform since the technology to do so is decades away from the present.

P.S Thanks White Drew Carey for the comment on how I started my thread.

[JB0]

Phyrox, I don't mean to be disrespectful but please tell me what exactly do you find lame about my topic?

Maybe the fact that you think anime planes are plausable?

...

Is this guy for real? HAS to be a joke account...

[Sdf-1]

Is this guy for real? HAS to be a joke account...

375888[/snapback]

It must be A1 himself!

[wolfx]

lol. I'd say because anime fighters aren't that practical in design.

And another reason for them to not be more creative in their design is pobably because their army is purely for self-defence (or so they claim) and thus have no research funds pumped into military applications.

But we all know they are secretly constructing a mobile suit underground of tokyo, and have cute school girls as their Ultimate Weapon somewhere in Hokkaido.

[JB0]

But we all know they are secretly constructing a mobile suit underground of tokyo, and have cute school girls as their Ultimate Weapon somewhere in Hokkaido.

375891[/snapback]

It's okay. Tokyo gets razed weekly, so their mobile suit never gets finished.

[Phalanx]

Yes JB0 I honestly do find anime fighter jets plausible and I think that they have an innovative land sleek look to them that rival the designs Real world fighters, Thats just my opinion.

[Sdf-1]

I think they should start building the Sdf-1 for god's sake. Would be a good place for all of us to live our elderly days onboard.

[JB0]

I think they should start building the Sdf-1 for god's sake. Would be a good place for all of us to live our elderly days onboard.

375907[/snapback]

And where's my Voltron lions, dammit?

[yellowlightman]

Assuming this thread is a joke, it's the funniest joke we've had around here in a long time.

[Graham]

The F-2 doesn't just resemble an F-16, it IS an F-16, with a few changes for the Japanese market. (Wings 25% larger all around, enhanced anti-ship capability, and 1 extra fuselage bay ahead of the fin) It's built under license from Lockheed-Martin, and the engines come straight from the US.  Little different from the F-15J---built in Japan, but under license from MDC with engines from the US.  The F-16E/F is also basically a custom modification of the design for the UAE, only it's still built in the US. 

Japan hasn't done an original design since the NAMC Y-11 I think.  (A 1960's turboprop airliner)

375811[/snapback]

I seem to recall reading that the F-2 ended up costing about six times the cost of a basic F-16. Am I correct? If so why?

Graham

[wolfx]

Yes JB0 I honestly do find anime fighter jets plausible and I think that they have an innovative land sleek look to them that rival the designs Real world fighters, Thats just my opinion.

375901[/snapback]

I, like you, feel that anime fighters look cool and MIGHT be plausible.

But considering i'm no aero-nut unlike most of the people on this forum who are, and some of them fighter pilots, I'd take their word for it if I were you, that anime-planes aren't quite plausible.

[Phalanx]

OK wolfx in you insist, but for some reason I feel that just SOME of them look as if they could be made into actual fighters. Not with the trademark features that they have in the anime series but with current technology like the triple redundant fly by wire control system, GPS and stealth capabilities. I already know that a pin point barrier system can't be produced for a fighter during this age.

[JB0]

OK wolfx in you insist, but for some reason I feel that just SOME of them look as if they could be made into actual fighters.

Which is the point. They LOOK like they could work.

How many flying machines LOOKED like they could work, but didn't?

[Sundown]

Aeronautic engineers rarely design something based on a design that wasn't designed by an aeronautic engineer. And an aeronautic engineer's primary concern is how well something flies, rather than getting something that looks neat but doesn't actually fly well to fly. Ie, designing planes to look like one out of a particular anime serves no one except anime fanboys, and that's really not their job or business.

[Gaijin]

Do you know nothing of foreign policy? It's forbidden. Japan can only maintain a military for self defense purposes and cannot project militray power otherwise. They would run into all kinds of problems from the postwar constitution, building their own fighters stemming from the infamous article 9; in fact that's why the FS-X (F-2) had strong opposition and problems at the start.

As far as Japan getting more advanced fighters, they may soon someday have F-22 Raptors as their are plans in the works to make that happen (prob stripped down some).

Edited March 3, 2006 by Gaijin

[David Hingtgen]

That's what the constitution says, but the F-2 and F-15J are equal to, and in some ways superior, to the US versions. They retain full long-range strike capability and long-range missiles, mid-air refueling, and all sorts of other features that wouldn't be needed for self defense, THAT ARE OFTEN DELETED FOR OTHER NATIONS.

Basically, many export versions of US planes are stripped down, especially in regards to anything that helps with long-range strikes (mid-air refueling, extra fuel tanks, long-range radar, etc). But not for Japan.

It's a big joke for aviation enthusiasts about the "Self Defense" part of Japan's Air Force/airplanes. It's as utterly capable of sending planes far away and striking as the USAF. And they're looking at building small carriers, possibly even ones capable of taking JSF's. Carriers are for power projection, not self-defense.

PS--for Graham: I don't know what the official number is, but the F-2 does cost MUCH more than a regular F-16. Because the only thing more expensive than designing a new plane, is trying to re-design an existing one. Also, they wanted to use Japanese electronics--and they really don't mesh well with proprietary US avionics. The F-16 is designed for very specific electronics, and to try to redesign the entire avionics suite costs as much as the plane itself. They did it, but it delayed the program by years and made the plane cost several times more than it should have.

[Phyrox]

...Ie, designing planes to look like one out of a particular anime serves no one except anime fanboys, and that's really not their job or business.

This is really the crux of the issue for me. I'll let it go at that.

[Phalanx]

I mean sure JASDF has F-15J's and the F-15 is still considered to be the worlds best fighter world but I was stunned at the fact that my own brethren, despite all the technology and resources as well the innovation, doesn't feel the need to produce original aircraft. I guess it's due to the fact that they prefer not to waste all of their time and resources on military weapons since Japan is a country that seeks peace with the world. That's my guess.Also judging by my post you guys can tell thatI'm a demanding person because I want things the way I see fit.

Also yet another good question about the F-15J's. How come the engineers of the F-15J haven't designed some sort of distinct and revolutionary avionic systems or missle types to make it stand a chance against the ultimate American variant; he F-15S/MT Active; an advanced canarded dual-seater version with thrust vectoring nozzles designed in conjunction with NASA. I know that the F-15J's have some original avionic systems (can't remember them) but in a sense, they don't don't appear to have any overall effect on the fighter's capabilities. It makes them appear as just another ordinary F-15 only just flown by japanese pilots and have distinct paint schemes( they have some nice designns)

[JB0]

It's a big joke for aviation enthusiasts about the "Self Defense" part of Japan's Air Force/airplanes.  It's as utterly capable of sending planes far away and striking as the USAF.  And they're looking at building small carriers, possibly even ones capable of taking JSF's.  Carriers are for power projection, not self-defense. 

It's still self-defense. Just pre-emptive self-defense.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I mean sure JASDF has F-15J's and the F-15 is still considered to be the worlds best fighter world but I was stunned at the fact that my own brethren, despite all the technology and resources as well the innovation, doesn't feel the need to produce original aircraft. I guess it's due to the fact that they prefer not to waste all of their time and resources on military weapons since Japan is a country that seeks peace with the world. That's my guess.Also judging by my post you guys can tell thatI'm a demanding person because I want things the way I see fit.

Also yet another good question about the F-15J's. How come the engineers of the F-15J haven't designed some sort of distinct and revolutionary avionic systems or missle types to make it stand a chance against the ultimate American variant; he F-15S/MT Active; an advanced canarded dual-seater version with thrust vectoring nozzles designed in conjunction with NASA. I know that the F-15J's have some original avionic systems (can't remember them) but in a sense, they don't don't appear to have any overall effect on the fighter's capabilities. It makes them appear as just another ordinary F-15 only  just flown by japanese pilots and have distinct paint schemes( they have some nice designns)

375977[/snapback]

Because the STMD isn't in production and was just a prototype. Plus the US has got japan's back, therefore japan doesn't really need to spend as much on their military weaponry as we do. We got bases over there and near there in Okinawa, so they are pretty much covered. The biggest threat would be Korean/Chinese Su-30's but at this point I still think japan could still take them on if attacked. And if japan gets the F-22, even if downgraded will still be a pretty powerful airplane, and possibly the most powerful fighter in the pacific as well as most advanced. If that happens you wouldn't even need an STMD much less an F-15 altogethere.

[Sdf-1]

Do You Want For Japan To Start Producing Original, fighter jet design's based off of anime?

On topic, I believe every sci-fi fan dreams sometimes how would such things look in the real world, and would want to live in a world where these things were real. But not realistically, just dreaming. Oh, and where would we then escape this boring world if all of that existed.

[Gaijin]

That's what the constitution says, but the F-2 and F-15J are equal to, and in some ways superior, to the US versions.  They retain full long-range strike capability and long-range missiles, mid-air refueling, and all sorts of other features that wouldn't be needed for self defense, THAT ARE OFTEN DELETED FOR OTHER NATIONS. 

Basically, many export versions of US planes are stripped down, especially in regards to anything that helps with long-range strikes (mid-air refueling, extra fuel tanks, long-range radar, etc).  But not for Japan.

It's a big joke for aviation enthusiasts about the "Self Defense" part of Japan's Air Force/airplanes.  It's as utterly capable of sending planes far away and striking as the USAF.  And they're looking at building small carriers, possibly even ones capable of taking JSF's.  Carriers are for power projection, not self-defense. 

375952[/snapback]

Yes, that's true but I was mentioning one of the reason why you don't see Japan creating weaponry. And the sale of F-22's and the talk of carriers are largely because if Japan has a stronger military, the US won't need to "look that way" as much (sorta ironic though in the aftermath of what's supposed to be happening and the last sentence is in the context of the whole article 9 thing).

[Mowe]

And where's my Voltron lions, dammit?

375910[/snapback]

Help, serious stomach cramp from giggling.

By the way, I heard Tokyo 3 is near completion, we just have to wait for the 3rd impact.

Edited March 3, 2006 by Mowe

[Sumdumgai]

Japan would be safer if they moved Tokyo tower you know...

If they did make anime planes into actual military hardware, eventually a crazy scientist who watched too much Patlabor will create a Hyper Operating System. And you know what that will mean! MAXIMUM OVERDRIVE!!! lol