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Aircraft Vs Thread 5


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Like many teen fighters, the F-16 can technically supercruise when clean and light.

But nothing but an ATF is in the 1.3+ "worth mentioning" supercruise. Because seriously, 0.95 vs 1.02 are effectively meaningless. But if you've got .3+ over somebody, that's something.

I seriously doubt the new thing even hits 1.1 ::reads article:: 32,000lbs of thrust? Heck, late model Vipers have that already. And you want to add all that extra junk to it? M1.05 is optimistic....

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  • 3 weeks later...

http://www.vectorsite.net/avparsit.html

Parasite fighters are one of those "Hmm, thats a nice idea but... " things that crop up now and again, usually with unpleasant results for the flight crews involved. Up until now, though, I hadn't known about the Boeing 747 "Microfighter" carrier concept, which is really something that should be a G.I. Joe playset and also proves that all those flying aircraft carriers in Ace Combat games are only mostly nuts. :)

Couple of odd designation thoughts that popped into my head - as theres already a F-35A, B and C what are they going to call improved variants down the line? And I know about the F-14A, A+ (later B) and D, but what/where was the C?

Edited by F-ZeroOne
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"Another scheme, known as "Tip-Tow", involved a B-29 modified to allow F-84s to hook up wingtip-to-wingtip using a clamping module on each of the B-29's wingtips. which came to an abrupt end on 24 April 1953, when an F-84 flipped over and tore off the wing of the B-29, with all crew killed in the disaster. The problem was that there were vortices around the B-29's wingtips that made the hookups very troublesome."

Severe vortices? Off of a gigantic unswept wing at high speed? You don't say. See the XB-70 for what happens when small fighters get near a heavy bomber's wingtips.

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Couple of odd designation thoughts that popped into my head - as theres already a F-35A, B and C what are they going to call improved variants down the line?

-35D, E and F most likely.

And I know about the F-14A, A+ (later B) and D, but what/where was the C?

the C was a proposed variant of the -14B with F401 (naval P&W F100's) engines and multi-mission avionics. The whole thing never got off the ground, and eventually they developed the F-14D instead.

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the C was a proposed variant of the -14B with F401 (naval P&W F100's) engines and multi-mission avionics. The whole thing never got off the ground, and eventually they developed the F-14D instead.

IIRC the C-model was a proposed variant of the 14B with F101DFE engines (not F401). Many of the upgrades (much of it avionics related) for the proposed C-model was later incorporated in the A, A+/B, and D model Tomcats.

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There never really was supposed to be an A+/B model (not as we know it). Remember, the original F-14B had the F101, but nothing ever came of it past the prototype. Then the C was proposed, and also never happened. Then the D came and was approved---but the engines were ready long before the avionics were. So the decision was made (since the TF30 sucked so bad it was a safety issue) to immediately refit as many A's as possible with the new engines, while waiting for the avionics to be finished. When the avionics were finished, all the "half-converted" A's were to be "finished up" with a full conversion into D's. Similarly, they built new F-14s with the new engines intending them to be upgraded later as well.

But, time/money/Cheney happened, and no plane ever got a "second" conversion to finish the job.

Now, as the "re-engined A" was to be simply that, nothing more, and only exist as a TEMPORARY status while awaiting new avionics---it was called the A+. Nice and logical. B and C were already taken, and you couldn't call it an "F-14-interim-notD".

But the Navy's ancient computers didn't like the "+" symbol at all, so they had to rename it SOMETHING, and B seemed fairly logical for a "slightly" modified A, as the original B never went into production and most people didn't know about the original one anyways.

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IIRC the C-model was a proposed variant of the 14B with F101DFE engines (not F401). Many of the upgrades (much of it avionics related) for the proposed C-model was later incorporated in the A, A+/B, and D model Tomcats.

oh, here we go, link I was hoping to find a half hour ago: http://anft.net/f-14/f14-history-f14b.htm

The ORIGINAL original F-14B prototype DID have F401's, but apparently they weren't all that good (P&W engines not being good? SHOCKING! :rolleyes: ).

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The Green Hornet: http://www.airliners.net/photo/USA---Navy/...-18B/1597042/L/

(camo+green+white=rare)

LOL!

Just LOL!!

The best part is that someone had to pitch this to gain approval for their corrosion control shop to paint it like that. Even better, the guy that approved it thought it was a great idea. Maybe even told the CO about it and got consent there too? :lol:

Edited by Warmaker
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What would win in a dogfight with pilots of equal skill/experience in BFM/DACM?

YF-17 Cobra VS F/A-18E Super Hornet

Unfair fight. The YF-17 was never fitted with any kind of extensive combat avionics system. The Super Hornet has the AESA radar, JHMCS, AIM-9X capability, etc etc. :)

If it was just comparison of airframe and engines, I dunno. Probably similar? Which means if pilot skills were equal, it'll be all up to luck.

Edited by Vifam7
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Little Typhoon tid-bit: you might recall that during World War II, the island of Malta was at one point defended by a famous trio of Gloster Gladiator biplanes. They were named "Faith, Hope and Charity" [1].

Well, the Falkland Islands is currently defended by a four-plane detachment of Typhoons. They've been named Faith, Hope, Charity and...

...Desperation. :)

[1] Actually, I seem to recall there were actually more than just the three, but thats the legend...

Edited by F-ZeroOne
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One of the few (only?) flying EE Lightings crashed at an airshow in Cape Town (as in South Africa), killing the pilot. :(

IIRC, those South African guys have about 2 or 4 flyable Lightnings but some guys in the US? are trying to restore one to flying condition as well AFAIK.

Edited by Retracting Head Ter Ter
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My favourite Lightning story is about a pilot whose job it was to give foreign pilots from air forces who might be interested in buying Lightnings a test flight. He'd sit in the back and let the visitor take off, fly around etc.

The instructor always made it clear to the guests that the Lightning had a surplus of power and could be going really rather quick [1] before you knew it. One of his pupils apparently didn't listen too hard one day just before take-off. So the tale goes, the Lightning was at 50,000 feet before they were able to raise the gear... :)

[1] Possibly the trouble is our British habit for understatement. Some embarrassments might have been spared if a well known phrase involving shovels had been employed instead... :lol:

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