Official Transformers Super Thread 3

[Chindenathus]

I'm gonna get both jetfire's because....It's jetfire. The original figure is what got me into Macross, so, the character is special to me.

411266[/snapback]

Same here.

Here are some CGI images from the 10 Fingers site that show the differences between WWI and DonF's "modern version":

G1:

Edited June 26, 2006 by Chindenathus

[Chindenathus]

War Within:

[Chindenathus]

Don F. "Modern":

Edited June 26, 2006 by Chindenathus

[eriku]

Is that the offical alt mode for the modern version? I like it. Seems bulky and only suitable for space-flight, but it still looks cool.

I really, really do not like the War Within Jetfire. The design and the toy are just all kinds of nasty.

[protostar8]

See I told ya. Looks like it won't be such an issue with the TF fans after all.

Some changes might actually be worth it if people can get used to it over time. Like when the X-men got a costume change and updated look (no more mohawk for you storm), the hulk turned grey for a while, the ninja turtles shed thier stupid "archie" comic look from the ole 80s cartoon, batman getting slight mod from when an artist wants to put thier own spin on the character etc (not to mention batmobile changing)

Nostalgia can sometimes get in the way of toy coolness.

411045[/snapback]

But those were supposed to be new takes on the old characters. This was supposed to be a perfect version of the old character. It wasn't supposed to heavily influenced by the artist/designer. If anyone doesn't believe that it was supposed to be G1 Starscream, then just look at the first prototype compared to Starscream in his G1 days and they are pretty close. Their was enough "stlye" in the first prototype w/out making it not look like G1 Starscream. Now it looks like like the illegitimate love child of Starscream and the YF-19! (With those scrawny legs and hip kibble) No version of a G1 Starscream toy homage I can remember has ever had gigantic hip kibble.

[Twoducks]

See I told ya. Looks like it won't be such an issue with the TF fans after all.

Some changes might actually be worth it if people can get used to it over time. Like when the X-men got a costume change and updated look (no more mohawk for you storm), the hulk turned grey for a while, the ninja turtles shed thier stupid "archie" comic look from the ole 80s cartoon, batman getting slight mod from when an artist wants to put thier own spin on the character etc (not to mention batmobile changing)

Nostalgia can sometimes get in the way of toy coolness.

411045[/snapback]

But those were supposed to be new takes on the old characters. This was supposed to be a perfect version of the old character. It wasn't supposed to heavily influenced by the artist/designer. If anyone doesn't believe that it was supposed to be G1 Starscream, then just look at the first prototype compared to Starscream in his G1 days and they are pretty close. Their was enough "stlye" in the first prototype w/out making it not look like G1 Starscream. Now it looks like like the illegitimate love child of Starscream and the YF-19! (With those scrawny legs and hip kibble) No version of a G1 Starscream toy homage I can remember has ever had gigantic hip kibble.

411433[/snapback]

If you want something that really looks like he cartoon, look at this old thing:

He even has some of the gimmicks MP Starscream is supposed to have:

http://www.bwtf.com/pvc/scf/starscream/

No tail fins and blocky as hell (just like the cartoon character) but it doesn't turn into a plane. Considering how blocky Starscream is, the plane would look like crap. Lets not forget that blocky Optimus turns into a blocky truck, something that I'm sure helped make the design of the MP Prime easier.

[Fit For Natalie]

Is that the offical alt mode for the modern version?  I like it.  Seems bulky and only suitable for space-flight, but it still looks cool. 

I really, really do not like the War Within Jetfire.  The design and the toy are just all kinds of nasty.

411394[/snapback]

I wouldn't take those CG renders at face value.

For one thing the artist in question takes some liberties with Don Figueroa's designs and makes them EXTREMELY CHUNKY AND BLOCKY. I mean the CG artist has Pat Lee-ed Jetfire there.

He's made both WW Jetfire and Stormbringer/Classics Jetfire look considerably worse than Don F designed them to be.

Edited June 26, 2006 by Fit For Natalie

[Radd]

Really, both sides of this drawn out argument have their points. The first design really is more "true" to the original Starscream, and the Kawamori redesign presents a much, much improved jet mode, and it would seem a more posable robot mode.

On one hand, I prefere the original prototype shown, mainly due to that robot mode looking more like a depiction of the G1 design. On the other, the better jet mode and better posability of the redesign strike me as the better toy. Still, I do agree with concerns on whether or not the arm guns will be perfect transformation, or popped off and reattached.

Either way, I plan on picking this up, along with Skywarp and Thundercracker, assuming they don't ignore the possibility of easy money.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

But hey, if you want to sit around and argue about why one of scratchy's ribs makes two distinct different sounds, by all means continue on fanboys, continue on.

411078[/snapback]

Oooh, WAY better than my Han Solo blue coat vs. brown coat reference!

Now, this bit of info may have been pushed out of my brain by all of the recent fuss, but has there been a confirmation on Starscream's scale or size? I seem to remember it being reported that he's not the same height as Masterpiece Prime. Personally, I think it would be cool if he was in scale with the Yammie 1/48 VF-1 and 1/60 VF-0.

411079[/snapback]

He's 1/60 scale so he is the same scale as the yammie VF-0. Someone@tfw did some measurements a few weeks back and I remember the fighter mode being longer than the robot height. Not sure of the exact measurements though.

[Dobber]

Ditto

Chris

[protostar8]

If you want something that really looks like he cartoon, look at this old thing:

http://www.bwtf.com/pvc/scf/starscream/1.jpg

http://www.bwtf.com/tfg1/tvshow/mtmte3/20.gif

He even has some of the gimmicks MP Starscream is supposed to have:

http://www.bwtf.com/pvc/scf/starscream/3.jpg

http://www.bwtf.com/pvc/scf/starscream/

No tail fins and blocky as hell (just like the cartoon character) but it doesn't turn into a plane. Considering how blocky Starscream is, the plane would look like crap. Lets not forget that blocky Optimus turns into a blocky truck, something that I'm sure helped make the design of the MP Prime easier.

411463[/snapback]

I already have that, and I'm not too impressed w/ it b/c it's kind of small and has very limited articulation. It's very deceptive looking in the pictures b/c it looks like it would move all over the place. In actuallity, the legs are more or less fixed pose. You'd just have to own one to really understand. The MPC Starscream looks great, just not as MPC Starscream. This particular line wasn't a line meant for re-inventing the wheel. The line was meant to give the fans who have waited for over 20 years the toys they wanted back then, G1 versions of their favorite characters that looked great in both modes. If this was another line of Transformers, then It'd be okay for Shoji to go nuts, but this isn't another line. He should have left it alone and just fixed the minor gripes people had with the first prototype.

Please don't triple-quote pics.

Edited June 27, 2006 by David Hingtgen

[Radd]

So, is there an article or something that says Shoji Kawmori took matters into his own hands and went nuts, while the people who hired him looked on helplessly, unable to stop the carnage he was causing?

[Cyclone]

So, is there an article or something that says Shoji Kawmori took matters into his own hands and went nuts, while the people who hired him looked on helplessly, unable to stop the carnage he was causing?

411566[/snapback]

No, but could be the Lucas effect of combination of people awed by the guy or too scared to believe they better opinions than him...

[wolfx]

So, is there an article or something that says Shoji Kawmori took matters into his own hands and went nuts, while the people who hired him looked on helplessly, unable to stop the carnage he was causing?

411566[/snapback]

Re-enactment in bad gaijin japanese

*Flashback moosik*

Takara Exec: Onegai shimasu, Kawamori-sensei, kore wa Makuros janai desu yo.

Shoji Kawamori: GAHH!!! Kore tail-findo, kimochi warui.

TE: Iyaan!! Yamete kudasai!!

SK: HA HA HA!! Watashi no Starrer Screamer "KAI", "ver. KAWAMORI", DAI SAK SEN, hak shin!!

TE: Agh!! Kawamori sensei! Iyaaaan!! Yamete kurei!!!

SK: Ja jannn!! (Tadaa) KANZEN!!

TE: *Kuso* Nande?! NANDE?!

Edited June 27, 2006 by wolfx

[Hikuro]

So yeah in other news, found out a guy I sort of VA with at TFCog.net named Daniel Ross has been trying for several weeks to land just an audition with DreamWorks to do some voice overs for Transformers.

However the CastingDirector said hell no to his agent over and over again and even hanging up several times.

Well Daniel came to us at TFCog and asked if we could shout out to the people working on the casting to atleast give him a shot.

Then he just heard recently that they finally agreed.

If none of you guys have heard of Daniel Ross, he's actually a very good Ameature Voice Actor who can pull off an AMAZING G1 Starscream ever so similar to Chris Latta.

[eugimon]

So, is there an article or something that says Shoji Kawmori took matters into his own hands and went nuts, while the people who hired him looked on helplessly, unable to stop the carnage he was causing?

411566[/snapback]

No, but could be the Lucas effect of combination of people awed by the guy or too scared to believe they better opinions than him...

411581[/snapback]

yeah yeah, lower the wings back to the hips where they belong! Since the toy came before the cartoon, shouldn't we all be blasting the animators for going all Mazinger on starscream and putting his wings up on his back instead of on his hips as the original master designer intended???

Booo animators! How DARE they muddle with such a beautiful creation?

[eugimon]

So yeah in other news, found out a guy I sort of VA with at TFCog.net named Daniel Ross has been trying for several weeks to land just an audition with DreamWorks to do some voice overs for Transformers.

However the CastingDirector said hell no to his agent over and over again and even hanging up several times.

Well Daniel came to us at TFCog and asked if we could shout out to the people working on the casting to atleast give him a shot.

Then he just heard recently that they finally agreed.

If none of you guys have heard of Daniel Ross, he's actually a very good Ameature Voice Actor who can pull off an AMAZING G1 Starscream ever so similar to Chris Latta.

411629[/snapback]

Nice! apparantly the movie version of starscream is going to be some big hulking thing, it would be interesting to hear his old school voice coming out of that monster of a body.

BTW, if that troll-scream is real, I really wanna see the transformation sequence they have in mind.

[KingNor]

didn't wanna look through 57 pages, but here is (i think) bumblebee

here is a much bigger version but who knows how long it will be up.

Edited June 27, 2006 by KingNor

[GobotFool]

wow... it really looks like they are going for that hulking monster look.

[HoveringCheesecake]

Hmmmm... I'll reserve judgement until I see a front-on view.

[Hikuro]

I dunno......is it just me........or is there something about that picture which just doesn't seem right? Seeing him and the human's around just doesn't wanna focus well with my eyes, like it's a photoshopped picture or something.

Anyways, I was at Fredmyers where they had another lil sale and I managed to pick up Rhinox, Cheetor and Waspinator (that's all they had) so I thought meh why not.

Sadly Im' not impressed with ANY of these beastwars toys, they just don't make me go "ooooooooooooohhhhhh" compared to some of the newer stuff.

Also, why in the hell does Waspinator have 2 heads?

[wolfx]

I can't tell what i'm looking at. >_>

[KingNor]

thats supposedly bumblebee's upper body, i'm asuming there are no hands because they'll be doing them digitally.

[eugimon]

huh... that looks like his engine block in his chest... I guess they're going to try to keep the guts of the cars instead of making them magically disapear.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I dunno......is it just me........or is there something about that picture which just doesn't seem right? Seeing him and the human's around  just doesn't wanna focus well with my eyes, like it's a photoshopped picture or something.

Anyways, I was at Fredmyers where they had another lil sale and I managed to pick up Rhinox, Cheetor and Waspinator (that's all they had) so I thought meh why not.

Sadly Im' not impressed with ANY of these beastwars toys, they just don't make me go "ooooooooooooohhhhhh" compared to some of the newer stuff.

Also, why in the hell does Waspinator have 2 heads?

411851[/snapback]

bear in mind those toys were designed in 94 and released in 95. The funny thing was, all through armada and energon, most of us kept battyING for beast wars quality in our new toys! That didn't happen till cybertron. Beast wars was one of the only lines to have FULL ARTICULATION in each and every figure.

Almost all the first wave figures back then had a mutant head and a robot head. It was to play on the fact that they were beasts. The ultra sized Optimus Primal had a bat head; the real reasoning behind this is because the toy initially was to be a tripple changer...

gorilla-bat-robot

To my knowledge the beast head was called a "mutant mask"

back then they were awesome and to me they still are. They are godsends comparing to some of the atrocities we got in armada and energon.

and car robots/RID was a prominently vehicle alt mode based line with beast wars level articulation.

[Hikuro]

I didn't realize till I saw some concept CG on Season 2 where I went "WOW! Hey that Rhinox looks like my BW toy" and sure enough it was....same with cheetor. But Turantulus doesn't have that same head does he? Or does he have the same thing where he can switch from a "mutant" head to a robotic version?

I think all I got left to collect is Turantulus and DinoBot and I'll have all the Reissued BW toys....I think I might pass on Primal and Megs reissues cause they look like complete crap.

[Kurisama]

What the hell?!?! They could've at least stayed a little true to the 80's bots, or at least the binaltech/alternators, he looks like a cross between a transformer and fricken general grievous...

[GobotFool]

What the hell?!?! They could've at least stayed a little true to the 80's bots, or at least the binaltech/alternators, he looks like a cross between a transformer and fricken general grievous...

412009[/snapback]

I was thinking it looked like, one of those lego robots... what's that series called?

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I know. But if they were to even remake G1 cartoon (they did it with the ninja turtles) I would prefer him to look like the second proto. Notice how he doesn't have anything messy on his legs in this statue? The cartoon can cheat, but toys have to keep those bits hanging off thier body.

My solution to SK: make pieces detachable so they can be like the cartoon. Where bits just disapear. This way if you revert back to the first proto, I can at least remove the bits hanging off his leg to make it more like the statue displayed above.

Cartoons = allowed to have anime magic. (growing, shrinking and disapearing pieces)

Toys need to do stuff to those pieces. And I like (from the POV of just liking the toy) the second version because it makes him look more intimidating. (sort of like how some comic artists draw characters differently to the toon, by making them look chunky or giving them massive fists and stuff)

Unlike the statue or action figure shown above:

...the toy has to have those bits on his leg be somewhere. It just looks cooler and has more attitude to have a clean smooth humanoid shape in robot mode. (and get away from that ugly 80s brick shape that all toys had back then, with bits and pieces hanging off thier body instead of tucking them away and stuff.)

Skinny legs makes the upper body seem wider. Sort of like how the GBP armor made the 1/48 yamato vf1 more intimidating than his old animated form by having the huge chest and shoulder armor. (looks less sunken in)

Notice too how in the statue (top of my post) they made his hands and feet more expressive by increasing the size? This is to give him a more manly appearance. So the same is being done here. Increase his forearms a little and give him a stronger upper body. It's more expressive in humanoid form that way imo. When I think about it, personally I think the fans are just making a big deal out of nothing.

Edited June 28, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Graham]

Sorry, but there's just something about that Starscream toy pic which looks so gay.

Graham

[Twoducks]

I dunno......is it just me........or is there something about that picture which just doesn't seem right? Seeing him and the human's around  just doesn't wanna focus well with my eyes, like it's a photoshopped picture or something.

Anyways, I was at Fredmyers where they had another lil sale and I managed to pick up Rhinox, Cheetor and Waspinator (that's all they had) so I thought meh why not.

Sadly Im' not impressed with ANY of these beastwars toys, they just don't make me go "ooooooooooooohhhhhh" compared to some of the newer stuff.

Also, why in the hell does Waspinator have 2 heads?

411851[/snapback]

bear in mind those toys were designed in 94 and released in 95. The funny thing was, all through armada and energon, most of us kept battyING for beast wars quality in our new toys! That didn't happen till cybertron. Beast wars was one of the only lines to have FULL ARTICULATION in each and every figure.

Almost all the first wave figures back then had a mutant head and a robot head. It was to play on the fact that they were beasts. The ultra sized Optimus Primal had a bat head; the real reasoning behind this is because the toy initially was to be a tripple changer...

gorilla-bat-robot

To my knowledge the beast head was called a "mutant mask"

back then they were awesome and to me they still are. They are godsends comparing to some of the atrocities we got in armada and energon.

and car robots/RID was a prominently vehicle alt mode based line with beast wars level articulation.

411919[/snapback]

The "mutant masks" where supposed to be in the original BW series but due to the low budget they weren’t implemented. Don't remember where I read this though.

What the hell?!?! They could've at least stayed a little true to the 80's bots, or at least the binaltech/alternators, he looks like a cross between a transformer and fricken general grievous...

412009[/snapback]

I was thinking it looked like, one of those lego robots... what's that series called?

412015[/snapback]

Bionicle. Don't know how kids can like those things over the rest of the Lego stuff (must be that today’s kids have less imagination).

Well, for one thing, if that thing turns into a normal looking car that has space for people to ride in we can expect really complex transformations (probably the only thing that will interest me about the movie).

Anybody know if the movie transformers will use laser weapons? If that thing in the pic is really one of them, he sure looks fragile (as the Starscream design sketch). Just too many exposed areas to defend you against laser shots.

[Graham]

Anybody know if the movie transformers will use laser weapons?

412027[/snapback]

Does it matter what weapons they use? I mean if the movie follows the TV series, they'll never hit anything anyway.

Graham

[JB0]

Anybody know if the movie transformers will use laser weapons?

412027[/snapback]

Does it matter what weapons they use? I mean if the movie follows the TV series, they'll never hit anything anyway.

Graham

412028[/snapback]

But if it follows the original movie, every last one will hit it's mark.

...

Oh dear... please! No Rodimus! I BEG OF YOU!

[Guppy]

haha.. so true. instant death for everyone! I just watched it again the other day and was shocked. Even main characters like Wheeljack who you just see lying dead for 3 frames.

[Graham]

As I've said before, while others cried watching their favorite transformers die in the movie, I cheered!

Evil Graham