Macross II versus Macross 7

[yellowlightman]

He's just everything one expects from someone with a DBZ screenname(read: stupid).

He's much too well spoken to fit into the regular DragonBall Z stereotype, what with the proper punctuation and capitalization and what not.

And seriously man, WTF? You act like he pooped in your Cheerios this morning.

[AlphaHX]

Great... keep this up and we can lock up another Mac7 thread. Have fun guys...

[Hurin]

And seriously man, WTF? You act like he pooped in your Cheerios this morning.

Well, you didn't ask me this. . . but the guy's post is deserving of some heavy ridicule. . . or maybe it just deserved to be ignored. I can't decide.

If I follow it correctly (and who's to know!). . . it goes something like:

Those who hate M7 are engaging in propoganda. The Nazis engaged in propoganda. Here's some quotes from Hitler. The US engages in propoganda and everything it has ever stood against has been a figment of its psychotic populations' imaginations. There is a lot of inequality in the world. The US is a bunch of Nazis. M7 is like the "Real World." Brainwash.

Now. . . even if we open our minds very wide and accept that this sorta stuff can be posted here. . . it's still utter BS. We've got a Marxist on our hands who just read Mein Kampf and now thinks everything he sees bears some relation to it and his worldview.

H

[Agent ONE]

And seriously man, WTF? You act like he pooped in your Cheerios this morning.

Well, you didn't ask me this. . . but the guy's post is deserving of some heavy ridicule. . . or maybe it just deserved to be ignored. I can't decide.

If I follow it correctly (and who's to know!). . . it goes something like:

Those who hate M7 are engaging in propoganda. The Nazis engaged in propoganda. Here's some quotes from Hitler. The US engages in propoganda and everything it has ever stood against has been a figment of its psychotic populations' imaginations. There is a lot of inequality in the world. The US is a bunch of Nazis. M7 is like the "Real World." Brainwash.

Now. . . even if we open our minds very wide and accept that this sorta stuff can be posted here. . . it's still utter BS. We've got a Marxist on our hands who just read Mein Kampf and now thinks everything he sees bears some relation to it and his worldview.

H

See I don't even read that guy's posts. But yeah, I can't decide... Is his head filled with human feces or dog feces?

[yellowlightman]

Now. . . even if we open our minds very wide and accept that this sorta stuff can be posted here. . . it's still utter BS. We've got a Marxist on our hands who just read Mein Kampf and now thinks everything he sees bears some relation to it and his worldview.

H

Is that any worse than AgentOne's old rhetoric of "Macross 7 is for sissies and gays?"

Seriously guys, lighten up.

[jenius]

AgentOne's old rhetoric of "Macross 7 is for sissies and gays?"

Dude, A1, did you say that?? I know sissies and gays that don't like Mac7 at all. You were way off.

A lot of blanket statements are getting thrown out there. I love all the poop references, from the cheerios to what's in someone's head, but none of it has anything to do with which is worse, Mac7 or Mac2. This thread is veering violently off course. So sad... it had been interesting.

[Hurin]

Seriously guys, lighten up.

Uh. . . you might want to take your own advice there. I think it's pretty clear who's all wound up here.

H

[JsARCLIGHT]

I think one real rule of "like or dislike" should be that you MUST actually watch the thing you claim to dislike in it's entirety before comming out against it. Otherwise you are basing your opinion on the opinion of someone else who could be huffing paint for all you know.

I watched all of Macross II as it came out in the mid '90s tape by tape at the time and have watched it several times since. I like Mac II... for what it is worth. The things I dislike about it are the horribly rushed feel of the ending and the sad truth that I saw the american dubbed version first and that ending song is burned into my mind as only the worst tortures can.

Macross 7... when I first saw images and synopsis from it I was very, very wary. But I still got the DVDs and watched ALL of them. Everything. Every episode. At the end it turns out I really did NOT like it. I thought it was terrible. Most of my hate of Mac 7 comes from the "what it could have been" side rather than the "what it is" side. So much was repeated and wasted in that show IMHO. I think it could have been much better had it not had this "stretching a premise" feel about it. I could ignore the clown valks in the hope that I would get drawn into the story but when the story failed to draw me in all the ugliness I was ignoring crashed down on me.

I am a firm believer that there seem to be only two camps for Mac 7, those that love and those that hate.

[yellowlightman]

Seriously guys, lighten up.

Uh. . . you might want to take your own advice there. I think it's pretty clear who's all wound up here.

Oh yeah, I'm furious over here.

[Hurin]

Seriously guys, lighten up.

Uh. . . you might want to take your own advice there. I think it's pretty clear who's all wound up here.

Oh yeah, I'm furious over here.

Okay, so we can all agree then that the only guy who needs to "lighten up" is the guy quoting Hitler when describing those with whom he disagrees?

I mean, really. . . that is just too funny. . . and a new low.

I mean, when a guy is quoting Hitler, and those who are making fun of him are the ones told to "lighten up". . . something is out of whack!

H

[yellowlightman]

I mean, when a guy is quoting Hitler, and those who are making fun of him are the ones told to "lighten up". . . something is out of whack!

The irony woudl likely be more apparent if you pulled your head out of AgentOne's ass, but...

[JB0]

And seriously man, WTF? You act like he pooped in your Cheerios this morning.

Well, you didn't ask me this. . . but the guy's post is deserving of some heavy ridicule. . . or maybe it just deserved to be ignored. I can't decide.

If I follow it correctly (and who's to know!). . . it goes something like:

Those who hate M7 are engaging in propoganda. The Nazis engaged in propoganda. Here's some quotes from Hitler. The US engages in propoganda and everything it has ever stood against has been a figment of its psychotic populations' imaginations. There is a lot of inequality in the world. The US is a bunch of Nazis. M7 is like the "Real World." Brainwash.

Now. . . even if we open our minds very wide and accept that this sorta stuff can be posted here. . . it's still utter BS. We've got a Marxist on our hands who just read Mein Kampf and now thinks everything he sees bears some relation to it and his worldview.

H

See I don't even read that guy's posts. But yeah, I can't decide... Is his head filled with human feces or dog feces?

I am now agreeing with AgentONE. In a Macross 7 thread. The world has now ended.

[Hurin]

I mean, when a guy is quoting Hitler, and those who are making fun of him are the ones told to "lighten up". . . something is out of whack!  

The irony woudl likely be more apparent if you pulled your head out of AgentOne's ass, but...

LOL! Agent One and I disagree pretty vehemently about 99% of the time. . . I agree with him, and say something nice about him just once, and I get this. That's too funny. I don't think anyone who pays even sporadic attention to even just very recent activity in these forums would consider A1 and I even cordial towards each other. Much less good buds. You amuse me.

Again, why don't you reserve some of this misdirected hostility for the guy quoting Mein Kampf and calling people Nazis. Your need to continue this when I obviously offered a relatively conciliatory tone in my last post is amusing, but also disturbing.

I don't know how I pissed you off so much. But I apologize for doing so and I suggest we move on now so that we don't contribute further to the imminent locking of this thread.

H

Edited April 1, 2005 by Hurin

[Mr March]

Brevity is our friend. Pedantry is not.

[Ivan]

Why isn't Keith in this thread at all?

[Keith]

I posted earlier, already stated how much better 7 is than II.

[areaseven]

Why isn't Keith in this thread at all?

Good question. I'm surprised neither he nor Agent ONE posted their comments on my recent review of Macross Dynamite 7.

[kazuo]

I posted earlier, already stated how much better 7 is than II.

And dog sh*t is better than horse sh*t, but the fact remains that its still sh*t.

Edited April 1, 2005 by kazuo

[yellowlightman]

Again, why don't you reserve some of this misdirected hostility for the guy quoting Mein Kampf and calling people Nazis. Your need to continue this when I obviously offered a relatively conciliatory tone in my last post is amusing, but also disturbing.

Recommend you look up "conciliatory" in the dictionary and then re-read the last line of your last post, as you seem to be suffering from some sort of selective memory.

I could care less what Final Vegeta said, I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy that people get on his case for making a ridiculous post about Macross 7, when everyone and their mother chimes in on a Macross 7 thread about how lame it is. At least Final Vegeta made some attempt to back up his statements.

[bsu legato]

Man I just love how Macross 7 brings out the best in so many people.

[Zentrandude]

Man I just love how Macross 7 brings out the best in so many people.

lol basara or boxana in some bad dubs is rolling around in his valk with all this fighting we have.

My reason I hate Mac7 is the storyline was too slow since it has a pretty large amount of characters they have to develope. If it was live action and not in space it would be a soap opera. As the Battle7 turns, Mylene must choose to love the person who doesn't know she exist or the man her dominating mother has shoved into her face. Will gubaba find out he has legs and arms? And will exodor discover true love being the only full sized zentran on the fleet.

[JB0]

Man I just love how Macross 7 brings out the best in so many people. 

lol basara or boxana in some bad dubs is rolling around in his valk with all this fighting we have.

My reason I hate Mac7 is the storyline was too slow since it has a pretty large amount of characters they have to develope. If it was live action and not in space it would be a soap opera. As the Battle7 turns, Mylene must choose to love the person who doesn't know she exist or the man her dominating mother has shoved into her face. Will gubaba find out he has legs and arms? And will exodor discover true love being the only full sized zentran on the fleet.

*cackles*

[bsu legato]

No seriously, what is it about M7 that makes people so retarded? I mean, we've got quotes from Mein Kampf in here, FFS!!! Usually that kind of overblown melodrama only surfaces in a Star Wars thread. Maybe this just proves the point that M7 is the most hated better than any poll could ever do. After all, I don't recall anybody quoting Pol Pot or Stalin in any Macross II thread.

Edited April 1, 2005 by bsu legato

[jenius]

Would Jesus like M7?

[Mr March]

No seriously, what is it about M7 that makes people so retarded? I mean, we've got quotes from Mein Kampf in here, FFS!!! Usually that kind of overblown melodrama only surfaces in a Star Wars thread. Maybe this just proves the point that M7 is the most hated better than any poll could ever do. After all, I don't recall anybody quoting Pol Pot or Stalin in any Macross II thread.

Some people like it, most hate it. The more people hate Macross 7, the more vehemently the fans will defend it. Put yourself in the place of those who like it and ask yourself if you wouldn't do the same. Imagine someone saying Macross in general was crap and Gundam was way better. I bet I can guess your reaction...and mine.

Granted, these threads are overblown to the point of total absurdity. No one should be quoting Pol Pot, Stalin, or Hitler unless you're having a discussion about Rwanda or some other recent, REAL LIFE tragedy. But hey, it's the net

[JB0]

No seriously, what is it about M7 that makes people so retarded? I mean, we've got quotes from Mein Kampf in here, FFS!!! Usually that kind of overblown melodrama only surfaces in a Star Wars thread. Maybe this just proves the point that M7 is the most hated better than any poll could ever do. After all, I don't recall anybody quoting Pol Pot or Stalin in any Macross II thread.

Some people like it, most hate it.

According to the poll, less than 50% hate it.

Or at least, less than 50% hate it with the blinding fury of a thousand suns that makes all other hatreds trivial.

A fulll 27% have no hatred for it.

Anyways, like I said, Final Vegeta is "special".

Edited April 1, 2005 by JB0

[bsu legato]

According to the poll, less than 50% hate it.

Or at least, less than 50% hate it with the blinding fury of a thousand suns that makes all other hatreds trivial.

A fulll 27% have no hatred for it.

Anyways, like I said, Final Vegeta is "special".

True. But when you consider that both M2 and M7 are by and large the two least popular Macross spinoffs, I think its telling that M7 is hated by a 2 to 1 margin over M2. They're both the red headed stepchildren of the Macross franchise, but M7 is #1 when it comes to late night drunken beatings.

[jenius]

According to the poll, less than 50% hate it.

Is that something to be proud of? We know about half the people voting (41 of 84?) HATE M7. Does this mean the other half like M7? No. Somethin' like 20 people hate M2 more than M7 but it seems to me a large number of those people have hated both but dislike M2 more than M7. So, seems the numbers work out where the majority hates M7, a large number more are probably neutral, and a few people like it.

That being said, different strokes for different folks. Wasn't my cup of tea.-

[bandit29]

Well they are both steaming piles but Macross 7 wins as the worst. Such a let down for an official sequel. All of my feelings for M7 have been said here already. In some ways Macross II is just a rehash of DYRL.

I think they are both tied for worst mech designs of the Macross franchise. I do like the VF-17S from M7 though.

[Hurin]

Recommend you look up "conciliatory" in the dictionary and then re-read the last line of your last post, as you seem to be suffering from some sort of selective memory.

I said "relatively conciliatory". . . meaning "more conciliatory than that which came before" and I still think it was. Sorry if my tone isn't coming across.

I could care less what Final Vegeta said, I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy that people get on his case for making a ridiculous post about Macross 7, when everyone and their mother chimes in on a Macross 7 thread about how lame it is. At least Final Vegeta made some attempt to back up his statements.

This is like the first time in eons that Agent ONE has given any reasons for his thinking. . . but if you think Vegeta's post was even remotely about M7. . . uh, wow! That guy was obviously just looking for a reason to post his Leftist political views. . . which, last time I looked, was against the rules. He could have stopped with just: "The rhetoric used by those who hate M7 reminds of the black-and-white propaganda perfected by the fascists in the middle of last centurty". . . which is still distasteful. . . but the other 90% had nothing to do with Macross and was just that guy spouting Marxist Left-wing ideology. . . for about three pages

Again, I'm sorry that you got so pissed when I merely stated why JBO was making fun of Vegeta. I don't think he should be called an idiot (and I said as much). But nor do I think his post should be immune from ridicule as there is a vast difference between what he wrote and the type of stuff the knee-jerk anti-M7ers write here. Last time I looked, political rants, together with comparing people to Nazis was frowned upon here.

You can be conciliatory while not totally caving into the other person. That's what I was trying to accomplish by apologizing and making light of the whole thing in my last post. Vegeta isn't worth all this arguing and the beginnings of bad feelings between two members. Why don't we just let it go? Reading what I just wrote above, I don't see anything that screams for rebuttal. You're an old-timer around here, I've never had a problem with you before, and I respect you. So can we just let this go, please?

H

[JB0]

According to the poll, less than 50% hate it.

Is that something to be proud of? We know about half the people voting (41 of 84?) HATE M7. Does this mean the other half like M7? No. Somethin' like 20 people hate M2 more than M7 but it seems to me a large number of those people have hated both but dislike M2 more than M7. So, seems the numbers work out where the majority hates M7, a large number more are probably neutral, and a few people like it.

That being said, different strokes for different folks. Wasn't my cup of tea.-

It still disproves the common belief that everyone hates Macross 7 more than anything else.

And some of those votes are from people that never SAW Mac7, or saw so little that it doesn't matter*, and have formed their opinions based on what others have said.

*Some would argue that it doesn't matter if what little they saw turned them off totally. I'd say they are wrong. I can assemble a good argument that SDF Macross is steaming feces based on selected episodes. I'd be wrong, but I could do it.

[azrael]

*Some would argue that it doesn't matter if what little they saw turned them off totally. I'd say they are wrong. I can assemble a good argument that SDF Macross is steaming feces based on selected episodes. I'd be wrong, but I could do it.

Footnote 2:

That can be said about a lot of series, not just Macross in general. Some people are already calling Gundam Seed Destiny a disappointment. The series isn't even at the half-way point and people are labelling it bad. At one point on the wayback machine, I thought Evangelion was boring and not worth it. That was from only watching episode 1 and 2. Was my opinion really justifible if I haven't actually finished the series? No, cuz I haven't finished the damn series. How do I know it won't be better or worst later in the series? I don't. So the arguement doesn't just apply to M7/M2 or any Macross.

[bsu legato]

That can be said about a lot of series, not just Macross in general. Some people are already calling Gundam Seed Destiny a disappointment. The series isn't even at the half-way point and people are labelling it bad.

Not to derail my own thread, I'd agree with that sentiment. Destiny IS shaping up to be a disappointment. Even if it somehow turns things around and has a amazing next 25 epiodes, they've still wasted the preceeding 20 odd eps with pointless nonsense. Thats as many episodes as many anime get for their entire run. So yeah, even if the remainder of Destiny is good, that'll only make it a half-good show. It'll balance out as "mediocre" in the end, if it's lucky.

But the same can go for Macross 7. Some of its defenders are willing to admit that it starts off a bit weak, but "picks up" at the end. I say that's too little, too late.* I can't be bothered to endure 20-30 episodes of crap just to get to the meat and potatos of a show. My time is worth more to me than that.

* I dub this the ZZ Gundam phenomenon.

[Jemstone]

No seriously, what is it about M7 that makes people so retarded? I mean, we've got quotes from Mein Kampf in here, FFS!!! Usually that kind of overblown melodrama only surfaces in a Star Wars thread. Maybe this just proves the point that M7 is the most hated better than any poll could ever do. After all, I don't recall anybody quoting Pol Pot or Stalin in any Macross II thread.

Some people like it, most hate it. The more people hate Macross 7, the more vehemently the fans will defend it. Put yourself in the place of those who like it and ask yourself if you wouldn't do the same. Imagine someone saying Macross in general was crap and Gundam was way better. I bet I can guess your reaction...and mine.

here's a better question: Is G Gundam better than Macross 7?

[treatment]

No seriously, what is it about M7 that makes people so retarded? I mean, we've got quotes from Mein Kampf in here, FFS!!! Usually that kind of overblown melodrama only surfaces in a Star Wars thread. Maybe this just proves the point that M7 is the most hated better than any poll could ever do. After all, I don't recall anybody quoting Pol Pot or Stalin in any Macross II thread.

Some people like it, most hate it. The more people hate Macross 7, the more vehemently the fans will defend it. Put yourself in the place of those who like it and ask yourself if you wouldn't do the same. Imagine someone saying Macross in general was crap and Gundam was way better. I bet I can guess your reaction...and mine.

here's a better question: Is G Gundam better than Macross 7?

a better question is ...

is Pokemon better than Macross 7?