The Unlicensed Third Party Transformers Thread

[mikeszekely]

I hope Xerxes sells well enough that PE does another run of Leonidas with the fixes.

[Kanedas Bike]

I hope Xerxes sells well enough that PE does another run of Leonidas with the fixes.

Nice, didn't even pay attention to the fact that Xerxes has been released.

I have Leonidas and spent some time with him in robot mode - I had no issues but I didn't put him through the paces or transform him at all before I boxed him back up a couple of weeks ago.

-b.

[Dangard Ace]

I have BC Sunsurge and I'm looking at OG's Spinout. I prefer BC Sunsurge for Bot mode since Sunstreaker is supposed to be a superior fighter and his colours are reminiscent to Bruce Lee's iconic yellow/black, therefore I've always thought of him as a lean mean fighter. Makes sense since a Lambo's a lean mean machine. OG's Spinout looks chunkier, like something out of Dreamwave comics or IDW stuff. I enjoy the comics but I'm not a fan of the look. The back looks cleaner than BC's but I really don't like the Countachs rear sticking out like that on the OG. Alt mode of OG though kicks BC's butt, right in the back end.

Breaking it down

Omnigonix Spinout:

Pro: Alt mode is fantastic

Bright Yellow paint

Cleaner bot mode

Con: Bot mode is fatter(Chest design?)

Bot mode is much taller then Sideswipe. IMO They should be about even for twins.

Intakes are ugly as f.

Alt mode looks a tad shorter and smaller then MP Sideswipe

Badcube Sunsurge

Pro: Bot mode is lean and mean

Car intakes are much nicer

Alt mode scale matches Sideswipe

More accessories

Con: Alt mode backend is ugly

Yellow should be brighter

Bot mode: BC wins because of my reasons above.

Alt mode: Definitely OG.

Dilemma: Buy OG as well for the alt-mode or wait for HasTak to release a MP Sunstreaker that should looks great in both modes. Damn 1st World problems.

[Valkyrie Hunter D]

At least Sunsurge made it out to production. Spinout's been in limbo for quite a while.

Nevermind, I just saw the update

Well I'm glad Spinout is still happening, I do prefer him over Sunsurge. If Badcube does a police redeco, I'll get one and call it my Clampdown

Edited January 27, 2016 by Valkyrie Hunter D

[Scyla]

Given the measurements in this image he doesn't look that much different in size than Lambor:

So I always assumed he was the same size as Lambor. On the new products shot he looks smaller though.

[Dangard Ace]

My issue is MP is supposed to be accurate alt mode to accurate mostly accurate toon mode. BC doesn't do an accurate alt mode because of the back but the toon mode looks good. OG does an accurate alt, but a tad too small, but not an accurate toon mode, more like a accurate toy mode.

This is the telling shot. Vehicle mode is smaller. Spinout is closer to the camera so should look slightly bigger if they're the same size in car mode. He's smaller. You may need a tfw2005 account to view it.

http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-3rd-party-discussion/990117-omnigonix-v-01-spinout-mp-scaled-sunstreaker.html

[Scyla]

I can see the image and I can see what you mean by smaller. That is why I posted the image with the measurements. That indicates to me that the designer took the size of MP Lambor into account. This is why I can't imagine why Spinout should be smaller. So maybe our eyes are playing tricks on us. I guess we have to wait until someone has it in hand because from my latest information the current pictures are from a near final test shot. They could be outdated though.

[Valkyrie Hunter D]

Great googly moogly. So, does anyone wanna buy a slightly used Fansproject Intimidator?

[Scyla]

Great googly moogly. So, does anyone wanna buy a slightly used Fansproject Intimidator?

I'm tempted by that Menasor. But I will wait till someone has a review up and in hand experience with the quality of the toys. I doubt that their Montormaster will be as cool as Diesel.

[mikeszekely]

Great googly moogly. So, does anyone wanna buy a slightly used Fansproject Intimidator?

Possibly.

As for the new not-Menasor, the limbs are as big as MP cars and not-Motormaster's alt-mode is MP-10 sized. So it looks like a cool choice of you want an MP Menasor, but I don't see how it won't be too big for CHUG collectors like me.

[anime52k8]

but I don't see how it won't be too big for CHUG collectors like me.

or reasonably sane persons for that matter.

[sh9000]

Maybe someday a company will make MP G1 styled Stunticons and Menasor.

[big F]

As is half the fandom it seems..."All hail Scalechartron his holiness".Any other size representation is blasphemy to "true Trans-fans".

Is that something that a tfw2005 member made? Can't find the thread it came from.

[Scyla]

It seems like the higher-ups if Omnigonix decided to make Spinout in car-mode slightly smaller so that the robot mode fits better with MP Lambo which explains the weird inconsistencies with the measurements from the early design pictures:

...Also, in the name of honesty - I only got confirmation yesterday that the alt mode is indeed slightly smaller, the thought was to make the robot mode more in-line with the other MPs while in robot mode.

Not something I approved - as one of the main outcomes I (as the designer) wanted was to have the alt mode the same as the current MP Lambos....

(http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-3rd-party-discussion/990117-omnigonix-v-01-spinout-mp-scaled-sunstreaker-523.html#post13306202)

Edited January 29, 2016 by Scyla

[Chewie]

Great googly moogly. So, does anyone wanna buy a slightly used Fansproject Intimidator?

Holy shitballs. That is awesome.

[Dangard Ace]

It seems like the higher-ups if Omnigonix decided to make Spinout in car-mode slightly smaller so that the robot mode fits better with MP Lambo which explains the weird inconsistencies with the measurements from the early design pictures:

(http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/transformers-3rd-party-discussion/990117-omnigonix-v-01-spinout-mp-scaled-sunstreaker-523.html#post13306202)

Ya. Read that too. I think I'm going to stick with sunsurge. My MPs are mostly displayed in bot mode and i usually don't display the back of alt mode. I like my bots more toon accurate than toy accurate and having rewatched the original mini series Sunstreaker does not have that giant chest that Spinout has and also isn't taller than Sideswipe. Yes I'm including the height of the airintakes in bot mode. Sunsurge will be a good standin until HasTaks offering.

Now onto Reflector Wars! Keeping both but its time for me to unbox FT Spotter to compare to MT Visualizer!

[Dangard Ace]

Quick impression of both straight out of the box. MT Visualizer got a cool holographic chest and fun and posable straight out if the box. No worries putting him through his paces. FT Spotter looks great but goddamn he needs more testing by FT. Limbs are all over tightened so you can barely move them and the side skirts are scary tight because of the plastic shape choices FT made. After reading up at TFW2005 i spent a good hour sanding down plastic so the skirts wont stress and snap off. So far MT is the better toy. Next test will be transforming both into Camera. I'll deal with that during the weekend.

[Vermillion One]

I received Maketoys Wrestle in the mail today. I haven't transformed him, but it is one solid MP scaled figure. There is a decent amount of die cast in the feet to hold him steady and the should and hip ratchets are tight. I can't wait to pick up the Inferno homage.

[Valkyrie Hunter D]

I bought a sheet of stickers for MP Exhaust on Ebay recently. While they look great, the creator/vendor did not mention they are not precut. So if you get these, expect to do a lot of cutting. And while the markings have outlines on them, some major trimming is still in order for the markings to be properly placed. The stock used is thick, yet pliable enough to hug curved surfaces. The stickers were printed on both white and clear stock, and a few markings that were printed on clear stock should definitely have been printed on the white one. Here's how it came out:

[mikeszekely]

Ugh. I had some extra money, and I was thinking about getting the Unite Warriors version of Defensor just to get the Deluxe-class Groove, but after screwing around on Youtube watching some of peaugh's reviews, I'm seriously considering getting Unique Toy's Siegfriend instead. I mean, I already have the Combiner Wars Defensor, and I've already got most of Feral Rex to fill in the Predaking void on my Combiner shelf. Plus, Hun-Gurr was the only part of any G1 combiner I actually had as a kid. Siegfried looks really good, and the combined Ordin looks equally-impressive (even if Blot and Cutthroat are swapped).

Any thoughts?

[David Hingtgen]

Their Blot was great, but every release went downhill from there. I came *so* close to buying Blot, but am glad I didn't, once I saw the final team.

[mikeszekely]

Their Blot was great, but every release went downhill from there. I came *so* close to buying Blot, but am glad I didn't, once I saw the final team.

Out of curiosity, what makes you say that? I thought that Siegfried was pretty spot on. Maybe the dragon necks are a little thick, but that seems like an acceptable sacrifice to get more bulk on Hun-Gurr's lower legs and Abominus' thighs. And the combined Ordin looks pretty great, although I'd prefer Ordin's head were animation purple instead of toy white, and there is the whole swapping Blot and Cutthroat thing.

[David Hingtgen]

Sinnertwin's tails have nowhere to go in most modes, and are very crack-prone.

All non-Blot limbs have very long, flat, skinny torsos in beast-mode and have poor-looking beast modes because if it. Rippersnapper can barely even stand due to being too long up front.

Plus all the other things you mentioned. (Colors, limb-swap).

And I think Hun-Grr's dragon heads/necks look awful in ALL modes, and that pretty much kills it for me. The torso-bit is by far the most important member. If he's not good, the team isn't good.

[mikeszekely]

Well, I do appreciate your insights. Don't think for a moment I don't. But...

Sinnertwin's tails have nowhere to go in most modes, and are very crack-prone.

But, like Leo Dux's tail, they seem to be removable for bot/leg mode. Personally, that doesn't bother me (I leave Dux's tail off to the side or still in the sword when Dux is in bot mode). The cracking thing could be problematic, though.

All non-Blot limbs have very long, flat, skinny torsos in beast-mode and have poor-looking beast modes because if it.

That seems fairly accurate to both the animation and the toys. Well, the flatness and the width, at least. I guess they're a little longer, but not really enough to bother me.

Plus all the other things you mentioned. (Colors, limb-swap).

Well, yeah. But the color thing, as noted, toy-accurate at least. The limb swap is the single thing that bugs me the most, but even that seems to be based on some official artwork.

And I think Hun-Grr's dragon heads/necks look awful in ALL modes, and that pretty much kills it for me. The torso-bit is by far the most important member. If he's not good, the team isn't good.

I concede that Siegfried's dragon necks look chunky. The heads themselves, though, look pretty spot on. I think they look fine as Hun-Gurr's lower legs or Abominus' thighs, though. In fact, I think Ordin's got great all-around proportions. Even Hagen/not-Cutthroat's wings can be removed and tucked away on Ordin's back. And while I'll definitely play with them, at some point if I buy Siegfried I'll get the rest, and he'll be primarily displayed in combined mode.

You're pretty-well known for being, let's say, discerning when it comes to your collecting (and when we're talking the kinds of investments 3P combiners end up being, that's more than reasonable!). I guess I can understand why the things that bug you are deal-breakers for you, but I don't necessarily think they're deal-breakers for me.

I guess I'll wait a day or two to see if anyone else has anything to add, especially if they already own Siegfried/Ordin, but I think I'm going to wind up pulling the trigger on this one.

[David Hingtgen]

Only last thing I have is that MMC is strongly rumored to be working on Abominus. But it's a long ways off. But a Rex-style Abominus would be awesome.

And heck, FP/MT might have come out with one by then.

[Valkyrie2008]

I bought a sheet of stickers for MP Exhaust on Ebay recently. While they look great, the creator/vendor did not mention they are not precut. So if you get these, expect to do a lot of cutting. And while the markings have outlines on them, some major trimming is still in order for the markings to be properly placed. The stock used is thick, yet pliable enough to hug curved surfaces. The stickers were printed on both white and clear stock, and a few markings that were printed on clear stock should definitely have been printed on the white one. Here's how it came out:

It looks nice, I was thinking of dressing up my MP Exhaust too. I just saw one one the Chinese web, but 13 bucks with S&H is a bit steep for me, I think it's one of those dry transfer. I got one for MP Wheeljack and it looks really nice.

[Scyla]

I have to chime in on Ordin. I think it is awful especially after the first member was so promising. The transformations on the limbs are terrible. Some arms don't have places to peg into, the weapons are weak and Hun-Gurr looks terrible in all modes. I don't like the parts-formery stuff for the chest and all around the combined mode is not as striking. I agree that Unique Toys made an valiant effort to recreate the style of Feral Rex but in my opinion they failed. I guess if you are only going for their Hun-Gurr than it might be worth checking out otherwise I wouldn't touch it. IIRC Hun-Gurss leg ratchets are prone to breaking. UT put in replacement parts but they are often missing from the box.

There are other toys in the third party realm that I would look at first before thinking about Ordin. If you really are going for it do some more research for it. There are plenty of reviews out there for him so you get a better idea what you're up to.

I'll be waiting on a MMC Abominus and King Posidon (that might never happen).

[mikeszekely]

Only last thing I have is that MMC is strongly rumored to be working on Abominus. But it's a long ways off. But a Rex-style Abominus would be awesome.

And heck, FP/MT might have come out with one by then.

Yeah, supposedly Dr. Killenger saw a design or a prototype, and then one of the MMC team gave an interview where they said they were going to do Abominus, and eventually all the combiners, but not soon. And that interview was over a year ago. I guess that's one of those things that if/when it eventually happens, and if I actually like it better than Ordin (Dr. K said that MMC's design was bulkier, which I don't actually care for. I mean, despite the fact that it was partsformery, I still think Warlord looks better than Rex; Rex won me over by having a much better take on Razorclaw.

On that note, why the assumption that if FansProject or Maketoys comes out with an Abominus that it will automatically be better? I mean, I know that their Predacons weren't that great, especially their Razorclaw, but I love Mania King. I don't own a lot of 3P toys yet, but Mania King is my favorite.

I have to chime in on Ordin. I think it is awful especially after the first member was so promising. The transformations on the limbs are terrible.

They look ok to me, although I admit I've been looking mostly at Siegfried right now.

Some arms don't have places to peg into,

Like Hasbro's combiners?

the weapons are weak

What, exactly, is weak about them? I like them better than anything but the pistols that came with the Feralcons (and don't get me started on the Feralcons melee weapons, which look like crap as anything but the combined sword).

and Hun-Gurr looks terrible in all modes.

Well, like I already said, I agree that the dragon necks look a little thick but I think he's spot on in bot and torso mode, so...

I don't like the parts-formery stuff for the chest

You mean the big, G1-accurate shield? I love it! Remember, I actually had G1 Hun-Gurr back in the day. That shield is definitely something I remember.

and all around the combined mode is not as striking.

As striking as what, exactly? I think, aside from Blot and Cutthroat switching positions, it's darn near perfect. I mean, he's a dead ringer for this art:

Look, as far as doing the research goes, most of what I'm hearing from people who actually own him are that, yeah, the individual bots aren't as good as the Feralcons, but the combined Ordin is as good or better than Rex. And yeah, I get that there's some other great 3P stuff out there, but suggestions like Commotus and Warden when I have zero interest in Turmoil and I'm waiting to see how Titans Return Fortress Maximus shakes out because I don't want a small Fort Max doesn't help when I'm into combiners right now (and Combiner Wars/Unite Warriors has most of those covered).

I will say that MMC's Azalea is high on my list, though, as she's relatively inexpensive, I never found a Hasbro Arcee, and I like MMC's take on IDW Craycee.

Edited February 9, 2016 by mikeszekely

[David Hingtgen]

I really hate that pic of Abominus. It's THE pic of that configuration. It's like when Takara colors something "animation error for that one scene-accurate".

ONE drawing, produced 20 years later, does NOT reconfigure Abominus.

There's also the one pic of Defensor with Streetwise as an arm. Again---one drawing doesn't override every animation and box art appearance ever.

[Valkyrie Hunter D]

It looks nice, I was thinking of dressing up my MP Exhaust too. I just saw one one the Chinese web, but 13 bucks with S&H is a bit steep for me, I think it's one of those dry transfer. I got one for MP Wheeljack and it looks really nice.

Yeah, it's not cheap, but the colors match dead on and it saves me the trouble of painting in the omissions Takara made to get Exhaust on the shelves.

[mikeszekely]

I really hate that pic of Abominus. It's THE pic of that configuration. It's like when Takara colors something "animation error for that one scene-accurate".

ONE drawing, produced 20 years later, does NOT reconfigure Abominus.

There's also the one pic of Defensor with Streetwise as an arm. Again---one drawing doesn't override every animation and box art appearance ever.

Yeah, Blot and Cutthroat are swapped and the head is toy colored. And yeah, it's probably the very reason why Ordin uses that configuration and colors instead of being more animation accurate. I'm betting this very image is the inspiration behind Ordin. If Blot and Cutthroat were in the right spots and his head was animation colored, though, we'd all be talking about how great that pic is.

In any case, I've conceded several times that switching Blot and Cutthroat is Ordin's biggest flaw. Yeah, the G1 toy could do it, but yeah, it's just wrong. And I accept that, for many, it may be enough of a reason to pass. I've been watching and reading as many reviews as I can for Ordin and Siegfried, though, and while the individual Feralcons still seem to be the gold standard for making a combiner part that's a great toy by itself, I've heard enough variations on "Combined, Ordin is better than Feral Rex" that I'm convinced. I ordered Siegfried, and I'll post a review after I get him. And if, someday down the line someone like MMC makes an Abominus I like better, I could always sell Ordin.

My combiner lust is getting out of hand, though. I'm starting to look at 3P combiners that Hasbro's already done (and I already have). I'm going to wait awhile on Devastator because I really do like the CW version (at least in combined mode), and frankly I think Hasbro's Superion beats Uranos, which seems to be the only 3P Superion. Warbotron Bruticus looks pretty good combined, but the individual bots are just off, especially Vortex. I think with some 3P add-ons, like Perfect Effect's, Unite Warriors Bruticus might be the best Bruticus. Quantron is tempting because he's pretty cheap now and I expect the Combiner Wars version to be crappy repaints, but he looks off as Computron and the individual bots look way off. Not sure I like the Warbotron Computron any better. I'm watching TFC's Poseidon, but it's too early to call.

On the flip side, I dig M3, but nobody seems to have Downforce. Is Fansproject going to do another run? I also think that Maketoys Protectobots look really good, but was Vulcan ever actually released? No trouble finding the limbs, but I can't even find an out of stock listing for Vulcan. I won't bother with them if I can't get Vulcan, but if I can I'll go for it. Lastly, I think I'll probably end up getting Toyworld's Dinobot combiner. Individually they seem like solid Dinobots that fit with the CHUGs, and as a kid I'd kind of always thought that it'd be cool if the Dinobots could combine.

TFC's Liokaiser and that Throttlebot combiner don't really interest me. The only Throttlebot I could even name is Goldbug, and I've never seen Transformers Victory.

[David Hingtgen]

Vulcan's not even out yet. The arms came out THIS week and very few people have them yet.

And yes, I'm 100% convinced Ordin is based on that pic, because it's the first pic that shows up if you google Abominus. Which tells me that UT doesn't really know TF's that well, if they're using non-standard stuff as references and not realizing it. For how expensive 3P is and how picky TF fans are-----you'd better make darn sure you're making the right/expected version of a character, and not basing it off of a one-off or fan-art pic.

[Scyla]

Yeah, supposedly Dr. Killenger saw a design or a prototype, and then one of the MMC team gave an interview where they said they were going to do Abominus, and eventually all the combiners, but not soon. And that interview was over a year ago. I guess that's one of those things that if/when it eventually happens, and if I actually like it better than Ordin (Dr. K said that MMC's design was bulkier, which I don't actually care for. I mean, despite the fact that it was partsformery, I still think Warlord looks better than Rex; Rex won me over by having a much better take on Razorclaw.

On that note, why the assumption that if FansProject or Maketoys comes out with an Abominus that it will automatically be better? I mean, I know that their Predacons weren't that great, especially their Razorclaw, but I love Mania King. I don't own a lot of 3P toys yet, but Mania King is my favorite.

They look ok to me, although I admit I've been looking mostly at Siegfried right now.

Like Hasbro's combiners?

What, exactly, is weak about them? I like them better than anything but the pistols that came with the Feralcons (and don't get me started on the Feralcons melee weapons, which look like crap as anything but the combined sword).

Well, like I already said, I agree that the dragon necks look a little thick but I think he's spot on in bot and torso mode, so...

You mean the big, G1-accurate shield? I love it! Remember, I actually had G1 Hun-Gurr back in the day. That shield is definitely something I remember.

As striking as what, exactly? I think, aside from Blot and Cutthroat switching positions, it's darn near perfect. I mean, he's a dead ringer for this art:

MTMTEAbominus.jpg

Look, as far as doing the research goes, most of what I'm hearing from people who actually own him are that, yeah, the individual bots aren't as good as the Feralcons, but the combined Ordin is as good or better than Rex. And yeah, I get that there's some other great 3P stuff out there, but suggestions like Commotus and Warden when I have zero interest in Turmoil and I'm waiting to see how Titans Return Fortress Maximus shakes out because I don't want a small Fort Max doesn't help when I'm into combiners right now (and Combiner Wars/Unite Warriors has most of those covered).

I will say that MMC's Azalea is high on my list, though, as she's relatively inexpensive, I never found a Hasbro Arcee, and I like MMC's take on IDW Craycee.

The fact that the limbs just dangle around without any place to go is one of main points I dislike on combiners (the other one would be staring at crotches and thigh gaps in the limbs). I prefer if the arms are integrated into the shape of the shoulder but even if they just hang out on the side of the toy disguise the hands and let them peg in solidly.

I think their Hun-Gurr is not good because of the proportions of the twin heads. They look to wide in beast-mode and not thick enough in combined-mode. In robot-mode it is also not very appealing to me.

Why I think the weapons are weak looking I could not tell you exactly why I feel that way. It is probably a combination of general looks the way they can combine. I think Feral Rex did it the best and all other combiners have to be measured against it.

While the chest shield is accurate to the G1 toy I don't think that this is a boon to Ordin. Engineering has changed over the last 30 years so I think they should include as many parts as possible. Having the threads as forearms was one of the successes of TFCs Hercules I think. I'm not one that is for G1 accuracy when it comes to Transformers toys especially if they have a different style like Ordin and Feral Rex. Arguments can be made in case of a Masterpiece-style toy but it can go too far there also (see MP Ironhides legs). So if they can pull some clever engineering tricks to turn a white robot into a maroon torso I'm all for it. Clever engineering and design is king when it comes to transforming toys in my opinion. Slavish G1 design is at the bottom of my list. If it doesn't look good don't do it.

For combine mode I feel that the proportions are not right in certain parts. Plus looking at the way the toy behalves while handled. How everything looks combined and where parts of the robots go are not to my liking. I think UT saw the success of Feral Rex and tried to ape the style but couldn't pull it off correctly. In addition the fact that Blot looked so great spoiled the whole toy for me once it was clear that the other members weren't up to par.

I personally like the Maketoys/Fansproject combiners because I dig the style and the engineering tricks (Diesel and Sonic Drill are great feats of engineering IMHO). They have massive shortcomings though. Stuff like Blindfires arms in arm-mode the weird l-shaped sled on Metalstorms back, the thigh-gaps on M³, the non-transformation of Kar Krash and T-Bone in leg-mode. The list goes on and on. At the moment I'm looking for a good deal on Green Giant and box sets of FPs Monstructor and MT Defensor. Like I said engineering is highly important so I can tolerate certain parts if they manage to wow me with the joints/transformation. The FP Dinoking/Monstructor looks weak in that department but I like the Monstructor colors and it would fit in well with the other combiners I have so I'm a hypocrite there I guess.

The fact that Fans Projects Downforce is not available comes from the fact that many collectors broke the windshield part during transformation and ordered a replacement unit from the retailers. So your best bet is ebay and maybe some lesser known stores might still have stock. I bought my M³ two years ago from TFSource but during my search I found a store where they still had all five members but I don't recall their name.

If you are in a combiner craze I would look at the early IDW inspired Menasor that was posted a few pages back in this thread especially since the CW version has a weak center part. Since it is from a newcomer I would wait for reviews first if they are able to release it. TFC is in the middle of releasing Liokaiser and have announced King Posidon but they are TFC so I'm not a fan.

If it doesn't have to be a combiner I would check out Planet Xs FoC Dinobots. I think they fit really well with mainline toys. All the Dinobot combiners seem to have some sort of problem with their design so going for a combiner team might not be ideal. Other stuff I would recommend is Warden and the Fans Project Function X line especially if you like hand candy.

[mikeszekely]

Why I think the weapons are weak looking I could not tell you exactly why I feel that way. It is probably a combination of general looks the way they can combine. I think Feral Rex did it the best and all other combiners have to be measured against it.

I don't have all the Feralcons yet and can't really comment on all their individual weapons. I like Bovis' pistols. Fortis' arm cannons aren't exactly bad, but it feels like a cheat that he didn't have a handheld gun. I don't know about Talon's or Leo's weapons, but I expect I'll like Tigris' pistols. Their combined mode looks solid from pics. The melee weapons are rubbish, though. A handful of knives, some with really funky handles, and whatever the heck Leo's are supposed to be. I would put them together in Rex's sword mode forever if it weren't for the fact that you need parts of it for Leo's chest and tail in lion mode.

While the chest shield is accurate to the G1 toy I don't think that this is a boon to Ordin. Engineering has changed over the last 30 years so I think they should include as many parts as possible. Having the threads as forearms was one of the successes of TFCs Hercules I think. I'm not one that is for G1 accuracy when it comes to Transformers toys especially if they have a different style like Ordin and Feral Rex. Arguments can be made in case of a Masterpiece-style toy but it can go too far there also (see MP Ironhides legs). So if they can pull some clever engineering tricks to turn a white robot into a maroon torso I'm all for it. Clever engineering and design is king when it comes to transforming toys in my opinion. Slavish G1 design is at the bottom of my list. If it doesn't look good don't do it.

I want a balance. I don't want or expect an overly-slavish G1 design, but to me they are meant to represent G1 (or at least IDW) characters. Too much departure (like TFC's Predacons) and I lose interest. All I can tell you is that I like Siegfried's shield (it's a lot better than Leo Dux's shield) and I think it looks perfect as Abominus's chest plate. I like what they did to break it up, too, so that the waist armor doesn't interfere with Ordin's articulation. So, yeah, if it doesn't look good don't do it, but I personally think on Ordin it looks very good.

I personally like the Maketoys/Fansproject combiners because...

I didn't really mean to sound like I was disparaging MT/FP. As I don't have a ton of experience with a lot of 3rd parties yet, I'm willing to give anyone at least one try. What I was really asking is why there should be an assumption that a MT/FP toy will automatically be better than UT. Like I said, their Predaking might not have been the best, but I still like Mania King better than any of the individual Feralcons.

The fact that Fans Projects Downforce is not available comes from the fact that many collectors broke the windshield part during transformation and ordered a replacement unit from the retailers. So your best bet is ebay and maybe some lesser known stores might still have stock. I bought my M³ two years ago from TFSource but during my search I found a store where they still had all five members but I don't recall their name.

Does FP usually do more runs? I'd like to get M3, but he's lower on my list.

If you are in a combiner craze I would look at the early IDW inspired Menasor that was posted a few pages back in this thread especially since the CW version has a weak center part. Since it is from a newcomer I would wait for reviews first if they are able to release it. TFC is in the middle of releasing Liokaiser and have announced King Posidon but they are TFC so I'm not a fan.

I have to pass on that Menasor. It'll be too large. Their Motormaster is the size of MP-10. I'm passing on that Liokaiser, too, because I've never watched Victory and I'd have to look at a wiki to even figure out who Liokaiser is. I've got my eye on TFC's Poseidon, though. I'll wait and see how the first two couple members shake out, though. For now, I've already ordered Siegfried, so my next 3P purchases will be the rest of Ordin, then I think I'm going to focus on Maketoys Guardian.

If it doesn't have to be a combiner I would check out Planet Xs FoC Dinobots. I think they fit really well with mainline toys. All the Dinobot combiners seem to have some sort of problem with their design so going for a combiner team might not be ideal. Other stuff I would recommend is Warden and the Fans Project Function X line especially if you like hand candy.

They don't have to be combiners (like I said, MMC's Azalea is on my list) but being a combiner helps. So... I'm probably going to go with ToyWorld's Dinobots. Yeah, their take on Swoop is horribly compromised by having to become a limb, and yeah, the combined toy seems to collapse under its own weight without some fixes. But the rest of their Dinobots look really good and the gestalt would look pretty good if some of the joints and connections can be tightened.

Warden gets suggested a lot. The problem with Warden (aside from the price, yeesh) is that despite being a fan of IDW's Transformers a Voyager-to-Leader-ish Fortress Maximus is non-starter for me. I'll wait and see how the Titans Return Fort Max shakes out.

So yeah, in summary, the Ordin limbs, MT Guardian, then I'll re-evaluate my situation (with Azalea, M3, and the ToyWorld Dinobots being heavy favorites).

[Valkyrie Hunter D]

I REALLY like what I see of MT Guardian, but I'm also holding out for MMC's Defensor. There's been nothing but CG lineart for their Hot Spot and speculation on what the other Protectobots will look like, but the rumored Studio OX inspired designs have left my finger off the trigger in buying Guardian.

Speaking of MMC, a new face for my Sphinx arrived from Hong Kong almost 4 weeks after I requested one. The default one my Sphinx had was scratched up real bad, so kudos to their customer service!