Andor (Star Wars: Andor) - Disney+

[jvmacross]

Now I demand to know why so many Bothans died....

[sh9000]

Beautiful.

 

[Seto Kaiba]

My group just finished Andor S2 Ep10-12.

Honestly, just cancel the other Disney+ Star Wars shows at this point.  Tony Gilroy and Andor have set the bar unfeasibly, unachievably, insurmountably high in a single Herculean work of cinematic mastery.  This is an unfollowable act.  Andor should be the model for future Star Wars stories.  We have no need of the Jedi and the Sith, their lightsabers and heavy-handed talk of destiny and moral absolutes.  This authentic, human drama about regular people living in the Star Wars universe has far more impact than anything else the franchise has done besides Rogue One.   

Like, I were working on one of the other in-development Disney+ Star Wars titles right now I'd be sweating bullets because this is what every other Disney+ Star Wars show will be compared to going forward.  Hopefully the critics will have some perspective and not simply murder the next series for not being on Andor's level.

[jvmacross]

When Star Wars actually caters to the OG (rapidly aging) Star Wars fans...you get Andor.....when Star Wars wants to force (pun intended) itself upon the preferred demographics or even the original, non-existant demographics (kids)...you get everything else.....Acolyte and Space Pirates....both trash in their own way....one failed because it alienated half their audience...the other failed because kids don't give a sh!t about Star Wars....

 

[Seto Kaiba]

1 hour ago, jvmacross said:

When Star Wars actually caters to the OG (rapidly aging) Star Wars fans...you get Andor.....when Star Wars wants to force (pun intended) itself upon the preferred demographics or even the original, non-existant demographics (kids)...you get everything else.....Acolyte and Space Pirates....both trash in their own way....one failed because it alienated half their audience...the other failed because kids don't give a sh!t about Star Wars....

Nah, that's not quite right IMO.

Disney has been fairly consistent in trying to keep Disney+ Star Wars titles at least as family-friendly as the Star Wars main series movies. 

However, only a few titles are actually made specifically for children.  That's your LEGO Star Wars titles and Young Jedi Adventures, and arguably Skeleton Crew.

Most of their output is nostalgia-driven, fanservice-based material that's aimed at an audience with fond memories of the Prequel Trilogy.  Filoni's shows are practically all based on his The Clone Wars cartoon from 2008.  Rebels and The Bad Batch are both direct sequels to The Clone Wars.  With, I think, one exception the three seasons of Tales of are all prequels or sequels to specific character arcs from The Clone Wars and/or the prequels.  Most of the stuff about Mandalorians in The Mandalorian and The Book of Boba Fett is from The Clone Wars and supported by Rebels, particularly the darksaber and Mando's weird cult.  Obi-Wan Kenobi is built on fandom's profound affection for Ewan McGregor's performance as Obi-Wan Kenobi in the prequels and the character's sassmaster role in The Clone Wars.  They're not aimed at kids, they're capitalizing on the nostalgia of people who were kids (or die-hard fans) in the 2000s when the prequels and The Clone Wars were new.

The Acolyte is one major exception there in that it's not directly tied into any pre-existing movie or series.  It's a tie-in to an ongoing Expanded Universe multimedia project instead, and suffered badly from being run by a promoted fan who was a devotee of that specific part of Star Wars history.

Andor, though... Andor is what happens when Disney stops trying to pander to Star Wars's aging audience with promoted fans writing glorified fan fiction in an attempt to set the Guinness record for most franchise references per minute of screen time and, instead, hires talented non-fan creators from outside to develop and tell a character-focused story for more than just Star Wars fans.

[jvmacross]

4 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Andor, though... Andor is what happens when Disney stops trying to pander to Star Wars's aging audience....

Nah...Andor definitely still panders, but not in the way practically every other SW TV show does....essentially relying on it to an absurd amount and hoping it distracts from poor writing or worse, an unnecessary story like Obi Wan....

The Mandalorian, at least initially, also worked and also lives in the OG SW timeline....basically the time before the ST takes over...

Andor's showrunners made the difference....they respected the original source material and thoroughly understood their "demographic"....

[F-ZeroOne]

So, as much as I really enjoyed "Andor", there is one little thing thats been bugging me... and thats travel times. It seems like most of the locations visited are within a "days" travel from anywhere else. That doesn't bother me too much for, say Corsucant and Ghorman, but it does make it feel like a certain Rebel base is pretty damn close to the seat of Imperial power. It may just be because I remember how hyperspace worked in the old West End Games RPGs so it just feels a bit odd in comparison...

[Duke Togo]

21 minutes ago, F-ZeroOne said:

So, as much as I really enjoyed "Andor", there is one little thing thats been bugging me... and thats travel times. It seems like most of the locations visited are within a "days" travel from anywhere else. That doesn't bother me too much for, say Corsucant and Ghorman, but it does make it feel like a certain Rebel base is pretty damn close to the seat of Imperial power. It may just be because I remember how hyperspace worked in the old West End Games RPGs so it just feels a bit odd in comparison...

Come on, man. It's Star Wars. You don't think too hard about how hyperspace/light speed works.

[jvmacross]

39 minutes ago, F-ZeroOne said:

So, as much as I really enjoyed "Andor", there is one little thing thats been bugging me... and thats travel times. It seems like most of the locations visited are within a "days" travel from anywhere else. That doesn't bother me too much for, say Corsucant and Ghorman, but it does make it feel like a certain Rebel base is pretty damn close to the seat of Imperial power. It may just be because I remember how hyperspace worked in the old West End Games RPGs so it just feels a bit odd in comparison...

https://www.starwars.com/news/star-wars-inside-intel-hyperspace

Edited yesterday at 07:20 PM by jvmacross

[Seto Kaiba]

37 minutes ago, F-ZeroOne said:

So, as much as I really enjoyed "Andor", there is one little thing thats been bugging me... and thats travel times. It seems like most of the locations visited are within a "days" travel from anywhere else. That doesn't bother me too much for, say Corsucant and Ghorman, but it does make it feel like a certain Rebel base is pretty damn close to the seat of Imperial power. It may just be because I remember how hyperspace worked in the old West End Games RPGs so it just feels a bit odd in comparison...

That seems to be the case for practically any hyperspace trip in Star Wars.

Jump cuts are used to preserve the flow of the story, but it definitely feels like Star Wars hyperdrives are so fast that you can get anywhere in the galaxy within a day or two.  Luke and Obi-Wan's trip to Alderaan in A New Hope seems to take only a few hours.  Anakin's trip from Tatooine to Coruscant in The Phantom Menace seems to be an overnight flight at most.  So very many characters take interstellar flights in small fighters with no evident way to deal with basic biological necessities (and are never shown racing to the john right after landing) that it seems to suggest most hyperspace trips are a matter of a few hours at most.  

[Duke Togo]

You should just never think that hard about space travel in Star Wars

[jvmacross]

2 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

...and are never shown racing to the john right after landing...

You'd think the topic is so inane that there is no way it would be brought up in Star Wars, but IIRC...didn't Mando's bounty in the first episode request to use the loo aboard his ship?  So I guess some ships have toilets...and the rest probably have some onboard mechanics to deal with it....

[renegadeleader1]

6 hours ago, Duke Togo said:

You should just never think that hard about space travel in Star Wars

Like how in Rise of Skywalker the Falcon hyperdrive hops between about 10 different planets that are nowhere near each other or even on the same hyperspace route?😆

[tekering]

37 minutes ago, renegadeleader1 said:

Like how in Rise of Skywalker the Falcon hyperdrive hops between about 10 different planets that are nowhere near each other or even on the same hyperspace route?😆

The gulf in quality between Andor and Rise of Skywalker could only be measured in parsecs. 

[Seto Kaiba]

7 hours ago, jvmacross said:

You'd think the topic is so inane that there is no way it would be brought up in Star Wars, but IIRC...didn't Mando's bounty in the first episode request to use the loo aboard his ship?  So I guess some ships have toilets...and the rest probably have some onboard mechanics to deal with it....

... y'know, you're right.  There is a visible toilet on the Razor Crest in The Mandalorian.  

I guess poor Mando just has to cross his legs and wait now that he's got that Naboo starfighter. 🤣

 

2 hours ago, tekering said:

The gulf in quality between Andor and Rise of Skywalker could only be measured in parsecs. 

Kiloparsecs.  It's difficult to believe Andor and The Rise of Skywalker are even in the same franchise, so vast is the difference in quality.

Imagine what we could have had if the likes of Tony Gilroy had been given creative control of the sequel trilogy instead of Jar-Jar Abrams.

[Duke Togo]

I've been thinking about where Andor sits in my favorite shows of all time. Top 5 for sure. Top 3, maybe? 

[Thom]

5 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

...

Imagine what we could have had if the likes of Tony Gilroy had been given creative control of the sequel trilogy instead of Jar-Jar Abrams.

Thinking too much about it could lead one to insanity...

[pengbuzz]

8 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

... y'know, you're right.  There is a visible toilet on the Razor Crest in The Mandalorian.  

I guess poor Mando just has to cross his legs and wait now that he's got that Naboo starfighter. 🤣

 

Kiloparsecs.  It's difficult to believe Andor and The Rise of Skywalker are even in the same franchise, so vast is the difference in quality.

Imagine what we could have had if the likes of Tony Gilroy had been given creative control of the sequel trilogy instead of Jar-Jar Abrams.

Can we get them to:

Spoiler

Remove the Sequel Trilogy from canon  and have Tony Gilroy the helm?

 

[Roy Focker]

Star War is going to suck now. Andor, Acolyte & Skeleton Crew were all departures from the usual formula. Making each of them was a risk and results varied. As bad a the Acoytle was at least they tried to do something new. You don't get shows like Andor by playing it safe.

The Filoni-verse is bland, functions like the cartoons it was based on, loaded with fan service and is creativity bankrupt. You might find a good scene here and there. They might introduce a really good idea but don't have the balls do anything meaningful with it. But this is the path they are going with for now because it is the safest.

[azrael]

29 minutes ago, pengbuzz said:

Can we get them to:

  Reveal hidden contents

Remove the Sequel Trilogy from canon  and have Tony Gilroy the helm?

In my head, I already did the first part. 🤣

[Seto Kaiba]

49 minutes ago, pengbuzz said:

Remove the Sequel Trilogy from canon  and have Tony Gilroy the helm?

As much as I would love that, Tony Gilroy has indicated he's not really interested in a long-term commitment to franchise filmmaking and there is no way Disney is brazen enough to do a partial reboot on Star Wars so soon after rebooting it the first time in order to get rid of the unremarkable and unsatisfying but financially successful sequel trilogy.

 

48 minutes ago, Roy Focker said:

Star War is going to suck now.

It sucked before... we're just going to be more aware of how much it sucks now that Star Wars has, by luck or good judgement, produced a series that doesn't.

Going back to shows that read like Dave Filoni playing with his Clone Wars and Rebels action figures is going to feel like one giant leap backwards creatively, but it's far too late for them to recalibrate their creative process for Ahsoka season two or Maul: Shadow Lord, both of which are Clone Wars/Rebels spinoffs.

[F-ZeroOne]

21 hours ago, Duke Togo said:

You should just never think that hard about space travel in Star Wars

 

I know, I know - hyperspace travel in "Star Wars" works however the writers need it to. But that system map has everything much "closer" together than it feels like it should.  Its one of those cases where whats depicted in-universe is at odds with my head canon. 😄

[Duke Togo]

I would love to know what Filoni thinks of Andor. 

[jvmacross]

1 hour ago, Duke Togo said:

I would love to know what Filoni thinks of Andor. 

Pretty sure he's the kind of Star Wars fan that actually likes anything associated with Star Wars.....

[pengbuzz]

6 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Going back to shows that read like Dave Filoni playing with his Clone Wars and Rebels action figures is going to feel like one giant leap backwards creatively, but it's far too late for them to recalibrate their creative process for Ahsoka season two or Maul: Shadow Lord, both of which are Clone Wars/Rebels spinoffs.

When I read that, I couldn't get this clip out of my head: