Macross Δ (Delta) - Mission 15 - READ 1st POST

[Product9]

To be fair, Grace wasn't exactly human anymore. Roid was never human but I get your meaning.

I wonder if maybe Gramia dropped the bomb on Windermere. He was a pilot, and had his weird ideologies and motives. Though Roid seems to be at the top of the propaganda conspiracy. Wasn't Roid a pilot at some point, too?

Edited July 15, 2016 by Product9

[Saruta]

I don't think Gramia dropped the bomb. It seemed to me that his desire for revenge was sincere. Whoever actually dropped the bomb, apparently Gramia believed it was the NUNS.

[kalvasflam]

You know, it had to be Windermere that dropped the bomb, at least to me that would make sense. Wasn't one of the reason stated earlier on about the fold bomb creating a fault that restricted travel there. It makes no sense for NUNS to have done it. Because if they want to win the war, they have tons of resources that keep folding in. The only reason that NUNS stopped if Windermere did drop the bomb is because they couldn't get in more reinforcements.

But then, one question that comes along is how is SV able to fold out, or for that matter the AKs. They would've had to travel a long way before their fold engines became effective. So, how did they do it. After all, NUNS couldn't fold in. Otherwise, Windermere would've been screwed. Anybody else have any thoughts on this?

[Product9]

Apparently the blue fold portal the SV uses is better than the pink ones we are used to. Frontier established some fold drives are more advanced, with that LAI prototype being able to navigate some fold faults in real time (or something - I can't remember).

[Seto Kaiba]

Yep, they've shown up as the guys in the desert type head dresses talking about improving the ruin's song enhancement and the proto culture ship after the Elysion shot it.

I noticed something interesting while I was rewatching some of the last couple episodes... I think the Epsilon Group may have ties to the Critical Path Corp. from Macross VF-X2.

While Berger's men are repairing the song shrine on the Sigur Valens after the lucky shot on Johnson's part that knocked it out, they mention of the parts is the "Zauberflute". That was the name of a piece of technology developed by the Critical Path Corp., a next-gen fold communications system based on a new kind of dimensional resonance crystal discovered in 2043 (Macross Frontier's novelization indicates this was fold quartz, potentially making Critical Path the first company to develop applications of the stuff after the discovery of the Vajra in 2040). If a Zauberflute system is part of Heinz's song shrine's amplifier, that means Epsilon is building on or adapting technology which the Critical Path Corporation developed for Latence, a rogue faction inside the military...

...

...

...

Hell's bells, now here's a theory!

What if the reason the Epsilon Group is supporting Windermere and egging on the Aerial Knights in their campaign against the New UN Government is because their real identity is a leftover branch of Latence?

They could be manipulating Windermere's elite to pursue this war becuase their aim was to manufacture a galactic-scale threat to the New UN Government so the organization's supporters in the New UN Forces' top brass could either use the crisis to increase the military's influence over the government to the rather excessive levels it enjoyed before the reorganization... or even as an excuse for that rogue faction of the military to launch another coup and establish a Earth-centric government.

In VF-X2 at least they were still using VF-11Bs. VF-19As were with named pilots. That was in 2050 to 2051. We know the VF-171 first took flight in 2046. As seen with Ozma the 117th Research Fleet had the VF-171 as a mainstay in 2048.Macross 7 was using the VF-11C variant so there may be some internal differences like the VF-19A does to the VF-19E.Also Macross 13 or Battle 13 had massed produced X-9 Ghosts or AIF-9B as fodder.

They were probably in the middle of transitioning part or all of their forces to the VF-171 or VF-19 when Macross VF-X2 was set... since Earth hasn't got the same restrictions on arming its forces as the rest of the galaxy. They were supposed to have been the first to adopt a 5th Generation VF though, that YF-24 Evolution spec that all of the other 5th Gen VFs so far are based on is the stripped-down version of their baby.

I wonder if there are any fully AIed Ghosts around. I would bet that the sol system probably has a Macross or Battle class around beyond the standard Gitmos, Uragas, and Northamptons.

Technically, all Ghosts are fully AI'd... they're just not "sentient AI'd" as that technology tends to go a tiny bit insane.

Both Macross VF-X2 and Macross Frontier's novelization have the flagship of Earth's defenses being the Macross-13, a state of the art Battle-class. In 2059, her captain was General Kim Kabirov... former SDF-1 Macross bridge operator.

It would be absolutely hilarious though if sol only had VF-11s still

Probably not... in 2058, the emigrant fleets were starting to sell off their now-retired VF-11s. (Macross the Ride protagonist Chelsea Scarlett put up the cash to buy three decommissioned airframes and use them to build one custom VF-11B.)

[Seto Kaiba]

Apparently the blue fold portal the SV uses is better than the pink ones we are used to. Frontier established some fold drives are more advanced, with that LAI prototype being able to navigate some fold faults in real time (or something - I can't remember).

LAI's "Super Fold Booster" was a fold system built using fold quartz instead of fold carbon, which enabled it to create a "zero-time fold" instead... which can cross fold faults and has no discrepency between the passage of time for the folding ship and the passage of time back in realspace.

(When folding with an ordinary fold system, time passes somewhat slower for the folding ship than it does in realspace... a problem exacerbated by distance and any fold faults that they have to pass through.)

[RedWolf]

I noticed something interesting while I was rewatching some of the last couple episodes... I think the Epsilon Group may have ties to the Critical Path Corp. from Macross VF-X2.

While Berger's men are repairing the song shrine on the Sigur Valens after the lucky shot on Johnson's part that knocked it out, they mention of the parts is the "Zauberflute". That was the name of a piece of technology developed by the Critical Path Corp., a next-gen fold communications system based on a new kind of dimensional resonance crystal discovered in 2043 (Macross Frontier's novelization indicates this was fold quartz, potentially making Critical Path the first company to develop applications of the stuff after the discovery of the Vajra in 2040). If a Zauberflute system is part of Heinz's song shrine's amplifier, that means Epsilon is building on or adapting technology which the Critical Path Corporation developed for Latence, a rogue faction inside the military...

...

...

...

Hell's bells, now here's a theory!

What if the reason the Epsilon Group is supporting Windermere and egging on the Aerial Knights in their campaign against the New UN Government is because their real identity is a leftover branch of Latence?

They could be manipulating Windermere's elite to pursue this war becuase their aim was to manufacture a galactic-scale threat to the New UN Government so the organization's supporters in the New UN Forces' top brass could either use the crisis to increase the military's influence over the government to the rather excessive levels it enjoyed before the reorganization... or even as an excuse for that rogue faction of the military to launch another coup and establish a Earth-centric government.

Alternate theory it's Macross Galaxy. Manfred Brando does have a relationship with Macross Galaxy. Or it could be just an Anti-UN group affiliated with Black Rainbow as Timothy Dadalton used the Sound Jamming System with his Feious.

You know, it had to be Windermere that dropped the bomb, at least to me that would make sense. Wasn't one of the reason stated earlier on about the fold bomb creating a fault that restricted travel there. It makes no sense for NUNS to have done it. Because if they want to win the war, they have tons of resources that keep folding in. The only reason that NUNS stopped if Windermere did drop the bomb is because they couldn't get in more reinforcements.

But then, one question that comes along is how is SV able to fold out, or for that matter the AKs. They would've had to travel a long way before their fold engines became effective. So, how did they do it. After all, NUNS couldn't fold in. Otherwise, Windermere would've been screwed. Anybody else have any thoughts on this?

Macross Delta Japanese wikpedia mentions that Megaroad 4 ran afoul of a Fold Fault which lead them to accidentally discovering Windermere 4. It could be the MDE made regional Fold Fault around Windermere worse.

Edited July 15, 2016 by RedWolf

[Einherjar]

Speaking of which, perhaps we should change Keith's name to "I'm not a Stark" after that whole "I'm a knight"-bit during Heinz's coronation.

Out of respect for Big Boss and Jon Snow, I think of him more as Most Dangerous Keith; little to no personality besides a-hole and no redeeming qualities beyond emo, his brother Heinz, and bromance with Roid. Give that b*****d a football uniform and he's set.

Not sure if the character development for the Knights made an impression at all to me. Except for Borgue, all I could think of for their part in the episode is "rich boy problems." For all the bad things that Windermere has gone through, perceived or actual, it doesn't change the fact that as part of the nobility they are probably more well off than a huge chunk of the populace. Of course most of them would agree to perpetual warfare. Also helps that either a random Terran, their late king, or some other secretive party literally killed the concept of chivalry for the whole kingdom. I'd like to know more of how life for the commoners are like by comparison. So far Freyja has been their only representation, and it's concerning that she desperately wanted to get off the planet and her only procession of note was contraband technology. What if she's not the only one with the same story? Might need to see Freyja's manga to be sure.

Edited July 15, 2016 by Einherjar

[eko.prasetiyo]

how does winderemere got a fold fault? is it naturally occur? or is it "created" by the protoculture to seal off sigur valens?

[Seto Kaiba]

Or it could be just an Anti-UN group affiliated with Black Rainbow as Timothy Dadalton used the Sound Jamming System with his Feious.

Black Rainbow may have been an anti-government group, but it was a puppet organization that was being manipulated by Latence and supplied covertly by Critical Path.

Macross Delta Japanese wikpedia mentions that Megaroad 4 ran afoul of a Fold Fault which lead them to accidentally discovering Windermere 4. It could be the MDE made regional Fold Fault around Windermere worse.

I doubt it... the conspicuously spherical dimensional fault that perfectly surrounds and also isolates Windermere IV smacks of design intent. The last time we saw something like this, the ancient Protoculture had gone to some frankly considerable difficulty to keep a dangerous toy out of the hands of literally everyone.

how does winderemere got a fold fault? is it naturally occur? or is it "created" by the protoculture to seal off sigur valens?

It hasn't been said officially if it's an artificial or natural dimensional fault, but the presentation strongly suggests it's artificial.

[kalvasflam]

Technically, all Ghosts are fully AI'd... they're just not "sentient AI'd" as that technology tends to go a tiny bit insane.

You know, it is kind of hard to tell how well the AI on the Ghosts worked.

The ones from Galaxy were certainly quite a terror on the NUNS pilots, and were only matched by the Ghosts from Frontier after Luca released them.

Would the so called "Juda system" sentient? Because there are huge performance difference there right?

But then, there were the generic versions that were in the first episode of Frontier that just got smacked around, those seem to be more remote piloted drones than AIed Ghosts.

Macross Delta Japanese wikpedia mentions that Megaroad 4 ran afoul of a Fold Fault which lead them to accidentally discovering Windermere 4. It could be the MDE made regional Fold Fault around Windermere worse.

Yep, that's another thing that hopefully someone will cover before the show ends.

Edited July 15, 2016 by kalvasflam

[Product9]

You know, it is kind of hard to tell how well the AI on the Ghosts worked.

The ones from Galaxy were certainly quite a terror on the NUNS pilots, and were only matched by the Ghosts from Frontier after Luca released them.

Would the so called "Juda system" sentient? Because there are huge performance difference there right?

But then, there were the generic versions that were in the first episode of Frontier that just got smacked around, those seem to be more remote piloted drones than AIed Ghosts.

The Ghosts at the start of Frontier were jammed by the Vajra and failed to operate correctly.

As for the Juda System, I think it was actually "Judas" system. The VF-25 is called "Messiah", and Luca's three drones were named after three (Simon, John and Peter) of the disciples of Christ (the Messiah). Judas Iscariot was the disciple who betrayed Jesus, so I guess the Judas system is the Ghosts "betraying", or rather leaving, the Messiah (VF-25).

I actually take exception to the symbolism (since I myself am a Christian), but I'm pretty sure that's what that's all about.

I wonder why they aren't deploying Ghosts in droves against Windermere... it's not like a Ghost can be Var'd.

Edit: Quick screenshot

Edited July 15, 2016 by Product9

[azrael]

The Ghosts at the start of Frontier were jammed by the Vajra and failed to operate correctly.

I wonder why they aren't deploying Ghosts in droves against Windermere... it's not like a Ghost can be Var'd.

The Ghosts at the start of Frontier were jammed by the Vajra and failed to operate correctly.

If Windermere can jam the Multi-drones, they can jam the Ghosts. Since Ghosts do not come with the "Judah"-system by default, they wouldn't stand much of a chance. Since the Wind Singer is emitting fold waves, those might interfere with fold communication that Luca used for his Ghosts. The Fold wave jamming system they used might be a 2-way street. It blocks the song of the Wind Singer but might also also disrupt signals to a fold comm-based command system.

[RedWolf]

The Ghosts at the start of Frontier were jammed by the Vajra and failed to operate correctly.

As for the Juda System, I think it was actually "Judas" system. The VF-25 is called "Messiah", and Luca's three drones (Simon, Johan and Petero) were named for the (Greek?) names of three of the disciples of Christ (the Messiah). Judas Iscariot was the disciple who betrayed Jesus, so I guess the Judas system is the Ghosts "betraying", or rather leaving, the Messiah (VF-25).

I actually take exception to the symbolism (since I myself am a Christian), but I'm pretty sure that's what that's all about.

I wonder why they aren't deploying Ghosts in droves against Windermere... it's not like a Ghost can be Var'd.

Macross Frontier BD changes it to Judah instead.

[Product9]

Macross Frontier BD changes it to Judah instead.

Really? I just checked my BluRay 720p fansub version and it was still the same.

Thing is I could have sworn it was Judah System as well, but I was watching it a few days ago and noticed this. I wonder if there is a version like that. Maybe the original TV broadcast?

Edit: Yes, the original TV version has the Judah System. It also says "AUTNOMY" instead of "AUTONOMY" which they fixed in the BluRay release. I can provide screenshots if you like.

Edit2: Went ahead and made an image to compare. TV at top, BD on bottom

Edited July 15, 2016 by Product9

[hulagu]

I wonder why they aren't deploying Ghosts in droves against Windermere... it's not like a Ghost can be Var'd.

Shouldn't full body cyborgs like Grace and Brera also be immune to a biological reaction like the Var?

[guyxxed]

While all the theories that tie in to past series are fun, I don't think that's where Delta will go. Pretty much all Macross series to date have been pretty well self contained, with the tie ins more as just easter eggs than critical plot points.

My theory: Keith and Roid are the ones that dropped the DE bomb, possibly with backing from Epsilon, and have been conspiring to usurp the kingdom out from under Gramia through his death and the manipulation of Heinz.

Up until this episode, I would have said Roid was doing it for power and Keith was doing it for revenge (bastard son and all that), but Roid's declaring war on the galaxy seems counter to that, so who knows.

I definitely second the thoughts that the villains are so far underwritten. Their motives are murky, their plans are unknown, and their personalities are thin at best. Grace was maybe not as developed as she could have been, but her actions were all clear and built a strong image of someone with a purpose, which was enough to successfully carry the story. The Windy's so far, not so much.

[MisaForever]

Really? I just checked my BluRay 720p fansub version and it was still the same.

Thing is I could have sworn it was Judah System as well, but I was watching it a few days ago and noticed this. I wonder if there is a version like that. Maybe the original TV broadcast?

Edit: Yes, the original TV version has the Judah System. It also says "AUTNOMY" instead of "AUTONOMY" which they fixed in the BluRay release. I can provide screenshots if you like.

Edit2: Went ahead and made an image to compare. TV at top, BD on bottom

At least they fixed the Autnomy typo.

Edited July 15, 2016 by MisaForever

[Kelsain]

It would be interesting if it were Roid & Keith who dropped the DE bomb. Perhaps they didn't really know what they were dropping - it might've been provided to them as an effective way to drive off the NUNS, or Gramia might've known, but told K&R nothing about the specifics.

This might explain the "turning white wings black" and how K&R are "in this together since that day" angle. While Keith showed Heinz the crater to steel his little brother's resolve, he didn't seem happy about it, and that may be why he refuses to get chummy with the singer; giving his loyalty to the wind, however it may blow, as an out.

Edited July 15, 2016 by Kelsain

[kalvasflam]

The thing about autonomy is interesting.

In the first episode of Frontier, the Ghosts were on their own, and got their heads handed to them. It was not obvious that they were running by themselves, they could've been directly controlled by Frontier, so their level of autonomous function could have been reduced. (i.e. the Ghosts were run like Predators are run today)

If you go back to Frontier in episode 7 when Luca's Ghosts were first introduced, you'll note that his drones were not interfered with at all, even though one would assume that the Vajra was doing the same thing as they were in episode 1. The one possible conclusion there was that the link between Luca's RVF-25 and his Ghosts were stronger, but Luca still had direct control.

Cut to the last episode where Luca releases the Ghosts to fight against the Galaxy V-9s He is shown to specifically activate a certain system, perhaps allowing the drone access to a higher level of autonomy. Something the V-9s likely already have. Again, no intereference from the Vajra, and they were there at all three instances. Also note in episode 24, the Ghosts run by Luca became much more effective against the Vajra, this was before gaining their higher level of autonomy, but they didn't seem to be special compared to earlier version of the Ghosts. So one conclusion is that direct control by Luca or at least within close proximity, Vajra could not affect the direct communications of the Ghosts with the parent ship, and hence not affecting the combat performance.

I would think that it is likely the Ghosts autonomy is not affected by the fold waves, but their communications might be. So, in episode 1, it became perfectly reasonable that the Ghosts there without a higher level of autonomy active lost links with the mothership due to jamming and were easily taken out.

Of course, the only way we can know for sure is if the Kawamori told us directly.

[RedWolf]

Both Luca's Ghosts and Galaxy's AIF-9V have a Sharon model AI running them as the X-9 did.

[squaresphere]

You'd think the NUNS would design the limited Ghost with a semi autonomous harden mode just in case all communication was severed with the master system.

[Product9]

Shouldn't full body cyborgs like Grace and Brera also be immune to a biological reaction like the Var?

I was thinking that cyborgs would be a pretty good match against Windermere people, what with their enhanced physical abilities and all. Though, Brera was pretty susceptible to fold waves, so who knows how they'd react to the Song of the Wind.

It would be interesting if it were Roid & Keith who dropped the DE bomb. Perhaps they didn't really know what they were dropping - it might've been provided to them as an effective way to drive off the NUNS, or Gramia might've known, but told K&R nothing about the specifics.

This might explain the "turning white wings black" and how K&R are "in this together since that day" angle. While Keith showed Heinz the crater to steel his little brother's resolve, he didn't seem happy about it, and that may be why he refuses to get chummy with the singer; giving his loyalty to the wind, however it may blow, as an out.

K&R were too busy writing "The C Programming Language"

Sorry, couldn't resist.

The thing about autonomy is interesting.

In the first episode of Frontier, the Ghosts were on their own, and got their heads handed to them. It was not obvious that they were running by themselves, they could've been directly controlled by Frontier, so their level of autonomous function could have been reduced. (i.e. the Ghosts were run like Predators are run today)

If you go back to Frontier in episode 7 when Luca's Ghosts were first introduced, you'll note that his drones were not interfered with at all, even though one would assume that the Vajra was doing the same thing as they were in episode 1. The one possible conclusion there was that the link between Luca's RVF-25 and his Ghosts were stronger, but Luca still had direct control.

Cut to the last episode where Luca releases the Ghosts to fight against the Galaxy V-9s He is shown to specifically activate a certain system, perhaps allowing the drone access to a higher level of autonomy. Something the V-9s likely already have. Again, no intereference from the Vajra, and they were there at all three instances. Also note in episode 24, the Ghosts run by Luca became much more effective against the Vajra, this was before gaining their higher level of autonomy, but they didn't seem to be special compared to earlier version of the Ghosts. So one conclusion is that direct control by Luca or at least within close proximity, Vajra could not affect the direct communications of the Ghosts with the parent ship, and hence not affecting the combat performance.

I would think that it is likely the Ghosts autonomy is not affected by the fold waves, but their communications might be. So, in episode 1, it became perfectly reasonable that the Ghosts there without a higher level of autonomy active lost links with the mothership due to jamming and were easily taken out.

Of course, the only way we can know for sure is if the Kawamori told us directly.

If I remember correctly, Luca's RVF-25 was equipped with some kind of new fold transceiver in episode 7 of Frontier, which is presumably why the Vajra captured him (for the fold quartz). Perhaps the enhanced communication abilities enabled more reliable control over his Ghosts.

You'd think the NUNS would design the limited Ghost with a semi autonomous harden mode just in case all communication was severed with the master system.

True that, but you'd also think the NUNS wouldn't suck at literally everything.

Edited July 15, 2016 by Product9

[Seto Kaiba]

You know, it is kind of hard to tell how well the AI on the Ghosts worked.

Macross Chronicle indicates that most of the QF-4000 Ghosts are operated in a semi-autonomous mode where a "ground" station designates the general areas of operation, permissible targets, and gives authorization to attack and the AI handles the rest. It would appear that, in the series, the Ghosts were lost in the first battle as a result of having that control fatally disrupted before an attack order could be issued (and possibly just ECM so strong it scrambled the onboard electronics).

Would the so called "Juda system" sentient? Because there are huge performance difference there right?

The Judas system is basically the same autonomous air combat program that was used in the Ghost X-9, but without the unstable hardware. Essentially, it's a Ghost tactical program with no limiters.

Shouldn't full body cyborgs like Grace and Brera also be immune to a biological reaction like the Var?

Nope... unless it's a 100% artificial body being operated remotely as Grace did sometimes, they still have their brain meats... so they're still vulnerable to Var syndrome.

[Raptor One]

The most likely explanation is that the "camera" is simply cutting away from the fold effect before the ship generating it can emerge. On those occasions when the Aerial Knights seemingly defold alone, the fold effect never closes behind them the way it does on the two or three occasions where we see their fleet defold. That suggests there's something else still defolding.

However, the idea of a "fold teleporter" does have precedent. On Uroboros, a form of fold-based teleportation technology was used for instantaneous short distance travel within the planet's Protoculture ruins. (This was the effect for entering and leaving ruins and caves on the three world maps used in the Macross 30: Voices Across the Galaxy game... pairs of "fold stones" that, when activated, teleported you from one to the other.)

For many planets and fleets, there may not have been an immediate or pressing need to upgrade from the VF-171. Frontier and Galaxy went for the upgrade en masse because they were headed into what was, at the time, Vajra territory in full awareness of the fact that a VF-19 or VF-22 would be just as helpless in combat with the Vajra as a VF-171. Backwaters like the Brisingr cluster, that would only have had to worry about Zentradi or terrorists would naturally not see much reason to upgrade to the more costly, more difficult to mass produce 5th Generation VFs. The VF-171 was, and likely still is, an excellent, highly versatile fighter with great cost performance... it's just hopelessly out of its depth against the 5th Generation equivalent fielded in low numbers by the Aerial Knights of Windermere.

The VF-19 and VF-22 can't be fielded in large numbers by the regional NUNS as the result of arms export restrictions imposed in the wake of the Isamu's and Guld's little stunt on Earth back in 2040. The central New UN Forces like to have the biggest stick, after all... and they may have finished upgrading to 5th Generation VFs by now (possibly the VF-24). Emigrant forces can deploy a "monkey model" reduced capability version of the VF-19 or VF-22 in some small numbers, but both the restrictions on their construction and use and the high burden their performance places on the pilot in the absence of inertia store converter technology makes them impractical to employ in large numbers.

would be interesting to see the type of VFs currently serving in the sol system.

I wonder if there are any fully AIed Ghosts around. I would bet that the sol system probably has a Macross or Battle class around beyond the standard Gitmos, Uragas, and Northamptons.

It would be absolutely hilarious though if sol only had VF-11s still

I would love for a Macross series where the story pits the colony-developed generation 5 VFs against whatever the earth based NUNS is fielding these days

[aurance]

LAI's "Super Fold Booster" was a fold system built using fold quartz instead of fold carbon, which enabled it to create a "zero-time fold" instead... which can cross fold faults and has no discrepency between the passage of time for the folding ship and the passage of time back in realspace.

(When folding with an ordinary fold system, time passes somewhat slower for the folding ship than it does in realspace... a problem exacerbated by distance and any fold faults that they have to pass through.)

Where is this from?

[This Confuses Gamlin]

You'd think the NUNS would design the limited Ghost with a semi autonomous harden mode just in case all communication was severed with the master system.

They're probably still a little paranoid about Ghosts Gone Wild, even 19 years later. Luca saying "show them the power that terrorized Macross City" or somesuch is a nice callback, but it's obvious in the final episode that Galaxy's unrestrained AIF-9Vs are more than a match for the average VF-171 mook.

[Seto Kaiba]

Where is this from?

Mostly, that's discussed right in the Macross Frontier series itself... though it's also covered in Macross Chronicle Technology Sheet 08A: Overtechnology: Space Folds.

(The bit about time passing at different rates in realspace and aboard a folding ship goes waaay back to the original series... where Misa indicated that, based on the current human understanding of fold travel, an hour's travel by space fold could see as much as ten days pass back in realspace. Chronicle indicates this was a crude, somewhat imprecise guess and indicates that under ideal conditions the time differential isn't much... but if there's a strong gravitational field nearby or a fold fault on the route, the time differential can quickly become large. For instance, Leon mentions in Frontier that if it weren't for the fold faults between the Frontier fleet and Gallia IV, they could've sent Sheryl there almost instantly... but because the fold faults increased the time loss, the difference in experienced time aboard the ship and the passage of time in realspace was 172.25 hours, or approximately 7 days, 4 hours, and 15 minutes. With the Super Fold Booster to cut out the effects of fold faults, Michel Blanc was able to make the trip in an extremely short, but unspecified, amount of time.)

[aurance]

Neato.

[Scyla]

I liked the episode (Battroid-action yay). I dislike the new opening *boo*.

[Scyla]

On a second thought. Now that a VF-22 is in Macross Delta I wonder if Bandai will release a VF-22ADVANCE later on. Could we tell if the VF-22 in this episode was blue with a yellow trim?

[ManhattanProject972]

On a second thought. Now that a VF-22 is in Macross Delta I wonder if Bandai will release a VF-22ADVANCE later on. Could we tell if the VF-22 in this episode was blue with a yellow trim?

If Guld is/was still alive you betcha he would've requested the same treatment Isamu got with his VF-19 ADVANCE on a VF-22. Or he could've ended up flying a VF-27.

[Master Dex]

Becoming a cyborg is certainly the only way Guld could have survived... but I'm just gonna put money on he's still proper dead. Evidence, the famous extra few seconds of the M+ movie edition when he bites it, lol.

[Product9]

If Guld is/was still alive you betcha he would've requested the same treatment Isamu got with his VF-19 ADVANCE on a VF-22. Or he could've ended up flying a VF-27.

Becoming a cyborg is certainly the only way Guld could have survived... but I'm just gonna put money on he's still proper dead. Evidence, the famous extra few seconds of the M+ movie edition when he bites it, lol.

Maybe Guld will have a 3 second cameo appearance in the second Macross Delta movie.

He'll fly by in his VF-22 ADVANCE while saying "It's me Guld back from the dead!"

[This Confuses Gamlin]

But Ernest Johnson is Guld too...