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Bandai VF100's Official Thread Ver.2

Graham

By Graham
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  • 2 weeks later...
Zinjo Galactic Diva

Zinjo

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Wasn't it said that the VF100 line has already failed which prompted the creation of the Hi-Metal 1/100 line? I'm sure a Hi-Metal line will be decidedly less ambitious in terms of which mechs might appear than the VF100 line was.

If it has failed, it is due to poor marketing IMO.

Bandai has the 1/60 scales which are the TRUE toys (very durable), then they have the 1/72 scale kits which are very customizable, and then the VF100 series which to me is essentially a transformable / posable display piece!

Had they marketed it as such and brought down the price point it would have been more successful. Keep in mind that a 1/72 transforming kit was cheaper and you could get itashi decals to customize it's look.

Had Bandai taken a few cues from its Gundam lines it could have sold "blanks" with custom decal sheets as well as after market decal sheets the line would have probably done as better.

By marketing it as a "toy" they alienated the collectors who were so impressed with the DX toys. which didn't need parts swapping to transform. The VF100 figure is far too delicate to be handled as much as a DX. Going for the clunky, fully transformable version like the VF-19Kai, they've lost the beauty of the original sculpts and added conspicuous screw holes on an already small figure.

As it is, with the molds they already have, they could still release a VF-25A CF and an Armored VF-25S. Hell if they were smart they'd re-market the existing figures as display pieces, finish the Mac F line, along with the VF-27G and then release a VF-27B to capitalize on that molds.

Then they could continue to bring the valks that the fans have been wanting like the VF-171, YF-24, VF-4, Vf-2SS, etc...

None of the other display figures currently licensed can change modes, but the VF100 series can. For me, that is a value add worth something.

They definitely dropped the ball on a promising figure line in my opinion! <_<

If any of our Japanese speaking members wishes to pass that along to Bandai, I'd appreciate it. :angry:

Edited by Zinjo
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VFTF1 Galactic Diva

VFTF1

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Um...going back to the M7 VF-100s...

Contrary to what I posted earlier, now I'm all excited by the VF-19Kai.

I hope Bandai makes Sound Force as VF-100s....

I think the M7 stuff might actually work better in 1/100 scale anyways given it's a bit more super robotish...

In any event....looking forward to it.

Pete

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Awacs Sharon Apple Concert Attendee

Awacs

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How exactly is the 1/100 scale more super robotish than any other scale ever? It's just a scale. I don't get it.

I think what Pete is saying is that the Macross 7 mecha are more super-robotish than the Frontier designs, and that he thinks that will make the formerr work better aesthetically in 1/100th scale than the latter. Rather than 1/100th being more super-robotish than any other scale.

At least, that is the way that I read it.

Karl

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jenius Super Dimension Member

jenius

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If the VF100 line is dead I don't really know if it could be pinned entirely on bad marketing. The product didn't seem like it knew what it was trying to be so I don't know if Bandai knew how to sell it. It was far too much a kit for a toy and far too pricey of a toy to be a kit. They either needed to knock the price way down and let it be sort of a prepainted snap together model with parts for every mode (like it was but even less assembled) or it needed to have far fewer parts and be more of a toy. If this were truly a toy they should have made it imperfect transformation in the sense that it had to be pulled apart and put back together again... not entirely new parts for different modes (the price could have been kept the same but obviously the toy wouldn't look as nice). As it is I think it really only appeals to a very narrow spectrum of the population... and I think those people it does appeal to wouldn't have minded having it be more like a model at more of a model's cost.

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Zinjo Galactic Diva

Zinjo

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If the VF100 line is dead I don't really know if it could be pinned entirely on bad marketing. The product didn't seem like it knew what it was trying to be so I don't know if Bandai knew how to sell it. It was far too much a kit for a toy and far too pricey of a toy to be a kit. They either needed to knock the price way down and let it be sort of a prepainted snap together model with parts for every mode (like it was but even less assembled) or it needed to have far fewer parts and be more of a toy. If this were truly a toy they should have made it imperfect transformation in the sense that it had to be pulled apart and put back together again... not entirely new parts for different modes (the price could have been kept the same but obviously the toy wouldn't look as nice). As it is I think it really only appeals to a very narrow spectrum of the population... and I think those people it does appeal to wouldn't have minded having it be more like a model at more of a model's cost.

I agree.

For me it wasn't as important for it to transform into battroid as having a well sculpted small sized display piece to put on my shelf to go next to my Doyusha fighters. As we've already seen in the new Robot Damashii line set of battroid figures, that there are plenty of companies willing to make the battroids. All bandai had to do was market the VF100s as 1/100 scale display fighters, price them at the same point as a kit and off they go (the transformation ability of these "models" compromises their ability to maintain the fighter mode anyway). The problem is that Bandai has always had this fixation (from the very beginning of Macross) that all Valks MUST transform or they won't sell and Hasegawa had shattered that notion over a decade ago.

There is a niche market to exploit and a bit of crossover marketing as well. Bandai had plans to release all the Macross valks in the VF100 line. By all means, go ahead and release them, as 1/100 fighters! With every fighter they release they can also release "blanks" with decals and then exploit the blanks with after market itashi decals like the ones we are seeing with the 1/72 kits. They've done it successfully with the Gundam lines, why not Macross? I'd be all over that!

The special event exclusive VF100 series VF-25s with metallic paint were fighter mode only and sold for the same price as the kits. this is the niche market they should be going after and market the models as "Collectors" series of fighters. I'd love to get all the Macross Valks in this size for display. Add blanks with itashi decals and you double the the profit on existing molds.

I wish I wrote Japanese so that I could at least mention this to the powers that be at Bandai... :angry:

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Ginrai Bridge Bunny

Ginrai

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I think what Pete is saying is that the Macross 7 mecha are more super-robotish than the Frontier designs, and that he thinks that will make the formerr work better aesthetically in 1/100th scale than the latter. Rather than 1/100th being more super-robotish than any other scale.

At least, that is the way that I read it.

Karl

Uhm, okay, so turn it around then. The Macross 7 robots are more super robotish... why is 1/100 a better scale for them? The 1/60 Macross 7 toys are clunky and toy like because they are 15 years old and were intended for children, not because they were 1/60. Am I missing something? What makes 1/100 ideal?

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VF5SS SMS Squadron Leader

VF5SS

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I think the upper body is a little longer or at least the overhang on the monoboob is a little thicker.

I think that guy is saying the Macross 7 designs are a little bulkier than the VF-25, which makes it more suited to being shrunk down to a small toy. Although given Bandai's design prowess with small toys like the HCM Pro line (some of which transform). Even looking at their kit designs, the intricate MG V Gundam is roughly the size of a 1/100 VF-25.

Then again, I don't know what Bandai was thinking. You think they saw Yamato's stillborn 1/100 VF-0? Remember the one they scrapped in favor of the 1/60? It had just as many (if not more) parts required for each mode.

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Zinjo Galactic Diva

Zinjo

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With the DX and variable kits in the market it just seems redundant to make a transformable 1/100 scale. Especially if you can't produce it for less than a model kit...

There is simply no incentive for buyers to get one outside of collectors. Spend about double the price and get a durable transforming toy or spend a little less and get a fully customizable model kit...

As a collectible single mode display piece it has a different value. Hell they could sell both modes separately and still cash in on the quality of the sculpts alone!

Edited by Zinjo
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Awacs Sharon Apple Concert Attendee

Awacs

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Uhm, okay, so turn it around then. The Macross 7 robots are more super robotish... why is 1/100 a better scale for them? The 1/60 Macross 7 toys are clunky and toy like because they are 15 years old and were intended for children, not because they were 1/60. Am I missing something? What makes 1/100 ideal?

No idea. I'm not entirely sure personally that it is any better a scale than any other to be honest. To my mind you can do a super-robotish toy in just about any scale. I could envisage quite a good version of Mac 7 toys in 1/72nd, 1/60th, 1/12th or just about any other scale.

I have to say that the price rise on the Fire Valkyrie pretty much puts it outside of the bracket I would consider. The VF-25's were at the upper end of the bracket once you add in shipping, VAT, customs charges etc, but I doubt I could justify paying the extra for the -19kai.

Karl

Edited by Awacs
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Vifam7 New Edwards Test Pilot

Vifam7

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I agree.

I too agree with Jenius.

For me it wasn't as important for it to transform into battroid as having a well sculpted small sized display piece to put on my shelf to go next to my Doyusha fighters. As we've already seen in the new Robot Damashii line set of battroid figures, that there are plenty of companies willing to make the battroids. All bandai had to do was market the VF100s as 1/100 scale display fighters, price them at the same point as a kit and off they go (the transformation ability of these "models" compromises their ability to maintain the fighter mode anyway). The problem is that Bandai has always had this fixation (from the very beginning of Macross) that all Valks MUST transform or they won't sell and Hasegawa had shattered that notion over a decade ago.

And yet when Graham suggested the notion of Yamato releasing a series of 1/100 fighter mode only models as part of the GNU lineup, a vast majority of posters here slammed the idea.

But I agree with you. That's what Bandai should've done IMPO. A series of fighter-mode only display models. Or considering their model kits expertise, take the old Imai "3-in-1" idea and release as easy to build HG kits.

Or how about the idea of the line being a series of diecast fighter-mode only display models? I mean, if it's going to be a fighter-mode only display model, why not make it diecast.

Bandai made the right decision in going for diecast use for the now Hi-Metal line but already there are some issues. The price is now even higher and for some idiotic reason they deleted the landing gears option. Will perfect transformation and diecast-use be enough to convince fans to buy the upcoming Fire Valk (a rather unpopular Valk too)?

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eriku SMS Squadron Leader

eriku

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Will perfect transformation and diecast-use be enough to convince fans to buy the upcoming Fire Valk (a rather unpopular Valk too)?

Don't cofuse it's lack of popularity on this forum with it's popularity in general. ;)

As for the price of this thing, if it really is as large as it looks in the photos where it's being held in someone's hand, it looks to be a lot bigger than the 1/100 VF-25. Unless the one in the photos is an upscaled prototype, it looks like the toy will be closer to 1/60 VF-1 size. ~80, ~90 for something that size sounds like a great price to me.

Regardless of size, I'm really excited for this release.

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jenius Super Dimension Member

jenius

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I personally like my fighter mode only stuff in gashapon so I think what Bandai did with their 1/250 stuff was great. In the VF100 line I would have liked it to be less anime perfect but be a toy that could be disassembled and reassembled into different modes (but no completely new parts or very very few). The real reason for this is the thought of having transformable versions of all those obscure valks like the VF-4 and VF-2SS. In the end it seems none of us got what we were hoping for.

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Zinjo Galactic Diva

Zinjo

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Bandai made the right decision in going for diecast use for the now Hi-Metal line but already there are some issues. The price is now even higher and for some idiotic reason they deleted the landing gears option. Will perfect transformation and diecast-use be enough to convince fans to buy the upcoming Fire Valk (a rather unpopular Valk too)?

I dunno. I'm not entirely convinced the Kai has any die cast parts. From all I've seen they seem all plastic. The "Hi Metal" appears to be referring to the metallic paint. The Gundam SP versions were metallic paint hence the "SP" meaning special paint.

Ironically the only thing that would have induced me to fork out for a Kai was the metallic paint job which makes the model look stunning!

The problem is that all the extra engineering that went into its transformation has pushed it's price point beyond my acceptable threshold for such a figure... :rolleyes:

No doubt the Gashpon fighters are nice, but the lack of detail afforded by the size just isn't enough for me. However, I do like the second series of 1/250 scale fighters. All the ones I really want are in that set. The VF-27B, the VF-25A, etc... ;)

Edited by Zinjo
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Vifam7 New Edwards Test Pilot

Vifam7

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I dunno. I'm not entirely convinced the Kai has any die cast parts. From all I've seen they seem all plastic. The "Hi Metal" appears to be referring to the metallic paint. The Gundam SP versions were metallic paint hence the "SP" meaning special paint.

Unlikely. It's already been mentioned in press releases that it would include diecast metal. We just don't know how much metal will be used. If it was just paint, they'd have left it in the VF100s line and specifically just mentioned the paint (using words like メタリック塗装 or メタリックコーティング - which they do in their gunplas).

Edited by Vifam7
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  • 2 weeks later...
Zinjo Galactic Diva

Zinjo

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Unlikely. It's already been mentioned in press releases that it would include diecast metal. We just don't know how much metal will be used. If it was just paint, they'd have left it in the VF100s line and specifically just mentioned the paint (using words like メタリック塗装 or メタリックコーティング - which they do in their gunplas).

True. The massive screw holes in the legs is usually a damning indicator of metal use... :rolleyes:

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Vifam7 New Edwards Test Pilot

Vifam7

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Question: Is VF-100 being replaced by VF Hi-Metal? Does that mean we can expect the rest of the MFrontier fighters released as Hi-Metal?

Very likely that the VF100s line is being replaced by the VF Hi-Metal line. Dunno what we'll be getting from this line in the future. We know that a VF-1 is in the works, but I wouldn't be surprised if Bandai has another Frontier Valkyrie in the works.

By the way, when Bandai uses the term "Hi-Metal" or "Chogokin", it rarely means that we're getting a ton of metal parts. More often than not it means metal in the joints and a few other strategic locations for strength and balance. I wouldn't be surprised if this Hi-Metal Fire Valk was 75 to 85 percent plastic (ABS&POM). It'd still be a major improvement over the all plastic VF100s Messiah though.

Edited by Vifam7
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Midi_Amp ARMD Deck Swabber

Midi_Amp

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It looks like Bandai is re-releasing the VF-100's line at a lower price point. Tamashii Nations will be selling the VF100 Super VF-25G for 2940 yen Tamashii Nations release calender

Ouch! That's crazy figure! It seems that Bandai wanted to clear its warehouse from the VF100 VF25 badly. At that price point, it is more attractive, given the nice detail and all.

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