Macross TV Dub

[Hurin]

As for replacing the song.  Well the theme from 'Do You Remember Love' was pretty much movie plot point specific.  Misa translates found lyrics, Hikaru slaps Minmay until she agrees to sing them.  The song loses its movie meaning if played in the series for no reason.

Now prehaps a new song for Minmay written by Mari would be different.

339604[/snapback]

Hmmmm, that's a point I hadn't considered. I mean, I was aware of the movie's plot and the meaning of the song. But, I hadn't considered that having that same song sorta appear ex nihilo in the TV series would somewhat drain the "power" from the song's unveiling in the movie.

Those who know the movie would be thinking: Why is she singing that song if this isn't the movie and the song was never discovered? Andt those who see this new dub first will not really appreciate the nature of the song, and will probably have its introduction in the movie spoiled when they finally see the movie. Really, the only benefit to having the song appear in the TV series would be as a sort of "tribute" that only existing fans would get. . . but would muddy things up unnecessarily while probably angering purists. All in all, it's a terrible idea. I wish I hadn't thought of it.

So. . . good point!

[JB0]

Would anyone object if they messed with things a little bit and had her sing "Do You Remember Love?" from the movie for the big battle episode (Farewell to Tenderness)?

I always felt that one of the few things RT did right was to introduce a new song ("We Will Win") at that crucial point in the series that was appropriate to the plot at that point. . . and I'm loathe to admit it, but by RT standards, that song wasn't too terribly bad.

I was a bit disappointed watching SDF Macross for the first time when that point arrived and we merely got another freakin' dose of "My Boyfriend is a Pilot", etc.  Instead of something dramatic and uplifting, it was time for "Kyun kyun!  Kyun kyun!". . .

I thought both styles had their merit, personally.

Robotech(and DYRL) has the extended cohesive song for maximum dramatic effect.

Though We Will Win seemd to carried a strong military theme, which would run the risk of negating the culture shock effect on the zentradi, it was still damn catchy, and gave the battle a more cinematic feel.

DYRL, of course, went with the same concept, but dodged the military theme.

In SDF Macross, however, Minmay just runs through her existing repertoire of songs. BUT the one she's singing always matches the mood of the scene in a way the single super-extended song couldn't have.

That was was what REALLY struck me about that episode when I ran through my Animeigo disks, was how well each song complemented the specific sequence it was heard in. Even the songs that I'd found annoying at prior points in the show all slid right in and justified their existence for the episode.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I liked that minmay song about the hero beating the giants from the Little White Dragon movie (kaifun stars as the action hero with kung fu to beat the giants) and how it plays during hikaru's fight against the zentradi. It is very apropriate when you think how he joins up with the military to protect minmay and all the "saving of her life" in real life that goes on in the tv series. (whereas kaifun is protesting to stop fighting in real life but is the hero in the movie, hikaru is the real life one so the song is really about hikaru, not kaifun in that context)

"We will win" is pretty good too, but that's robotech. Totally different universe which needs to co-exist as a seperate thing to macross. No point including it with macross when you can just get robotech dvd instead.

Edited October 26, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Hurin]

"We will win" is pretty good too, but that's robotech. Totally different universe which needs to co-exist as a seperate thing to macross. No point including it with macross when you can just get robotech dvd instead.

339699[/snapback]

Uh, nobody is suggesting moving "We Will Win" into Macross. . . and least, I'm not.

But please don't aggrandize RT by giving it co-equal standing with Macross. Macross is the original story. RT is an ill-conceived, poorly executed, and unfortunate bastardization of it. The only redeeming quality of RT is that it made some of us aware of Macross. Yet, that doesn't make the changes good, nor does it give RT any co-equal status alongside the original.

H

Edited October 26, 2005 by Hurin

[Apollo Leader]

Hopefully Mari does NOT redo Minmay's song's into English... the majority of English dubs of anime usually keeps the songs (either in the background or foreground) in Japanese. Of course in Macross Plus, Myung's song at the end was changed to English in the English dub, but the lyrics were more or less being spoken then sung, so it kind of made sense.

Has anyone heard what the suggested retail price for this set will be? Since ADV doesn't have to go through the exhaustive remastering that Animeigo went through and based off of what the Mospeada and Southern Cross sets went for, my guess is between $100 and $150.

Holy smokes! Didn't expect to be shelling out more money for a Macross DVD boxset again in just four years from when I got my Animeigo set. Now I just need to decide if I should sell or trade off my Animeigo set...

[JB0]

Holy smokes!  Didn't expect to be shelling out more money for a Macross DVD boxset again in just four years from when I got my Animeigo set.  Now I just need to decide if I should sell or trade off my Animeigo set...

You should keep it for the sexy box.

[Pat Payne]

Those who know the movie would be thinking:  Why is she singing that song if this isn't the movie and the song was never discovered?  Andt those who see this new dub first will not really appreciate the nature of the song, and will probably have its introduction in the movie spoiled when they finally see the movie. 

339659[/snapback]

On the other hand, you could also say that it might tie the two together...but that, like all historical moviemakers, the makers of DYRL? decided to go with the "spin" instead of fact

Apollo Leader: no word on how much the entire set will go for, but they're going to be selling individually at $30 a disc, so roughly competitive with (or perhaps a bit higher than) the Animeigo release. But you are getting 5/6 eps per disc as opposed to four with the AE, so it evens out.

Edited October 26, 2005 by Pat Payne

[DeathHammer]

Please Delete Thanks

Edited February 8, 2010 by DeathHammer

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

But please don't aggrandize RT by giving it co-equal standing with Macross. Macross is the original story. RT is an ill-conceived, poorly executed, and unfortunate bastardization of it. The only redeeming quality of RT is that it made some of us aware of Macross. Yet, that doesn't make the changes good, nor does it give RT any co-equal status alongside the original.

When I say "co-exist", I didn't mean macross fans have to accept robotech. What I mean was if you (the customer) want robotech go buy that. If you like macross, go buy macross. Ain't choice nice? I don't want people getting confused if they start to hear robotech music within macross. Yeah I know you didn't say this, but just in case someone will. hehe Co-exist just means that because robotech still exists in the west as a seperate universe (with a sequel to its ongoing story and seperate games and timeline and everything) and the proper macross is being brought over too, they are both in existance together. You have the choice for either one both or none. (there may be people who are fans of both universes)

Because both universes are completely seperate to each other, (robobtech has protoculture as an energy source, and mixes stuff, and changes the story completely by killing the bridge crew and putting events in that never happened) I want people (who are too lazy to read subs and won't watch macross because of this, and yes, these people exist) to be able to look at the real macross but without anything about robotech mentioned. As it was before, little kids who can't be bothered or are too young to read subtitles, only had robotech to watch as an option because it was in english.

Also the confusion will be there from first generation fans of robotech who will start telling people that macross is merely the first third of robotech and confuse little kids.

Just the mention of "we will win" song and saying that robotech had a more fitting song over macross kind of scared me for second heh. I liked the song too, but not over the original songs. Hell no. Don't give them ideas.

See: I believe in a slow conversion process. If people want to know the history of either universe they can see it as they were originally rather than being confused. Someone mentioned that when macross plus came out some people still thought this was a part of robotech's universe. This was that confused group I was mentioning. Convert these over to the original macross and the disinfo about macross being "the japanese version of robotech" stops spreading.

You got to assume that there are still people out there that have not bothered to find out what the real macross even is. But these types of people are not necessarily dumb, they just haven't seen macross, and won't bother to seek out macross like a fan of macross would. (let's just call that type of person "casual anime watcher" who is most likely to ignore the original language and choose english in the dvd setting)

I think if those people were converted over, as proper macross fans, (through the 'slow conversion process' of first watching it in english like people who saw robotech did) robotech might actually die off properly. I've noticed when something has an english dub it has an increased chance of being watched, because some people just do not like reading. No, robotech is not on an equal standing to macross, but that doesn't mean robotech as a universe no longer "competes for attention/recognition/money" in the west and is more likely to be popular by that generation that saw it as robotech. (whether fans of macross like it or not, they are outnumbered by the robotech people)

When you look for toys on ebay to do with macross, there is a reason "robotech" is still lumped together with macross in some descriptions or categorised in shops together with macross toys. They are targetting that group of people who best knew macross from robotech. This is the reason I made that comment about seperating the two universes and not mixing stuff you liked in robotech with macross. I don't want to hear "we will win" on the english track, just the original songs. No this isn't directed at you, but just those who might think that maybe robotech songs have some relevence to macross, which they don't.

My comment about the "we will win" song use, has to do with the use of that song within robotech, and how I thought this was actually good for robotech. Given the time (during the 80s) it was an ok substitute and I liked this. (earlier I even mentioned that I prefered the rock/metal sounding music from robotech in the battle scenes because the heavier sounding stuff suited the military theme more, over the macross battle music for example) But where I disagree is that I don't hold this music to be somehow "more relevant" to the situation than the original song which is the message I got from earlier. (ie that a pop song was less fitting than a dramatic one when both are actually pretty suitable.)

Edited October 26, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[JB0]

Also the confusion will be there from first generation fans of robotech who will start telling people that macross is merely the first third of robotech and confuse little kids.

Gods... the depths these people will sink to to protect "their" show...

I've heard the classic "3 seasons of Macross" referring, of course, to the Macross, Southern Cross, and MOSPEADA portions of Robotech, that Robotech was the original and Macross was the adaptation, and even that the Robotech events, while not original, have been backported into the Macross chronology.

[Keith]

7 disc's is good....not as good as 6 with an even 6 episodes per disc, but still good. I also doubt they'll dub DYRL into the show, most likely it'll be one of those extra's. The question is, can they get away with it without licensing it through the proper channels.......!

The disc's (with proper online discounts) will probably be around $20 each, so easily $140, or even $150 since the first volume with box will cost extra. It'll be worth it to have a copy of the series with no worries of disc cracking.

[Hurin]

But again, saying that Robotech and Macross are seperate universes that co-exist gives Robotech waaaay too much respect. Macross is the realized vision of its writers and artists. Robotech is a poorly executed bastardization. To say that they should co-exist as seperate fictional universes is like saying that if I re-edited and re-dubbed Star Wars, Star Trek, and Battlestar Galactica so that they all appear to be one over-arching story, and then licensed those films from their original studios for 300 trillion dollars, that my bastardized version of those films and series should then be accepted as a legitimate, seperate fictional universe. When in fact, they'd just be mangled crap. . . with each part suffering as it is artificially crammed into the whole.

I realize I may appear to be splitting hairs. But when people look at Robotech and sorta justify it or legitamize it by saying that it's just a different story that should be considered seperate, they are sorta sweeping under the rug how much of a lame-ass decision it was to ever mangle those three series in the first place. . . no matter how necessary it was to do to get it over here (and I doubt so much mangling was actually necessary. . . they just got carried away).

Edited October 26, 2005 by Hurin

[DeathHammer]

Please Delete Thanks

Edited February 8, 2010 by DeathHammer

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Gods... the depths these people will sink to to protect "their" show...

I've heard the classic "3 seasons of Macross" referring, of course, to the Macross, Southern Cross, and MOSPEADA portions of Robotech, that Robotech was the original and Macross was the adaptation, and even that the Robotech events, while not original, have been backported into the Macross chronology.

I think though that a lot of it is just plain ignorance. They were not necesarily heavily into robotech, but are stuck with the idea that robotech = the original, and macross = a japanese version. Due to not knowing any better. Of course if they were fans of robotech as oposed to casual watchers of the show they would eventually be led to find out more and realise the truth, which some have done. But I got to figure that: Robotech was popular due to exposure (international audience), while macross wasn't due to inaccessibility. Inaccessibility meaning people who are lazy and don't read subs so they settled for robotech thinking it was the same thing. A friend of mine won't even bother watching the proper space battleship yamato because as a casual watcher, he would rather hear english - kind of shallow, but I figure there are lots of people like this who do not like keeping thier eyes at the bottom of the screen. They look at it as entertainment not as art, so the whole "purity of seeing the original" does not entice them enough to abandon what they saw first.

And on top of that, now you have a generation gap that won't touch an old series anyway. (ie the kids that only want new anime who wouldn't touch macross zero just because they might not be familiar with macross events, its timeline and future history, having not seen the original tv series)

So now you have only small fanbase of support for the macross series and related movies and ovas to market to. (as well as HG discouraging sellers from buying macross toys to pimp thier own robotech grrr This is what I mean by competition - robotech competes with macross for $)

Whether fans of macross realise it, the series could wither away unless people slowly convert to macross in non-bastardised form by watching it in thier native language and then slowly turn towards hearing the pure form of it. This is how I see most people converted.

Like what one poster mentioned, at first you want to hear the english because you don't like to miss out on whats happening onscreen, (I remember seeing akira and really caring more about catching all the action onscreen than acting) but then after a time you switch to sub because you start to notice inferiour acting. This is what happens only after you've seen both and had a chance to compare. So taste refines over time. But reeling in new people involves a bit of compromise. (ie giving them that option to be lazy and in a relaxed state - but when they do finally switch over they notice the difference and see the more kiddy version and laugh at what they once thought was good. )

I realize I may appear to be splitting hairs. But when people look at Robotech and sorta justify it or legitamize it by saying that it's just a different story that should be considered seperate, they are sorta sweeping under the rug how much of a lame-ass decision it was to ever mangle those three series in the first place. . . no matter how necessary it was to do to get it over here (and I doubt so much mangling was actually necessary. . . they just got carried away).

But Robotech will continue to exist because there are already comics, novels, the dvd, the games, fans that don't want to give up support, people buying toys from companies making them for robotech etc (lots of people here on macrossworld who caved in and bought MPC alphas - face it, in the end we are all selfish and there is no integrity Knowing that you're supporting robotech by buying toynami alphas doesn't seem to affect peoples ability to sleep at night knowing they are supporting the enemy..) In the end what matters is money. If people are still buying stuff with robotech written on it, they can't really say they are helping to destroy the monster now can they? In some ways when you look at it, there is probably less chance of robotech dying out than macross sadly. (due to international recognition of robotech) And for every purchase of a robotech toy, game, DVD, whatever, you are probably helping the beast to stay alive and continue, and yes, legitimise its existance.

The enemy's weakness is that fans of robotech will eventually defect when they "awaken". Until then I consider the two worlds are still alive: people are importing and buying macross toys but people are also buying robotech stuff as well due to ignorance (robotech got more exposure to the masses in the 80s) and/or because it makes no difference to them.

Edited October 26, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Pat Payne]

^

Speaking of which, is there a reason why SDC Orguss was never used for the Robotech continuity?

I've read that the syndication package had to hit 65 episodes. So in theory, if Mospeada just had a few more episodes, they could have dumped the entire Southern Cross/Robotech Masters angle altogether.

Is there any word about DVD extras? Commentaries? Storyboards? Anything new?

339759[/snapback]

The only straw I can grasp at on why thy didn't use Orguss is that perhaps Tatsunoko had nothing to do with Orguss and therefore, it couldn't have been included in their deal with HG.

No firm word on extras, according to ANN and AoD, but ADV did say that Mari Iijima will be involved in some of the extras, perhaps as a commentary track on some episodes or with new interviews or other things. BTW, can someone help me reel my jaw back in? It's still on the ground after hearing that announcement...

[Roy Focker]

Not to throw to much fuel back on the fire but I stand by my statement that the main stream is stupid. This a statement I'm making and not based entirely on the typical domestic anime that is avaliable to the masses.

Things are dubbed for the main stream. We here a lot of excuses why but I believe I know the really reason. People are indeed stupid. There are more illiterate people now. I'm not saying things are dubbed because people can't actually read. They can read alright but reading comprehension is the problem. The masses have very low reading comprehension. Isn't too difficult from them to watch and read subtitles at the same time. Their comprehension isn't strong enough. Others excuses might be used to safe face but that is the real reason why some prefer dubs.

[pfunk]

Not to throw to much fuel back on the fire but I stand by my statement that the main stream is stupid.  This a statement I'm making and not based entirely on the typical domestic anime that is avaliable to the masses.

Things are dubbed for the main stream.  We here a lot of excuses why but I believe I know the really reason.  People are indeed stupid.  There are more illiterate people now.  I'm not saying things are dubbed because people can't actually read.  They can read alright but reading comprehension is the problem.  The masses have very low reading comprehension.  Isn't too difficult from them to watch and read subtitles at the same time.  Their comprehension isn't strong enough.  Others excuses might be used to safe face but that is the real reason why some prefer dubs.

339838[/snapback]

I like dubs,,,,,,,im not stupid

actually, I dont mind sub's, but i enjoy the film better when I dont have to read and possibly miss some continuity

[EXO]

I don't like dubs not cuz I'm stupid... I like them cuz I'm lazy...

With Macross (both DYRL and the series) though, I can watch it without subs or anything. I've seen it so many times I already know what they're saying. But an english dub will be like hearing nails scratching against a blackboard. It'll be too weird for me like my mom calling me up and all of a sudden she speaks fluent italian.

Edited October 26, 2005 by >EXO<

[pfunk]

I don't like dubs cuz I'm stupid... I like them cuz I'm lazy... 

With Macross (both DYRL and the series) though, I can watch it without subs or anything.  I've seen it so many times I already know what they're saying.  But an english dub will be like hearing nails scratching against a blackboard.  It'll be too weird for me like my mom calling me up and all of a sudden she speaks fluent italian.

339842[/snapback]

DYRL dubbed is like watching a godzilla movie,,,,,,,you avatar just freaked me out EXO

[Sumdumgai]

OMG THE EYES MOVE!!!! I never noticed it before. Freaked the poo out of me.

Yes lots of people are poor on their reading. I remember in high school that half of my Senior English class read like retarded five year olds. Having people read out lines from Macbeth was utter torture... What's worse is that these morons that could barely read all graduated...

[Roy Focker]

Thats a common excuse but why might someone miss something if they are reading subs? Could it just be that their comprehension might be strong enough to focus on both at once. Lazy is just an excuse as well

[Hurin]

I'm just impressed that some people can simultaneously read text and scrutinize facial expressions. And that they never miss a facial expression, event, or subtle nuance no matter how briefly it is displayed and no matter how long the line of dialogue to be read. Truly astounding and impressive.

Really, it makes me wonder why we bother with dialog in movies at all. Why not just subtitle everything, all the time? I mean, obviously, there is no advantage to having your eyes free to take in scenery and nuance while your ears handle dialog. Subtitles are just simply superior and audible dialog has no place in a video experience.

[azrael]

Reading and reading comprehension is one issue...

Another would be that people don't like to read and watch the screen at the same time. People have trouble processing information like that. One thing I might ask how close to your screen are you? Some shows flash a banner saying "Please watch at a proper distance and in a well lit area." Sometimes, sitting too close, you move your head around to capture the entire image. This is where a dub would come in.

And to bring this up a level Roy...people are lazy. Not that they don't want to read or can't read, but they don't want to make the effort. They say "I don't know what their saying so I'll just listen to the dub. It's easier." People don't want to make an effort to read as they watch. They don't want to listen to the original voice and feel the tone of voice used in the original product because of the language barrier. They don't want to read and watch at the same time. They want to focus their attention on the image, i.e. they can't process the all the input. They want the quick and easy way out. Look at how many times people at almost every forum you go to have said, "Use the search button." Think about that and look at our dub vs. sub situation.

Edited October 26, 2005 by azrael

[pfunk]

A) kiss my ass roy (jk if you didnt allready know)

B) I like watching the action myself, as long as the dubs are good ( a very argumental subject) I dont have a problem with it ( I really like the Mac plus dubs) Im not lazy, I work 8 hours then go home and put up 12 ft walls on a garage Im building, If I wasnt doing that, Id be working out,,,or something, so in otherwords Im lazy in the aspect of dubs and nothing else? weird statement

C) I watched Mac zero and had no problems,,,,,,but I think a dub would be sweet, I mean come on, you ever watch the breakfast club in french

[isamu]

Would anyone object if they messed with things a little bit and had her sing "Do You Remember Love?" from the movie for the big battle episode (Farewell to Tenderness)?

I always felt that one of the few things RT did right was to introduce a new song ("We Will Win") at that crucial point in the series that was appropriate to the plot at that point. . . and I'm loathe to admit it, but by RT standards, that song wasn't too terribly bad.

I was a bit disappointed watching SDF Macross for the first time when that point arrived and we merely got another freakin' dose of "My Boyfriend is a Pilot", etc.  Instead of something dramatic and uplifting, it was time for "Kyun kyun!  Kyun kyun!". . .

I'm sure the purists would howl.  But I think it might be cool if they did it.  (no, there is no word that they are even considering this.  This is all from my fevered little imagination.)

H

Edit:  Some clarification of song titles and sources.

339506[/snapback]

Hurin.

Words cannot describe how strongly I agree with you on this. You took the words *RIGHT* out of my mouth!! Upon watching SDF Macross for the first time, I too, was expecting her to sing "Do You Remember Love", only to be greeted by "My Boyfriend Is A Pilot" yet again!

Hopefully they will put DYRL in during that scene.

[isamu]

The thought of having to listen to Tony Oliver's voice again would make me want to nuke a gay whale.

Seriously... Tony Oliver blows dead bears.

339317[/snapback]

No way man, Tony Oliver friggin rocks! If you don't believe me watch Gungrave. That man has very good range. How could you picture anyone else playing the English Hikaru?

[Sundown]

Thats a common excuse but why might someone miss something if they are reading subs?  Could it just be that their comprehension might be strong enough to focus on both at once.   Lazy is just an excuse as well

339854[/snapback]

That's just silly. No matter how you spin it, reading subs take some amount of focus away from the image. Subs aren't all that distracting in certain films or anime with natural language or where the focus is on action... but in heavy dialogue laden anime, reading what amounts to small novellas gets tiresome. I'm going through Legend of the Galactic Heroes and I keep wondering how different the experience would be if I could actually react to the dialogue as it's spoken, instead of reacting to reading text on the bottom of the screen. And I miss reading a word or there here, which is entirely annoying to someone like me who needs to hear, understand, and contemplate every word and isn't happy with just getting the gist of things.

I even find close captioning on English films and TV shows distracting, and I actually understand the language and don't even have to process one language while my ears are hearing another. Close captioning ruins punchlines and surprises. So I can only wonder how different my anime watching experience is from someone who actually understands the actual language, because I sure as heck know that someone in Japan watching Lost with Japanese subtitles is not getting the same experience that I am. I'm not even getting that when my silly friends are adamant about leaving the close captioning on.

If reading text while listening to a language they can't understand makes someone feel that they're somehow much more intellgent than your average viewer, then that's their perogative, however silly it is. But the truth is that there's simply something lost in the experience, and frankly the actual experience should be more important than whatever notions we have about ourselves based on our viewing selection.

-Al

Edited October 26, 2005 by Sundown

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Well there is one instance where I find reading hard: there may be a complex scene where you hear background talk and this gets printed, (like an announcement on a PA) and at the same time you hear several people talking at once and this also gets printed. Several things talking at once in a short space of time. And then add an extra delay in comprehending what you just read and what it means as the story is flowing.

Sometimes I find I have to rewind to capture it all because on the first time I didn't get the chance to read the whole block of text in time. Plus there may be something I want to see going on in the scene.

If I had it my way I would invent a language translator like the one they used in macross II that you connect to your ear to know what the other is saying but our technology is too limited. This would be in the future after world war III, and the technology advances again and when we all have cyberbrains and read barcodes instead of printed words and have huge amounts of storage space and memory to access information imediately.

Even if what you say is true about people not comprehending what is said, it still takes extra effort for those that do comprehend it. And sometimes people just want to relax, not use any brain power. I guess it depends on the show. Some shows only have very little said and the actions that go onscreen become the focus of the show. Other more cerebral shows might want you to focus on details or clues given by what characters have said in the show (they might have a lot of information to go through) and then on top of that make you think about them and thier relevence.

Some shows do not even explain what some of the terms mean. Like when ghost in the shell movie came out, my friend didn't even know what section 9 was! And they mention it but give no reference. Maybe it is just "cool" to not explain what something is, but to the dumb ones they got to have everything obvious and handed to them on a platter.

Anyway whether you think it is an excuse or not, the point still stands that more people are likely to watch if they can relax as it is being shown. When people can hear the character in thier native tongue this will expand the audience to the dumb ones. Once they become fans robotech will no longer be "the english version of macross".

Edited October 26, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Hurin]

Well there is one instance where I find reading hard

339910[/snapback]

For me, it's your posts.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

That's because you dumb humans need to upgrade to a cyborg body. In the future we cyborgs all talk simulataneously and can take in multiple streams of information at once with no delay at all. I can speak absolute nonsense, mention terms that have not been explained before and your brain will be able to automatically pull that information wirelessly from the net to find out thier meaning and understand it immediately and even nonsense makes sense.

Edited October 26, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Hurin]

Hurin.

Words cannot describe how strongly I agree with you on this. You took the words *RIGHT* out of my mouth!! Upon watching SDF Macross for the first time, I too, was expecting her to sing "Do You Remember Love", only to be greeted by "My Boyfriend Is A Pilot" yet again!  

Hopefully they will put DYRL in during that scene.

339900[/snapback]

Well, I sorta disagree (with myself!) now. Having considered Roy's point, I no longer think that "Do You Remember Love" would be a good choice.

But thanks for your support anyways!

[Agent ONE]

That's because you dumb humans need to upgrade to a cyborg body. In the future we cyborgs all talk simulataneously and can take in multiple streams of information at once with no delay at all. I can speak absolute nonsense, mention terms that have not been explained before and your brain will be able to automatically pull that information wirelessly from the net to find out thier meaning and understand it immediately and even nonsense makes sense.

339913[/snapback]

Somebody needs to explain how I can set MW up so I don't see this dip sh!t's posts. He is so stupid.

[Hurin]

I believe "stunned silence" is the appropriate term for what this thread is collectively experiencing now.

[VF-18S Hornet]

Gods... the depths these people will sink to to protect "their" show...

I've heard the classic "3 seasons of Macross" referring, of course, to the Macross, Southern Cross, and MOSPEADA portions of Robotech, that Robotech was the original and Macross was the adaptation, and even that the Robotech events, while not original, have been backported into the Macross chronology.

I think though that a lot of it is just plain ignorance. They were not necesarily heavily into robotech, but are stuck with the idea that robotech = the original, and macross = a japanese version. Due to not knowing any better. Of course if they were fans of robotech as oposed to casual watchers of the show they would eventually be led to find out more and realise the truth, which some have done. But I got to figure that: Robotech was popular due to exposure (international audience), while macross wasn't due to inaccessibility. Inaccessibility meaning people who are lazy and don't read subs so they settled for robotech thinking it was the same thing. A friend of mine won't even bother watching the proper space battleship yamato because as a casual watcher, he would rather hear english - kind of shallow, but I figure there are lots of people like this who do not like keeping thier eyes at the bottom of the screen. They look at it as entertainment not as art, so the whole "purity of seeing the original" does not entice them enough to abandon what they saw first.

And on top of that, now you have a generation gap that won't touch an old series anyway. (ie the kids that only want new anime who wouldn't touch macross zero just because they might not be familiar with macross events, its timeline and future history, having not seen the original tv series)

So now you have only small fanbase of support for the macross series and related movies and ovas to market to. (as well as HG discouraging sellers from buying macross toys to pimp thier own robotech grrr This is what I mean by competition - robotech competes with macross for $)

Whether fans of macross realise it, the series could wither away unless people slowly convert to macross in non-bastardised form by watching it in thier native language and then slowly turn towards hearing the pure form of it. This is how I see most people converted.

Like what one poster mentioned, at first you want to hear the english because you don't like to miss out on whats happening onscreen, (I remember seeing akira and really caring more about catching all the action onscreen than acting) but then after a time you switch to sub because you start to notice inferiour acting. This is what happens only after you've seen both and had a chance to compare. So taste refines over time. But reeling in new people involves a bit of compromise. (ie giving them that option to be lazy and in a relaxed state - but when they do finally switch over they notice the difference and see the more kiddy version and laugh at what they once thought was good. )

I realize I may appear to be splitting hairs. But when people look at Robotech and sorta justify it or legitamize it by saying that it's just a different story that should be considered seperate, they are sorta sweeping under the rug how much of a lame-ass decision it was to ever mangle those three series in the first place. . . no matter how necessary it was to do to get it over here (and I doubt so much mangling was actually necessary. . . they just got carried away).

But Robotech will continue to exist because there are already comics, novels, the dvd, the games, fans that don't want to give up support, people buying toys from companies making them for robotech etc (lots of people here on macrossworld who caved in and bought MPC alphas - face it, in the end we are all selfish and there is no integrity Knowing that you're supporting robotech by buying toynami alphas doesn't seem to affect peoples ability to sleep at night knowing they are supporting the enemy..) In the end what matters is money. If people are still buying stuff with robotech written on it, they can't really say they are helping to destroy the monster now can they? In some ways when you look at it, there is probably less chance of robotech dying out than macross sadly. (due to international recognition of robotech) And for every purchase of a robotech toy, game, DVD, whatever, you are probably helping the beast to stay alive and continue, and yes, legitimise its existance.

The enemy's weakness is that fans of robotech will eventually defect when they "awaken". Until then I consider the two worlds are still alive: people are importing and buying macross toys but people are also buying robotech stuff as well due to ignorance (robotech got more exposure to the masses in the 80s) and/or because it makes no difference to them.

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Jaeeeez this guy rants way too much. My eyes are hurting.

Edited October 26, 2005 by VF-18S Hornet

[Jasonc]

But Robotech will continue to exist because there are already comics, novels, the dvd, the games, fans that don't want to give up support, people buying toys from companies making them for robotech etc (lots of people here on macrossworld who caved in and bought MPC alphas - face it, in the end we are all selfish and there is no integrity  Knowing that you're supporting robotech by buying toynami alphas doesn't seem to affect peoples ability to sleep at night knowing they are supporting the enemy..) In the end what matters is money. If people are still buying stuff with robotech written on it, they can't really say they are helping to destroy the monster now can they?  In some ways when you look at it, there is probably less chance of robotech dying out than macross sadly. (due to international recognition of robotech) And for every purchase of a robotech toy, game, DVD, whatever, you are probably helping the beast to stay alive and continue, and yes, legitimise its existance.

The enemy's weakness is that fans of robotech will eventually defect when they "awaken". Until then I consider the two worlds are still alive: people are importing and buying macross toys but people are also buying robotech stuff as well due to ignorance (robotech got more exposure to the masses in the 80s) and/or because it makes no difference to them

Man, Did congress vote for you or the macross fans to go to war??? Damn, man, chill out, breathe into a brown paper bag, relax a little. I don't think people that bought a "Robotech product" are sleeping less, or feel conviction. In a free, capitalistic market we live in here in the U.S. we buy many goods out of choice, not because we have to. Toys and anime like this we buy cause of choice. If you hate HG so much, fine, but let it go about sticking it to them or ranting about that. This thread is about MACROSS being dubbed, not HG or their products.

Again, I say, glad to see that it (Macross dubbed) will probably bring in more fans, and as far as modifying songs and the sort, hope they don't. Maybe redoing the original songs, I'd be alright with, but the songs fit great, and should stay original there. Dubbing it is different enough, don't need to change the whole damn thing.