VFTF1 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Ooops That does make a world of difference But now that we're back on the subject of the greatest achievement in human history (Macross 7), I must report that I am tearing my hair out (thankfully there's lots of it!) because FIRST my old torrent just up and erased itself and now I've gotten 52% of the series downloaded and it...was all destroyed in a minor problem with my laptop caused by my girlfriend's cats pressing some buttons... WHEN will I FINALLY have Macross 7 back?! Can I actually get it subbed on DVD?? VFTF1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stray Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 But now that we're back on the subject of the greatest achievement in human history (Macross 7), I must report that I am tearing my hair out (thankfully there's lots of it!) because FIRST my old torrent just up and erased itself and now I've gotten 52% of the series downloaded and it...was all destroyed in a minor problem with my laptop caused by my girlfriend's cats pressing some buttons... Kudos to you, good sir. And... bad kitty. Sadly, though, no DVD subtitles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Wait wait wait... You're telling me that that WAS Physica's wife...? I thought that Gamlin THOUGHT it was, but as he approached them, realized that it was someone else's wife and kids, and ran away... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Wait wait wait... You're telling me that that WAS Physica's wife...? I thought that Gamlin THOUGHT it was, but as he approached them, realized that it was someone else's wife and kids, and ran away... I think Physica was divorced. He complained he did not see his kid often. I think this may be a prevalent problem in UN Spacy. In Encore Millia said how hard it is to be married to a military man and given Mylene's feelings for Basara she tried to match them before she dies. (Not really it's just a cold.) We know from the Plus clips Max goes on planetary survey missions before Macross 7. These missions may take months. Which could explain why they only have 7 kids. Max comes home bangs his wife then she gets pregnant again. Thus another maternity leave. Millia can't go on active duty while she has a baby... Okay maybe can, she did it with Komalia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nexx Stalker Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 (edited) Wait wait wait... You're telling me that that WAS Physica's wife...? I thought that Gamlin THOUGHT it was, but as he approached them, realized that it was someone else's wife and kids, and ran away... Right, she was indeed her for real. Gamlin wants to give Physica's kid the carillon his father made for him, goes out to visit him and his mother but when he sees them he imagines his comrade going back to his family (Physica is actually recognizable in the features of the man they see). He doesn't have the heart to break the terrible news to the kid and woman and runs away, asking himself why this had to happen (Physica dying). Thus said, the sequence is somehow willingly foggy, so everyone is entitled to his/her own vision of what happens. Edited July 17, 2008 by Nexx Stalker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protoculture Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 absent from which will be things like "Bassra is annoying" or "The beginning is excessively repetative" because these are blatantly obvious... Awwwww, man. That's what we've been rootin' for! 1. WHY did they do something cheesy like "bring back Gamlin"? He should have stayed dead - it would have made the entire episode so much more moving, not to mention making the series so much more moving. He is needed for the plot, man. Someone needed to be a perfect foil for Basara, & Gamlin took the part. Besides, having Gavil as possesed his body & run amok was way cooler! 2. Why did they spend 3/4 of the show developing Gigil just to have him dissapear when he got very very interesting? Just like they did killing off Roy Focker halfway through SDF:M when that character already make a big impact. 3. Why didn't Bassara demand that Lord Gemelitch return the body of Advisor Dudewholookslikegirl back to him? I mean - in the end, Lord Gepelnitch just up and flew away in a body that was not his own... Lord Gepernitch already intimately wind its soul & binded with Advisor Ivano Gunther body. It is the same as Gigile, whose human host didn't actually freed itself mentally from Gigile's mental domination. My bet, the man that is Ivano Gunther is no more, much less his conciousness, just an empty shell of a body that inhabited by supreme beings. Besides, Gepernitch true form is terrifying & will dried the entire universe of Spritia into Spritia Blackhole, meaning his own true physical body. Ain't want that TO HAPPEN TWICE. Over all - I LIKE this series...... It's a good show. I'm glad I watched it. Welcome to the collective, brother. BOMBAAAAAA! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nexx Stalker Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 GRIPES WITH MACROSS 7: 1. WHY did they do something cheesy like "bring back Gamlin"? He should have stayed dead - it would have made the entire episode so much more moving, not to mention making the series so much more moving. Indeed Gamlin's death (for real, not just the it-was-just-a-flesh-wound thing we get here) would have been one of Macross's strongest moment. I think they didn't have the guts to make such a thing. But I must say I'm kinda relieved they didn't, as Gamlin is the best M7 character (for me, along with Gubaba!) and is pivotal to the series' ending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Indeed Gamlin's death (for real, not just the it-was-just-a-flesh-wound thing we get here) would have been one of Macross's strongest moment. I think they didn't have the guts to make such a thing. But I must say I'm kinda relieved they didn't, as Gamlin is the best M7 character (for me, along with Gubaba!) and is pivotal to the series' ending. Given the amount of space and words the WTF-1 took up, can you imagine what it would've been like if Macrossworld had been around in 1995? Someone would be saying that Gamlin was stil alive, a lot of us would point out that there was no ejection seen and the VF-17 blew up too quickly for him to escape, and Agent One would be saying that all of us were gay for even caring...on and on for at least thirty pages... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nexx Stalker Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Given the amount of space and words the WTF-1 took up, can you imagine what it would've been like if Macrossworld had been around in 1995? Someone would be saying that Gamlin was stil alive, a lot of us would point out that there was no ejection seen and the VF-17 blew up too quickly for him to escape, and Agent One would be saying that all of us were gay for even caring...on and on for at least thirty pages... oh god! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protoculture Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 and Agent One would be saying that all of us were gay for even caring...on and on for at least thirty pages... Damn, despite his antics, he'll be sorely missed ...... Hell, I missed him already when he spewed venom to both open & closet Basara's fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Damn, despite his antics, he'll be sorely missed ...... Hell, I missed him already when he spewed venom to both open & closet Basara's fans. He once admitted to me in a PM that he didn't really hate Basara that much, he just enjoyed the game of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Damn, despite his antics, he'll be sorely missed ...... Hell, I missed him already when he spewed venom to both open & closet Basara's fans. Yeah, me too, and especially my door knob BTW, any of you remember on which episode Basara and Gigile make a trek across the desert on their valk? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 That happens a bit after Bassara "dies" - he decides to find out what he sings for. Can't place the episode beyond saying it's somewhere round the thirties. Soob.... I want my Macross 7!! :( :( :( Welcome to the collective, brother. BOMBAAAAAA! bombaaaa! VFTF1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stray Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 (edited) Given the amount of space and words the WTF-1 took up, can you imagine what it would've been like if Macrossworld had been around in 1995? Someone would be saying that Gamlin was stil alive, a lot of us would point out that there was no ejection seen and the VF-17 blew up too quickly for him to escape, and Agent One would be saying that all of us were gay for even caring...on and on for at least thirty pages... I really kind of regret missing the old days of M7 hate around here... however watching it live would have been awesome. I can't even imagine thinking Gamlin was dead for like a week. The one drawback to that, tho, is that so many M7 episodes just flowed right into the next episode. I can't even count the number of times watching it that I kept going an episode or 3 later, just waiting for a logical stopping point. That's one definite gripe I have with 7, and the pacing on Frontier is so, so much better so far. Edited July 18, 2008 by stray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Seven was way more drawn out - that's for sure - but I actually think this was not a bad thing. Macross: Frontier seems to be more like a longer OVA than a series. M7 was more like a series - a good series reels you in to a world and fills that world with as much "filler" space as possible - besides; it was so in keeping with Bassara's mode. Many episodes actually just revolved around Bassara's emotions - around some zany "problem" that Bassara invented out of thin air - because he needed space, because he needed inspiration, because he needed to think... lots of it was just a reflection of Bassara himself being very drawn out and chaotic. It's hard to make a "paced" series about an artist, because art is anarchic and refuses to be paced... So... I don't think this was a weakness in M7 - it's just a characteristic tied to Bassara being the artist; and the artist and journey being the focal point of the series. VFTF1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stray Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 VFTF1 - No, that is one of the things I like the most about 7; and why I think the characters are some of the best in Macross bar none. I mean, if Max and Millia had mended fences in episode 4; that would have been utterly anticlimactic. Likewise if Basara and Gamlin hadn't taken time to trust each other; Mylene and Gamlin slowly becoming friends and Gamlin coming to terms with the fact she's in the band, Basara singing to Sivil day in and day out, while Gigl watched and started to recognize Basara's power... I dunno tons more examples. The thing is, week to week it would have had to be a really casual watch... I mean there's so many episodes where... nothing happens. Like, in the middle stretch... Basara sings to Sivil, Mylene wonders where Basara is going, and Gamlin talks to Millia... and that was pretty much it. That's not the kind of stuff that fills messageboards... well maybe talk of turning people gay, but... I guess it's not a gripe so much as a different experience. But when you're watching it straight through, it's easier to get into the greater arcs; but to do that it's easy to intend to watch 3 episodes in an evening and end up watching 6. Frontier is so much more balls to the wall through and through, and the arcs are probably as big, but there's alot more of a sense of closure in each episode, for better or worse. At the end of the day: I doubt I would be making rampant speculation, freeze frame analysis, complex character studies, or arguing who was going to end up with who all over the internet about Macross Seven; but I'd probably turn off a bit, and keep watching it week after week and enjoy it as much. On that note; I might actually start doing that soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 VFTF1 - No, that is one of the things I like the most about 7; and why I think the characters are some of the best in Macross bar none. I mean, if Max and Millia had mended fences in episode 4; that would have been utterly anticlimactic. Likewise if Basara and Gamlin hadn't taken time to trust each other; Mylene and Gamlin slowly becoming friends and Gamlin coming to terms with the fact she's in the band, Basara singing to Sivil day in and day out, while Gigl watched and started to recognize Basara's power... I dunno tons more examples. The thing is, week to week it would have had to be a really casual watch... I mean there's so many episodes where... nothing happens. Like, in the middle stretch... Basara sings to Sivil, Mylene wonders where Basara is going, and Gamlin talks to Millia... and that was pretty much it. That's not the kind of stuff that fills messageboards... well maybe talk of turning people gay, but... I guess it's not a gripe so much as a different experience. But when you're watching it straight through, it's easier to get into the greater arcs; but to do that it's easy to intend to watch 3 episodes in an evening and end up watching 6. Frontier is so much more balls to the wall through and through, and the arcs are probably as big, but there's alot more of a sense of closure in each episode, for better or worse. At the end of the day: I doubt I would be making rampant speculation, freeze frame analysis, complex character studies, or arguing who was going to end up with who all over the internet about Macross Seven; but I'd probably turn off a bit, and keep watching it week after week and enjoy it as much. On that note; I might actually start doing that soon... I hear ya on that last one...I've read so many wacky theories here that people have been posting about Frontier that I worried that one of them will turn out to be right, and it'll feel like the ending was spoiled. There's something to be said for quietly watching a series and absorbing it by oneself. About the story arcs...one thing I like about all three Macross TV series is that the arcs are all roughly 9~14 episodes long, in every series. It's just that SDFM had three acts, Mac7 had four...and it makes me kind of sad to think that Frontier only has two (can we all agree that episode 14 ended the first arc? Or do most people think it ended the second?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Dex Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 I hear ya on that last one...I've read so many wacky theories here that people have been posting about Frontier that I worried that one of them will turn out to be right, and it'll feel like the ending was spoiled. There's something to be said for quietly watching a series and absorbing it by oneself. About the story arcs...one thing I like about all three Macross TV series is that the arcs are all roughly 9~14 episodes long, in every series. It's just that SDFM had three acts, Mac7 had four...and it makes me kind of sad to think that Frontier only has two (can we all agree that episode 14 ended the first arc? Or do most people think it ended the second?). Depends on what you would call the arc or arcs in Frontier so far. Some say up to episode 7 was an arc and from there to 14 was another, and some say up to 14 was a whole arc. I think of episodes 1-10 as a beginning arc really and then 11-14 has the Gallia 4 mini arc which launched into what we are starting now with ep.15 which seems to be an adventure/conspiracy arc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stray Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 I hear ya on that last one...I've read so many wacky theories here that people have been posting about Frontier that I worried that one of them will turn out to be right, and it'll feel like the ending was spoiled. One thing Frontier has going for it is that it's not all that predictable... For the record, I meant I was going to go back and savor Seven, episode by episode, not Frontier... although, I have been trying really hard to avoid Kei subs lately, if nothing else *shaking* About the story arcs...one thing I like about all three Macross TV series is that the arcs are all roughly 9~14 episodes long, in every series. It's just that SDFM had three acts, Mac7 had four...and it makes me kind of sad to think that Frontier only has two (can we all agree that episode 14 ended the first arc? Or do most people think it ended the second?). There's been so many mini-arcs in Frontier it's tough to say, there's just no real greater arc we have that much visibility on. Seven was kind of like that too, though. I mean you can call up til episode 10 the Ranka arc, up til 14 the prelude to a coup arc, up til 7 the Galaxy arc, 7 to 14 the Galaxy is missing arc? I dunno. Just the way things all clicked into place in episode 15 makes me wonder if this can really wrap up in 25 episodes... I'm already booking a hospital and/or saving up for a Yakuza hit come October, either way... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocombatpilot Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Does any know exactly why after parenting 7 children Max and Millia split up? Are they offically divorced or just seperated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 One thing Frontier has going for it is that it's not all that predictable... For the record, I meant I was going to go back and savor Seven, episode by episode, not Frontier... although, I have been trying really hard to avoid Kei subs lately, if nothing else *shaking* There's been so many mini-arcs in Frontier it's tough to say, there's just no real greater arc we have that much visibility on. Seven was kind of like that too, though. I mean you can call up til episode 10 the Ranka arc, up til 14 the prelude to a coup arc, up til 7 the Galaxy arc, 7 to 14 the Galaxy is missing arc? I dunno. Just the way things all clicked into place in episode 15 makes me wonder if this can really wrap up in 25 episodes... I'm already booking a hospital and/or saving up for a Yakuza hit come October, either way... No, no...I understood. But it seemed like you were treating it as a hypothetical...IF Macroswworld had been around then, and we were doing the same thing we were doing with Frontier, what would it have been like? And other things involving difficult grammatrical constructions that are hard to explain to ESL students. Savoring Seven...is an interesting idea. The first time I watched it, I kind of rushed through it, since I had heard it got good towards the end, and I was trying to get to that part. (It also didn't help that I was watching it raw...I never saw it all properly fansubbed for quite a while.) But I generally like the kind of story where little clues and hints are given in the early episodes, that are baffling until you reach the later ones (like Frontier...I especially liked Sheryl's admonition to Alto not to put the pictures of her breasts on the internet, which made no sense...until two episodes later, when we find out about the implants). And Mac7 just ain't that kind of story. I ended up liking it a lot, but it's not really the kind of series I like to savor... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Does any know exactly why after parenting 7 children Max and Millia split up? Are they offically divorced or just seperated? Separated. Work got in the way of marriage so they needed a timeout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Separated. Work got in the way of marriage so they needed a timeout. That and some boy named Siva/Siba/Shiva/whatever is rumored to be Max's illegitimate son. (Macross 7 Trash) I'll try to finish reading that manga one of these days and get a straight answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 That and some boy named Siva/Siba/Shiva/whatever is rumored to be Max's illegitimate son. (Macross 7 Trash) I'll try to finish reading that manga one of these days and get a straight answer. Straight answer: He's not Max's son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stray Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 (edited) But I generally like the kind of story where little clues and hints are given in the early episodes, that are baffling until you reach the later ones (like Frontier...I especially liked Sheryl's admonition to Alto not to put the pictures of her breasts on the internet, which made no sense...until two episodes later, when we find out about the implants). And Mac7 just ain't that kind of story. I ended up liking it a lot, but it's not really the kind of series I like to savor... Wow, I totally forgot about that... seriously, if Frontier can keep it up until series end, (I mean... even the clip show floored me) it's going to be the new benchmark for quite some time. No, no...I understood. But it seemed like you were treating it as a hypothetical...IF Macroswworld had been around then, and we were doing the same thing we were doing with Frontier, what would it have been like? And other things involving difficult grammatrical constructions that are hard to explain to ESL students. Wait that was your point... Anyway, it was a really, really good point... and VFTF1's response kind of reminded me... 'wait, I love seven... and I'm not gay because of it!' Moreso I went with... "what if we were watching M7 now instead of Frontier?" I just wasn't sure if it came off as I was saying the endless speculation on Frontier was bad... because I really, really feel we're onto something special right now, and it shows in how many new faces, topics, artwork, etc. I see each week here, suki, and elsewhere. edit: MW does kind of seem to be getting a bit harder to read, lately, however... but I guess now I know how flower girl felt when Fire Bomber made it... Savoring Seven...is an interesting idea. The first time I watched it, I kind of rushed through it, since I had heard it got good towards the end, and I was trying to get to that part. (It also didn't help that I was watching it raw...I never saw it all properly fansubbed for quite a while.) I think we all kind of rushed through it... and I'm probably alone in wanting to savor it... but one of the biggest reasons I like it so much is it's so good at being a character focused ensemble show almost in the vein of something western like *gasp* Northern Exposure... or maybe (sort of a stretch) Scrubs to be more current. It's not a dark, brooding character piece like... Plus, or Cowboy Bebop (anything Watanabe, really), and the most f'ed up characters... don't become ninja warriors, or mecha pilots hellbent on gar vengeance... they start a band! As a space opera, though, not so much. And, I'm a little bit gar for Basara, but I won't go there... right now anyway. That and some boy named Siva/Siba/Shiva/whatever is rumored to be Max's illegitimate son. (Macross 7 Trash) I'll try to finish reading that manga one of these days and get a straight answer. Speaking of Macross 7 mangas, does anyone know if there are any Mylene Beat scans around anywhere? I found some links but they all seemed to be dead... I didn't see them on iMacross or MShare, but I haven't checked recently... if they're there, I apologize in advance for being baka. Edited July 19, 2008 by stray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Wait that was your point... Anyway, it was a really, really good point... and VFTF1's response kind of reminded me... 'wait, I love seven... and I'm not gay because of it!' Moreso I went with... "what if we were watching M7 now instead of Frontier?" Crap, there I go again, thinking I'm the most important person here... edit: MW does kind of seem to be getting a bit harder to read, lately, however... but I guess now I know how flower girl felt when Fire Bomber made it... Agreed...but I try to read the board pretty thoroughly...so it's a given that I'll come across people repeating points that have already been made (and often, shot down...Ranka is Anima Spiritia, anyone?). But it's hard not to become a little irritated when someone starts a new topic saying something like, "I think Galaxy is the real enemy! What do you guys think?" when we've been hashing it out in the episode discussion threads for months now. Still...occupational hazard of frequenting a message board, I guess. Makes me glad I'm not a mod. I think the locked Macross F threads will soon outnumber the open ones! I think we all kind of rushed through it... and I'm probably alone in wanting to savor it... but one of the biggest reasons I like it so much is it's so good at being a character focused ensemble show almost in the vein of something western like *gasp* Northern Exposure... or maybe (sort of a stretch) Scrubs to be more current. It's not a dark, brooding character piece like... Plus, or Cowboy Bebop (anything Watanabe, really), and the most f'ed up characters... don't become ninja warriors, or mecha pilots hellbent on gar vengeance... they start a band! As a space opera, though, not so much. And, I'm a little bit gar for Basara, but I won't go there... right now anyway. ...which of course is why the mecha-heads hate it. I like Basara, but I never thought he was as cool as I'm evidently MEANT to think he is...nowhere did I feel that more strongly than in the D7 ED, where my main thought was, "Man, if I really, really liked Basara, this would be the greatest thing ever!" I agree about your ensemble cast point, but still...I kind of wish the M7 cast had been bigger...there was definitely enough room to give us more background on Akiko, Kinryu, Docker, Phsyica, the Bridge Bunnies...even Ray and Veffidas should've taken the spotlight more often than they did. And there could've been a few more minor characters introduced and fleshed out. Speaking of Macross 7 mangas, does anyone know if there are any Mylene Beat scans around anywhere? I found some links but they all seemed to be dead... I didn't see them on iMacross or MShare, but I haven't checked recently... if they're there, I apologize in advance for being baka. I don't think there is, but there soon will be! I recently ordered Mylene Beat from Amazon.co.jp, and it should be arriving in next few weeks...now I just need to get my hands on a scanner... I'd also like to scan M7 TRASH (I have all the volumes, although I don't really want to cut them up, so I'm not sure what to do) and do a better translation of them. Japanese -> Chinese -> English really isn't the best way to do things, and the fact that the guy who translated it before didn't seem to know anything about Macross didn't help much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Does any know exactly why after parenting 7 children Max and Millia split up? Are they offically divorced or just seperated? You know - I never got the feeling that they seperated or anything. It's so patently obvious they love eachother. As to the matter of MW and whether it is a good or bad thing to be on the boards while watching .... I think it's GREAT! It's like group sex or something! No wait...bad analogy! I personally like all the discussion - I guess it reminds me of being in college; reading great books and then going to class to have insightful discussions about them with your fellow classmates and the Prof. It's so much funner than just watching/reading alone. And finally - just an aside; I understand the whole "Gay/Macross 7" joke/innuendo thing - but for a moment I want to take it semi-seriously and ask...what is it based on?? I mean - Bassara is in love with Sivil (totally hot babe), loved by Rex (totally hot babe), possibly in love with and loved by Mylene (cute babe), constantly chased by flower girl (cute babe) and himself has absolutely no homo-erotic inclinations or experiences. The only hint of homo-eroticism was the "Basara and Gamlin are lovers" tabloid article - which was of course a big joke... I just don't see where the idea of Bassara being gay or M7 being gay developed? Is it the general notion that singing and rock and roll are gay? VFTF1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 You know - I never got the feeling that they seperated or anything. It's so patently obvious they love eachother. As to the matter of MW and whether it is a good or bad thing to be on the boards while watching .... I think it's GREAT! It's like group sex or something! No wait...bad analogy! I personally like all the discussion - I guess it reminds me of being in college; reading great books and then going to class to have insightful discussions about them with your fellow classmates and the Prof. It's so much funner than just watching/reading alone. And finally - just an aside; I understand the whole "Gay/Macross 7" joke/innuendo thing - but for a moment I want to take it semi-seriously and ask...what is it based on?? I mean - Bassara is in love with Sivil (totally hot babe), loved by Rex (totally hot babe), possibly in love with and loved by Mylene (cute babe), constantly chased by flower girl (cute babe) and himself has absolutely no homo-erotic inclinations or experiences. The only hint of homo-eroticism was the "Basara and Gamlin are lovers" tabloid article - which was of course a big joke... I just don't see where the idea of Bassara being gay or M7 being gay developed? Is it the general notion that singing and rock and roll are gay? VFTF1 Probably yes...that somehow, blaring guns are masculine, but singing at a threatening enemy is not. I think also the fact that Basara had Rex falling all over him but he just feel alseep didn't help...nor did the fact that she stayed at his place all night and nothing happened. Hikaru can be forgiven...he was a nervous and inexperienced teenager...but Basara's a 21-year-old rock singer! Where are the groupies, the trashed hotel rooms, the heroin? That, and Agent One flexing his pecs in EVERY...SINGLE...M7 thread really kind of helped the message sink in. (Sometimes I miss his bluster, but I can't deny that it's A LOT easier to discuss M7 without him around.) And a lot of the old timers here at Macrossworld either currently serve or have served in the military, so Basara's anti-military stance might raise a few hackles. (Although politics is a forbidden topic here, attitudes on pacifism tend to come to the surface in almost any M7 thread, just as attitudes on environmentalism come out in almost any M0 thread.) So yeah...Basara isn't typically masculine, but then...none of the Macross heroes are (except Focker). Basara's just the one who refused to use missiles. And that apparently makes him weak. Which apparently makes him gay. Which apparently makes him wear assless chaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stray Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 (edited) ...for the record, we never saw Basara in assless chaps. Or any chaps for that matter, IIRC... it was pretty much just the wifebeater and jeans... or the flightsuit. edit: unless there was some fanart/doushinji going around that I'd really rather not look for... As an aside, are the stars in some kind of crazy alignment today? we're like... having a relatively intelligent discourse on Macross Seven... I half am expecting the rapture to be upon us. Anyway, I was exaggerating about being gay for Basara earlier, but I can totally respect where he's coming from. I mean, he's not in it for the fame, or the poon, he just wants to get through to people (and aliens) and move his mountain. And he falls for the one (alien) chick that he can't get through to. Basara's role in the series is weird, though... in alot of ways his biggest purpose is to be the mirror everyone else sees themselves through. Also, further bordering on gay... I really thought the whole Basara/Gamlin friendship or rivalry was one of the better male bondings I've seen portrayed in an anime. Never once did I expect either of them to start shouting gar man-love should the other have been defeated. Although, I guess that was pre-gar. And finally, anyone who thinks an 100,000 watt soundsystem is not manly... seriously has to be... well, you know. Edited July 19, 2008 by stray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sumdumgai Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 I think that Basara is too into the music and getting people to listen to him sing to care about sex. And I'm serious on that. He doesn't seem to show interest in anyone in a romantic manner. He gets interested in Sivil, but it seemed to me more because he realized he was getting through to one of the protodevlin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gubaba Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 (edited) I think that Basara is too into the music and getting people to listen to him sing to care about sex. And I'm serious on that. He doesn't seem to show interest in anyone in a romantic manner. He gets interested in Sivil, but it seemed to me more because he realized he was getting through to one of the protodevlin. I agree completely. His interest in Sivil seemed to have more to do with her alien-ness than her womanliness... Plus, for a good chunk of the the show, she was a captive audience, and what performer wouldn't want that? Edited July 20, 2008 by Gubaba Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkullLeaderVF-X Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 I agree completely. His interest in Sivil seemed to have more to do with her alien-ness than her womanliness... Plus, for a good chunk of the the show, she was a captive audience, and what performer wouldn't want that? I concur, but he also seemed a little bit interested in Emillia, in M7 the galaxy is calling me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 Well, personally I don't think it's right to extrapolate that Bassara is a-sexual just because the series shows that he is primarily focused on getting his music across to the enemy and stopping the war. I would imagine that under more normal circumstances, he would have been more intent on developing a relationship... But maybe despite his age, he is just not ready for a relationship? After all, given how driven he is and how deeply involved he is in trying to "find the right music" (after all, often times he thinks that his songs just aren't right and that's why he's not getting through to the Protodevilin), he doesn't seem to know himself yet - and if you're that confused about who you are, while at the same time being convinced of how to "get" where you hope to "go" - I guess you don't really need a relationship... Although - I think he does love Mylene; he just isn't the type to say it, but when he lost his voice and walked out on the Chiba experiments, making Mylene mad and jelous ("you're just jealous that my song made the sound unit work!") Basara smiles - I interpret his reaction to mean that he is hoping that Mylene will succeed; that her inner beauty will flow thanks to her song - and indeed, later - it does; and she saves his voice using the power of song... which for Bassara has to have been a very intimate experience. As for Rex - well... who knows what happened between them? All in all, it is true that the romantic angle in M7 is skewed because the male lead, while being "loved" does not reciprocate - kind of like Alto actually, and unlike Hikaru, Isamu, Guld, Shin and Roy; who all - in their own way- do find happiness in their relationships... I dunno - I just think that in all seriousness Bassara is an artist and not a "rocker" in the groupies/heroine sense. He demonstrates that contemporary rock and roll can have a higher cultural purpose - as Minmey demonstrated that sentimental pop music does not have to just be "mere entertainment." The stereotype of the sex/drugs obssessed rocker is tossed out in favor of the idea of the serious, unconventional, philosophically driven artist who takes culture seriously as a means for changing people from the inside. Bassara is basically a return to the "original" counterculture revolution in contradistinction to the "corporatized/commercialized" MTV generation - where music became more of a business than a political movement to change the world. VFTF1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedWolf Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 I concur, but he also seemed a little bit interested in Emillia, in M7 the galaxy is calling me. More like Emillia got her traits from mom. Being defeated is a turn on. Liza was also interested in Basara. Much better than her not-boyfriend space whale otaku. As for Elma, good thing Basara isn't interested in kids or Graham would've pounded him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkullLeaderVF-X Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 More like Emillia got her traits from mom. Being defeated is a turn on. Must find way to find Emillia and defeat her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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