HG and Robotech Debates

[Keith]

I wonder how long it will be before Steve Yun marries Macek's widow...

[VF5SS]

hate the game, not the player guys

stop attacking some dead guy's widow

[Gubaba]

hate the game, not the player guys

What if the player is Wanzerfan?

[azrael]

Geez, can't I start a day without someone complaining? (Don't answer that)

Svea Macek is OFF-LIMITS.

What if the player is Wanzerfan?

Then blast away.

[Wanzerfan]

_-|-- --|-_

[BeyondTheGrave]

Geez, can't I start a day without someone complaining? (Don't answer that)

Svea Macek is OFF-LIMITS.

Yun's gotta keep his Pimp Hand strong someway doesn't he?

[BeyondTheGrave]

Touble on the RT front line!!

Concerns of new "production" to use recycled footage.

No one on MWF surprized.

Analysis ofmemo's post:

ON THE QUESTION OF WHAT WAS MEANT BY "EDITING PHASE" OF THE 2011 MOVIE, TOMMY SAID THAT RIGHT NOW THEY GOING THROUGH THE ANIMATICS FOR TIMING AND SCENES AND SUCH. SAME PROCESS THEY DID WITH SHADOW CHRONICLES.

Does he mean cinematic?

*SIDE NOTE*

REFRENCE OF ANIMATICS.. I THINK WHEN THEY WERE SHOWING SHADOW CHRONICLES ANIMATICS BACK BEFORE IT'S RELEASE, THEY WERE INCOMPLETE ANIMATION. ONLY LIKE ROUGH SKETCHES AND CG WITHOUT SOUND.

Test footage maybe

ON A FOLLOW UP QUESTION ABOUT VOICES ALREADY DOING THEIR PART IN THE MOVIE, TOMMY HAS SAID THAT THEY ARE NOT THERE YET. RIGHT NOW THEY ARE SAVING THE VOICES FOR LAST TO BE ADDED AFTER THE MOVIE IS DONE. AGAIN, JUST LIKE THEY DID WITH SHADOW CHRONICLES.

So are they in the final stages of the movie or just trying to find SC footage to splice in??

Unrelated:

How's the weather where your at?

Edited August 2, 2010 by BeyondTheGrave

[Jasonc]

Touble on the RT front line!!

Concerns of new "production" to use recycled footage.

No one on MWF surprized.

Analysis ofmemo's post:

Does he mean cinematic?

Test footage maybe

So are they in the final stages of the movie or just trying to find SC footage to splice in??

Unrelated:

How's the weather where your at?

I think the term Animatic is accurate. It's been thrown around before, and is test angles of moving storyboard. Still not sure what this supposed movie is, but I know Tommy was hard pressed to call it a movie, and I think because the term maybe inaccurate. Speculation of course, but there you go, unless they are indeed using beginning footage from Shadow Chronicles and just splicing it. Then maybe adding some very small tidbits of new animation with Sera? Seems like too much, but that just goes with the idea that it's something else, like a flash "movie". And you're right I don't think most really care here about the news, just more the ignorant comments that come from it from time to time. Even then, it's more like it's simply pointed out for comic relief. That all said, I'm almost under the impression that this isn't Carl's idea of a project, but moreso HG using the sad turn of events to bolster putting out something small and making it more grand than it is. I'm not gonna prove that out in public, but I have my thoughts about it. Seems several others do here, and elsewhere on other sites. Either way, unless someone at HG talks, it's only good speculation.

[Einherjar]

For everyone's sake, maybe MEMO should stop leading people on like that. Only a handful of people on the Internet are really making this secret project a big deal. News sources don't even care.

[Jasonc]

For everyone's sake, maybe MEMO should stop leading people on like that. Only a handful of people on the Internet are really making this secret project a big deal. News sources don't even care.

I don't even know a lot of Robotech fans that care too much about this, although, I'm sure the vocal ones would try to make you think otherwise. I know one RT fan that didn't even know they were doing something like this, then proceeded to be more of the "whatever" attitude. And he's not one of the bitter fans either. Oh well, what can they do?

[Funkenstein]

I can only hope they're splicing scenes from Astro Plan into their "new" production.

[terry the lone wolf]

I think all this speculation is much ado about nothing. The last time HG used recycled footage was the Sentinels & RT the Movie over 20 years ago. To be honest there was more recycled scenes in The False Diva then there ever was for Shadow Chronicles. I don't understand the why there's a controversy that a RT feature movie could be worked on as we speak. It didn't take Satelight too long to release the MF movie; just a matter of months.

[Save]

It didn't take Satelight too long to release the MF movie; just a matter of months.

That is because Satelight is an animation studio with animators working around the clock on many kinds of animation projects not just Macross. HG is a corporate office that houses a rental theater and offices where less than a hand full of people use Photoshop and Powerpoint.

Actually some of the Satelight staff attended SDCC 2010 and even sat in on the RT panel.

Edited August 3, 2010 by Save

[Jasonc]

I think all this speculation is much ado about nothing. The last time HG used recycled footage was the Sentinels & RT the Movie over 20 years ago. To be honest there was more recycled scenes in The False Diva then there ever was for Shadow Chronicles. I don't understand the why there's a controversy that a RT feature movie could be worked on as we speak. It didn't take Satelight too long to release the MF movie; just a matter of months.

The difference between the False Diva movie and RTSC, is that Satelight was probably working non stop, and didn't wait years to start working on the movie. Another difference is that Shadow Chronicles is didn't have a spinoff, so of course there wouldn't be any recycled scenes. You do know that Frontier was a series, and has a movie, thus some recycled scenes. There's also a lot of new animation in that movie as well. Satelight, I can believe working on the movie while finishing the series, or something to that extent. It wasn't just a matter of months. News about the movie has been out for quite sometime. And, when it was announced that a new project was being made for Macross, they enphasized it being a movie, and didn't hide or be vague about what it was, or wasn't going to be. Oh, and HG wasn't working on this for too long either, so there isn't any controversy, just speculation based on some facts and good guesstimation.

That is because Satelight is an animation studio with animators working around the clock on many kinds of animation projects not just Macross. HG is a corporate office that houses a rental theater and offices where less than a hand full of people use Photoshop and Powerpoint.

Actually some of the Satelight staff attended SDCC 2010 and even sat in on the RT panel.

QFT!!! I wonder what they thought of RT? In either case, They're doing quite a job with the franchise, and are on top of the game.

[terry the lone wolf]

The difference between the False Diva movie and RTSC, is that Satelight was probably working non stop, and didn't wait years to start working on the movie. Another difference is that Shadow Chronicles is didn't have a spinoff, so of course there wouldn't be any recycled scenes. You do know that Frontier was a series, and has a movie, thus some recycled scenes. There's also a lot of new animation in that movie as well. Satelight, I can believe working on the movie while finishing the series, or something to that extent. It wasn't just a matter of months. News about the movie has been out for quite sometime. And, when it was announced that a new project was being made for Macross, they enphasized it being a movie, and didn't hide or be vague about what it was, or wasn't going to be. Oh, and HG wasn't working on this for too long either, so there isn't any controversy, just speculation based on some facts and good guesstimation.

What you're saying is speculation; you don't know when the MF movie was first animated. Maybe it was at the same time of the series or maybe afterwards but it doesn't negate the fact that recycled animation from the tv series was used for the movie. Even Shoji San admitted he wanted to improve on the animation. Now, when I said it was a matter of months between the end of the tv series to the opening of the movie I didn't mean it was long time but rather a short period of time. So why couldn't an RT movie be finished by next summer and be a real feature opposed to a flash movie?

Edited August 3, 2010 by terry the lone wolf

[Keith]

What you're saying is speculation; you don't know when the MF movie was first animated. Maybe it was at the same time of the series or maybe afterwards but it doesn't negate the fact that recycled animation from the tv series was used for the movie. Even Shoji San admitted he wanted to improve on the animation. Now, when I said it was a matter of months between the end of the tv series to the opening of the movie I didn't mean it was long time but rather a short period of time. So why couldn't an RT movie be finished by next summer and be a real feature opposed to a flash movie?

You saw "The Shadow Chronicles" right? And you're still asking these questions?? Regardless, on the Frontier issue, the improved animation was already put into place between the tv series broadcast & bluray release. A large number of these which Kawamori felt needed to be addressed were addressed. In regards to recyling footage for the feature, welcome to anime, it's actually pretty rare when a movie version of a series uses 100% new animation. The difference now being the TV animation is so damned high quality, it's not really justifiable to "not" reuse some.

Back to the Robotech issue we're talking about a group of people who obvously has little to no idea on how to assemble an animated feature. And even when they did it the first time, they grossely over-estimated their product, clainning it to be "OVA" quality animation, neglecting to point out that it was circa 1990 OVA quality animation. But at this point, that's neither here nor there, just wait for them to finish and you'll see. This isn't hate on american animation, hell, I've loved most of the recent DC/WB/Bruce Timm offerings. But HG & Yune are going to have to pull a true miracle to turn o ut anything markedly better than SC (not a compliment). Hell, I'd be damned surprised if they didn't at the very least re-use their CG renders.

You know, if HG & Yune were smart, they'd ask/beg Timm & his gang to help them produce a robotech animated feature inbetween their various DC projects. Which comic company handles the robotech comics anyway?

Edited August 3, 2010 by Keith

[Robelwell202]

What you're saying is speculation; you don't know when the MF movie was first animated. Maybe it was at the same time of the series or maybe afterwards but it doesn't negate the fact that recycled animation from the tv series was used for the movie. Even Shoji San admitted he wanted to improve on the animation. Now, when I said it was a matter of months between the end of the tv series to the opening of the movie I didn't mean it was long time but rather a short period of time. So why couldn't an RT movie be finished by next summer and be a real feature opposed to a flash movie?

First off, I'm certain that there's someone on this site that can give us the exact start-date for production of the MacF movie. The people behind that production have been completely forthright with thier details, even going so far as to develop some rather interesting advertising campaigns, if memory serves correctly.

Second, in comparison, HG's continued tight-lipped stance regarding anything they're supposedly 'working on' only shows a severe lack of competence on their part. 'Shadow Chronicles' came out HOW LONG after anything else? And most of HG's RT productions before then (And, a lot would say, include SC) were stamped with PHAIL. It's absolutely no wonder why there's twenty million tons of skepticism whenever HG makes an 'announcement'.

Author's Note: The exact measurement of skepticism associated with HG announcements is somewhat speculative, as there's never been an accurate method of measuring it. The best that can be hoped for is a close approximation of the total amount.

[Aladdin Sane]

Concerns of new "production" to use recycled footage.

What makes you think this? There's absolutely nothing in the post you're quoting that would even come close to suggesting that.

EDIT: Just followed the link through and see a single person suggesting that maybe it's recycling footage given the short production time. I wouldn't exactly say there were concerns of recycling footage based on a single speculative post.

Does he mean cinematic?

No, he means what he said.

I know we all like to bag on MEMO, and he certainly provides plenty of opportunities to do so, but this isn't really one of them. His enthusiasm is, as always, misplaced, but everything he said is correct (in terms of the facts he's been given, that is) even if it's poorly presented (as most of his posts are).

Edited August 3, 2010 by Aladdin Sane

[Einherjar]

Since everyone has been given a year to wait for this project, wild speculation was bound to happen to keep interest up. It's going to get worse no matter what by nature.

[Jasonc]

What you're saying is speculation; you don't know when the MF movie was first animated. Maybe it was at the same time of the series or maybe afterwards but it doesn't negate the fact that recycled animation from the tv series was used for the movie. Even Shoji San admitted he wanted to improve on the animation. Now, when I said it was a matter of months between the end of the tv series to the opening of the movie I didn't mean it was long time but rather a short period of time. So why couldn't an RT movie be finished by next summer and be a real feature opposed to a flash movie?

You do realize that's why I said probably, and not as matter-of-fact? At least I hope you understand that. Also, no one ever denied that Macross Frontier: False Diva had some recycled animation. It seems easy enough, especially with 25 episodes. So if HG does the same thing for a say, 90 minute movie, what are they gonna recycle, the entire movie? 50% of it? If you read the last few pages and the news of this "production", you'd see that there are a few things that detract this from being an actual movie. 1)If Shadow Rising is on hold for the LAM, why would some side story get a full feature length green light?

2)They've mentioned that the production is on a much smaller scale than Shadow Chronicles...And it is fact that Shadow Chronicles was a small production. Doesn't really equate to what you're expecting as a movie. Again, it is speculation, but without the wishy-washy fanboy tunnel vision. If it is a movie, it wouldn't make sense to put it out and leave their "flagship" animated movies on hold, but again, who knows.

[terry the lone wolf]

You do realize that's why I said probably, and not as matter-of-fact? At least I hope you understand that. Also, no one ever denied that Macross Frontier: False Diva had some recycled animation. It seems easy enough, especially with 25 episodes. So if HG does the same thing for a say, 90 minute movie, what are they gonna recycle, the entire movie? 50% of it? If you read the last few pages and the news of this "production", you'd see that there are a few things that detract this from being an actual movie. 1)If Shadow Rising is on hold for the LAM, why would some side story get a full feature length green light?

2)They've mentioned that the production is on a much smaller scale than Shadow Chronicles...And it is fact that Shadow Chronicles was a small production. Doesn't really equate to what you're expecting as a movie. Again, it is speculation, but without the wishy-washy fanboy tunnel vision. If it is a movie, it wouldn't make sense to put it out and leave their "flagship" animated movies on hold, but again, who knows.

You're argument makes no sense....I could read the same statements you did and come up with an entirely different scenario. That's called an opinion. HG's movie has not even been released but it's under so much scrutiny of being recycled garbage. The last time that happened was over 2 decades ago. It seems that HG has been going out of their way to avoid all those criticisms of the past. You're inferring from statements and innuendo but the truth is I don't know what this OAV is all about and you don't know. There might be some wishy-washy fan boy tunnel vision but it seems to be a definite negative push on any project that HG is involved in especially Robotech ones.

[Gubaba]

There might be some wishy-washy fan boy tunnel vision but it seems to be a definite negative push on any project that HG is involved in especially Robotech ones.

I'm with ya. I'm shocked -shocked- to find that negative opinions about Robotech are going on in this thread!

[ps99042]

Terry, I don't think it's necessarily a negative push on anything from HG related to Robotech though it does happen. Still, I think Jasonc is making an accurate assumption about the new Robotech project. Afterall, Tommy Yune and his crew have gone on record saying that Shadow Rising was their main project before the Live Action Movie and with the LAM in development, SR is on hold to help coordinate these "huge" releases. He's also gone on record saying that Robotech fans only care about the continuing story of Rick Hunter, making other story productions less successful. Thus, with this new project in production, it's reasonable to assume that it's got a much smaller budget than SR and, even Shadow Chronicles, as HG wouldn't be able to justify spending too much money for a production not featuring Rick Hunter, especially if it's not tied to the LAM release. Moreover, for this new production to be called a "movie" it's likely gonna feature recycled footage to minimize costs or be very short (but then they it wouldn't be a true "movie"). True, this is all speculation and we don't know anything other than that Sera appears to be a featured character. As a character who was shown in less than half of The New Generation, she's not gonna be a big draw even if Lancer shows up though you know I'll buy every version that comes out which is all HG cares about.

[chrisk]

If Shadow Rising is on hold for the LAM, why would some side story get a full feature length green light?

I think the bigger question is why should anyone care?

1.) Tommy already made it clear it's not worth talking or showing at Comic-Con International

2.) Our only source of info is a rabid fanboy who likes to hear himself talk with capital letters

3.) They've attached Macek's name to the project - Is it that uninteresting?

[Jasonc]

You're argument makes no sense....I could read the same statements you did and come up with an entirely different scenario. That's called an opinion. HG's movie has not even been released but it's under so much scrutiny of being recycled garbage. The last time that happened was over 2 decades ago. It seems that HG has been going out of their way to avoid all those criticisms of the past. You're inferring from statements and innuendo but the truth is I don't know what this OAV is all about and you don't know. There might be some wishy-washy fan boy tunnel vision but it seems to be a definite negative push on any project that HG is involved in especially Robotech ones.

This is why I said it's all speculation. Also, I never said anything about it possibly being recycled footage in a negative manner. I mentioned that I hope it's not Love Live Alive, but that doesn't have a lot of footage. We're both under the agreement that until actual word gets out, no one knows what it's gonna be. Like fingerprints, everyone's gonna have their own opinion on what they think it's gonna be. If it bothers you that there are a lot of negative comments amongst people here and fans elsewhere, I can't help you with that. I think my ideas of what it may be aren't so conspiracy driven, or full of negativity. I'm curious as to know what you think it is that will be coming? You have an opinion of what many here think, but haven't really given your own. While we're on this topic, if we're gonna talk about it, as well get your ideas if you're gonna spend time talking about everyone else's.

[Einherjar]

3.) They've attached Macek's name to the project - Is it that uninteresting?

I think this is a very important tidbit that was mentioned for the project. As the brainchild for this outing, he shares the burden for its failure if it goes down that road. It would be a hell of a way to get back into the franchise when Tommy Yune did not live up to people's high expectations.

[Jasonc]

I think this is a very important tidbit that was mentioned for the project. As the brainchild for this outing, he shares the burden for its failure if it goes down that road. It would be a hell of a way to get back into the franchise when Tommy Yune did not live up to people's high expectations.

From listening to the various podcasts, and from sitting at one of the panels, it was pretty much said that Carl mentioned that because HG was in a position where Shadow Rising was on hold, that didn't mean that they had other outlets to put out new Robotech. That was Carl's extent of working on this project, and they've never said that it was Carl's story. Somehow, the idea that Carl was creating this has gotten tied into the project, when in fact, it's really only Tommy's work. I can see why this is getting the diversion with that. For one, it takes some of the blame off of Tommy if it gets a harsh criticism. Two, it gets people interested in it more due to the fact that Carl is no longer here. Now, if Carl did come up with the primary thought of putting new Robotech out through other outlets, that's great and all, but I've heard countless fans utter the same thing for years and years.

It doesn't seem like Carl would be working on a documentary AND a new Robotech story at the same time. Heck, if that was the case, were they thinking of phazing out Tommy, cause that seemed to be all they were doing. The LAM has nothing to do with HG (although they like to tie that to themselves) and with Shadow Rising on hold, doesn't seem like there was more than that.

I was talking with another RT fan the other day, and the issue of Shadow Rising came up. He was under the belief of what Kevin was saying, that it's in "active development". I told him that first off, "active development" means that they are actively thinking of what it's gonna be about, and not that anything is being done. Secondly, after pointing out the little action with the franchise and whatnot, HG maybe be wanting to sell it to WB. If that is the case, do you really think they'd be working on something that they are going to stop and give over to another studio? What if WB didn't like what Shadow Rising was going to be? That'd be a lot of money wasted for nothing, so it seems logical that nothing is being done on Shadow Rising. Some would disagree, and that's fine. I'm not saying I'm totally correct here, but HG is into making money, and not wasting it. Knowing that, the idea of Shadow Rising still being worked on, and actually seeing new production work wouldn't make sense. Of course, if they aren't trying to sell off the franchise, then all bets are off, and HG is just fiddling around then, still not a good sign for them.

[terry the lone wolf]

This is why I said it's all speculation. Also, I never said anything about it possibly being recycled footage in a negative manner. I mentioned that I hope it's not Love Live Alive, but that doesn't have a lot of footage. We're both under the agreement that until actual word gets out, no one knows what it's gonna be. Like fingerprints, everyone's gonna have their own opinion on what they think it's gonna be. If it bothers you that there are a lot of negative comments amongst people here and fans elsewhere, I can't help you with that. I think my ideas of what it may be aren't so conspiracy driven, or full of negativity. I'm curious as to know what you think it is that will be coming? You have an opinion of what many here think, but haven't really given your own. While we're on this topic, if we're gonna talk about it, as well get your ideas if you're gonna spend time talking about everyone else's.

It's too early in the process to give my opinion on the OAV; in a earlier post I held my opinion of the Sera art that was leaked because it was so fuzzy. When I criticized Shadow Chronicles was after I've seen it and I could give an accurate accessment based on facts. Now I hope the OAV's a good story and something worthy of Robotech but it's still too early.

[VF5SS]

Now I hope the OAV's a good story and something worthy of Robotech but it's still too early.

are you serious

"worthy of robotech"

what does that even mean

worthy of being a bad dub of 1980's mecha?

[Einherjar]

are you serious

"worthy of robotech"

what does that even mean

worthy of being a bad dub of 1980's mecha?

So a Macross sequel doesn't even fit the bill? Not enough exposition and such to be worthy of whatever people have been obsessing about?

[Smegalot]

I think it is only speculation about the OVA, and the Roobotech homepage hasn't had any updates for a while either. They could either be trying to keep peoples interest in robotech. As for a series there has nothing been until RSC. And before that it was the orginal Dubbed and re-written series to make the "Anime" series that we know as Robotech.

I would prefer to wait to see what happens before I jump to any conclusion. But we know that they can't use any macross related stuff. Because all they "supposedly have rights" to is the Distribution rights to "Macross", not the intelectual content or the designs. And it all came up when Yamoto wanted to release the Macross Plus 1:72 all those years ago. They simply saw a way to make cash with out doing any leg work, and it still going. And Scince Bandai have an arm overseas I don't think they will just hand over any new stuff to say hey we paid to get it dobe, now we are going to pay you money to distribute it for us. Even though we know we have our own company that can do it.

As for the MF movie. I have seen bits of it, and some of teh deign work. Most of the Characters and mecha have had some redesign work and colouration changes. Which will be good.

As for the new robotech project. I say wait until more comes out. as it is all only speculation.

And HG should just let Macross go, it has out grown them, and was only a borrowed property to begin with.

that's my 2 cents worth anyway.

[Keith]

I'd also consider it dubious to call this an OVA, since it almost assuredly has a sub TV budget.

[Zor Primus]

I have a sneaking suspicion the new "project" will be a 15 minute short side story about Sera, presented in 3 five minute parts available for $2.99 each on iTunes.

So with that said, we'll get the lame attempt by HG to cash in on RT yet again covered, the lack of anything really new to add to the story, and also with such a short flick we'll probably see 98% recycled footage and 2% of Sera flaunting her buns with the Invid shield as she dances to Janice's rendition of Stagefright.

[Ginrai]

I'd also consider it dubious to call this an OVA, since it almost assuredly has a sub TV budget.

OVA stands for "Original Video Animation". Was it intended for TV? Was it intended for theatrical release? If not, guess what? It's an OVA! The word OVA says nothing about budget.

[Keith]

OVA stands for "Original Video Animation". Was it intended for TV? Was it intended for theatrical release? If not, guess what? It's an OVA! The word OVA says nothing about budget.

Actually, OVA has a lot to do with budget, bigger than TV, not quite as big as movie, and viola, you have an OVA. In general though, considering this isn't a Japanese production or release, it's automatically disqualified as an OVA. Maybe it should instead be called an STD (Straight to Disc), lol.