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Real World Technical References of Macross Variable Aircraft


charger69
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Oh, these are pretty cool. I didn't know a 3-vane thrust vectored engine existed in real life. That's so strange, all these years of looking at aircraft books, photos, air shows and museums and this is the first time I've seen it. Very cool!

I don't know if "reference" applies to the VF-4 Lightning III example, since I doubt very much Kawamori would have access to the Eurofighter Typhoon mere months after design had only begun so that he could be inspired to work on the VF-4. Perhaps there are older fighters with recessed missiles?

The TIAS Macross Plus book makes mention that the YF-21 and YF-19 were also partly inspired by the YF-22 Raptor and the YF-23 Black Widow II. The YF-19 forward-swept wing was also partly inspired by the Grumman X-29.

post-114-0-08000500-1392388374_thumb.jpg

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Mr. March

A more historically correct reference for VF-4G might be Russian Air Force MiG-31BM Foxhound (showing off the four semi- recessed missile hardpoints)

2357099.jpg


Also F-4

Yes, the Typhoon did come to mind, as being among the newest planes with conformal carriage. I've always thought the forward troughs of the Tornado were a great example--they're among the "deepest" I can think of. (a Tornado's rear ones are not recessed)

m02006120200271.jpg

::edit:: And here's a good one showing an F-4's:
f4j-9-2004.JPG

Edited by charger69
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Some obvious ones :)

YF-29 (VTOL with tilting engine pods)

yf_29_durandal_fighter_by_dstorres-d6ztp

VF-25F Tornado Messiah (VTOL with tilting engine pods)

vf_25_tornado_by_bloodrunner79-d4c94h2.j

New references thanks to Graham :)

EWR VJ 101 (German, Heinkel+Messerschmitt+Bölkow joint venture)

vJ101C_20.jpg

BELL XF-109

Bell-XF-109-5.jpg

CV22 Osprey (VTOL with Tiltrotor)

cv22-osprey-vtol-specialist-careers.jpg

Edited by charger69
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Some obvious ones :)

VF-17

vf-17d-diamondforce-fighter.gif

VF-171

vf-171-fighter.gif

F-117

f-117_13-front.jpg

From VF5SS's post http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=38605&p=1026377

VF-17
Nightmare (Stealth Valkyrie)


Interviewer: In the rough drafts of the VF-17, did you
stray far from the F-117?


Kawamori: It had a more traditional fighter shape at
first.... No, I didn't like the F-117 at first. (laugh) It had a shape that I refused to use. But when I went to the U.S. and saw the real
plane, I thought, "Well, it flies.
Nothing I can do about it." (laugh)


Interviewer:
You didn't think it would fly, at first? (laugh)


Kawamori: It's ugly, isn't it? I couldn't stand seeing one flying alongside
an F-15. But the F-117 also seemed
futuristic, or the times were changing, and I came to like the shape of the
F-117. I didn't like it, but I was like
"I was wrong, I'm sorry". And
so I decided that it would make a good 'character'. I'm glad I took a defiant attitude about the
VF-17.



Interviewer: Also, its Battroid mode has a heavily armored
look that was never seen before.



Kawamori: Since most Valkyries become thin anyway, I
think that is a merit in this clearly different type. I think it might have been better to put the
VF-17 in Macross Plus as a series of work.



Interviewer: It seems strange, though. It has the form of an airplane that already
exists.



Kawamori: It's embarrassing, but I couldn't expect that
to happen with only the F-117. I could be
convinced until the F-23. But when the
F-117 was done, I was like, "What happened?" (laugh)



Interviewer: How did you feel about that sudden onset of
reality? I think when someone is
designing sci-fi works, he can have the self-confidence of going ahead and
borrowing from reality.



Kawamori: The one I thought I really couldn't surpass
was B-2 Stealth Bomber. The B-2 is
really great looking. I even thought I
might stop designing after seeing it fly.
"It's so simple, it has so few lines, and yet so much
character. I could never come close to
it." (laugh) It's the one real
design I cannot surpass.



Interviewer: And to think it came from a company that
makes real planes. (laugh)



Kawamori: I'd be reluctant to answer if I was asked
whether I like the F-117 now. But I'm
more close to the point that I was convinced. Maneuverability is not so good,
when I asked a pilot "How about the maneuverability of this looking
body?", then the pilot said to me " It's alright, because it carries
4 computers" (laugh)


Interviewer: And if one computer fails, it'll drop like a
brick.



Kawamori:
That's right (laugh)



Interviewer:
And an impression is considerably different although it is a remodeled VF-17T
with the double seats and is a minor change.



Kawamori: The body is just about as good as the real
thing, but it becomes quite different by making even a small change. But it wouldn't look like we changed it much
if we did it in a very manga-like or anime-like way. The design near a real plane could affect
very much with the slight difference. It is an interesting part.

Edited by charger69
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Oh, these are pretty cool. I didn't know a 3-vane thrust vectored engine existed in real life. That's so strange, all these years of looking at aircraft books, photos, air shows and museums and this is the first time I've seen it. Very cool!

I don't know if "reference" applies to the VF-4 Lightning III example, since I doubt very much Kawamori would have access to the Eurofighter Typhoon mere months after design had only begun so that he could be inspired to work on the VF-4. Perhaps there are older fighters with recessed missiles?

The TIAS Macross Plus book makes mention that the YF-21 and YF-19 were also partly inspired by the YF-22 Raptor and the YF-23 Black Widow II. The YF-19 forward-swept wing was also partly inspired by the Grumman X-29.

The main reason that 3-dimensional thrust vectoring isn't used much is that it adds more complexity and weight to an aircraft, with very little return on maneuverability over 2-dimensional TVC. I can see it working out great for non-atmospheric maneuvers, though.

We also don't see forward-swept wings much because of the aeroelasticity issues it has. All it needs to become feasible is to produce a wing with composite grains in the appropriate directions so that when the wing undergoes loading, it flexes in a way that doesn't destroy the behavior of the flow over the wing at reasonable angle of attack.

IIRC, the story of Macross Plus was inspired by the ATF competition. The designs were pretty unique from their real-world counterparts.

Oh, and I'd bet that Kawamori doesn't really like the F-117 because it was essentially designed by electrical engineers, not aerospace engineers. ;)

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Semi-recessed long range missiles (moun

I don't know if "reference" applies to the VF-4 Lightning III example, since I doubt very much Kawamori would have access to the Eurofighter Typhoon mere months after design had only begun so that he could be inspired to work on the VF-4. Perhaps there are older fighters with recessed missiles?

The F-4 Phantom had semi-recessed missiles.

The design of the VF-4 was perhaps inspired by this McDonnell Douglas concept.

atf-mdc_zps004963c2.jpg

Edited by Vifam7
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As Kawamori's VF-4 Lightning design pre-dates the Eurofighter Typhoon by many years, it's more likely that Kawamori got the inspiration for the VF-4's semi-recessed missiles from the F-4 Phantom, which IIRC was the first fighter to feature carriage of semi-recessed missiles.

Graham

post-11-0-59209800-1392432328_thumb.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

Oh yeah, that is definitely a major influence on the Durandal. Great color scheme.

Now that I'm getting close to owning proper high res scans and finalized many colored versions of all the Valkyrie line art, I'd love to dive into some custom work using some of these schemes like the YF-16. Or maybe even color the VF-1A Valkyrie using the YF-29 Durandal colors, kinda like Macross The First :)

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I initially thought the Beatrice was a variation of the Stryker Mobile Gun, but I was informed by another Macross fan a year or so back that the Beatrice most closely resembles the Italian B1 Centauro tank destroyer. The Beatrice's armament is similar and the appearance of the Beatrice matches the Centauro more than most other wheeled LAVs or Tank Destroyers I've seen, right down to details like the ports and features like the angular armor on the forward section of the main turret.

post-114-0-64215900-1394027562_thumb.jpg

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Love this thread!!!

IMHO, some of the references are a bit off-base though!

For example the second ATF (F-22) design is quite close to MIM-31 Karyovin. I've never seen those mockups before, they are very cool!

The intakes and layout of the outrider engines on the Bell XF-109 are very similar to the layout and intakes of the engines on the VF-4.

The VF-4 is based off of the SR-71.

Didn't you guys read my translation of an article about this? http://nomansland.site.nfoservers.com/MRG-Active-Archive/forums/index.php?topic=2385.msg35718#msg35718

From Pg 092.

The interviewee states the VF-4 is reminiscent of the SR-71 but there didn't seem to be notes by the Kawamori Shoji with his inspirations for the design, unless I missed something….

The Grumman X-29 is also very reminiscent of the VF-9 Cutlass.

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Not the Variable fighters, but I was so impressed by those things below in the Macross World in the 80's.


post-14942-0-93226600-1394713622_thumb.png

Roomba.



And digital photo frames. This one is almost 100% the same thing as the one which appeared in Flashback 2012.

post-14942-0-86664100-1394713824_thumb.jpg

post-14942-0-36218900-1394713848_thumb.jpg

Edited by antibiotictab
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  • 10 months later...

Return from certain death! :D

Major similarities with Pantsir-S1:

1) In the centre the EHF phased-array tracking radar.

2) Two (in Maverick's case one) twin-barrel 2A38M automatic anti-aircraft guns

3) 12 (in Maverick's case six )ready to launch missile-containers each containing one 57E6-E command guided surface to air missile

SDR-04-MkXV Destroid Maverick (Thanks to jvmacross!)

naively_kid2-img424x600-1421510253wgtlk6

Russian Pantsir-S1 (anti-aircraft artillery) on a tracked GM-352 chassis

89oW81.jpg

Edited by charger69
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Siokorvsky Comanchero Attack Helicopter (SDF TV: Episode 20)

comanchero.gif

Mi-24 Hind

Never liked that design.

Always thought the RAH-66 Comanche was a better design than this.

Unfortunately at the time, the Comanche was still in early development in 1982. :(

Edited by Zinjo
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