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1/72 Bandai VF-25F Messiah build-up step-by-step (sort of)


wm cheng
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I added magnets to the underside of the fuselage because my tab broke off into the cockpit. This conveniently filled the gap. I used 1/8 diameter magnets by 1/16 thick. It's really stable now. Thanks to WM for the magnet idea and thanks to Vince for the link to the magnet store.

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Edited by Lodizah
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Use a drill bit to start the hole.Then use a dremel hi-speed cutter (size is 1/8).

Thanks alot. This thread and many other threads have lots of great information to get a model to look its best.

Even though I have been building model kits for some time, I'm actually new to the painting and detailing aspect of it (I have a practice model thankfully). Pretty much I'm going through all related threads in the forums to gather as much knowledge as I can. :p

Edited by shiroikaze
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Hey Cheng.

Actually the green stuff putty idea was bad advice. My bad. It was late and I was thinking incorrectly. Also you would have to build a non transformable model to do that. The kit is looking good by the way,.

I do however have a miraculous fix for the scratches on windows, I just tried this and it worked awesome. I used " Future acryllic floor wax " . It has a number of different names though. You can check out the names here depending on where you are in the world.

http://basic1.easily.co.uk/05800C/03D03B/klear.htm

Also, if you look at Hobby Japan #11 2008 and know or can get kanji ? ( spelling ? ) translated, there are some incredible builds of the frontier series mechs and variable fighters. Really seemed to do a good job of hiding the big gaps that are inherent with transforming models.

Cheers dude.

Also , I just picked up a " 1/72 SV-51 Gamma Ivanov " that doesn't transform, ( which I am so happy about, ) so if you have any ideas or links where there

are some step by steps or work ups anybody did of this model, please let me know.

Thanks and Cheers again.

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" shiroikaze "

" Thanks alot. This thread and many other threads have lots of great information to get a model to look its best.

Even though I have been building model kits for some time, I'm actually new to the painting and detailing aspect of it (I have a practice model thankfully). Pretty much I'm going through all related threads in the forums to gather as much knowledge as I can. "

Check out

http://www.heavyarmourstudio.com/ there's a tutorials section at the top.

and this guy is a sick modeler/painter and has a lot of tutorials.

http://www.fichtenfoo.com/02GiantRobots/02c.htm

Cheers

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Hey Cheng.

Actually the green stuff putty idea was bad advice. My bad. It was late and I was thinking incorrectly. Also you would have to build a non transformable model to do that. The kit is looking good by the way,.

I do however have a miraculous fix for the scratches on windows, I just tried this and it worked awesome. I used " Future acryllic floor wax " . It has a number of different names though. You can check out the names here depending on where you are in the world.

http://basic1.easily.co.uk/05800C/03D03B/klear.htm

Also, if you look at Hobby Japan #11 2008 and know or can get kanji ? ( spelling ? ) translated, there are some incredible builds of the frontier series mechs and variable fighters. Really seemed to do a good job of hiding the big gaps that are inherent with transforming models.

Cheers dude.

Also , I just picked up a " 1/72 SV-51 Gamma Ivanov " that doesn't transform, ( which I am so happy about, ) so if you have any ideas or links where there

are some step by steps or work ups anybody did of this model, please let me know.

Thanks and Cheers again.

You should really check out some of wm cheng's other builds/how-to's. ;)

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Ok, So really I shouldn't bother answering anything to this guys posts as it Appears you are quite the modeler Cheng.

Nice work. I just checked out all your previous stuff on the advice of Master Ace.

How cold is the T dot ? Must be chilly. I'm from BC.

Great stuff again man, I'll be looking up a lot from you.

Cheers.

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Hey Master Ace, since you're being so helpful, maybe you or somebody else might be able to tell me if there's ANY difference between using

Future Floor Wax

http://www.castlewholesalers.com/FUTURE-Fl...ish-27-Oz-.html

and Pledge with Futureshine ??

http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.j...oductId=1340324

I've heard they are the exact same thing but I don't want to ruin my paint. The Pledge stuff is easy for me to get where I live in L.A right now, but I'm from BC and

we don't have future there, so I'm trying to figure out the names that work, and I was going to pick up some new stuff tomorrow.

Again, not to derail the thread or anything, but thanks for your help Ace or anybody. Also keep the Gamma Ivanov tutorials flyin' my way if you know of any.

Thanks, and I can't wait to see Cheng's finished VF25.

Thanks for the step by steps too Cheng, they are great!!! The weathered VF 0S is sick man, soooo awesome.

by the way, my website is www.animoceans.com and I'll upload all my models pics when the site is done if anybody is interested..

Cheers guys

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Hey Master Ace, since you're being so helpful, maybe you or somebody else might be able to tell me if there's ANY difference between using

Future Floor Wax

http://www.castlewholesalers.com/FUTURE-Fl...ish-27-Oz-.html

and Pledge with Futureshine ??

http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.j...oductId=1340324

I've heard they are the exact same thing but I don't want to ruin my paint. The Pledge stuff is easy for me to get where I live in L.A right now, but I'm from BC and

we don't have future there, so I'm trying to figure out the names that work, and I was going to pick up some new stuff tomorrow.

Again, not to derail the thread or anything, but thanks for your help Ace or anybody. Also keep the Gamma Ivanov tutorials flyin' my way if you know of any.

Thanks, and I can't wait to see Cheng's finished VF25.

Thanks for the step by steps too Cheng, they are great!!! The weathered VF 0S is sick man, soooo awesome.

by the way, my website is www.animoceans.com and I'll upload all my models pics when the site is done if anybody is interested..

Cheers guys

If I recall correctly, Future is renamed in certain markets -- Pledge w/Futureshine may be the new name. I'd wait for other members to chime in on this, or check out sites, like aircraft resource center and starship modeler.

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If I recall correctly, Future is renamed in certain markets -- Pledge w/Futureshine may be the new name. I'd wait for other members to chime in on this, or check out sites, like aircraft resource center and starship modeler.

Sweet, thanks. Feel free to chime in everybody. I know some guys at Starship so I'll try them, and I have heard the same. That it's a " new package " for 2008, but the same formula.

Ps. check your post about the macross toy. I have the armor your looking for if you need it.

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Check out

http://www.heavyarmourstudio.com/ there's a tutorials section at the top.

and this guy is a sick modeler/painter and has a lot of tutorials.

http://www.fichtenfoo.com/02GiantRobots/02c.htm

Cheers

I already gone through fichtenfoo's website as much as I can already :). As for Heavy Armor Modeler, the site helps alot, it put some of the self-doubts in my mind to rest. Thanks alot!

Edited by shiroikaze
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Hey. wm cheng has been taking a loooong break.

I swear I am not the only one waiting to see some more progress on that expert build...

I have to date not seen a single build that has no paint scratches or decal peeling around the complex chest/shoulder/dorsal/wing extensions (depending on the mode) area, maybe wm cheng finds an answer to this??!

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If I recall correctly, Future is renamed in certain markets -- Pledge w/Futureshine may be the new name. I'd wait for other members to chime in on this, or check out sites, like aircraft resource center and starship modeler.

I live in Montreal and Future is available here at Walmart. I think I got the big bottle for $4 or something.

I am sure most people on this forum have see this link before, but this is the end-all guide to Future and it's many uses:

http://www.swannysmodels.com/TheCompleteFuture.html

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Merry Christmas & Happy New Year everybody! Sorry for the long break. I started this build while I was out of work (and thought I had some decent chunk of time to devote to it - I like to build when I have a solid stretch of time). But with the downturn in the economy and the film business in Canada not picking up, I thought I might seek alternate employment to pay the bills and support our collective addiction ;-) Once I started my new job, it took a while getting used to - you know, impress them and all... then the Holiday season hit (my first where my 2.5yr old daughter actually "got" Christmas - its so wonderful to experience childhood Christmas again, I highly recommend it to anyone here still sittin' on the fence about children). So needless to say, I haven't had time to my hobby much these days. I'm sure I'll be back to these boards with a vengeance when I retire or when my daughter hits teenage years and wants nothing to do with her daddy ;-( Thanks to all who follow along.

Firstly, what does this mean?

天啊``我等到花儿都泻了``

I hope its something good...

Thanks for any and all advice. I appreciate it, its the reason I post online - its one thing to show off, but its really the only input I get on this hobby (I don't have time to attend the IPMS meetings and no one I know locally is interested in this hobby) so I end up building in isolation which isn't great for my skills building. No advice or suggestion is too trivial, I might be good in some areas, but I also lack knowledge in some basic stuff too, so please fire away if you have anything to say (if I already know it, then it might help out someone else who is reading this thread at a different experience level than I). Actually, the problem I've been having lately is a very basic one; I'm having problems filling a seam (its model building 101) - I've been away from it so long that I find I keep leaving a hairline seam after filling and sanding, or I sand too much and lose the shape or contour - argh! - its just a finesse thing and I hope its something that will come more naturally whenever I "get back into the saddle".

I've never built an SV-51 (its on my huge pile of unbuilt boxes) but it isn't even on the radar yet.

I'm not a huge fan of Future yet. I've used it for clear-coating canopies, and its great for that. However the last time I used it (I don't know if any of you caught my F-16CJ on ARC - it was my attempt to start modeling again after a long break) I wasn't too impressed with the results. I may of laid it on too thickly, but it partially obscured or filled in some very fine panel lining so the oil panel wash didn't take as well as it should, it did allow the decals to sit remarkably flat and made them disappear and appear painted, but when it came time to airbrush the matte/flat clear-coat finish overtop, the clear coat developed micro-cracks and fractures in the surface (as though the future undercoat was just too slippery to grab hold of, too smooth) and the top matte coat looked like it had slightly shrunken uniformly. In the end after a lot of careful micromesh sanding and multiple coats, it looks somewhat acceptable, but still it was a hassle. Maybe its the mixture of ModelMaster acrylic clear-coats over Future that the combination doesn't like, but for now, I think I will stay with ModelMaster clear-coats all the way and only use Future for canopies & tinting.

Unfortunately, I don't think I'll have a solution to this chipping paint or decal problem. It was one of my first criticisms of Bandai when I first heard that this kit was going to be transformable - in fact I had originally intended to build it in the aircraft only mode and fill in all the seams and gaps. However its moving parts are so well engineered that it seemed a shame negate all that goodness. My plan is to apply many layers of clear coat to help protect it and minimize on the number of transformations - realizing that it is a model and not a toy after all. The tolerances are so tight and the transformation relies on these parts being so tight so that friction can help it stay together that I don't think this problem will ever be truly solved, I think all the clear-coats of whatever people decide to put on will only delay the inevitable, at first its only the clear coat that gets damaged, before it eventually works its way down to some visible part such as the decal or paint finish. Just my opinion, but I'd love to be proven wrong - so if anyone comes with a better solution, let me know!

OK, on to the VF-25, I haven't done much, but did get in a day over the holidays, I basically took the whole thing apart and separated it into painting assemblies (it ended basically un-building the whole thing). I took some pictures which I'll try to get around to posting sometime soon. But there's not much to see but a bunch of parts ready for paint. I also filled and sanded a few pieces (nose cone, forearm seams, shoulder seam and the knee mechanical joints) that I thought needed the seams to be removed, but overall the seams have been successfully kept to a minimum by Bandai's excellent assembly design - as HWK MKII correctly states - unfortunately Bandai did not design for painting assemblies so a few parts will be awkward to mask and paint. Just an update, I haven't forgotten and I desperately want to get back to this baby (especially since I picked up the Ozma one too now).

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ahh...sorry to hear this, but I know everything will come up nothing short of great with this

I'm very worried about chipping too, so I may be probably getting me two kits one to keep in battroid and the other to switch between fighter and gerwalk since this will require less transforming and could keep chipping to the minimum; looking forwards to your progress pics man! thanks for dedicating your time on this

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Nice to have you back. Thought you had abandoned the project. I can sympathize, with 2 kids and a full time job, it is difficult to get any modeling done (stop staring at me VF-25S, I will get to you!!)

One thing you can do for filling fine lines is to use Mr.Surfacer 500. Here is a small tutorial in case you are unfamiliar with it: http://www.swannysmodels.com/Surfacer.html

I have not been able to find the 500 locally in Montreal, but I do have the 1000 and it covers pretty well without obscuring the fine details.

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Merry Christmas & Happy New Year everybody! Sorry for the long break. I started this build while I was out of work (and thought I had some decent chunk of time to devote to it - I like to build when I have a solid stretch of time). But with the downturn in the economy and the film business in Canada not picking up, I thought I might seek alternate employment to pay the bills and support our collective addiction ;-) Once I started my new job, it took a while getting used to - you know, impress them and all... then the Holiday season hit (my first where my 2.5yr old daughter actually "got" Christmas - its so wonderful to experience childhood Christmas again, I highly recommend it to anyone here still sittin' on the fence about children). So needless to say, I haven't had time to my hobby much these days. I'm sure I'll be back to these boards with a vengeance when I retire or when my daughter hits teenage years and wants nothing to do with her daddy ;-( Thanks to all who follow along.

Firstly, what does this mean?

I hope its something good...

Thanks for any and all advice. I appreciate it, its the reason I post online - its one thing to show off, but its really the only input I get on this hobby (I don't have time to attend the IPMS meetings and no one I know locally is interested in this hobby) so I end up building in isolation which isn't great for my skills building. No advice or suggestion is too trivial, I might be good in some areas, but I also lack knowledge in some basic stuff too, so please fire away if you have anything to say (if I already know it, then it might help out someone else who is reading this thread at a different experience level than I). Actually, the problem I've been having lately is a very basic one; I'm having problems filling a seam (its model building 101) - I've been away from it so long that I find I keep leaving a hairline seam after filling and sanding, or I sand too much and lose the shape or contour - argh! - its just a finesse thing and I hope its something that will come more naturally whenever I "get back into the saddle".

I've never built an SV-51 (its on my huge pile of unbuilt boxes) but it isn't even on the radar yet.

I'm not a huge fan of Future yet. I've used it for clear-coating canopies, and its great for that. However the last time I used it (I don't know if any of you caught my F-16CJ on ARC - it was my attempt to start modeling again after a long break) I wasn't too impressed with the results. I may of laid it on too thickly, but it partially obscured or filled in some very fine panel lining so the oil panel wash didn't take as well as it should, it did allow the decals to sit remarkably flat and made them disappear and appear painted, but when it came time to airbrush the matte/flat clear-coat finish overtop, the clear coat developed micro-cracks and fractures in the surface (as though the future undercoat was just too slippery to grab hold of, too smooth) and the top matte coat looked like it had slightly shrunken uniformly. In the end after a lot of careful micromesh sanding and multiple coats, it looks somewhat acceptable, but still it was a hassle. Maybe its the mixture of ModelMaster acrylic clear-coats over Future that the combination doesn't like, but for now, I think I will stay with ModelMaster clear-coats all the way and only use Future for canopies & tinting.

Unfortunately, I don't think I'll have a solution to this chipping paint or decal problem. It was one of my first criticisms of Bandai when I first heard that this kit was going to be transformable - in fact I had originally intended to build it in the aircraft only mode and fill in all the seams and gaps. However its moving parts are so well engineered that it seemed a shame negate all that goodness. My plan is to apply many layers of clear coat to help protect it and minimize on the number of transformations - realizing that it is a model and not a toy after all. The tolerances are so tight and the transformation relies on these parts being so tight so that friction can help it stay together that I don't think this problem will ever be truly solved, I think all the clear-coats of whatever people decide to put on will only delay the inevitable, at first its only the clear coat that gets damaged, before it eventually works its way down to some visible part such as the decal or paint finish. Just my opinion, but I'd love to be proven wrong - so if anyone comes with a better solution, let me know!

OK, on to the VF-25, I haven't done much, but did get in a day over the holidays, I basically took the whole thing apart and separated it into painting assemblies (it ended basically un-building the whole thing). I took some pictures which I'll try to get around to posting sometime soon. But there's not much to see but a bunch of parts ready for paint. I also filled and sanded a few pieces (nose cone, forearm seams, shoulder seam and the knee mechanical joints) that I thought needed the seams to be removed, but overall the seams have been successfully kept to a minimum by Bandai's excellent assembly design - as HWK MKII correctly states - unfortunately Bandai did not design for painting assemblies so a few parts will be awkward to mask and paint. Just an update, I haven't forgotten and I desperately want to get back to this baby (especially since I picked up the Ozma one too now).

It's Chinese and it's way of saying "I have waited for updates for a LONG LONG time that flowers have already died"

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OK, as promised some photos of the recent work I've managed to sneak off to do (sorry its a bit anti-climatic after all this waiting...)

Basically I've separated out all the parts that get a white spray (it takes away the slightly purplish cast that the Bandai white plastic has) and taped them to a cardboard tray for painting. The key thing here is that the wings need to be fully finished, clear coated, decaled and weathered before attaching them back into the wing glove pivots so that can then be glued and the seams be filled and sanded, then painted, so we have to basically re-paint and seal that part all over again after the wings are finished.

I also broke down the parts that needed filling to get rid of the seam, I used Tamiya putty for the bigger stuff and Mr. Surfacer 500 for the smaller stuff. There's a shot after the sanding too.

Lastly I sprayed everything else Steel from AlcladII metalizer paints as the base metal skeleton to be detailed over top of. Then I masked that little circle detail on the ankle - it would of been so simple for Bandai to mold this piece separately as an add-on later, but they weren't really thinking about people who paint (it was a bitch to mask decently, I'm still not happy with the demarkation between the colours, but once I do the black oil wash over this part, I think it will hide the masked line nicely (I hope!).

Today I've clear coated the flat white. I used flat white (Tamiya Acrylics) because it seems to have a better coverage, I find gloss white to be too translucent and requires too many coats to cover anything underneath. I then used ModelMaster clear-coat semi-gloss with some gloss added into the mixture to cover the flat white. The flat white is fairly fragile and is prone to scratching off if not protected. If I use pure gloss, I find the shine too much that it attacts finger prints, this semi-gloss mixture I find is just smooth enough to take decals and an oil wash sucessfully, but not glossy enough to keep fingerprints. Also I want to mask the white areas to spray varying shades of off-white and grey because I find the overall white too flat or dull, but I don't want to stray from the canon scheme too much, so I think some off-white (tinted light grey) panels will make the white plane jump out a bit in terms of paint finish. This clear coat allows me to use the masking tape without fear that it might pull up some of the white paint (which has happened in the past). So not much to show today, just the clear coat which doesn't look any different.

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I'm too chicken to start mine, after looking at this! Still, impressive to see you mask around circles - that's hard, and by hard I mean very, very difficult to do correctly! Nice to see a bit of progress, looking forwards to seeing more.

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I also broke down the parts that needed filling to get rid of the seam, I used Tamiya putty for the bigger stuff and Mr. Surfacer 500 for the smaller stuff. There's a shot after the sanding too.

Aren't the forearm seams supposed to be there (for removal to expose endoskeleton frame)?

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I hear ya on the ankle circle detail. I ended up just doing it "inside the groove". I tried doing it "properly" (with the curved outer ring white too) but it was impossible for me to mask. There's really nothing TO mask---the "not white" section surrounding the outer edge is less than .5mm wide for about 1/2 the circumference (the right side on the pics), and every masking tape type/size I had ALWAYS just "fell off" the edge and lifted up off the part in that area. (I am loathe to cut tape directly on a part to make a mask---I always try the "ultra-thin-strips wrapped around" method)

PS---if you freeze-frame the show, you'll find LOTS of minor inconsistencies for how small details like this are painted. How Bandai did it is "only correct for 1 particular scene", if that. I don't worry too much about it being "correct" when there's obviously multiple models/texture maps used, and they're not identical.

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There are blades made for use with a compass, and you can cut a circle from airbrush masking film with that. It might take a few atttemps until you hit the perfect diameter, but I find this method much more convenient than the masking tape way in this kind of situations.

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What I did was use the back of my x-acto knife (the fine no.11 one) to trace a rough circle in pencil, then I cut the circle out of the Tamiya masking tape. The size was not crucial, just close was good enough. As it happened, the hole cut out was a bit smaller than the circle I wanted to mask, so I cut a slit in one side of the hole to open it up, and I "stretched" and massaged the cut circular opening around the circular ankle detail until it matched the curvature. I've found that you don't necessarily need to match the curvature that much as long as you're close (it wasn't even a true circle, just a free hand one...) but with these masking tapes, you can push, nudge, pull and bend it to fit the proper curvature. Because I had to open it up a bit, there was a small portion unmasked which I filled in with a small thin piece - I found that this way it was easier than with many built up pieces and that the curvature was too tight to do it with a small thin strip.

Sorry I didn't take any photos of this process, I didn't really think much of it - especially because the edge wasn't that crucial since its in a crevice and a dark wash will be applied so the oil wash will hide any masked messiness.

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Just some photos of the grey panelization process. Found out that I liked it better (from my YF-21 & starship Enterprise) that if it was a fairly straightforward scheme like an all white or all blue scheme that it adds interest to vary the panel shadings a bit - so I wanted to get some off-white/greyish tints in there, the overall end result will still be a white plane close to the canon scheme, but I thought that it adds interest.

My first attempt was just to tint the white with Tamiya Sky Grey (its warm) - it looked fine in the airbrush cup, but by the time it was evenly applied, it appeared way too dark against the white parts. So I mixed up a batch of thin white again, and airbrushed over it to lighten the grey panels so there was more subtlety in the shading. Its still a bit on the strong side, but I will "post-shade" the panel lines (which will further blurr the edge distinctions between the white and light grey) weather on top and the relatively high contrast decals will all fight with the grey panels in the end. I still want to see the effect. My past experience with the VF-0 showed me that by the time all those other layers were on top, the panel difference was so subtle that it hardly showed through, so this time I was going a bit more heavier. If its still too heavy in the end, I can still spray a light coat of white over the decals to tone them down a bit and tie everything together a bit more as well as lighten any overtly strong paneling. Well... at least thats the plan.

Now the next step is to completely finish the wings so I can glue the wing gloves together and fill and sand that seam. I think I will paint the grey stripes on the wings, was well as any of the grey decalled areas such as the back of the leg stripe and the knee patch. Firstly, I hate seeing screened areas on the decals - and unfortunately, the Bandai grey on their decals is a screened element, plus the knee and wing glove will be a "high-traffic" area (lots of movement - so the decal will be more prone to scratching and chipping) - so the hope is that the painted grey will stand up better than the decals.

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OK, got to sneak in a few hours over the weekend to work on this bird, its finally starting to come together - but boy, Bandai certainly doesn't make it easy for you if you want to paint this model!

I first concentrated on masking the areas that the grey stripe decals would be, since they were relatively simple, the knee part would see a lot of rubbing, binding or chipping and the fact that I hate seeing screened decals on any model, it made sense to me to paint these details. I mixed up a bit of White with Neutral Grey (I was going to use Tamiya Sky Grey, but it had too much of a warm tint that it looked a bit brown next to the white of the plane). Unfortunately only after I removed the masking did it appear too dark compared to the decals supplied, however between the various animation cel references, they sometimes appeared quite dark too, so I decided to leave it alone for now instead of re-painting it.

I then hand painted the small details in the cockpit and pilot area. I actually airbrushed the pilot and the area immediately behind him (the two cylinder details) flat white to get a good white coverage first, then hand painted the greys and purple stripes. Then I brushed a bit of gloss clearcoat (to prevent the next step of the oil wash from staining the flat white). The oil wash really picked out the details. I then brushed some gloss clear coat over the helmet and white shoulder pads and flat clearcoat over the grey/purple body suite which really played the contrast well. You'll probably not see any of this well after the purple tint is applied to the canopy in the end, but you never know, I'll know how much I should detail after this one for the Ozma bird. I wished there were decals for the chest SMS logo, I ended up have to approximate something with a yellow marker and a red sharpie marker - it's okay to the naked eye, but by no means great. Maybe it would be a good thing to do a custom decal for as well as the shoulder patches (again they were just drawn on with a sharpie marker).

Lastly I did a thick black oil wash over all the metallic parts to pick out all the nicely engraved techno gak! I love this part... and Bandai doesn't disappoint here!

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