1/1 LowViz Lurker

I want the guy from collection DX who did the review for the protogarland to do a review for the 1/60 yf-21 when it comes out so he can grab it by the arm and fling it around the place to prove it can hold together.

Glaug would be great. Than do the Qrau. Get all the major bad guys to fight. Yeah yeah yeah..."VF-1 is the only popular toy from the 20 year old robot show that will be recognisable to mr. casual purchaser etc etc etc".... but who cares about the casual buyer? These things are cheap toys people. Not like masterpiece grade. How risky could it be to try other thing in the macross universe besides popular robots?

No I was responding to that guy's post. It's just called being off-topic. "Shirlock"? Nice spelling, dude.

I will probably end up skipping animated for some classics/universe. I do like the fact that animated is trying something different with the transformers by making them like superheroes and giving them a greater focus on the characters themselves and not just the fighting. The new generations of kids needs to see what good writing can do, and treat the series less like a robot show and more like a show you watch with robots in it. If the series wasn't about robots and you had no interest in toys, you would hopefully still want to watch it for the characters' depth, story and humor. ..but that doesn't mean I prefer it over a non-super hero style of show where the fighting CAN be the focus of the story and it is just action packed fight scene after another. (ie see the new Spectacular Spiderman cartoon if you want to see a fast action-packed ADHD toon with cool fights and witty dialogue, and less emphasis on character development) Which is why I can ignore the animated toys. I feel like as good as they are, it is just that bit easier to resist because of the decision to make the robot modes more cartoony. I'm sure they will still sell well though. As for the purchase of Leader Brawl: Yeah I like brawl leader class version. Accept for the face. I do like the claws on the leader version. You get that sense he is an evil creature and is designed for one thing: destruction. All the heavy weapons and bulky body covered in armor plates is the reminder to run away. "I am the giant robot. Since I'm not a shrinking robot from G1 like megatron who goes down to normal size, or a combiner like devastator who crumbles into pieces just from losing balance, my natural size is scary enough. I am a monster robot" And this is where the more animalistic claws seem to work well for him where it doesn't for the good guys who still look 'creepy' by having sharp hands and stuff. You can imagine that evil robot guys specifically created brawl, tortured him, and then like a caged animal set him free to go and destroy things like a trained unthinking beast. Oh well that's what made me buy him. Also helped that starscream sucked for being a chunky fighter jet so it meant there wasn't many other Decepticons worth getting. (and yes I have seen custom paint of megatron and do think it looks awesome but I don't have patience to do that. Brawl looks ok just plain green) And people that say deluxe brawl is better: I think they are lying. 1. Leader brawl has better and more practical transformation. (the tank turret isn't a mere shell that hides the arms, it's a solid piece that you can imagine has stuff inside it in both modes to be functional in both modes. Just like how a valkyrie doesn't split up the cockpit into parts and still remains useful and functional in all modes because it's a part that doesn't need to change.) 2. the long cannon of deluxe brawl would have made the joint go loose at larger scales where things start getting heavier. Any robot that has one really long barrel is going to need a strong joint in the elbow for larger size toys. Plus if the robot was real it would shoot more accurately by having the gun mounted to the backpack and guided by the hand of the user. 3. more movie-accurate than deluxe 4. no shoulder problem connecting to the body on the leader class 5. skinny arms but chunky legs look silly on the deluxe. 6. more detail due to the bigger size. For example the minigun can be seen and isn't covered up by the hinge of the wrist-mounted claw weapon. 7. clicky joints. But it needs them so you can say it isn't really a great advantage. The Bad poo: 1. worse green than the deluxe version imo 2. more expensive 3. poo pose-ability. But it's a blocky guy that sits there and blows poo up. Not dances and somersaults and twists and cartwheels from danger. It's actually suitable for a brute force character to not care about moving around so much when its attention should be on using all its weapons to shoot/destroy 90% of the time, and 10% advance. Instead of "evade and run" like the smaller lighter guy. It's like a monster robot similar to the introduction of scorponok in the movie. Size and strength over brains. 4. the light and sound gimmicks. Clear plastic parts don't go well with the rest of the robot's body. 5. the main cannon barrel is smaller in proportion to the rest of its body than the deluxe which has a fat cannon barrel, which gives it a more powerful look. You can say this is like the transformers equivalent to the "small hands = more girly" argument for the yamato 1/48 vf-1, where having something be all skinny makes it seem a little too weak and delicate.

Side by side comparison of the revoltech and GNU would be good.

I like what I've seen so far. But I think it's too early to judge. Remember what happened when gundam seed came out. Seed was good. But after seed, we got seed destiny and that thing had lots of flashbacks and stuff. I'm crossing fingers it is able to maintain high quality to the end. Of course this IS a macross fan site, after all. So we are all destined to put a little bit of damage control/positive spin on it even if it doesn't turn out as great as we all hoped. And then we will hopelessly be slaves to bandai because we love the mecha in the show and want to buy the toys just like as we were as little kids watching SDF:Macross.

Looks really good in pics. I prefer the movie colour a lot more. Are these sold out everywhere yet?

Can't wait for the reviews. Sure looks great in fighter mode. About the only complaint is the feet, but since it destroys the 1/72 and that is its only competition out there, that can be forgiven. Repaints: Gamlin. The VF-22 from one of the ovas that he appeared in. Thanks. It would fit in nicely with the 25th aniversary stuff I would imagine. I don't have any money to buy this right now though. I blame all the hasbro transformer stuff I bought. (I should have not bought leader class brawl movie. It ate a chunk of the yf-21 money But good thing yamato delays releases. Not for those who want it early of course. Just saying it's a busy period right now for transforming robots) Edit: oh yeah almost forgot I just bought a mz23 garland too... Whatever the repaint is, I hope there is a looooooooong time (wallet healing period) before it comes out after the canon yf-21 colour release.

Now on the topic of max: this has already been addressed by others. He was put there to make the world seem more realistic. That no matter how good hikaru thinks he is (and he has lots of skill gained from the flying circus) there is always someone else smarter, better looking, luckier and happier than yourself and who you kinda hate/admire/fear/jealous of. An example of this is in the Simpsons where Homer is always pissed that Ned Flanders always seems to have more luck than him. It's a joke we can laugh along to and we can relate to this. Spiderman: when peter parker whines about how his life as a masked super hero means he has less time to be with his girlfriend, dating, career, .....and then along comes the Symbiote suit which makes him stronger, more confident, more powerful, faster, and sexier than he was when he didn't have it. Is this necesarily making parker a more interesting character? If the show was all about spiderman with the alien costume and he never had a hard time, would you have a story to tell? No. It would be boring. Just like if Max had been the focus of SDF:M. People can't relate to it. It's not realistic. (war is not won by a single being) And you spoil the sense of danger that is in more realistic shows that adults like to see. eg Roy actually dying as opposed to Basara's fake death. Guld having to give up his life to kill the ghost in macross plus. Hikaru growing up and becoming a man and forgetting about dating or getting the young girl he original planned to have in order to live a more (what appeared to be) practical lifestyle by staying in the military. (and not because he likes flying; which would be a selfish reason, but because he feels its his calling to "protect people" other than the princess who needs rescuing from danger in the romantic movies. So it end up being less about "me" and "what I want" and more like a "I'm doing this because now with all my dead friends and an almost-extinct race it's a responsibility now and people need my skills". Much different from when he first began in episode 1 where he just mopes about and all he had to worry about was getting minmay to like him. ....So all this drama, all the change, it feels like you experienced an event in that person's life. So in summary, yeah max is like a "humble basara", but that's not why we like him and hate basara. It's just that him not being the central focus of the story is a huge reason why it doesn't affect SDF:M and spoil the realism. Like Ned Flanders in the Simpsons, or the Alien costume in Spiderman, we are not watching it for them. They are background figures. The spotlight is always on the messed-up, imperfect people who are forced to struggle through the challenges, and due to it being 'harder' for them, due to being average joes, (who are not perfect, who do not have the best looking face, who do not know everything) it's just easier to relate to them. Superman will never be as interesting to watch as spiderman. Because nobody relates to a guy who can just do everything without effort and where there is no danger. Basara in macross 7 appeared too godlike in situations where a normal person should be frightened to death. If Exedor poos his pants at the sight of the protodevlin monsters, and a young kid doesn't react in fear, don't you think that is unrealistic at all? This would be like if a dinosaur came into your backyard and eat your dog? You telling me you wouldn't be a little bit scared? But because it's all a cartoony world, we just have to accept that the main character is not the least bit affected at all by these super powerful space monster and just continues on as usual singing a song as if nothing changed?. Now compare that to Dyson: his confidence is due to his love of speed,flying, the thrill of being in some sort of zone. It's his addiction to that which makes him behave like an apeface so that he doesn't get promoted and so he can stay in a cockpit flying planes rather than at a desk. That confidence (from an addiction to flying) sounds more realistic to me. At least Dyson gets shot at, almost dies, has to fight a rival pilot (just like max had to fight milia who is almost his match) and there is a sense of danger in watching them try to kill each other. It's an interesting story, allows for interesting fights, and due to the characters not being perfect, there is dramas they must go through which has a permanent effect on later events. (ie trust in AI drones is killed after the pilots show they have more common sense than robots despite bold and irresponsible behavior that endangers themselves and the planes. If they didn't take risks and weren't crazy and willing to bet their life, ghost drones would have taken over the human race led by an AI. So there was a purpose for watching these A-holes and even if you didn;t like them as characters, they spoke through actions.) If macross 7 wanted to be liked for the story it would need to go back to the realistic character formula, and ditch the monster of the week formula, speed up the pace, increase the battle scenes so that they appear more interesting, have basara not be the central focus, and make the characters he interacts with more serious, and the monsters more frightening and less cartoony. (think vampire hunter D type vampires with intelligence, emotion, reasoning, charisma whatever.. rather than sailor moon villains.) Generally make it less a vehicle to sell merchandise (cds, toys, dvds) and more a classic show that will appeal to more than just the genre fans (robot show nerd) or fans of anything-macross. ("it's got valks so I have to see it") You can't just rely on the macross name only. What people want is a soap, (normal people, not superheroes) mixed with a science fiction war story(realism in battles and detailed combat), and action. (mecha porn - when the ace pilot comes in it's done in a style that is very energetic, fast, and dramatic that is what makes them interesting compared to the grunts..yet they are not invincible and still rely on the military for support. SDF:M had the "Qrau vs VF-1" with max vs milia. "VF-1 vs Glaug" with Kamjin vs Hikaru. Zero had "VF-0 vs SV-51" with Roy and his teacher. These were highlights of the war, as two equally-matched pilots engaged in combat with each other personally one-on-one, with equal technology, and without outside interference, to see who was "da man" and which side was right. )

Good point. I agree with the general "war is bad! war is bad! war is bad!" message in a lot of japanese anime and sympathise with basara's dream of bringing people together using the music. But I think shows like astro boy just did it much better than macross 7 ever did. Astro Boy showed how an innocent little robot that wasn't immediately tolerated by humans could slowly learn from human behaviour and become like one of them and eventually surpass the behavior of the humans by making wise choices and bringing balance. He didn't have to preach, he acts. He just rescues people from danger which is far more interesting than singing a song and having monsters slowly become hypnotised by the songs so that they would understand because magic seemed to come out of the lyrics which converted them to be good guys again. It's just not interesting storytelling. It's not just basara. It's the formula of the show: each week basara will sing a song and the monsters will run away. Now I know you guys mention that this was aimed at a younger audience, and that's fine, but I'm just saying it's possible to have a anti-war show but have action and adult themes like astroboy where the person is actually getting off their ass and doing something interesting, feeling emotions, falling in love with someone, breaking up, feeling vulnerable and out of control, and learning from life mistakes and getting more experienced and wise throughout the show. It shows us the audience, that you have given the character a life beyond the cartoon world that you created and which real people can relate to. Ie they are 3d dimensional 'people' not mere cartoon characters from a cartoon like bugs bunny. It's the same reason why I couldn't really sympathise with Stick (who you could say was very pro-war) in Mospeada. He was just so single-minded and 'flat' and the end of the story he seems like an ok guy who has a great sense of duty, but so does a robot that never sleeps. Nothing changes. The invit were sent off, and it's like "mission accomplished". That's it? Now beyond the fighting he gets himself into, does it make him interesting to watch? So similarly I have that issue with basara where he just doesn't change much or evolve, and it's like he accomplishes a mission, but I'm like why do I care? I like your beliefs but I don't know "the real you". The one that has a life outside the cartoon world you live in. If given a choice, would you rather see someone fight to save a life, almost die doing it, or listen to a music video and some monster running away every single episode? For me macross plus gave us the action we like with the 3d character depth the older audience goes for. That was just the right balance I like. Although the characters were not interesting or likable to some people (1 is a jerk, 1 is a depressed wannabe loser, 1 is mentally unstable) they felt like real people not "saturday morning cartoon" people. SDF:M also had more "realistic" people.

Now I can pretend to be the Vulture from spiderman.

Biggest issue I still have with yamato are: -I want hasbro levels of ratchets (like what you get on a leader class toy) on toys that are large. -things must lock together tightly in ALL modes just like transformers, and not just in fighter mode only. If TF Alternators and stuff can look like replica model cars in Alt mode whilst at the same time have their robot mode feel solid and locked firmly into place, then so can yamato's toys which cost heaps of money. ^ These two things should be their goals now that we've got the man hands on 1/60, more tampo prints, and balanced proportions for all three modes, along with the usual accurate sculpts we've come to expect from the more expensive, small run toys. As they meet our expectations and demands, naturally our standards for quality gradually gets set higher and higher as we get used to the improving toys and keep spending money on the better ones that replace the older ones. Work on those joints to increase their lasting power. So if in future we get say a male zentradi power armor at 1/60 (to fight a 1/60 Qrau) I no longer have to worry about the figure flopping over backwards or forwards and falling off the shelf due to loose hip joints and stuff, or the ankles collapsing down due to the weight of the toy pushing them back inwards when they should stay extended. Whoever is designing the toys, need to think about these things apart from just how it looks on a computer. "What does it feel like when you handle the physical thing itself?" For smaller toys I have not as much issue but when you get to a certain size and weight that is when you'll need the better joints. Maybe for some mecha designs you can't help it (for example if a robot naturally back-heavy) but just consider those things when making it and look at how other toy companies solve that problem.

I remember transbot - crap (all sega master system shooters were except for r-type imo) zillion (this is like metroid in a way. But duuuude so much sprite flicker. ) zillion II (more action focused. I won the game. Didn't mind it. I thought all 8 bit games sucked in the 80s though because back then arcades offerred the real fun. Home systems couldn't compete unless they were handled by game developers who knew what they were doing. Ie pretty much all the inhouse nintendo software developers) If anyone should make a macross or mospeada side scrolling shooter in 2d, it should be Treasure. Have you played a game called Bangai-o? Itano circus micromissile swarms are the order of the day in that. Can't wait for the ds release. I had this on dreamcast. Just substitute your character for a Qrau and there's your macross shooter. Incidentally treasure also made the GBA Astro Boy game. Very good game. They are one of the few companies that don't stuff up games with movie licenses out there because they understand how to make the gameplay fun. Also check out the Gradius V game on ps2 by them if you love side scrolling shooters.

No it wasn't just your age.

The old leisure suit larry games were way better than the crap ones of today though, ironically.

Looking good. So who is going to get a first release?

I purchased one from HLJ. Now make me my EX-garland yamato. Even though I know it is the fixed shoulder I am going to only transform it rarely like with my konig monster just to be careful. Oh yeah I just remembered I got to save some money for the bubblegum crisis toys too.. I wonder if they have decided whether they will make the bike shiny and stuff like the hardsuit? (or go cheap on us like in the early days when they didn't tampo print anything on the valks)

I had a pencil sharpener valk. Horrible horrible toy. Even as a kid I thought it sucked. I always preferred buying model kits and stuff of macross, but the problem with those is they also had limits. I now understand why the chunky monkey was the holy grail of toys back then. If I had owned one I would have had a really happy childhood as a kid! The smart fan who couldn't afford a proper macross toy would try to make their own valks with lego. Too bad I wasn't that patient.. You know, if we never get toys made of things like the vf-4, or the variable glaug or whatever valk that isn't made by these toy companies, I would love to see instructions on how to make those with lego. I don't want to die before someone makes those things you know what I am saying? Not that I hate the vf-1, it's one of my favorite valks. But we get vf-1 after vf-1 after Vf-1. When are the toy companies going to focus on other valks?? It would be like if hasbro only made G1 optimus prime and that was it!

How do you tell if it is a reissue?

Dude, buy the nora SV-51. It feels light but that is imo so far the best valkyrie yamato has done so far. The reason diecast is bad is the paint can chip the more the parts scrape together. Most yamato toys are mainly plastic, which is good in some ways for them because the joints may get loose and the limbs become floppy due to the weight. (eg the legs of the old 1/72 yf-21 would sag down if you lifted the toy up by the chest instead of the legs staying stuck in the position you last left them. This is not good for people like me who like to display my toys sometime in a flying or "floating in space" pose in battroid mode)

1/55 are strong but they were beaten/surpassed when the 1/48 came around imo. Nothing against bandai, I just think the whole "1/48 is soooo delicate don't touch it or it will break!" is exaggerated. Sure it's not as strong as a toy designed for a mainstream casual buyer but it was aiming more for the collector who is never going to just throw it around and who understands they are paying a premium to have it. So for that customer it achieved what it set out to do. Now when the vf-25 comes out which has strong joints, good materials, and at the same time is faithful to the cg model, then we will have reached a new level. Strong toy, but sculpted well too. These 1/60s are great, but let's hope that yamato really does pay attention to all the criticisms in quality this time. So far they've done good with the later sv-51 releases, and I hope they keep it up. By the time yf-21 is out, and is safe to buy on first release (that should be the goal they set for themselves to repair their reputation) then they can have all the money they want from me.

Yeah as far as I'm concerned based on what others have said on previous pages. But if yours DOES break and it's not a red one, (which was the earliest release) then that would be the first I have heard of that. I'm assuming yamato fixed the weak shoulder problem since the brown army colour release. (similar to how the 1/72 vf-11 FAST Pack release eliminated problems of fragile parts which plagued the non-FP version all those years ago when people's toy were breaking) Graham mentioned a new quality control guy was hired at yamato and the old one was fired (I'm a poet and don't even know it) so I'm going to assume that means the later releases are going to be ones with the fixes made to them... Hopefully the new QC guy means no more breakages. (especially for future macross products due to no official support allowed to us due to this HG legal crap) Has anyone who bought the brown army garland experienced a broken arm yet? I'm pretty forgiving of breakages on early releases of toys so long as there is some support for replacement. If I were you and if you are going to get a red, just transform that bastard as often as you can so it DOES break off, then get the replaced arm as early as you can to get the problem out of the way. Don't leave it in the box and not play with it, otherwise how will you know if the shoulder is fine or fragile?

On the topic of the protogarland (I still haven't got this yet!) *shaking head* that's pretty ballsy of him to handle the thing like that.. macrossman: customer service page from the yamato usa site: http://www.yamatotoysusa.com/page.cfm/242 If toynami/HG allows it for their toys, yamato should be able to as well and match that service if they want us to buy their stuff. (at least we all hope they care about us)

Should be a sticky thread like the "difference between robotech and macross for noobs" thread imo. Lots of nice specs and images for the mecha in the macross universe that you won't get from compendium.

Great work on the site as usual, Mr March. Variable Glaug is there which is nice to see. One of my fave transforming mecha from macross.