VF-14 Vampire Design Preference

[Aurel Tristen]

Shoji Kawamori has finished the design for the VF-14 Vampire. It is seen in the Macross M3 Dreamcast game. However an early rough concept was seen in the Macross 7 Plus short "Spiritia Dreaming". Which do design you like more?

[Marso]

Got links to any pictures? I've never seen either one.

[Anubis]

I like the stealthy SR-71ish look to it best.

Though both rock.

Edited June 26, 2004 by Anubis

[Aurel Tristen]

Got links to any pictures? I've never seen either one.

They can be viewed here:

http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat/vari/vf14.html

[JB0]

The nose is the only big diffrence I see.

Personally, I think the canpopy whiffs it on the final design.

[Knight26]

I thought that first one was the VA-14, the attack varient made for zentraedi forces.

[Aurel Tristen]

I thought that first one was the VA-14, the attack varient made for zentraedi forces.

RPG sites confusing you.

The VA-14 was never seen in its pure form... only in the form of the modified/derived Az-130.

[Guest Khyron_Prime]

Its hard for me not to think how much these designs recall the VF-4's body shape. Of course, its a natural evolution, right?

Personally, I think the canopy whiffs it on the final design...

Right on. It certainly appears that it would be a cramped space for the pilot, even as in rotating his or her arms--a regular design for traditional fighter planes, but one that I've never seen in Valkyries. I have to wonder if it might be better (from a certain, scrupulous perspective) to extend the cockpit back a little bit, if even for a more eye-pleasing view of the pilot's area. Well, it would be good for the viewers...forget the pilot's safety...

[Hurricane29]

I like the final design, reminds me of the SV-51.

[Aurel Tristen]

Refresh for screen captures from Spiritia Dreaming:

http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat/vari/vf14.html

[Aurel Tristen]

The nose is the only big diffrence I see.

Personally, I think the canpopy whiffs it on the final design.

I like the armored cockpit/canopy cover of the early design more than the finalized design. The rear view of the Battroid seen in Spiritia Dreaming is nice-showing the colors used on those covers-they make it seem like the VF-17's "older brother".

[Jedi Knight]

Refresh for screen captures from Spiritia Dreaming:

http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat/vari/vf14.html

Umm, I think that's the wrong link.

[JB0]

Its hard for me not to think how much these designs recall the VF-4's body shape. Of course, its a natural evolution, right?

Personally, I think the canopy whiffs it on the final design...

Right on. It certainly appears that it would be a cramped space for the pilot, even as in rotating his or her arms--a regular design for traditional fighter planes, but one that I've never seen in Valkyries. I have to wonder if it might be better (from a certain, scrupulous perspective) to extend the cockpit back a little bit, if even for a more eye-pleasing view of the pilot's area. Well, it would be good for the viewers...forget the pilot's safety...

Well, I happen to like the Blackbird a lot.

Replacing it's streamlined hatch with a glass bubble is just criminal.

It's like adding warts to the Venus De Milo. If the Venus De Milo was a transforming plane instead of a marble statue.

Same for the lasers on the "engine spikes", really. But that canopy just screams "Look at me, I'm a giant zit on perfection!" in a way the lasers don't(they at least TRY to go along with the lines).

On the plus side, the finished battroid has a sleekness that the early sketch doesn't. It's more in keeping with the speed machine it's based on.

The sketch battroid looks more like it belongs to an Abrams than a Blackbird.

[Aurel Tristen]

Refresh for screen captures from Spiritia Dreaming:

http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat/vari/vf14.html

Umm, I think that's the wrong link.

Check again now-scroll down.

[Guest Khyron_Prime]

But that canopy just screams "Look at me, I'm a giant zit on perfection!"

As objective as I can be, inside, I can't really enjoy the extreme Gundam-ness of the battloid mode. "Half-way between the VF-1 and the VF-19 Kai!" Ugh. Bust out the beam sabers...

[Aurel Tristen]

lasers

just a note

beam guns, not laser guns per Kawamori's design sheets

[JB0]

lasers

just a note

beam guns, not laser guns per Kawamori's design sheets

*nods*

I could arguel I meant laser in the generic sci-fi sense of "anything that doesn't shoot bullets", but it'd just be silly.

[John Focker]

I like the earlier design over M3's. The earlier design has more visual tie-in with earlier variable fighters (VF-1, VF-4), while it also resembles the VF-17, so it's a good transition in terms of visual design. That said, the M3 design is nice, but it just felt less Macross-like.

Anyone notice that on the last screenshot on the Nanashi page

http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat/vari/vf14.html

the VF-14 at the left bottom corner?

It has a Jolly Rogers skull on its left shoulder!

Long live the Skull Squadron!!!

Edited June 26, 2004 by John Focker

[GreenGuy42]

Rough sketch...

The "finished" design is hideous.

[Dat Pinche Haro!]

i say the rough sketch...but as soon as Druna Skass see's this thread he'll say the finalized version

Edited June 26, 2004 by Dat Pinche Haro!

[Radd]

I must be in the minority that preferes the final design. I believe there was a very similar poll done ages ago and I voted the same back then.

While I love the Blackbird, and I agree that I prefere the rough version's canopy, the bubble canopy hardly ruins the final version for me. I also approve of the beam cannons and overall design evolution that seems to come from the VF-4 (my favourite Valkyrie).

Far from the losing visual tie in with earlier fighters, I'd say Kawamori expanded on that with the final design.

If anything, I'd say that the ultimate version would have the SR-17 style canopy and the rest would be the finished version, but as it is that one point just is not enough to beat the refined version's design.

On a side note, I think any comments about the design being too 'Gundam', I can only assume they mean the oversized shoulders and that there's cents on the chest, saying it looks like a Gundam seems akin to saying a kitten looks like a great dane because they each have legs, two ears, and a tail.

[Aurel Tristen]

lasers

just a note

beam guns, not laser guns per Kawamori's design sheets

*nods*

I could arguel I meant laser in the generic sci-fi sense of "anything that doesn't shoot bullets", but it'd just be silly.

Yup, hehe

[Nightbat]

I agree with Radd on this one

the final version looks much more "evolved" while the blackbird just seems like a

ealy design rip-off

as for that bubblecap?

is it me or why are there no complaints about rear visibility? seems the higher

position gives a very good 360-view

except for the head that looks a little too "squidlike" in the final version

both battroids look great, built for heavy h-t-h combat and able to take a punch

[Radd]

as for that bubblecap?

is it me or why are there no complaints about rear visibility? seems the higher

position gives a very good 360-view

I wondered about that too. I suppose there could be a virtual cockpit much like those sported by the VF-11 and 19 (and the 22 maybe?), giving the pilot a view of the outside even where there's no clear canopy. No clue when those started getting widespread use.

[Druna Skass]

I like the final version, better. Though of the three 14 variants I still like the Fz-109F the most.

[Boxer]

The first design looks more rugged and durable...it also reminds me of the 'simplicity' of the VF-17...i.e. not covered in details.

The 'Finished' design seems more fragile. OUt of the two of them I think the finished sketch's head is the worst. I just don't like the big 'fan head' that looks like an aerodynamic wind block instead of something useful.

If you want to go for cannon, I think the production sketches are 'Cannon' M7 because they were seen on screen.

But my vote is that the first sketch was either a pre-production version or a 'stealth type', and the VF-14 used in the games (final design) was a second type produced later.

Besides, even though the final production type keeps the shoulder lasers of the Fz... but it drops the tradmark rotatory chest laser mount of the Fz.

[Knight26]

Besides wasn't the VF-14 (blackbird type) the later production version? I thought that hte VF-14 seen in M3 was a pre-production prototype. That might explain the differences in the design, the VF-14 seen in Macross 7 is a later model with more passive stealth features. I personnaly prefer the head of the Macross-7 version, but the overall fighter design for the M3 version is better IMHO with the head the biggest detractor. My biggest problem with the design though is that the cockpit is exposed in battroid mode, no armor covering it like in almost all other valkyries.

[Aurel Tristen]

Besides wasn't the VF-14 (blackbird type) the later production version? I thought that hte VF-14 seen in M3 was a pre-production prototype. That might explain the differences in the design, the VF-14 seen in Macross 7 is a later model with more passive stealth features. I personnaly prefer the head of the Macross-7 version, but the overall fighter design for the M3 version is better IMHO with the head the biggest detractor. My biggest problem with the design though is that the cockpit is exposed in battroid mode, no armor covering it like in almost all other valkyries.

Nope. The rough design seen in Spritia Dreaming (Macross 7 Plus short) was an first animated, yet unfinished design of Kawamori. (Like the VF-11's internal weapon bays I guess) Kawamori later finalized the VF-14 as it appears in Macross M3. Personally, I prefer the early design.

[Boxer]

Well it could be that the pre-sketch is a VF-14A pre-production type (Which would explain why the Varuta fighters look like this) and the latter version may be a Vf-14B or even an S or X type (Modified and updated with upgrades).

I didn't take timelines into account, but it seems like another logical solution. Will you still keep both sketches on your website Nanashi? Why did you post this poll?

[Aurel Tristen]

Well it could be that the pre-sketch is a VF-14A pre-production type (Which would explain why the Varuta fighters look like this) and the latter version may be a Vf-14B or even an S or X type (Modified and updated with upgrades).

I didn't take timelines into account, but it seems like another logical solution. Will you still keep both sketches on your website Nanashi? Why did you post this poll?

There have not been any model letter designations released yet. Only merely "VF-14".

Its Macross mecha information, that's what my website is about.

This poll is just a poll. Something to talk about.

[Boxer]

So is there any official information surrounding the VF-14?

I just hopped over to the compendium and it designates a VA-14 and VF-14 (Since this isn't an RPG site...and since the Compedium is official...)

It was brought up earlier, but maybe this IS the VA-14. They're similar designs, and the only problem I see is where a full-sized Zentran would fit...

(When a mecha is designed for 'Zentreadi use', does it imply full-sized?)

Edited June 27, 2004 by Boxer

[Aurel Tristen]

So is there any official information surrounding the VF-14?

I just hopped over to the compendium and it designates a VA-14 and VF-14 (Since this isn't an RPG site...and since the Compedium is official...)

It was brought up earlier, but maybe this IS the VA-14. They're similar designs, and the only problem I see is where a full-sized Zentran would fit...

(When a mecha is designed for 'Zentreadi use', does it imply full-sized?)

It is not the VA-14. It is an early concept/rough design for the VF-14. Its was labeled as such and in the dialogue it was called "VF-14".

The VA-14 is said to have a larger body. This does not mean that its for full-sized Zjentohlauedy pilots. It means it is for pure Zjentohlauedy, such as those who served in the Macross-05 Emigration Fleet (The origin of the Varuata's Az-130s)

[azrael]

http://www.anime.net/macross/mecha/united_...va14/index.html

It says it there. VA-14 has heavier armor and weaponry, increased engine thrust and redesigned wings compared to the VF-14. If anything, I would say that the VA-14 probably shares a similar wing design as the Az-130.

[Aegis!]

Damn , AT LAST this valk gets some recognition on this board !

This is on my top 3 fav. valks together with the 5000 and the 0D.

It´s a dificult choiche since I reallhe sake of the bat just for tf the designs buty like both otroid mode I´ll choose the earlier rough version , the M3 version is just too skiny (though really nice ) looking for me.

[Boxer]

Just thought I'd add that article also shares the same basic structure and transformation system. Since these two VFs appear to have (roughly) the same profile and I assume the same transformation methods...

Seems the only thing stopping the first VF-?? being the VA-14 is the lable Nanashi says it has. Ah well, but at least it gives us a general idea what this mythical VA-14 looks like.

This is an off-topic question, but are there any VFs designed to be used with full-sized zentreadi? The only one I can think of is the Variable Glaug (Zentran version) which seems able to fit a full-sized zentran in it's cockpit and still function.

Edited June 27, 2004 by Boxer