kaiotheforsaken

I really hope the thing doesn't have delimiter mode. No reason to give a yammie an additional reason to fall apart

In an attempt to bring a bit more discussion, to the thread, especially with the S4 premier only hours away. I'll go ahead and post my thoughts on the final 5 and the so forth. Also this is going to be lengthy. ***SPOILERS AHEAD**** My personal feelings on the 5 is that first and foremost, they are fundamentally different than the significant seven. I do not subscribe to the idea, that they can be boxed, resurrect (in the same sense as the 7) or are bound by the same laws/programming etc that the 7 are. What they truly are, and what their purpose is, I'm still on the fence about in some degree. In my mind their correlation to the temple of five and the thirteenth tribe is without question. If we are to take the mantra we hear from both Leoben, and the first hybrid, this being the line "All this has happened before, and will happen again". The idea that the final 5 were members of the 13th tribe, eternally reborn to replay their roles throughout the ages, seems to fit. This would also explain their "activation" as it were. As they draw closer to Earth, more memories and shared experiences from their subconscious bring about their true natures. I also believe that the with these models, the line between what is Human, and what is Cylon is substantially more blurred. Most of what I've been chewing on as of late, is not the nature of the "Watchtower 4" revealed at the end of s3, but the final Cylon, whose identity is still a mystery. This is where the bulk of my BSG thought process has gone lately. Especially after taking the last couple of weeks to re-watch every episode prior to season 4. First I will say that I think the final Cylon's identity has been kept secret for a very specific reason. He (or she) is by far the most important of the 5, and may even be as different from the other 4 as the 4 are from the 7. From re-watching season 3, it's quite clear that while the 7 know that the 5 exist (simple math dictates they must, as all models know that their are 12), but WHO the 5 are and what their purpose or function might be are complete mysteries. This, to me at least, debunks either Adama being a Cylon. For those who may remember, Leoben said just that to Laura before his death by airlock scene in season 1. While Leoben can see things privy to only oracles and the hybrids, I don't believe he deviates from the other 6 so much, that he is aware of who the 5 are. I believe this statement was a means to sew fear and suspicion amongst the higher ups of the fleet, nothing more. I also believe that minor characters like Gaeta and D, do not carry enough weight in the series to be the final Cylon. All that being said, and despite some of what was said in season 3, I believe the last Cylon is Gaius. I'll start with the most basic evidence, in my eyes to supporting this claim. First, we know where he comes from, but little else, nothing on his parents, or family (other than a brief comment about lying to his mother back in s1). He is also a character of high importance. The bulk of my theory however comes from the both the words of the first hybrid, and D'anna's quest for the 5 and her vision in the temple just prior to her line being boxed. We'll look first at the hybrid, I'll cut out some of the other things he says in favor of what I feel, relates to Baltar. I will then apply it in context to events that have happened. "And the fifth, still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering." First comes the part of redemption, there is no character, in the entire show (at least currently) wanting to be redeemed more than Gaius. He has been tortured at the hands of both races. This is important, as it plays into a large part of my theory. When being subjected to drug induced hallucinations on Galactica in S3, he envisions himself surrounded by darkness, with only a light source as his lifeline. He is quite literally in shadow, clawing towards the light, which he feels is safety. In both cases of him being tortured, he lets out quite disturbing screams. There is also the case of miss D'anna. During her vision of the 5, she recognizes one of the faces and offers up this "forgive me...I had no idea". Her inflection and facial expression are akin to that of a genuine apology. What major character, have we seen her wrong? The answer is Gaius, only an episode or two prior, she was the one torturing Gaius. Certainly the grounds for an apology. There is also this interesting bit, she reaches for the hand of that particular Cylon in the vision, only to be holding Gaius' when she comes out of it. Now during the past few eps, Gaius has suspected, and hoped he is a Cylon, and has said as much to D'anna. As she is dying in his arms, she tells him that "he was right" but has no time to elaborate on what exactly this was. So there is, believe it or not, my bare bones theory on at least the final Cylon. Obviously it's just that, a theory and we wont know until the show gets underway.

I'm a bit surprised we haven't seen these images in the 21 thread yet.

--------possible spoiler stuff----------- While an interesting theory. I don't think the explanation for the "head" versions of Six and Baltar are so easily explained. One theory regarding the 5 I found of particular interest, is that they are reborn over and over again. What I mean by this is, unlike the 7 who download, the 5 live their lives and are born again, without the knowledge of their past lives, somewhat akin to the Dali Llama. However as they draw closer to earth, memories buried within their subconscious start coming to the surface. This would explain why people with lengthy, confirmed histories (like Tigh) could be Cylons. It also plays into the All this has happened before, and will happen again" mantra we have heard since season 1. I think we also have to take into account that the we know very little about the 13th tribe. However, we DO know that at least some members built a temple on their way to earth. The Temple of Five, where the five priests pray to the one whose name cannot be spoken. This, combined with D'anna's vision of the final 5 in the temple, seems to suggest a great connection between the final 5 and the 13th tribe. Perhaps the Cylons are older than we realize, at least in some sense. I don't think that 7s lack of knowledge of the 5 is purely based on the fear that the 5 cannot be controlled. While it is apparent that all 7 models know the 5 do exist, it seems equally apparent they know little else. If members of the 5 could jump there souls or what have you, into any being they wished. The visions of them and who they are wouldn't carry as much weight, at least in my mind. I also don't think that the the toaster versions rebelled, and created all 12 models, after the first Cylon war. I think for the 7, that is almost certainly the case, but the 5 are fundamentally more important, and vastly different from their mass produced brethren. I have my own theories, but this is kind of becoming a wall of text already, so I'll keep them to myself for now. edit: one additional note, neither Gaius nor 6 as the corporeal versions, know nearly enough about the workings of the universe to provide each other with such important information. 6's prophetic guidance of Gaius is completely unique to her head version, her humanoid versions show no sign of this ability, the only model (of the 7 anyway) that has shown such prophetic knowledge is Leoben.

you know the guns move right?

I believe man doll, in this case = dolls for men

With the new QC guy and the pure bad assery of this particular valk, I know I'm willing to risk it.

Graham said something like that in either this 21 thread or the first one I believe.

The 19 at least still looks to have the paint app done up the same as the rapid prototype version (i.e the surface isn't smooth). I wouldn't be terribly shocked if these were still the same ones we've seen at a few other events. edit: This image here: http://ga.sbcr.jp/mreport/009339/40.html really demonstrates what I mean, especially the shield and the shoulders.

This one is a toughy, while the Federation has always been the "good guys" of the Trek universe. I always found the story arcs dealing with the other races the most interesting. For example, the TNG arc where Gowron and Duras struggled for control of the High Command. So I'm not sure, the Feds are the "good" guys, but the other races/factions seem far more interesting. note: I use the term Federation a bit loosely here, since obviously it is compromised of more than just mankind.

I wasn't aware of such a creature. I've had 0 issues with my Nora ver however.

maybe he's just referring to the image on the front page of MW? Which is just showing the non transformables. If there was some imgaery of a 1/60 11B im sure someone here would have found it already.

While the chest may not lock, I've found the problem to be substantially less irritating then what I had believed after reading the boards here. I can pose the arms with out issue of it being floppy. Hell I even held it upside down, the nose separated from the gullet piece but the chest and nose stayed locked while only drooping from the gullet piece maybe a quarter of an inch if that. The thing feels damn solid in everything but gerwalk (which I'm not a fan of anyways, and is more of just how gerwalk is designed).

I bought one of these bad boys (with fastpacks) this past saturday. My god it is fantastic, the transformation is fun the sculpt is excellent. It's just an all around great figure. If the 21 weren't coming out in such a short time, I'd consider buying a second.

I want to add this thing to my collection really badly. However, with all other awesome releases coming up (like the 21) if it's not available through some form of normal retailer (like hlj) I may just have to wave good bye. It's awesome but not 300+ bucks awesome.

The finish on that sucker makes it look like a new car. While I typically prefer the flat finish (like Yamato's other valks) this looks really really great. Glad to see more pictures.

I'm gonna have to agree with the Gman on this one. At first I was like, oh damn revoltech 19 and 21, but the more I look at em, the more I'm not that thrilled. The yammies may not pose as well (or they may, I dunno) but they look more accurate to me, and that goes a long way in which gets bought up. That being said, I now own the 1/60 19 (which is amazing) have the 21 on pre-order (which looks amazing) and will buy the 11 when it eventually comes to be. With these large scale versions already out, I may opt out of their smaller counterparts entirely.

I know the chances of me buying one have gone up since they will be in scale with the Yammies.

God that 21 is gorgeous, I cant wait for these to come in.

I hope he weathered 1/48 isnt a WF exclusive. That thing looks awesome, and happens to be my personal favorite valk (at least from sdfm). It'd be a shame if I lost the chance to give Yamato more money

Wow that weathered 1/48 looks amazing, as does the destroid. My wallet mourns the inevitable loss.

Yeah, I worded that a little wonky. By fixed I meant that things like the gunpod sitting straight in fighter mode were fixed. I was pretty sure they didn't retool the thing to lock. I cant see the locking as being to big a deal though, how often is the thing gonna be upside down?

to my knowledge the chest doesn't have a lock at all. It's just how it was designed. So for example, if you held it upside down in Battroid mode, the chest would flop out of place. It isnt a QC issue, just how the thing was designed. The fold booster set is supposed to be the fixed version though.

anyone know when in Feb this is coming about? I imagine it's gonna be tough to find a 2nd release unless it pretty clearly states it on the box or something. If anyone has some leads on this that would be awesome. I kinda want to grab one before the 21 hits.

I'm gonna have to agree with The White Drew Carey on this one. An interesting theory, but one that I don't think will ultimately pan out as the truth come s4. *possible spoilers* I'm fairly convinced that we have a hint as to what the 5 cylons might actually represent/be in S3. In the episode where D'anna has her vision inside the temple regarding the final 5. They talk about that temple being for 5 priests who worshiped 1 god. This is potentially a link to the fact that cylons in some form have existed since the exodus of the 13 tribes. Maybe the 13th tribe were the original cylon descendants. If they can go from Super intelligent machines, to super intelligent flesh and blood. Who is to say they didn't start that way? Perhaps the grand design of the original Cylons was to infiltrate the 12 colonies and they were the original "human" scientists that built the first machine versions. That's pretty out there of course. But according to what's been said, there were humans, that shared a belief system similar to the cylons, and I think that holds significance in what we will be told later on.