Keith

Oh come on, what's wrong with The Black Hole, or The Last Starfighter....I actually just bought both this month

Finally found a place that has them in stock, should be here in a week or so.

I started to read, then I saw the title and realized... *(internal voice) NO! You aren't supposed to listen, look at the member title.* Do you ever pull that stick out of your ass? Are you talking!? I can't tell... The member title tells me to not to listen. Oh well. That's no member title, that's my name bitch, and it's too bad it doesn't tell you to eat me.

I started to read, then I saw the title and realized... *(internal voice) NO! You aren't supposed to listen, look at the member title.* Do you ever pull that stick out of your ass?

I'll vote for the sketch comedy show "Wararu Inu" (laughing Dog) currently running in southern california on KSCI (18), wednesday nights, 11:40 PM-12:30 AM. No subtitles, but better than any american sketch comedy show I've seen since in living color.

Not super original, but fun. I've seen the OVA & movie.

??????????????

Hmm, since we're just tossing out blunt responses & not paying attention to what others say, I'll return to my old standby. YOU WILL LISTEN TO BASARA'S SONG!

If you're not going to be open to discussion, then there's no point in you expressing your views either. Bottom line seems to be, you dislike 7 because you "choose to." What I said stands, go back & watch for yourself. The culture shock aspects were mearly a stop gap on the way to the more advanced anima spiritia technique.

Hmm, where to start.... Go take a look at Shao Pai Loon, when Brita & Exedor see the film, as well as when they show it to Bodolza, the energy generated by Kaifun is instantly recognized as an ancient power. It's not gun based, it's not "culture shock," is an energy been shooting from Kaifun's hand & zapping a giant. Though at the time it was little more than "movie magic," it was undeniably recognized by the Zentradi as a familiar power. There you have it, "aniima spiritia," even incorectly diagnosed, did indeed exist in Macross way back in the days of Macross TV. This would later manifest itself in a true form in Macross 7. Kawamori has even been so kind as to place it into Macross Zero to affirm its placement in the continuity so that even Togo can't deny it. The thing you have to remember here when arguing such things, is that Kawamori & Mikimoto are/were huge Gundam fans. Gundam itself has its own mystical "Newtype" powers, so its no surprise to anyone that Kawamori would want to implement his own version of it into Macross. A mystical force that transcends all archaic notions of war. As for Minmay, she was indeed nowhere near as powerful as Basara, or even what Sara has shown. The "culture shock" implemented through her is at the surface a simple distraction so that the U.N. Spacy could launch reaction weapons...or was it? The true power of Minmay didn't come from arousal, or distraction, but her ability to move peoples hearts. Her true part came into play long before the final battle with the Bodolza fleet, when the 3 spies invaded the Macross. Attracted by the initial "culture shock," they were woo'd (sp?) by the emotions they felt, and experiences they had. Through sharing them with the rest of the Britai Adoclas fleet, they created enough of a faction in the Zentradi to force Britai into signing a treaty with the Macross. His men wouldn't fight, and would only rebel if forced to. Those aren't the actions of an initial "culture shock." It's those soldiers that Minmay won over with her songs, with the emotions she awoke in them, that turned the tide in the war. Due to the unfortunate lack of time, and Bodolza's intent to kill any further threat to his fleet, the Macross was forced to use Minmay as a 'shock" tool to distract them & save everyone's lives. Did they want to take out a huge chunk of the Zentradi fleet? No, but there was no other choice at the time. Would simple porn have done the job? No, because porn wouldn't have won over Britai's fleet, just confused them until they got used to it (see Kamjin), in which case it would have been useless. The Macross's shock tactics alone wouldn't have gotten them close to Bodolza's ship, and everyone would have been killed. Even later in the series after the war, Minmay forgets her reason for singing, and just drudges through performances. When captured by Kamjin, she learns just that lesson about the difference between "culture shock," and moving peoples hearts. Kamjin through her trick back in her face, and caged her right back up. In the last episode, we have Minmay (after losing Hikaru), deciding to seek out her reason for singing, to find her emotion in it, and to sing her songs for herself first before she can move anyone else. Again, understanding that she can't just simply "phone it in" like some Britney Spears. That's the true "Minmay effect" project M. was started to find. Max & Chiba could have easily found some pop band to use as a distraction, but they were looking for something more, someone with true conviction in what they were doing, someone like Basara & Ray. That in itself is the true continuation brought about in Macross 7. Not a simple repeat of a culture shock phenomenon, but an evolution into a peaceful way to end wars without having to distract & use reaction weapons. Much like Gundam's distinction between a simple "Ace" pilot, and a Newtype, Kawarmori kicked the stakes up a notch from a simple "idol singer," to "Anima Spiritia." In it, isn't a simple DBZ ki blast to zap the enemy, but a raw physical manifistation of one person reaching out with their emotions to effect change in another. Despite the militaries attempted misuse of Basara, he knew the true potential of what he was developing. As pointed out earlier, singing had nothing to do with the actual effect of Anima spiritia. It could have been just as easily generated by someone dancing, doing carpentry, whittling, drinking coffee, anything that someone can put all of their emotion into. It just so happens that the chosen medium of Macross is music, and as such, that's the form thats used. It also doesn't hurt that music is an easy to express format, not really requiring much understanding of language or style to be expressed. Over the course of the series, Basara goes from having no effect other than a basic "shock" reactions, to honing his personal concentration & skill into a tangable extention of himself. Through this we have the much bashed "first 15" episodes. What everyone keeps missing is that those episodes are important, not just for character introduction, but to establish the beginning of Basara's abilities. When looked at in this way, you can see just how natural the progression is from Macross TV to Macross 7. Kawamori's point all along not being to solve wars through shock tactics, but to solve them through a created understanding. Like that Newtype thing where their minds open up to one another to form a perfect understanding. Though there are obviously still conflicts, and of course, resistence to such things, those are natural. Plus is no different, in that it also displays a piece of this overall puzzle. There we have another dynamic of Idol verse's actual emotional effect. Sharon with her artificial pop idol hypnotism, and Myung with her genuine feelings reaching out to Isamu. Zero too seems to be exploring this, as Sara expressed a force which is undeniably that very same "anima spiritia." Lastly, regarding Macross II, I'm sorry, but no, 7 isn't a rehash. Big West demanded the songs be used to save money yes, but Kawarmoi has explicitly stated that he's never watched Macross II. The emulators are nothing even remotely like "anima spiritia." They're simply response triggers. The Marduk's Zentradi are trainied to respond to the different songs with different levels of fighting intensity. One song tells them to fight moderately, another more fiercely, and the "song of death," to fight with kamikaze tactics. The Marduk themselves have nothing even remotely of the history that the Protodevilin have, nor any of their purpose. The Marduk are simply a rehash of the Bodolza fleet being sent to earth to destroy it. Ishtar a rehash of Minmay (absolutely nothing new whatsoever), and the whole of Macross II being a scene for scene replay of DYRL. Macross 7 on the other hand is an entirely original evolution of the story, not a rehash of DYRL. You name me a scene in II, I can name you its parallel in DYRL. The same can't be said for Macross 7. What you're actually saying togo is that 7 is a rehash of DYRL, which again, isn't true.

You haven't been here long have you? Just when have I ever said the power of music was like bio-weapons & the like? You simply stated that the music was "repeated to much like a radio station," while I said I was referring to its actual implications in the series, not its placement. As for slander, just when did I slander you now?

thats very bold and foolish to say. the music thou is repeated bit too much like a radio station. the only great plot twist i saw in mac7 is when that guy says the protodevil leader (forgot the names) is a guy. i was like ahh noooo cant be. I said "power of music" i.e. the anima spiritia, singing instead of weapons, etc. How foolish is that to say when that's what's been said all along? Pay attention! As for great plot twists, if you didn't like the whole Gigil thing, then you have no soul.

Now that's just wrong!

The first 15 episodes are necessary for setup. -Basara is introduced & shown to not yet be effective (its a skill he has to build up) -The Varuta fleet are introduced, and shown to be a much smaller enemy than they will become -Gamlin is introduced, and shown to be a straight laced by the book pilot. -Mylene is introduced & shown to be well, a teenage girl with potential to go either way. -The M7 fleet is introduced, with Max & Milia's growing problem shown. All of this is necessary for the great plot twists that occur later. If Basara had flown out right at the beginning all powerful, then the believability would have flown right out the window. If the Protodevilin were shown off from the beginning, then we'd have been wondering why they didn't just show up sooner in Macross history. Etc, etc, etc. Through out the run we get some great character developement, some cool ass battles (despite those who choose to ignore ones such as Milia in City 7, Kinryu at Lux's orbin, operation Stargazer, etc). None of the "filler" episodes lack in plot or character developement. & the ending is just as climactic as the build up to it promises. They're nowhere near the fillerness the origianl series episodes 28-34 (which were most certainly fillers). The bottom line is that those who don't like 7, don't like the power of music aspect of Macross period. They even ignore them in Plus, despite the fact that it was just as prominent there.

I didn't say I was better than people who watch dubs, you did. I just said such people are ignorant, never did I make any inclination as to their personal "status" as a human being. Nor have you disproved their ignorance. There's nothing elitist about it, just simple facts.

Who has the superiority complex? He who chastises the idiom of those who want something different (*coughcoughYOUcoughcough*) You've made it clear how YOU choose to view your anime best... no need to belittle others for what they prefer. Honestly... as long as they aren't watching it with you what does it matter? Give it a rest man. How is me wanting something "not" to be changed wanting something different? Movies aren't filmed (not theatrical productions at least) in "fullscreen," nor is 99% of anime originally produced with bad english dubs.

I thought the real triangle there wasn't between Basara, Mylene, & Gamlin (everyone know's Mylene will end up with Gamlin), but between Basara, Sivil, & Gigil.

.....Exactly! Why do so few understand that the freakin' guitar control stick is just that, a control stick shaped like a guitar. It isn't played at all (Basara is singing Karaoke in combat), it's just a control stick in the shape of a guitar, with the exact same functions as the regular 2 control sticks, just condensed into one larger unit.

If anything, Macross 7 is the truest sequel to Macross out of everything presented so far. It's not about the flashy mecha battles, it's about the love & music.

Come on, how could you miss that. The real question is, who got Roy's nudie posters.

That's like waiting for the next episode of jerry springer to be a deep philisophical interlude. Not gonna happen chief.

Chances are a 4-6 year old isn't going to be watching Gundam Seed, or carring what language it's in if they did. Anyone older than than is old enough to read! And seriously, who has the supeirority complex. Someone who expects a product to be presented in its original form, or someone who expects a product to be changed to appeal to ignorant bias's (and not liking something because it's in its original language, or its original aspect ratio is an ignorant bias). There are no bars on the freakin' top or bottom, and why such people believe that anyone would crop the top & bottom off of a picture boggles the mind (while it does happen in rare case's to "fake" a widescreen effect, that's a whole other conversation).

Don't suppose that bootleg also includes the Japanese goonies game, & that old HK bootleg NES street fighter II.

Uhh, would kids even bother watching those to begin with if they had to read words that flashed (in some cases quickly) across the bottom of the screen? I mean my friend's nephews/neices always bitch to him to change it or to put the dubs on if he's watching something subtitled (one time it was Char's Counterattack). And these kids are about 4-12, and 4-12 is the target audience of pokemon, dragon ball z, yu-gi-oh, and zoids right? "Much less ignorant world"? OK I'm sorry if this is stating to cross the line into the realm of flaming, and if that's the case Mods I apologize, but isn't that statment a bit arrogent, I mean if people don't agree with you on a topic, like their personal preferences happen to be diffrent, are they completly and utterly wrong or something? Cropping nearly a 3rd of a film from its original aspect ratio isn't a preference, it's hacking it up. The same goes for dubbing something into another language! Kids & ignorant people who request such things only do so because they're uninformed. If you teach people about things, they'll widen thier horizens. If you let the perpetuated idiocy continue, that's all that they'll get.

Hey, the Guitar control stick is a hell of a lot more plausable than the BDI/BCS system. It's exactly the same as the twin control sticks, only melded into a single guitar shaped control (which is NOT played to control flight, just moved in a smililar fashion to the control sticks). And yes, you're missing a hell of a lot of Macross background story if you don't watch all of 7.