Saruta
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In order of increasing seriousness: - If it's just for young adults what are those Osamu Tezuka references doing in the second movie? There's the Hyotan Tsugi toy on sale, Black Jack on a TV screen, etc. To me, the references actually make sense as Ranka's pholosophy sounds rather Tezuka-esque there, but I'm *young* for a Tezuka fan at 36, most are older; there are very few YA Tezuka fans, and most that do exist are Astro Boy remake fangirls. (A possible explanation is that Kawamori himself was one back in the 80s, though. He could probably not have avoided it). - I do remember being a young adult. I picked detais in science fiction to *bits* back then. I totally overthought Isaac Asimov's robotics and "psychohistory" (until reading his doorstopper of an autobiography, "In Memory Yet Green", helped put things in context). I don't think I'm the only one, in fact many devoted sci fi fans of the age group are probably like that, so a young adult audience does not mean you can skimp on the details. And Kawamori knows it very well, judging by the numerous supplementary materials. (A side whine, though I think I did whine about this problem before. Apparently a YA audience does mean addition of gratuitous fan service. I have a nearly 9 year old son who loved SDFM and wants more. I have to keep him away from Frontier *solely* because of fan service scenes; I think he can handle the plot itself and the occasional gore, but how do I explain the panty thief scene, Sheryl's remark about Nanase being well endowed, etc? I hate telling him to wait all of four years, I was a sci fi fan at his age already, he's got his rights too! Though perhaps I can work out a few episodes to skip in the TV series, and retell them instead). - Finally, I also posted this query at a Ranka fan's blog and someone (namely kaldar5) DID come up with the things I missed. From his answer: == Ep 24 At 19:43 we see a Cruiser from the Galaxy fleet skimming the Vajira planet ring, heading to the center. These Vajira stay still as if they are paralized or made docile. 19:53 we see the glowy Grace consciousness “Rez in”, the cruiser in the background overhead. 20:00 Glowy Grace gains access to the queen at the center of the Vajira planetary ring. [He explains elsewhere, and is probably right, that when a character is glowing with one colour the events are likely not in the physical space] Seems as if Grace was in this cruiser, projecting her senses and influence outward. Would have been a great time to transfer while everyone was so busy dealing with Holo Ranka & Battle Galaxy and the Vajira doing what comes naturally, being “told” by drugged Ranka to defend against the “enemy” – all of them but the few directly in the area around Grace. Again making it look like Grace can have limited short range control of a few Vajira when they are “Distracted”. Ep 25: 2:52 – We see the queen again, now flanked by a large number of Galaxy YF-27′s *Non-glowy* Grace lowers herself into a Queen eye, she connects. 6:49 Now Grace controls all the Vajira fully. == This gives a rather narrow time frame for transferring Ranka, either shortly before or shortly after Grace installs herself in the Vajra queen head. Problem solved. (I think she was in information overload not drugged, though. One does not need to be drugged when one suddenly finds oneself in the center of an immense "hive mind" network)
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I put "not here to debate that" in for a reason! I'm not interested in which singer is "better" (apples and oranges) and who ends up with Alto (they both have a lot of interestng qualities APART from that particular hime). What I wanted to discuss is that Ranka's character development, as per TV series, is in my view very far from over. It's not about "Sheryl wins"! It won't be over if Ranka ends up in Alto's bed the next day, either, because a handsome man is no replacement for a clear sense of belonging, direction, identity. Ah yes, the ones for whom Brera was apparently special fan service? (Not just for them but NO... not mention the incest fans! I prefer fujoshis to those! As for a bit of yuri, I like that myself - and the idea of yuri is played massively in the movies, starting right in the beginning with Universal Bunny).
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Thanks! I wonder if the game is supposed to be building up the canon story, or is it an entirely fanservice-y (in the wide sense of the word) offshoot? For example, that 11yo Mao - she presumably was put back into her own timeline because, you know, she had to grow up and have a daughter... would her memories of the M30 time trip be erased? More fundamentally, is time travel now possible in the Macross Universe, so Richard Birler could finally get his Minmay? (He did apparently say that the fold network could transcend space and time, but as there was nothing to indicate it really could do time travel, I assumed it was wishful thinking on his part).
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I wonder if plot details of the Macross 30 game are available anywhere. I'm unlikely to get the game itself (no translation available apparently, and I'm not into playing space battles), so spoilers are not a problem, but all I could find was the plot of the first chapter and some squees over the rest. Notably, I'd like to know if the Mao Nome you get there is the 11 year old Mao or the adult Dr.Mao. And if it's the former I do wonder how she reacts to seeing a granddaughter. She'd probably get interested in who the heck the grandfather was?
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Not exactly just a Frontier-thing. This happened before with the movie "Macross: Do You Remember Love" (1984), which significantly changed the story from "Super Dimensional Fortress Macross" (1982). The movie-story-change is possibly yet another deliberate shout-out to the original Macross.
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I have repeatedly watched the last episodes and am failing to understand something. Alto rescued Ranka from Battle Galaxy - but how did Ranka get moved into Battle Galaxy? Finally I sat down and wrote a description, with timings, of all the sequences with Ranka from the moment she ejects from Brera's Valk until Alto sees she is in Battle Galaxy. I still failed to work out when or how she was transferred, as it seems she was in the Vajra Queen at one point (the place where Grace was later tentacle-connected, and yet later killed). Here are my notes and I would ery much appreciate help in understanding when and how that transfer happened. (Perhaps something is known from novels etc?) ep23 13:56 Ranka sees Ai-kun, ejects; before this moment she was in Brera's Valk at all times. Tries to talk to Ai-kun 14:06 Ai-kun's eyes glow red and shortly he grabs her with a tentacle. Ranka screams; Brera cries out "Ranka" - he did NOT expect this. Ranka regains some of her memories as she cries out "Onii-chan" 14:28-14:29 Ranka still held by Ai-kun who is riding, apparently, a bigger Vajra, but of a colour I don't remember. http://hkar.ru/qNXl http://hkar.ru/qNXh . Brera is shown trying to follow in his Valk but pushed away from her by another Vajra and fighting them 14:50 Grace talks to Brera from big humanoid mecha with a green glowing band on "head" at the level of "eyes", probably her own Valk as size is comparable to Brera's. Shortly after 15:00 she says "seems the Vajra have noticed us - how these bugs annoy me" according to the subs I have. This seems to mean she does not control Vajra at the point 15:29 Grace clicks fingers to take control of Brera (after his "controlled now" sequence the anime cuts to Frontier, and we go to next scene with Ranka/Grace/Brera) 17:37 Ranka on screen again, and she apears to be flying with Brera again though it is probably Alto thinking of her flying with Brera, as she onky appears for a few seconds while he looks at a picture of her. 17:50 we see a Vajra thing with red dots (head of the Queen?) and then immediately we see Ranka who looks like she is laid on a web of something. So it appears she was pulled into the Queen? She says "forgive me brother" and gets the key memory - she is singing as a child, Brera playing harmonica, Vajra appear, then battle then she sees her brother in a hatch etc. Back to present Ranka who now says it's all her fault. 18:29 cut to Grace who sees Ranka as if hanging in space, says "we awaited this moment, I hear her, the Little Queen, now we..." and we see a green apparentl fold-network spring into action and expand intoa spiral, then Grace says "it's tjhe moment of truth" and cut to Alto wih Klan. That scene leads to Alto telling Klan he will kill Ranka if she is turned by Vajra into a tool against humanity, with Klan responsing "so this is your love" and Sheryl reacting (wait, both Klan and Sheryl have time for the triange stuff while THIS CRAP is happening? Though they don't know...). Shortly after we see the same planet on Mishima;s screen but no Ranka. Episode ends. Ep24 starts with the attack on the 117th fleet starting with child!Ranka singing then showing Grace burning and cursing Vajra. Then, after a brief appearance of Ozma, child!Brera is seen saying to child!Ranka "don't tell anyone they came for your song" (not exactly very wise but he's how many years old here...) 01:04 today's Ranka in unclear space saying it's her fault. Grace answers that it is correct and proceeds to guilt-trip her - not yet into action, but into "opening up fully" (making the information overload worse, presumably). Cut to Ozma after that, then opening and the SMS searching the old Macross on Galia-4. (Wait, Alto found it was all erased - bt I guess they got better computer tech there and unerased it all) 06:44 we see Ranka again and she is crucified now, held by those rings. She will remain in this pose until freed by Alto. Brera reports to Grace that the analysis of the quantum protocol is nearly complete, then flashback to a burning Grace who says that Ranshe's and Mao's blood will soon start burning them from the inside and people will know Grace was right. (Does not exactly make sense to me). Cut to SMS. 17:10 we get Ranka again, crucified anc clearly not in control of herself though conscious. Grace is guilt-trippoijng Ranka into defending this lovely planet from the invasion. Controlled Brera hekos at 17:27. 18:20 we see Ranka singing to rally the Vajra, and it seems like the giant hologram of her appears but I am not sure 18:38 the giant hologram appears for sure. 20:00 we see Grace flying without a space suit (well she's a cyborg) and right into some sort of Vajra mesh as she is saying "your key is in my hands, the throne is mine, let me in" 20:17 we see the same Vajra thing with red dots as in ep23 17:50; Grace flying towards it. Cut to battle, Alto flying around the big hologram. 20:35 Alto flies throuhg holographic Ranka's eye and sees Brera's Valk or Battle Galaxy? Colour is the same) and aparently realizes Ranka is holographic, followed by Alto being shot by Brera, then Sheryl appears briefly, ALto and Brera fight while having a chat focusing on whether the humans are invaders (a bit close to current politics...). The Meltran (Klan?) joining the fight also joins the debate. The fold network is so like Teh Internets! 21:53 damaged Alto's Valk wkirts arm of holographic Ranka, episode ends shortly ep25 beginning recaps what was at the end of last ep but no new footage of Ranka 0:47 SMS folds in and Ozma immediately lands a strike on Brera breaking his implant. SMS shortly reveals the Galaxy plot. 2:08 Alto says the holographic Ranka is not the real Ranka (I wonder if anyone thought it was the real Ranka grown to THAT size) so tells them to shoot at her 2:23 projection destroyed by Macross cannon strike from Macross quarter, revealing Battle Galaxy. (Intact after a direct hit from the cannon? The holographic projection doubled as an energy barrier that absorbed the hit?) 2:52 we see the Vajra thing with red dots again. 2:59 Grace is inside, discussing being discovered. 3:04 Grace connects to Vajra netwirk with tentacles. Ranka not in sight. Immediately after. Phantoms start shooring from Battle Galaxy. 4:30 "at that moment I heard you" (appparently Alto is also a narrator telling of these events as past". We see crucified Ranka and hear her "Save me". 6:18 we see crucified Ranka again trying to open here eyes 6:34 she succeeds 6:43 Vajra red dotted thing again, Grace inside with web of tentacles in ecstasy, NOW she controls Vajra as shwn by them changing colour 7:56 a voice says the Little Queen is no longer needed 8:30 Ozma fires rockets at the red dotted Vajra thing - rockets consumed by fold barrier. This is followed by a long epic sequence with Vajra and Grace but no Ranka 10:46 we hear Ranka singing as herself, and Alto clearly sees she is inside Battle Galaxy. So the big question - at which point and how, did Ranka get physically transferred from the Vajra Queen into Battle Galaxy?
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Thanks! And now that the Vajra questions landed on this thread - I wonder if it is known why the Vajra have attacked Macross Galaxy. I initially thoguht it was because Grace had o use for Galaxy anymore but it seems that Grace did not have such level of control at the time; she could possibly *attract* the Vajra somewhere by using Sheryl, but Sheryl was elsewhere when the attacks happened.
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There is something I'm failing to understand from both the Frontier TV series and movies - I wonder of the novels or any other supplementary materials explain it. We know that Aimo is a Vajra love song, sung quite rarely. So how did Ranshe Mei and Dr. Mao Nome learn this song? They seem to have done so quite some time before the destruction of their fleet; Ranshe taught it to her children and Mao, at least in the movies, even sent it to her adult daughter on the Galaxy (so she could teach Sheryl). Also in the series we hear from Grace about the Protoculture's reverent attitude to the Vajra. But how would Grace know it? It' not like she talked to the Protoculture? Also, someone on TV tropes notices that Grace was "doing revenge on the Mao line" by doing what she did to Grace. Any idea where they got it from and what the revenge is for?
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The Ranka story in the movies is simply different.She does mature there - but she never has to deal with having consolidated Vajra to kill people on Frontier. My hypothesis (within the Kawamori-suggested logic of "all versions are different reflections of some reality") is that the movies reflect how Ranka and Sheryl tell the story many years later (while the series is Alto's view shortly after what happened - note it starts exactly at the moment Alto got involved). Ranka does not want the pain of that part and airbrushes it out. Sheryl, on her part, airbrushes her total breakdown out.... on the other hand, the entire prison thing probably happened, it's just that Alto had reasons not to mention it. "You nearly got your ass kicked, people - oh and your top-security prison is a piece of cake to get out of" might have been too much!
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In Frontier TV Series, is Richard Bilrer's exact part in the Mishima plot and O'Connor network known? He does supply information and fold crystal to them but is he somehow a part ofthe network? When O'Connor claims power over the galaxy there are a few other voices heard but I could not make out if they include Bilrer.
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I wonder if I'm the only one to feel that Ranka's story at the end of the TV series is far from complete. Alto and Sheryl are both adults and we have learned much about them including family traditions and we know their ultimate choices in their fate. Well, except the triangle part - one can reference the movies for that one though. In any event, at least apart from love life, each of them clearly knows who he/she is and what he/she wants and lives for. Ranka has just spent something like 8 episodes being heavily pounded and surviving against all odds - and her emotional life in that period clearly was not her own. By the time she decided to confess to Alto, she was getting emotional feedback from a big Vajra network - of which some members were being killed around her. And she did not know about the feedback. The feelings raging within her were not of her own origin and quite out of her control - all she could do was direct them at Alto (and possibly to a degree Sheryl, depending on how one reads some clues). As this sort of feedback was gradually erasing her, Grace guilt-tripped her and we know what happened. Yes, she fought her way out of it heroically, and now the Vajra are gone. Ranka is left with: - A drained emotional life that was driven by forces external to herself, and to humanity, for whatever number of weeks, and she just started to take it back ("I will not stop singing nor loving" is a start, but only a start). - A double-whammy feeling of guilt - not only does she feel responsible for the destruction of the 117th fleet but now she was a tool that nearly wiped out humanity and got a lot of pilots killed (and she probably knew some of those killed, by sheer demographic) - On the plus side, some very good friends (Sheryl doubles as a mentor), an excellent track to a galactic singing career (they'll be shortly making a quartz fold drive, too, so she can have a gigs on Earth and around colonies easily), and a manager to match. Oh, and a real brother who can kick a lot of ass. These, however, are all things somewhat external to herself and not resolving the great deal of internal turmoil she is still facing. And all we know of her background is a brief glimpse of her mother... The movies sidestep the issues instead of resolving them. In the movies she never "changed sides", instead she had a "take me ant leave Frontier alone" moment. So in the movies she does not face massive guilt, and she can identify fully with the people of Frontier even when she loses Alto and sees Sheryl in a coma - giving her a clear sense of identity and direction. That's clearly a different story (perhaps the movies are the story as told by the two singers quite a few years after the fact? it also leaves very little rivalry in there and has them as BFFs from first sight - consistent with them telling it after many years of being BFFs). So on the series Ranka... I actually think Alto belongs with Sheryl (not here to debate that) but at the same time would want 10 more episodes of Ranka, to see her actually finding the real herself after all she went through, and perhaps discovering more of her background in the process. Guess this makes me a bad Sheryl fan AND a bad Ranka fan... but seriously - I wonder if this ground has already been covered elsewhere in the fandom, it's been 6 years after all.
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Once upon a time there was a totally awesome video of May'n pefrorming Diamond Crevasse live without, or nearly without, the music - her acting really shone there. And now I can't find it even though at that time I commented on YouTube I apparently forgot to "like" and old comments can't be searched. Would anyone please pooint me tothe video? Thanks!
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Some of the later Macross Frontier TV episodes have a living singing woman in the ending. She is showm as little more than a silhouette. Who is she - May'N?
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http://www.slashgear.com/nasa-unveils-valkyrie-robot-for-darpa-robotics-challenge-11308358/ I wonder if the one who came up with the name is reading this forum, or should I look for then on robotech.com ?
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The Korean situation you describe, from what i could google on it, appears to be propaganda. THAT is very old (used in World War II for sure, then in the Cold War). But directly using music to scare and disorganize the enemy in a battle situation, Episode 27 style, seems to be much more rare.
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Well, Alto has absconded with the Vajra queen in the movieverse, at least. That after apparently making a choice... And yes, on some thought, it does mean he escapes the consequences (as in living with a Tsundere).
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Wow. The Disney takeover described back in 2007.
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Robotech was on Russian TV in the late 80s when I was in school - I never liked it, though. My interest in Macross was aroused in 2011 by Vocalod Gumi (therefore Frontier), watched an episode or two and reas some online stuff back then. And thius year a friend roped me into a Robotech and Macross team for a fan fiction contest. For that, I went and watched SDFM, DYRL, Frontier movies, Plus, started but failed to complete Zero, and finally started Frontier TV. And apart from Zero, never regretted it. (I don't like Zero at all, it seems extremely contrived). And joined this site too. I just like doing my stuff properly if I do it at all, and I wanted to go with the original, too.
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Up to now, the main thing from the Macross series to be defictionalized was, as far as I understand, Vocaloid (especially in concert - the holographic concerts were probably inspired by Macross Plus). But now, it looks like someone is using a pop star in battle.In real life. Not sure they even watched Macross (or Robotech), but the approach seems to be the very same (though they use recordings, so is this the Macross II "Minmay attack"?). http://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/oct/29/britney-spears-navy-scare-somali-pirates === Britney Spears has emerged as an unlikely figurehead in the fight against Somali pirates. According to reports, Britney's hits, including Oops! I Did It Again and Baby One More Time, are being employed by British naval officers in an attempt to scare off pirates along the east coast of Africa. Perhaps nothing else not guns, not harpoons is quite as intimidating as the sound of Ms Spears singing "Ooh baby baby!" Merchant naval officer Rachel Owens explained the tactics to Metro: "Her songs were chosen by the security team because they thought the pirates would hate them most. These guys can't stand western culture or music, making Britney's hits perfect. As soon as the pirates get a blast of Britney, they move on as quickly as they can." == I can just imagine pirates angrily spitting out "deculchaa"...
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In SDFM, the Breetai fleet has an advisor/archivist, Exedol Folmo. Does the Lap Lamiz fleet have a similar character, perhaps unnamed? I don't remember seeing such a lady, but I might have failed to notice. and one fan art at http://danbooru.donmai.us/posts/507752 does feature her (as well as some other named Zentradi I fail to recognize).
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Thanks for the sisters!
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Where can I find pictures and bios of the seven Jenius daughters, and who of them can be seen where in anime? I know of child Komilia Maria in SDFM, Mylene Flare in 7, i think there is Emilia in 7 movie? and a historical thread also mentions a family picture in or from Dynamite? Thanks!
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Question from 8 year old viewer - "wait, the Macross main cannon used to destroy entire Zentradi ships - now it shoots at Kamjin and his ship still flies?" I had to make up an answer - that the cannon is likely less effective when used in atmosphere. I guess the real answer is "it's a TV cartoon episode hastily scripted after an extension"? Or did the cannon shot actually miss?
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VF25-F - thanks for working this out. I'm not sure if I can make it (some personal stuff arose) but if I do, I'mm make sure to follow your directions
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...OK I'll be honest - I'm jealous of those who can make it there. Tezuka and Macross all in one place.