Pervataru Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 (edited) Have not seen the original Macross yet, but do the male and female giants fight like that in the series too? Also why are the alerts in english? Edited March 4, 2006 by Pervataru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 Have not seen the original Macross yet, but do the male and female giants fight like that in the series too? No. While sexually segregarted, the zentradi in teh series are coworkers, not archnemesises... nemeses... whatever. Also why are the alerts in english? Because no matter where you are, english is the language of choice for aviation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowe Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 IMO, the segregation of the male/female zentradi was the cleverest twist in DYRL, it works on so many levels. Because no matter where you are, english is the language of choice for aviation. 376375[/snapback] Funny, I never interpreted it that way before, I just assumed it was the usual Japanese antics for creeping in foreign language whenever they possibly can (and it does sound kind of cool). Now that you mentioned it, it made sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf-1 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 IMO, the segregation of the male/female zentradi was the cleverest twist in DYRL, it works on so many levels. 376396[/snapback] I was soo confused when I finally saw the series after seeing only Dyrl many, many times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 So. Now that you've seen DYRL does it like, rock, or what? Onward to 'Plus my young apprentice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skullsixx Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 To this day I still use DYRL as the animation measuring stick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowe Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 Skullsixx, I'm with you there. DYRL still kick butts when compared to alot of the CG enhanced stuff now days. To this day I still use DYRL as the animation measuring stick! 376470[/snapback] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf-1 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 Skullsixx, I'm with you there. DYRL still kick butts when compared to alot of the CG enhanced stuff now days.To this day I still use DYRL as the animation measuring stick! 376470[/snapback] 376471[/snapback] Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pervataru Posted March 4, 2006 Author Share Posted March 4, 2006 Ok haveing just finish seeing DYRL, oh fuc* that is bleak, I have zero on the way just waiting. Over all I liked it but the yahoo add was a little odd. A very diffrent look at Macross for someone that has only seen the Americanized versions, The real Macross still to come. BTW Thank Gawd Hikuaru got his head out of his fourth point of contact and hooked up with the hot Leuy. nothing like being with a women you have to Salute in the morning. Lastly who else thought this: the lost Protoculture city = Atlantise? I'm sure that there was whole threads argueing both for and against this when the movie first came out, all I'm asking for is a show of hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 You've seen DYRL the concise, straight to the point and beautifully stylized version of the Macross story; watching the t.v. series would be redundant and a step backward from a technical/visual perspective. Your Macross introduction would flow much easier and beautifully with a follow up by the equally stunning 'Plus. Oh, and make that the movie version, as the ending is far more satisfying than the OVA's handling of "final events..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf-1 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 (edited) Oh, and make that the movie version, as the ending is far more satisfying than the OVA's handling of "final events..." 376497[/snapback] So, I have only the OVA of plus, I take it I should really get the movie edition. I've read before too that it's better. Basically it was quite a surprise to me that there would be so noticeable difference. Edited March 4, 2006 by Sdf-1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted March 4, 2006 Share Posted March 4, 2006 Lastly who else thought this: the lost Protoculture city = Atlantise? I'm sure that there was whole threads argueing both for and against this when the movie first came out, all I'm asking for is a show of hands. May've been a minimal amount of usenet quibbling, but the online world was massively diffrent back then(and lots smaller).You've seen DYRL the concise, straight to the point and beautifully stylized version of the Macross story; watching the t.v. series would be redundant and a step backward from a technical/visual perspective. Your Macross introduction would flow much easier and beautifully with a follow up by the equally stunning 'Plus. Oh, and make that the movie version, as the ending is far more satisfying than the OVA's handling of "final events..." I disagree with your point of view on the TV series. The TV series is vastly superior in terms of writing. Agreed with teh movie version of Plus, though. Oh, and make that the movie version, as the ending is far more satisfying than the OVA's handling of "final events..." 376497[/snapback] So, I have only the OVA of plus, I take it I should really get the movie edition. I've read before too that it's better. Basically it was quite a surprise to me that there would be so noticeable difference. Yah. There's a lot less suspension of disbelief in-between the beginning and the end(most notably the bullshit "I stuck live ammo into his gun so he'd throw it away and start punching me and I could steal his gun, then shoot him and frame him for attempted murder all at once" segment is gone), and the YF-21 VS Ghost fight is light-years ahead of the OVA version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket Punch Posted March 5, 2006 Share Posted March 5, 2006 You've seen DYRL the concise, straight to the point and beautifully stylized version of the Macross story; watching the t.v. series would be redundant and a step backward from a technical/visual perspective. Your Macross introduction would flow much easier and beautifully with a follow up by the equally stunning 'Plus. Oh, and make that the movie version, as the ending is far more satisfying than the OVA's handling of "final events..." 376497[/snapback] I'm gonna have to disagree with you on both points. In terms of character and plot development the TV series is superior to the movie (probably because they had 24 hours of extra running time to work with). Personally, I never watched any of the Macross titles because I was looking for some eye-candy; I watched it purely because I wanted to be entertained by great storytelling. The original Macross TV series is the greatest Space Opera ever written. EVER. Granted back in the 80's it was some of the coolest animation I had ever seen, but being a little (okay, a lot) older and a lot (okay, a little) wiser, it's the story that still has me addicted. I had no problem with the Macross Plus OVA's ending, although I can understand why some people would. I suppose it's just like how some people didn't like Cowboy Bebop because most of it's episodes were stand-alone stories that didn't follow or resolve any major storyline. BTW, hi! I'm Rocket Punch and I'm an alcoholic! SPOILER ALERT!!!!!! Guld's death scene in the Movie was a lot better than in the OVA, though. Plus you got to see Lucy's ladybags! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1/1 LowViz Lurker Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 (edited) I would have to agree with people who are fans of the tv series. TV series is a more realistic telling of events, and you get a good variety of different mecha shown and used in the context of what the episode is about. For example to see hikaru use the gerwalk to rescue misa and minmay. To see the fighter used for dogfights, and to see the battroid mode as an emergency mode to transform in when crashing into buildings (because robot mode is the most robust), to see the GBP armor as a more heavily armed and amored addon to boost the ability of the existing valkyrie, and finally to see the FAST Pack armor transform the vf1 into super version of itself, ....all highlights to the viewer the versatility and reasons behind the modular transformation of these machines. You just don't get that in the movie version. For example the SDF1 having it's fold drive disapear, and the need to move into attack mode to fire the cannon all makes sense when you see these events and a whole episode can show them. The movie just skips all these little details which adds up in the end, and to fans who have seen the series already, the movie kinda feels almost like a music video. There are however other things in the movie which were handled much better: when you see them fly in formation and use fighter for long distance to shoot the missiles, then go into gerwak to brake and reduce speed, and then battroid mode for close combat: I like that about the opening scene because it summarises the advantages in having a 3 mode vehicle. DYRL has much more emotion and soul put into to it, of course. But there is just so much cool stuff about the tv series that you have to see if you want the complete picture. (ie how zentradi gradually struggle with thier warrior instinct vs thier human emotions which brings them closer to who they were originally as opposed to what they were genetically grown for.) It gives us the story from many different angles and through the eyes of many different characters, not just looking at the love triangle only. As for plus, that is the top gun of macross. How can you not like it? The mecha fighting alone make it worth seeing even if you hate the story. Oh and BTW if you want to get the most out of +, please watch both the movie version and OVA. I just can't resist not wanting to see the opening scene where the vf11 fight the zentradi. Fans of the VF11 should watch the bit where the bayonet is used to gut the zentradi mecha because the gunpod jammed. hehe Guld probably tampered with it before hand! Too bad it got such poor treatment in macross 7. I would trade a scene of lucy's tits for more vf11 action anyday. Edited March 6, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 I would trade a scene of lucy's tits for more vf11 action anyday. 377065[/snapback] But removing nekkid Lucy caused continuity problems! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowe Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Hey, hands of my property, you have your opening action sequence, don't be greedy!! I would trade a scene of lucy's tits for more vf11 action anyday. 377065[/snapback] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurin Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 Over all I liked it but the yahoo add was a little odd. 376487[/snapback] Yahoo ad? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 (edited) I'm gonna have to disagree with you on both points. In terms of character and plot development the TV series is superior to the movie (probably because they had 24 hours of extra running time to work with). You're right. I should have stated as a disclaimer that I don't put any stock in animated character development because, well, they're cartoons, which is why I've always prefered movie versions of anime stories than their televised, OVA releases. Could you imagine if Independence Day was a 30 episode or so series? "Yawn" Give me the story short and quick 'cause it's bloody fiction, not historical analysis. Besides, I have ADD and can't sit through that stuff anyway. Also, my idea was to get the newbie up to speed as quickly as possible, and what better way to do that than to watch the DYRL and 'PLUS movies... As for trading sights on Lucy's womanhood for VF-11 action, did you just finish watching Brokeback Mountain or something? Just kidding. Actually I agree with that too. It pained me to see that stuff cut from the movie version. I had always contended that the final version should have contained the extra action footage of the OVA, while including the tweaks of the movie version and.......Lucy's breasts, but alas. Oh and don't worry Mowe, Lucy's the type of girl that has plenty of action to go around... Edited March 7, 2006 by myk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 Also, my idea was to get the newbie up to speed as quickly as possible, and what better way to do that than to watch the DYRL and 'PLUS movies... DYRL by itself typically leaves a newbie with more questions than answers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 Shh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf-1 Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 (edited) Also, my idea was to get the newbie up to speed as quickly as possible, and what better way to do that than to watch the DYRL and 'PLUS movies... DYRL by itself typically leaves a newbie with more questions than answers. 377382[/snapback] But it's not necessarily a bad thing. For me, it was finally awesome to see the series after seeing dyrl countless times. There's only that one thing, the series can be a little disappointing at first if you are a dyrl-only fan before, but I got used to it soon, and love the series too. It's just sooo different version of the thing. Actually, I had hopes it would tell the story before dyrl, before I knew it was another arrangement of the same thing. But, yes it answered many questions, but not always in the way I had wished. Anyway, IMO, if you really like dyrl, at some point you will want to see the series before it. Those two are the most important Macross releases ever, then propably Plus would be good. That's the order I saw them anyway. Edited March 7, 2006 by Sdf-1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 (edited) Well I'm a shallow person, a proud member of the Jerry Bruckheimer school of thought, so I'm all about slick presentation, needlessly displayed freckled breasts and something under 2.35 hours; hence, my love for the movie versions. I do agree with that suggestion however, going back and watching the television series to "flesh out" the Macross story... Edited March 7, 2006 by myk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB0 Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 Well I'm a shallow person, a proud member of the Jerry Bruckheimer school of thought, so I'm all about slick presentation, needlessly displayed freckled breasts and something under 2.35 hours; hence, my love for the movie versions. I do agree with that suggestion however, going back and watching the television series to "flesh out" the Macross story... 377388[/snapback] Nothing wrong with any of those 3 goals. DYRL IS a good movie, don't get me wrong. It just has a few holes because they expected TV series knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1/1 LowViz Lurker Posted March 8, 2006 Share Posted March 8, 2006 (edited) I think noobs might want to know who kamjin is though. And they might want to see battles on earth and on the ground and see regult and glaug get some action. Then when the Qrau finally makes its debut and Milia kicks butt for the first time the sense of awe at seeing something new is there. Tv series are great for 'building up' a character or introducing us to them in a more dramatic fashion then what you might get in the movie which is time limited. Sometimes you want to know "how" something was achieved and the little details might be interesting to know. (like what was hikaru's feelings when he first discovered these mysterious aliens and how the planes could transform? Was his real motivation for becoming a fighter pilot just to rescue the girl and impress, or duty to helping mankind survive? Seeing the gradual changes in his attitude is possible when each episode is more slowly paced) Although people like the more mature versions of the character in the movie it is nice to know you are along for the ride in a tv series and know what is in the character's heads and stuff. In the movie Max suddenly appears in a Qrau and it is not explained what led him to be with the zentradi all of a sudden. Just seems kinda added in because we know those two hook up from what we've seen before. But to somebody who didn't see the series it would just seem out of place and hard to believe. Edited March 8, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radd Posted March 8, 2006 Share Posted March 8, 2006 Strangely, I've only ever heard people who've seen the tv series first say that they feel the movie is full of holes that would leave a new fan clueless. I know a few people who's first introduction to Macross was 'DYRL?', and they didn't experience any of the confusion a lot of people seem to expect they would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1/1 LowViz Lurker Posted March 8, 2006 Share Posted March 8, 2006 (edited) Well just then somebody made a comment in a thread about how max killed milia in DYRL when he didn't. It's just that it was so brief they didn't have time to think about it in depth (like a few seconds showing a blue QRau, and a scene where max comments on how beutiful the alien looks), whereas in the series more time is dedicated to them episode by episode. I was just watching RahXephon the movie the other day and even though it only goes for 2 hours I couldn't connect as much to each character as I would have in the tv series. It just felt like a montage of everything seen in the series. Jumping from one event to another to cram as much as possible in as short a space they can. The slower pace is good for those moments where you wnat to get to know the character in depth. What they are thinking, how they are reacting and changing thier attitude slowly about things like war, seeing the character get married etc and like you are there with them as they live thier life. (like the godfather trilogy or something ) Although not required, it really helps to flesh out the backstory and explain HOW things came to be. for eg: the sdf1 transforming into a giant humanoid robot for accidental purposes in the tv series. But how in the movie you just witness it happen and left to guess. A fan should be asking "Why the hell does this have to happen, when it would endanger the onboard civilians and crush thier skulls and have thier heads chopped off? Seems stupid." But the series explains that little detail and makes the SDF1 seem all the more interesting. Personally I think the SDF1 is more heroic in the tv series because of the way it fights: using the deadalus manuever to punch holes into things, smashing its body into the hulls and releasing missiles and then creating a force field to protect itself, being told it must go back out into space to fight to draw enemy fire; thrown out to the wolves by the UNG whilst not being able to unload the civilians onboard who have no business being on the ship to begin with etc Although it may not be required to understand the basic idea of the series, it gives people a point of reference when they are given the full story from the very start of the war as opposed to chucking us right into space halfway through thier 1 year journey. Some questions like: "Why doesn't earth have other ships like the SDF1 to help fight the aliens? Where is UN SPACY's space fleet?" should be asked. I know I would be asking this question. But the tv series shows that the SDF1 is earth's 'first of its kind' and that the alien tech is still experimental to them, with humans only half understanding how the actual things inside the ship work. We get this indication that humans are only just starting out and technology like the Valk is still kinda new. Tv series covers all the small stuff the geek wants to know. It also helps boost the atmosphere a little too. (ie that the insignificant character is a small part of a bigger whole) Edited March 8, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginrai Posted March 8, 2006 Share Posted March 8, 2006 DYRL doesn't even explain that the SDF-1 is an alien ship, now does it? It doesn't explain why the aliens are attacking Earth, it doesn't explain how Earth got nuked... it doesn't explain a lot of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansubs2000 Posted March 8, 2006 Share Posted March 8, 2006 DYRL doesn't even explain that the SDF-1 is an alien ship, now does it? It doesn't explain why the aliens are attacking Earth, it doesn't explain how Earth got nuked... it doesn't explain a lot of things. 378231[/snapback] Yeah it doesn't even explain why Roy constantly gets away with DUI. Wait I mean "FUI". Hikaru! Friends don't let friends fly drunk! Sadly, it was too late. Bye bye skull leader..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big F Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 I love both the T.V series and DYRL. nuff said on that. On the flip side though I never paid it any mind that the OVA and Movie versions were different. I now need to add another DVD to my collection. The movie version of Plus. I must have all the versions and now my needs count is up to two again. Oh well (wallet just walked out) never mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1/1 LowViz Lurker Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 (edited) DYRL doesn't even explain that the SDF-1 is an alien ship, now does it? It doesn't explain why the aliens are attacking Earth, it doesn't explain how Earth got nuked... it doesn't explain a lot of things. Which is why watching the tv series will be a more enriching experience storywise. People might want to know what started the war.. People might want to know why the ship has to change into a fricken giant robot just to fire a gun because it involves killing people to do so! People might want to know what happened to max. They could have added some extra scenes showing him becoming attached to the giant alien girl so it is clear to the audience why he is fighitng alongside them in an alien mecha. Rather than a few seconds. The argument that just because you don't need the details to enjoy the movie means therefore you are not missing out on much by ignoring the tv series is silly. Yes I admit you can watch the movie without that much confusion, but those details make the characters smaller and the world around them bigger. (like there is important stuff happening in the background beyond the love triangle of the three main characters - weddings, how characters deal with death, propaganda, being betrayed and used as a shield, racism, the use of different battle tactics depending on the environment they fight in, flashbacks that help flesh out who the characters are and thier relationships to each other etc) For example the Byebye mars ep really softened up misa's image up a lot and made her less bitchy, and her opening up and revealing why she is in the military (because she comes from a family with military background so the pressure to live up to her dad is there) made us see her less as a cold manhater. Pressure from dad = obsession with the sdf1 which the bridge bunnies make fun of her for. (knowing the reasons for why is important in getting us to like her more) Her former BF dying on mars = she does like men after all. (knowing this lets us see she is just an ordinary person like the other bridge bunnies, and gives a reason for her behaviour. ie maybe she was holding onto the hope that she would have a life with this person in future and now she had no reason to live after he was dead. The movie doesn't explain that this flame is alive or dead) Mention of Anti UN = there are bad guys other than the aliens. (the reason this is important is it shows that humans can be just as warlike as the bad guy aliens in the story. If we want to get philosophical about it, a zentradi can say that we are no different from them but with weaker and crappier weapons and less opportunity to kill other aliens on other planets. The evil is inside man as much as the zentradi, since if we were so perfect we wouldn't have wars) Movie is great for action. Tv is like being a fly on the wall and spying on the characters to get a more 3d view of them. It also had a much better ending: knowing that the aliens would one day come back and could attack again and that we would need to leave it; and that this victory over them is the tip of the iceberg, is a more realistic expectation than the sappy one in the movie about an how an ancient britney spears type pop song awoke a dormant memory that suddenly made them all into pacifists. (ie this effect wore off in the tv series showing there were some people in the world who just can't be pacified and should be killed to protect others) Edited March 10, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 DYRL doesn't even explain that the SDF-1 is an alien ship, now does it? It doesn't explain why the aliens are attacking Earth, it doesn't explain how Earth got nuked... it doesn't explain a lot of things. 378231[/snapback] I don't see why we have to have that explanation at all. A malignant, alien force has come in great numbers to besiege the Earth. It doesn't matter if our lead spaceship is an import or a domestic. And since when does a malignant, alien warrior force need a reason to attack a planet? Finally, in DYRL Earth was mentioned to have been bombarded by the attacking fleet sometime during the SDF-1's narrow escape. DYRL is the abridged and slightly modified version of the television series and isn't meant to replace it. Alot of questions and issues get left out when you only have 2 hours to tell your tale. Ultimately, this comes down to personal preference. I like the look, feel and pace of DYRL. It's got so much style it KILLS me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf-1 Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 (edited) Explanations are for wimps. Seriously, I really hate when viewers are underestimated and every single thing is been explained like to a child. It doesn't hurt to leave something to be thinked about. Good Japanese anime is many times made that way. If dyrl had explained everything, I doubt it would've made such an impression on me. Edited March 10, 2006 by Sdf-1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowe Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 I never treated the TV and Movie as two different things. I always thought the Movie is just an alternative extension to the TV series. I just assumed the movie picked up from the TV (after Captain Global f***ed up the space fold). If you think of it that way, there ain't much explanation is required. I really liked DYRL and I think it is the most cunning adaptation and complete storyline ever written for an anime movie with immaculate attention to details. (Bty, excuse my language above, but every time I see Global’s face after that space fold, I always think: if swearing is permitted on television, I swear that is what Global would’ve said) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sdf-1 Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 (edited) if swearing is permitted on television, I swear that is what Global would’ve said) 378896[/snapback] Isn't it? No cencorship over here. Well not that kind at least. Am I right but in the US it is allowed only on cable pay-tv? Edit: Oh, you are from Australia I noticed. Edited March 10, 2006 by Sdf-1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfunk Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 eh, for me TV series=loved story and plot fold out animation for the time was very good DYRL=Loved in a diferent way, story was pretty good but you need to see the series IMO to apreciate,,,and the animation was excelent and for me plus was an awesom continuation in the Macross story not to mention the great animation,,,,Oh, I dont need to see boobs in my anime to enjoy it, I prefer the OVA in plus, cept for the end, thats it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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