The MW Automotive Thread

[areaseven]

I'm liking this... it looks like the Civic Si is returning to its former glory

(200hp 16valve DOHC!)

http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshow/artic...08/page014.html

http://www.hondanews.com/CatID2001?mid=200...037548&mime=asc

Wow...what will make of the Acura RSX when that comes out? That new Civic looks sleek, though it looks too much like a Scion tC.

[Viceland]

I've seen that magazine.  They always print pictures of cars and what they think they will look like, not what manufactures have actually released.  About 3 or 4 years ago, they printed pictures of the all-new 3.5 litre V8 2003 NSX, and here it is 2005 and it still looks the same as in 2002.

Well, what they might "think" might as well "be", look at how similar that Impreza is to what Subaru recently vomited...

Behold, the new Subaru B9 Tribeca!!! :puke: :puke: :puke:

Edited February 21, 2005 by Viceland

[yellowlightman]

Owning 3 maintenance and gas hungry muscle cars is getting kinda' old. I'm actually considering selling all three and getting a newer car that could replace all 3 of them, at least in performance...What do you guys think, an '02 or newer Cobra or something?

Not sure what your budget is, but definately check out the new Pontiac GTO. Could care less what people say about it, it's a damn good car and thanks to the fact that they're not selling so great, they're discounting them heavily. I've seen them get into the $25k range.

At my dealership's Christmas party our GM rep showed us his new company car, an new GTO. Looks boring as hell on the outside, but the interior is great (leaps and bounds above the usual American car interior) and the nifty backseats were very cool. Not to mention it's a screamer.

We were talking about it not selling so well and he told me "Giving this car to a Pontiac dealership is like giving a super model to a 90-year old man. He can look at it, and he knows it's pretty, but damned if he knows what the hell to do with it."

[areaseven]

Not sure what your budget is, but definitely check out the new Pontiac GTO. Could care less what people say about it, it's a damn good car and thanks to the fact that they're not selling so great, they're discounting them heavily. I've seen them get into the $25k range.

Pontiac's actually discounting them by that much? As good as the GTO is, it's not a true American Muscle car (the only thing "American" about it is the Corvette engine it's equipped with).

My recommendations would be either the Ford Mustang GT or the Chrysler 300C Hemi.

[yellowlightman]

Pontiac's actually discounting them by that much? As good as the GTO is, it's not a true American Muscle car (the only thing "American" about it is the Corvette engine it's equipped with).

GM is not ashamed to throw big rebates at cars that don't sell. I remember Suburbans having something insane, like $8k in rebates last year. Although part of it is that American cars generally have a highe rprofit margin on them for the dealership, opposed to Japanese cars.

I agree it's a funky car, and I don't think they should have called it the GTO. Not to mention the fact that it looks like a glorified Cavalier, but it's still a damn good car.

No opinion on the 300C Hemi, but I think I'd go for the GTO over the Mustang GT. The Mustang has the looks, but the handling is trash and has a solid-rear. The interior of the GT is nice, but I think the retro look would get tiring after a while. With the GTO redesign this year, I think the GTO is also firmly ahead of the Mustang in terms of performance as well.

Not to mention everyone and their Grandma is going to be driving a new Mustang, the GTO is a bit more unique.

[reddsun1]

We seem to have at least a few muscle-car drivers on MW, but I don't know who owns what...so what do we (or have we) driven as far as muscle cars/pony cars (for those that draw a distinction) go?

I've driven the new GTO as well; I'll admit it's a real hoot. Able to annihilate the rear meats with ease, and plenty of grunt to pull you back in the seat when you plant your right foot. I got on the highway and saw speeds well in excess of 55 (but only very briefly, and not in traffic like a di-khead or anything), and hardly needed 5th gear--never even needed to bother with 6th. The styling's a little "blah" but not too hard on the eyes; if you see a pic of the new "GTO" and an old HQ Monaro, you can actually see the evolution of the original's lines. The interior feels a little cheap and plasticy (hey, Pontiac had to contribute something, I guess), but it's comfortable enough. If I were in the market for a new car, I think I'd be weighing a GTO against a new Mustang, just for the distinct sounds, torquey power, and "sh-ts-and-giggles" factor that V8 power can provide.

Other "muscle cars" I've driven? Well, there's my XB--making about 310-320hp now; but when I'm done with it, it'll crank out about 425...I figure that's plenty for a street car (that's MORE than enough to get you in trouble, if you don't respect what you've got under your right foot, I say), and it won't be completely embarrassed by a newer car, say a C5 Corvette or something. I figure, when the 5-speed goes in, if it gets anywhere near 20mpg, then I'll be happy--hell it gets about 15mpg now with the 3-speed.

Edited February 21, 2005 by reddsun1

[reddsun1]

If you missed the Daytona 500, you didn't miss anything. As a matter of fact, I'll call it "The Nextel Cup Series of Unfortunate Events." One of which is the Coke commercial reported earlier. Here's a lowdown of the commercial:

Daytona, schmay-tona--I'm looking forward to Sebring myself. This ought to be an exciting year for road racing fans:

--Aston Martin: returning to "big time" racing with the highly anticipated DB9R

--Chevy: debut of the new racing version of the C6 'Vette, will Chevy be able to continue their domination of GT racing in the ALMS? Also, the C5 hasn't been put out to pasture yet; will the C5R maintain it's competitive edge in the hands of privateers?

--Lamborghini: having a season of sorting/growing behind it, the Lambo is surely expected to move closer to the front of the pack

--Ferrari: the already wicked-fast 550 Maranellos will be supplanted by the even more brutish 575's; will they knock Chevy off the top of the tin-top racing heap? Will the 360 Modena be upgraded on the track as well as in the showrooms? Will they bring more of a challenge to the stalwart Porsches?

--Bugatti: the "ringer" MC12 that's causing a stir across the pond has been approved for ALMS competition; will it turn sports car racing on its ear here in the US too?

--Pontiac: joining the fray with the GTO-R; but I'm perplexed and a little frustrated with Pratt and Miller/GM--I guess these guys just like doing things the hard way. They're throwing the baby out with the water, and starting over from scratch with the GTO. Hello, anybody even bother to call the boys at GM Holden? Don't you guys share info/resources? They've already made a proven winner out of the Monaro (albeit, with a "ringer" packing a honking 427c.i. stroker, like that of the 'Vette C5R)....obviously, they're determined to follow the whole "NASCAR-izing" formula to a tee with this, and with the Rolex series...

I think this could very well be looked back upon as another "golden age" in racing--arguably, of course. The diversity of competition seems to be improving, and the cars are pretty exciting.

Edited February 21, 2005 by reddsun1

[yellowlightman]

One of my best friends is a HUGE DB9 fan and can't wait to the see the DB9R in action-- we're plannong on going to the San Jose race later this year, which should be awesome.

Looking forward to this year's F1 season, as I'm curious to see if the rule changes will bring about any change in the heirarchy there. The FIA seems to be desperately trying to get someone ahead of Schumacher.

Makes me wish we had real racing on TV, only chance to see F1 or World Rally Championship is on the SPEED channel at weird hours. But NASCAR runs on so many channels so damn often, not fair I tell ya.

[ComicKaze]

The new Subarus are designed by a European guy. Same guy who styled for Renault or something.

Ahhh, that explains it.

It's not attractive, but then again... no Subaru's really are. You don't buy Subaru's for looks.

Just for the record, the old Impreza WRC car's cosmetics were designed by the designer of the McLaren F1, and those changes and other things like front and rear spoiler designed by him also were integrated in the production P1.

That said, I'm a Mitsubishi fan and I hate what they've done to the Evo.

[Agent ONE]

Good lord, that Chrysler is hideous. Looks like a bastard child of the gorgeous Aston Martin DB9 and the rather grotesque Z4.

HAHA! I love that thing!

If they make it, I will definately ditch my M3 for it.

[Jemstone]

If you missed the Daytona 500, you didn't miss anything. As a matter of fact, I'll call it "The Nextel Cup Series of Unfortunate Events."

So sad. So true.....

[areaseven]

HAHA! I love that thing!

If they make it, I will definitely ditch my M3 for it.

That would rather be a tough call. Because dude, why give up one of the best-handling cars in the world for something that's faster, yet possibly not as good on the corners?

[Agent ONE]

HAHA!  I love that thing!

If they make it, I will definitely ditch my M3 for it.

That would rather be a tough call. Because dude, why give up one of the best-handling cars in the world for something that's faster, yet possibly not as good on the corners?

Well, I need a new car. I love my 99M3 but I think the current one looks like a bloated Jeta.

[Lightning]

HAHA!  I love that thing!

If they make it, I will definitely ditch my M3 for it.

That would rather be a tough call. Because dude, why give up one of the best-handling cars in the world for something that's faster, yet possibly not as good on the corners?

Well, I need a new car. I love my 99M3 but I think the current one looks like a bloated Jeta.

you could always go for that Aston Martin Vanquish that you were tellin me about...

[Agent ONE]

HAHA!  I love that thing!

If they make it, I will definitely ditch my M3 for it.

That would rather be a tough call. Because dude, why give up one of the best-handling cars in the world for something that's faster, yet possibly not as good on the corners?

Well, I need a new car. I love my 99M3 but I think the current one looks like a bloated Jeta.

you could always go for that Aston Martin Vanquish that you were tellin me about...

That car isn't intended to be driven. It is intended to sit in someone's private showroom and looked at. Not my style.

[Lightning]

All cars are meant to be driven, otherwise they would not have been created.

[Agent ONE]

No man.. If you put more than 1k miles a year on any exotic you screw the value.

[Agent ONE]

No man.. If you put more than 1k miles a year on any exotic you screw the value.

Besides, its not like you can drive it to the grocery store. You'd be inside for 20 seconds before some jealous a-hole keyed it. I had a buddy with a Testarosa he used as a daily driver. Thing got keyed once a week at least.

[peter]

No man..  If you put more than 1k miles a year on any exotic you screw the value.

Besides, its not like you can drive it to the grocery store. You'd be inside for 20 seconds before some jealous a-hole keyed it. I had a buddy with a Testarosa he used as a daily driver. Thing got keyed once a week at least.

If I had a Vanquish, I'd drive it anytime it's sunny. Who cares about value if you never plan to sell it? The money's gone anyway.

And about getting your car keyed, I think it really depends on where you live and what kind of places you park it.

[Agent ONE]

No man..  If you put more than 1k miles a year on any exotic you screw the value.

Besides, its not like you can drive it to the grocery store. You'd be inside for 20 seconds before some jealous a-hole keyed it. I had a buddy with a Testarosa he used as a daily driver. Thing got keyed once a week at least.

If I had a Vanquish, I'd drive it anytime it's sunny. Who cares about value if you never plan to sell it? The money's gone anyway.

And about getting your car keyed, I think it really depends on where you live and what kind of places you park it.

Depending on how nice the car is, it doesn't matter much. Other than the Marina in SF or Newport beach in Orange County, your exotic will be messed with.

[peter]

No man..  If you put more than 1k miles a year on any exotic you screw the value.

Besides, its not like you can drive it to the grocery store. You'd be inside for 20 seconds before some jealous a-hole keyed it. I had a buddy with a Testarosa he used as a daily driver. Thing got keyed once a week at least.

If I had a Vanquish, I'd drive it anytime it's sunny. Who cares about value if you never plan to sell it? The money's gone anyway.

And about getting your car keyed, I think it really depends on where you live and what kind of places you park it.

Depending on how nice the car is, it doesn't matter much. Other than the Marina in SF or Newport beach in Orange County, your exotic will be messed with.

That's crappy. Knock on wood, my car's never been keyed....but then again, I live no where near those places.

[Agent ONE]

No man..  If you put more than 1k miles a year on any exotic you screw the value.

Besides, its not like you can drive it to the grocery store. You'd be inside for 20 seconds before some jealous a-hole keyed it. I had a buddy with a Testarosa he used as a daily driver. Thing got keyed once a week at least.

If I had a Vanquish, I'd drive it anytime it's sunny. Who cares about value if you never plan to sell it? The money's gone anyway.

And about getting your car keyed, I think it really depends on where you live and what kind of places you park it.

Depending on how nice the car is, it doesn't matter much. Other than the Marina in SF or Newport beach in Orange County, your exotic will be messed with.

That's crappy. Knock on wood, my car's never been keyed....but then again, I live no where near those places.

I drive an M3, which is by no means exotic or even that special, and I still get my car mess with all the time. Last week somebody dug the center piece out of one of my wheels. There are just jealous a-holes everywhere.

[reddsun1]

Thought you guys might enjoy this. It's a big download--at 74MB--but worth the wait. One lap around the uber-track: Nurburgring. The "Ring Taxi" driver in front really has a ball, hanging it out at some points. Note the etiquette of the overwhelming majority of other drivers on track--it still trips me out that they let anybody on track (I guess they charge on a per-lap basis?), from econo-boxes to delivery trucks. Too bad no US tracks could do something like this (at least on a regular basis). I could see myself burning my credit card up every week if I lived near this track... http://63.208.74.38/modules.php?name=Downl...op=getit&lid=25

Here's another one; I like some new-school rides too. This R34 is pretty beastly. "Ooh, ooh! I want one!" http://63.208.74.38/modules.php?name=Downl...op=getit&lid=80

And finally, an absolutely spectacular example of "10/10ths driving." Peter Brock is da man! http://63.208.74.38/modules.php?name=Downl...op=getit&lid=48

[Jawjaw]

Messing with a man's car should be a much more serious crime. Unless of course it's a real POS.

[Panzer]

aahhh... sweet, sweet German sex-on-wheels... around $60,000 I think..

2006 Audi RS4

New dimensions in driving dynamics combined with innovative ideas and concepts - and, in addition, exciting lines and a level of equipment living up to even the highest luxury performance standards: The new Audi RS 4 combines the latest high-performance motoring qualities offered by quattro GmbH in a thoroughbred sports saloon with supreme everyday driving qualities in the premium segment. Indeed, the new RS 4 is the top-of-the-range model in the A4 series, a development all-new from the ground up.

Available as a sedan in the U.S. in mid-2006, RS 4's numerous technical achievements - many of which hail from motorsport - give the new Audi RS 4 its unique class and character. These features include the high engine speed concept now being introduced for the first time in a production Audi, innovative FSI technology, as well as the latest generation of quattro drive with asymmetric/dynamic distribution of torque. Developing a maximum output of 420 bhp, the V8 revs up to a speed of 8250 rpm. With its displacement of 4163 cc, this outstanding engine exceeds the magical barrier of 100 bhp per litre truly outstanding in a production saloon. Maximum torque of 430 Nm comes at 5500 rpm in this very compact engine, with 90 percent of the engine's torque consistently available between 2250 and 7600 rpm. The result is excellent muscle and pulling force at all times, enabling the driver whenever he - or she - wishes to drive in truly relaxed style without frequent gear changes.

Audi has chosen its trendsetting and groundbreaking FSI technology for the RS 4 saloon, direct gasoline injection ensuring even more effective combustion of the fuel/air mixture and, as a result, an even better power yield. This is matched by the highly responsive development of power, the RS 4 accelerating to 100 km/h in 4.8 seconds and reaching 200 km/h in 16.6 seconds. Top speed is cut off electronically at 250 km/h.

Audi's FSI technology has already proven its qualities impressively in Audi's four-time Le Mans winner, the Audi R8.

A further essential point in the brief given to Audi's development engineers was to optimise the car's power-to-weight ratio, avoiding every superfluous gram on the Audi RS 4. Accordingly, virtually every component was checked and cross-checked for minimum weight. The front wheel arches and the engine compartment lid are therefore made of aluminium, just like most components on the chassis and suspension. The specially designed RS bucket seats, in turn, are not only very light, but also offer extremely good body support in every situation.

The result is a power-to-weight ratio of just 3.93 kilos per bhp - a figure truly reminiscent of a thoroughbred sports car, which would not even have been conceivable just a few years ago in a midrange saloon.

New generation of quattro drive

The challenge, of course, is to get all this power on to the road in perfect style and with optimum handling. And for no less than 25 years, Audi's answer to all the particular requirements in this respect has been that magical name "quattro". Now the latest generation of Audi's permanent four-wheel drive featured for the first time in the RS 4 offers asymmetric/dynamic torque distribution and a self-locking Torsen centre differential, making a significant contribution in enabling the RS 4 with its sports suspension to enter new dimensions in driving dynamics. Indeed, Audi quattro technology still provides traction when other drive concepts have long reached their limits. And in this case quattro drive is further enhanced by Audi's DRC Dynamic Ride Control, significantly reducing both body roll and dive.

The brakes also enter new dimensions, an 18-inch brake system ensuring optimum stopping power. The cross-drilled, inner-vented brake discs at the front measure 365 millimetres in diameter, as opposed to 324-millimetre brake discs at the rear. Flow-optimised ventilation geometry incorporating Naca jets on the underfloor of the car ensures first-class cooling of the brakes under all conditions.

As a result, brake fading is significantly reduced even under extreme loads, for example on the race track.

Focusing on the RS 4, quattro GmbH has carefully re-aligned the latest generation of ESP to the particular properties and features of this high-performance sports saloon. With the system intervening later and for a shorter period than on a conventional car, driving dynamics are improved significantly. The integrated dry braking function in wet weather, in turn, ensures additional safety on the road, with the brake pads being unnoticeably placed on the brake discs at regular intervals in order to dry the brakes for instantaneous use whenever required.

Design

The RS 4 features racing technology in civilian clothes. While many of its features look similar to the new Audi A4, the RS 4 is far more than just a "fast" derivative of Audi's highly successful midrange saloon. Quite simply because the car is an almost entirely brand-new development tailored to the highest performance requirements.

The single-frame radiator grille, the rear section with the distinctly horizontal orientation of the car's lines, and the side surfaces with the shoulder line plastically filling in the car's contours, all prove that the RS 4 is a member of the A4 family. However, the radiator grille in diamond look, the additional air intake scoops in the front section, as well as the wheels developed specifically for the RS 4, clearly set the car aside from a "normal" Audi A4.

The newly designed rear air dam encompassing two extra-large tailpipes as well as the discreet but highly effective spoiler integrated in the luggage compartment lid and the rear side panels all bear clear testimony to the saloon's dynamic driving potential also in terms of their looks. Compared with the Audi A4, the entire body of the car has been lowered by 30 millimetres. And at the same time the development engineers at quattro GmbH have widened the car's track both front and rear. At the end of the day, however, all these modifications to the body of the car are significant not only in terms of design, but also above all in terms of function.

Inside, the RS 4 combines the straightforward function of a sports car with the luxurious ambience so typical of all Audi models. The dominating materials are leather, aluminium, and carbon. But at the same time the RS 4 comes with all the additional qualities so typical of a genuine sports car.

This superiority becomes clear immediately when you take your seats in the car: The RS bucket seats with their high side sections provide excellent support. A further feature of these bucket seats is the control button on each seat for inflating the side support elements adjusting perfectly to the driver's anatomy. The sports steering wheel tapering down at the bottom and the engine starter button on the centre console, in turn, are also clearly reminiscent of motorsport, just like the aluminium pedals.

You start the engine of the Audi RS 4 by pressing the starter button housed conveniently in the centre console right next to the driver. Pressing the sports button in the steering wheel, in turn, the driver is able to modify the gas pedal control map, giving the engine even sharper and more direct response.

Features and equipment

Driving the Audi RS 4 means driving a sports car without making any concessions. Right from the start, therefore, the RS 4 comes with virtually all the features already boasted by the Audi A4. Apart from a wide range of advanced safety components, this also means high-comfort automatic air conditioning, central locking with remote control, and electric window lifts at the front. Further features of the RS 4 include the acoustic parking system at the front and rear, the Concert radio system, as well as sports suspension with variable damper control (DRC). Furthermore, the purchaser of an Audi RS 4 can also opt for a particularly high standard of comfort amenities such as Audi's navigation system plus or dynamic adaptive light headlights literally guiding the driver round bends in the road.

Edited February 25, 2005 by Panzer

[Panzer]

more...

[Panzer]

interior....

[peter]

Messing with a man's car should be a much more serious crime. Unless of course it's a real POS.

Haha, no kidding. I think Travolta said it best in Pulp Fiction when he'd pay money just to catch the son of a b**** messing with his car.

[Commander McBride]

Did anyone go to D1? It was a bit short, but awesome action.

Kazama took out Imamura with an insane pass on the inside of the west corner, for his second Irwindale win in a row.

I got a nice little prize out of it, too. I managed to get myself into the pit area, as I usually do at events. Because I was in the right place at the right time, I was able to score Kazama's victory champaigne bottle, even managed to get him and Imamura to sign it!

[Agent ONE]

That Audi looks cool except for the front. They went a little grill crazy.

[Lightning]

Did anyone go to D1? It was a bit short, but awesome action.

Kazama took out Imamura with an insane pass on the inside of the west corner, for his second Irwindale win in a row.

I got a nice little prize out of it, too. I managed to get myself into the pit area, as I usually do at events. Because I was in the right place at the right time, I was able to score Kazama's victory champaigne bottle, even managed to get him and Imamura to sign it!

blasted Kalifornians! I wanted to go!

[Panzer]

That Audi looks cool except for the front. They went a little grill crazy.

yeah the new front end is an acquired taste.. its growing on me though. looks really aggresive.

the new A6, A4, A3 and new Passat all have the huge trapezoid grill. on the Passat its toned down a little than more than the Audi's though.

[yellowlightman]

I dig the front end on the RS4. My problem with it is that it still looks too much like a prettied-up Volkswagen.

[Commander McBride]

On the Audi subject, I actually like the new front end. I think it looks like crap in photos, and even out of context, as in a car show, but when you see one under natural light, out on the road in the real world, they look pretty good.

[Panzer]

I dig the front end on the RS4. My problem with it is that it still looks too much like a prettied-up Volkswagen.

a VW is just a dumbed down Audi...

Audi's are actually really impressive cars. read over the numbers on that RS4 and you'll know what I mean. not to mention they were the first production car to have AWD.

Theres a cool Audi commercial from europe:

They hang a keychain from an Alfa Romero on a wall that represents style..

Next they hang a keychain from a Volvo that represents safety..

After that they hang a Mercedes Benz key on the wall that represents comfort..

Finally they hang a BMW key on the wall that represents sportiness and the four rings together make teh Audi symbol! pretty good commercial if you ask me..