Radd

Saturn wasn't a bad system at all. At a time when most 3D games sucked, the Saturn was the most powerful 2D game in town. The Playstation couldn't compare. Of course, 2D was old hat, and everyone was wowed by 3D graphics, enough so that they convinced themselves that Tomb Raider was an excellent game. Of course, I still believe it was the $400 price tag, compared to Sony's $300(cheap!), and Sega's terrible change in marketing that drowned their 32 bit attempt. I gotta agree with JBO on the sales of add-ons as compared to software and stand alone consoles. I knew several people with a Sega CD, and amidst all the FMV crap there were some great games for it. (Sonic CD and Lunar spring to mind immeadiately.)

I'll grant that the widescreen is a most excellent choice. I was sad to see that the NDS abandoned the wider screen of the GBA for a pair of square-shaped screens. I'm still not sold on the PSP's library yet. The two Rockman remakes and the new Ghoul's and Ghosts are the most interesting things I've seen headed Sony's way. We'll see. Plenty of time to see what magic the developers for both handhelds work.

I spent many a day playing Power Stone and Project Justice on the Dreamcast. It certainly died before it's time. Well, at least every gamer in the world learned their lesson about bowing to a company's hype machine before their system is actually out. Right? Right guys? Guys? Hello?

I gotta go with Keith on this one. The art leaves a lot to be desired, the Photoshopping is just atrocious. The way the drama and storytelling is handled is very comic-bookish, and I mean that in the worst way possible. I can put the fact that it's an unwanted sequel to an edited version of a show that already has legitimate sequels and spin-offs to the back of my mind, but when the end product doesn't at least stand up to Yamato, I lose any desire to.

I just hope an unedit version makes it to DVD.

This thread is certainly full of hate, and I'd have to say appropriately named if some people's opinions are any indication. I can understand disliking the obnoxious anime fans who tout thier shows as the best, and will shove craploads of BS arguments towards anyone holding a dissenting opinion, or the hygiene-impaired fans who believe that bathing is always optional and are usually lacking any and all social graces (the usual stereotype is a fat, balding, 30+ years old man who still lives in his parents' basement). As others have pointed out, such "uber fans" are not at all limited to anime. However, much beyond that and it seems to me someone has a bit of an insecurity issue, and it's not the 200lb biker who's confident enough to dress like Sailor Moon for a few laughs.

Niiiice, but will it come to the States?

I should add that I'm 26, and watch anime once a week with a large group of friends of ages between 19 and 28. I've met people much older just as into anime and animation in general. Of course, I went to art school specifically for animation, were my instructors all immature for appreciating animation?

When someone says something like that I believe it's a pretty obvious sign that person is insecure, and probably with good reason, about their own maturity.

That new Ghouls 'n Ghosts looks most excellent. Another interesting title I've heard of, wich will unfortunately probably be Japan-only is Mini-Pato.

Huh, if I'd seen this post before heading off to the local anime night I'd have checked to see wich group we're watching. Still, I'm almost certain we're watching the Anime-Kraze version. If we are, then that's worth nabbing because I haven'd had any complaints on the subtitles, nor has anyone else in the group.

While DYRL? and Plus went one way with the Macross story, with a heavier emphasis on the mecha battles and more serious storytelling, it seemed to me that Macross 7 remained equally true to the original tv series but in the opposite direction. If you'll recall, SDF was very, very light hearted at times. It was a nice change of pace. Also, like Plus and Zero, it's a different story, and not just a rehash of the same tale, one of the reasons I'll always prefere Macross as a whole to some other mecha franchises. Character and relationship developement was definitely the strong point of M7. Among my friends we sometimes call it the shojo-Macross. In particular, I like how all the characters around Basara are handled. All of them mirror fan's reactions to Basara. Some dig him and his ideas right away, most slowly come around over a very long period of time, and others never get him or his ideas, and never will. I love the relationship developement between Max and Millia, and between Basara and Gamlin particularly. I'm not a fan of the Sound Force mecha designs, it's true, however there's still plenty of excellent mecha in the show. In fact, I'd way just about every non-Sound Force Valkyrie is excellent. Even so, Dr. Chiba's attitude towards everything lends a certain kind of sense to the Sound Force designs. I really enjoy the music, and with such a large selection of songs from the show I'd wager I listen to M7 music more than any other Macross. I also like the overall story and themes. That if you work hard, don't give up, and don't compromise your beliefs, you can make a difference in the world. Also, even though it's a lot of work, if everyone did try, just try, to see things from the "other side's" point of view things would be better all around. This was also a strong theme in Macross Zero.

I liked Robotech as a kid, growing up in the 80's it was one of the best animated series out there, the Starblazers of that generation. However, even as a kid there were parts I hated. Minmei was a terrible character, and her songs were good reason to keep the mute button handy. It was a running joke among some friends of mine that her singing was one of the most painful things you could inflict upon anyone. Some of the story elements, such as the SDF-2, seemed painfully forced into the show and none of us were fooled into believing there were 2 SDFs in that lake. The Masters saga was slow and dull, though it did have some interesting mecha designs. New Generation was a lot of fun, more like the first part of Robotech than Masters was. However, as I grew older, the cracks in the show grew wider and wider, even before I knew it was an edited version of three unrelated shows. Finally the AnimEigo DVD set of SDF Macross came out, and I saw the original series, unedited for the first time. It really struck my how different it was from Robotech, in tone, character developement, pacing, and writing. Most of the problems that I had with Robotech were completely absent, and Minmay was not only able to sing well, but she wasn't a worthless character at all, she was actually likable for the most part (My favourite Minmay is still the DYRL? version, though, I thought she and the whole love triangle was handled so much better for the film). I have to say that while I harbour no ill will towards Robotech as a tv show, I find Macross to be better in every concievable way. I do look forward to seeing if Shadow Chronicles raises the bar for the Robotech franchise a bit, but I won't get my hopes up until the show is out. I'd be more excited to hear Kawamori was heading up a brand new Macross project. I love DYRL?, Plus, Zero, and I even enjoy M7 though I think it would have benefited if Kawamori had directly overseen the project. I also don't hold with the idea that we have Robotech to thank for introducing us to Macross. I'd still have developed an interest in anime, I've always loved animation, and if Harmony Gold had released the series unedited to begin with, I'd have seen uncut, unedited Macross goodness many, many years earlier. That, combined with HG's hostile attitude towards Macross sequels and merchandise (and by proxy, their hostile attitude towards Macross fans) gives me a less than grateful attitude towards them as a company. However, I'm not able to work up the raw vehemence that some fans are, and I'm willing to support them on those rare occaissions when they do something right.

Oh, she shows up again. I'll say no more. Good, good show. I love the character developement and relationships in this series.

Primus looks like a fairly crappy looking toy based on a Dreamwave design for the War Within that was never used. Of course, I'm not a fan at all of the asthetics of the Armada/Energon/Galaxy Force lines. The Dreamwave design was ok. So far the only planet Transformer design I've seen that looked even decent was the unused Beast Wars II Unicron. That thing looked freaking gorgeous.

Sorry, poorly worded post. I meant in general, not on this board specifically. I recall some statements people made that they were completely adamant about, but turned out to be completely wrong.

I do agree with some of what DeathHammer posted, but other things strike me as completely off. My opinion, of course. To me it seems Macross 7 had some incredibly strong character developement. Not in Nekki Basara, no. If he's the only character you're paying attention to, then of course you'll come away griping that there was little development. Take a look at Mylene, Gamlin, Ray, Max, Millia, Gigil. The "love triangle" of M7 was also more complicated than those of previous Macross shows, and still managed to avoid any of those "Hikaru, you're a moron" antics that sullied SDF. I had no problem with the music, in fact I think M7 has one of the more enjoyable soundtracks. Fire Bomber certainly isn't a boy band, and it is no affront to my sexuality to hear male vocals. I also enjoy KMFDM, Dire Straits, They Might Be Giants, NiN, Andrew W.K., and many other bands with male vocals. In fact, I've never heard of anyone complain that these bands wouldn't appeal to guys because they lack female vocalists. Of coruse it's already been mentioned that Mylene did plenty of singing herself. The analogy of M7 and Cop Rock seems stretched. Both had male singers and that's why they failed? That's Hollywood executive logic that always misses the real cause and effect. I will agree, however, that the show would have benefited greatly had there been more variety in the music. There are ablums and albums of Fire Bomber music, it's a shame that through about half the series only one song was played over and over again whenever Basara jumped into the battlefield. I wouldn't be surprised if azrael's assumption is correct. As for the mech designs, while I'm not a fan of the Sound Force mecha, there's plenty of very excellent looking designs in M7 that would make for some wonderful toys. The VF-17, the VF-5000, the VA-3, VF-22, VF-11 Jamming Birds, full armour VF-11, several variations of the VF-19, including the VF-19P wich is my favoruite even over the YF-19. Seriously, I'd like to see almost any of these over the VF-0.

I loved the movies, especially the second one. I remember the live action tv series, but I can't recall how good or bad it was. I don't think I ever saw the animated series. The comics were great though , from what I recall.

Finally got to see the movie after having missed its run in the local theatres (one of the worst parts of working third shift is how difficult it is to go see a movie in theatres). Personally, I loved the movie. Lots of excellent performances, and imaginative visuals. Not as good as Shaolin Soccer, I thought, but still a good movie. I'm looking forward to tracking down more of Chow's work.

With the PS2 it was like a year or so before the system had a library to make actually buying the console worthwhile, wich made the early death of the Dreamcast, wich already had a growing library of great games, sting all the more. Not saying that will happen with this new generation, but it is a valid concern.

I remember Captain Power, the videotapes had some pretty nice 2D animation for the battle sequences as I recall, though the show was all live action with...was it CG for the bad guys? Guys in suits? Stop motion? I can't recall, it's been so long, but I don't think it had any 2D animation in it. And yeah, it was pretty dark. That's a show I'd like to see sometime.

I'll see about being there for the panel, but the Otakon schedule seems full of holes right now. Like, opening ceremonies isn't listed anywhere on Friday. The only thing listed for Main Events in the morning is the AMV screening. Also, if they're having an Otazine panel, I'll have to be at that...but it's not listed either. I'll definitely be at the con, though. Most of the weekend I'll be chained to my table in Artist's Alley.

Well, Eisner is gone within the next couple years, isn't he? That could be a good step forward for Disney. Still, the company shouldn't be buddying up to him and letting him run the company into the ground. I'm hoping that the increased popularity of anime, and animation aimed at the 18-35 year old crowd will help push a new boom of animation in the States, but I'm not holding my breath. Japan seems to be having its own problems, with more and more of their domestic animation jobs going to countries like Korea. People over there seem to be concerned about the anime boom ending in Japan. Even if animation does get big again, more than likely all the jobs will remain overseas.

As I recall, Mighty Orbots was a collaboration between an American and a Japanese studio. Yup, here it is http://well-of-souls.com/orbots/credits.htm I saw an episode or two back in art school, and the animation was truly exceptional for a television production. Of course, I don't know if the show maintained that level of quality. It's really a shame that more shows don't aim for quality animation.

Wacky thread. Just to get things down as I know them. Disney is ceasing production of all their 2D animated features and tv series. They've been scaling back in this regard for quite some time. Eisner went so far as to claim 2D was dead, because of the Disney's recent failings at the box office. For 2D computer animation, it takes just as many people, and almost as much time. All the cels still need to be drawn, whether on paper or on the computer, an animator is still required. There are no magical computers that create the inbetween frames. Is this just a technological step? Were 3D CG works destined to put an end to 2D animation? Stupid question. 2D and 3D animation are different types of art. Saying CG animation makes 2D obsolete is like claiming sculpture makes illustration a thing of the past, or that markers put an end to paint. Should 2D animators run out and learn 3D animation? Well, currently if they want to remain in the animation industry then yes, however it's like telling a physician to become a dentist to remain in the health industry. There is some crossover in skills, but also a lot that has nothing to do with the other. That's just to put some perspective here, because a lot of people commenting seem to think it's just pencils and paper being given up for wacom tablets and computer monitors, and anyone who isn't keeping up has no one to blame but themselves. Disney is burying an artform just because they've screwed up most of their major 2D animated features over the past years. Their mindset is, "Well, Atlantis and Treasure Planet bombed at the box office, it must be because people don't like 2D animation." They haven't stopped to consider that maybe, just maybe, it's because movies like those were utter crap. Remember when Final Fantasy bombed in theatres? You know what people said then? They claimed it was because audiences did not want 3D animated movies. Add to this that for years now the entry level grunt work in animation has been moved overseas, leaving almost no way for new talent to get into the industry. Disney has a history of treating their animators rather poorly. I hope the rumours that Pixar is moving into 2D animation wind up becoming true, and that Pixar becomes very successful in their 2D endeavours. Meanwhile, the people responsible for Disney's latest box office bombs are probably the same people heading up their new 3D movies. I wonder what they'll say when those movies fail?