SeminNV

These are my last 2 posts on this forum. The project is not over, we don't stop or quit. I simply see no reason to be a part of this community anymore. On February 5th 2009 will be 1 year since my first announcement of Free Fan Robotech / Macross Game Project on this forum. I 'd like to sum up what we got during the last year. To start with, I want to say that the project was established around May 2007, though I was thinking about it from December 2006. By that time I had some experience with C mostly for computational programs, but I was a complete noobie in computer graphics. At that time everything looked like this: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In February 2008, I registered to this forum mainly because I was in search for cg models and modelers. At that time I could not do any modelling at all, the screen-shots looked like this: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I got some feedback here, but users did not seem to like my idea for some reasons. Those who had models probabely were afraid that my project would fail many many others. I do understand that. So, around March 2008, I started learning a bit of milkshape 3d, did a couple of very poor models myself. Here is how it looked like on the screens and Video #5. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As a result of this breakthrough, some people lent me their cg models in June 2008. Namely, It was Darrtallion,but, in fact, there were more people who did model them. I know only AncientAngel and BretaiSmth. I do thank them for that. Based on 2 of the contributed models, currently now I am developing VF-4 and VF-A (see post below). Finally, in August 2008, with the great help of Sakura Shinguji, who gave absolutely suited for my goals YF19, I switched to Blender and Blender Game Engine. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- in December 2008, the project managed to attract a programmer dpsstudio, who is currently developing in parallel the game in panda3d game engine. Also, another person from this forum, op4_delta, gave me several of his great models. Latest screens and Video #6 from Blender Game Engine (January 2009) Latest screens from Panda3D game engine (January-February 2009). This last stage already has gameplay!

The guy was too enthusiastic in the beginning. Probably his interest faded away. So, currently I am continueing with the project. I find the idea right - there is no need to models VFs several times, because 2 properly modelled vfs should be identical. Here is the status SV-51 - modelled, rigged, not textured VF-1S - modelled and rigged, but needs tweaking and refining, not textured VF-0D - modelled and rigged, but needs tweaking and refining, not textured VF-4 - not modelled completely, not rigged, not textured VF-A - not modelled completely, being rigged, not textured VF-B - not modelled completely, being rigged, not textured Sakura Suinji submitted YF-19 - finished and working on VF-21 - not modelled completely, being rigged, not textured VF-11 - not modelled completely, being rigged, not textured

To ALL Guys, this discussion is really pointless. My goal is to finish the project, and using lots of words is not getting me closer to this goal. From this standpoint - have this project finished- you either flame or help. There is no alternative. I have no time and intention to asnwer all these posts. P.S. By "flaming" I simply mean that the discussion itself going on here is pointless. I don't mean that you are breaking any forum rules, or should be banned, or whatever.

I did not mean you nor persons on page 8. My remark was a joke directed to StarDragon excuse that he was going off topic. I meant evens that were going on from page 3 to 5. THat's it

It is OK, I get used to flaming in this thread after the guy called Zinjo hahaha

How about asking our mutual friend - google first?

I am kinda tired arguing with you and other people on performance issue. Read this please http://nsider2.com/forums/Polygon-Count-list-t165375.html Here are some examples that caught my eye: Gears of War, Xbox 360, 2006 Wretch - 10,000 polygons with diffuse, specular and normal maps Boomer - 11,000 polygons with diffuse, specular and normal maps Marcus - 15,000 polygons with diffuse, specular and normal maps Halflife 2, PC, 2004 Alyx Vance - 8323 polygons Barney - 5922 polygons Combine Soldier - 4682 polygons Classic Headcrab - 1690 polygons SMG - 2854 polygons (with arms) Pistol - 2268 polygons (with arms) Lost planet, X360/PC, 2007 Wayne - 12392 polygons (but finally 17765 polygons for compatibility with motion blur effect) VS robot - 30-40K polygons Background - ~500K polygons Peak number of polygons per frame - ~ 3 million** Project Gotham Racing 3, X360, 2005 Cars - 80K-100K polygons (interior + exterior), damages add between 10K and 20K more polygons per car Gran Turismo 5: Prologue, PS3, 2007 Cars - 200K polygons (probably interior + exterior) Midnight Club, Xbox360/PS3, 2007 Cars - 100K polygons Lair, PS3, 2007 Main dragon plus its rider - 150K polygons 16x16KM scene - 134M polygons (streamed into memory, not loaded at run time) *Might be a cut-scene model **No precisions whether it's actual rendered polygons or just the number of polygons sent to transform, pre Z-pass and culling. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aslo, did you see screens of upper posts? There I render about 35k polys in the scene with FPS more than 100. It shows 60 because of Vsync on. I have a poor system for current standards, namely video is Readon 1600 series, 2048 mb RAM, 2.8 Ghz CPU and Windows XP SP2. This system lets me play NFS:MW on medium settings and COD4 on low settings. Also, I am currently using Blender Game Engine that is very simple, but as a result not very flexible. It is performance is poor. What I want to say is that even with these stuff I can render 100.000 polys in real time with shaders and all that. I expect that on GF 8800 type of video card the performace will be at least 10! times faster. SO, I am not worrying about anything. I have enough room in FPS to do what I want. Namely, render twenty 20k polys models at the same time, calculating physics, processing collisions, playing sound and all that necessary in a game. Well, again you are not completely right. With Level of Details (LOD) system, everything will be fine. I am kinda confused, because your posts look like a confession, not a business offer or smth else. what acually do you want? Look, I wanted to give you and Dartallion a piece of advice that could save your time. If you want to reinvent the wheel, than be it. Blender 2.47 is very much stable for all sorts of modelling/ rendeing/ animation. I heard about some bugs on 2.48a that I am using currently, but I never encounter them. My last appeal to you is just try it out and than make judgement. I did try ms3d, max and blender, and this is why I can do a proper judgement.

First of all, since you appeared in the thread, I 'd like to thank you and Dartallion for givving me some of your models and offering help. Currently I am remodelling his VF-4. But, I have some suggestion. From what I understood, you had bad experience with another game project. As you can probably see now, my project is serious simply because I am not doing MMO. I am a realistic guy, and my game concept is feasible. So, if you want to finally help the project, here are my advises. I oututline that these are advises, not demands. I think well of you, and these are just suggestions from a person who wishes you all best 1) I cannot reach you with skype or email. You did the VFA, but it is not how I woild like to see it in the game. I mean design, nt details like texture and all that. We need proper communication, otherwise all your efforts are pointless. 2) I have some critics on models. Guys, this is 2008! not 2002. Use 10.000 - 20.000 polys, texture size 1024 at least. What is highly recommended: normal/bump map and specular map. This is the state of art in game industry. Nex,t look on my Sv-51 and Alpha - My cg models are exact copies of blueprints! - All parts look connected during trasformation or animation - There is a cockpit 3) The program you are using. Lets face it - ms3d is outdated! For your own good, please, switch to smth more professional. I suggest bledner. I managed to learn it in 2 months while working on sv-51. I am sure you can do it faster, since you are originally better modellers than me.

Origrinal mesh is not mine. But it is still unfinished. I think after completing it I will have the right to desitribute it No, it is not. But check this some work in progess VF-0D VF-4 VF-A Happy New Year!

Very well said. I could not choose better words to express this flaw of these games. Tiny apdate! The project is going to fruition. Soon there will be a tech demo where you can choose a vf, fly around and shot some turrets and ship. This screen are from Radeon 1600 256 mb video , CPU 2.8 Ghz , RAM 2GB , Windows XP.

I am just wondering does anyone have good shots or pictures on Alpha and Beta in front, side and top/bottom? For instance, from Shadow Chroniles or your own collection? I lost hope that in this life I will get a good Beta / Aplha toys, so I decided to quickly model them.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Game concept!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Abstract This game will be a mix of arcade flight and robo simulators, based on some ideas borrowed from Mech Warrior 4 and Wings of War. However, in these splendid games the gameplay tends to be more shooter-like, thus not letting a player to experience completely what is to operate gigantic robot. It means that though piloting a mech (either robot or a an airplane), player’s piloting skills contribute to a very little degree to victory. Basically, the one who has bigger mech with more weapons/armor is the winner. In my concept of a new gameplay stated here I will try shift the accent from shooter to the gameplay where the player can in principle outfight his opponent even having less firepower and armor. For this purpose, I introduce a concept of specials actions or maneuvers. In the game player can pilot a transformable mech either in robot state (Battloid Mode) or airplane state (Fighter Mode), depending on his own preference at a particular moment. The transformation itself is not a key feature of the gameplay. It simply serves as a logic brick to explain the fact that in the game mechs (either in Battloid or Fighter modes) can modify their aerodynamics properties very fast. Thus, a player can change direction of movement and its speed very rapidly with the help of special actions or maneuvers. To illustrate the idea of maneuvers, Figure 1 is presented. On Figure 0.1 player faces a heavy ship with various weapons and defense systems. It is impossible to get close and deliver a punch in a standard way, because you will be shot down. To solve the problem, player presses special combo and the plain starts approaching to the ship doing tricky maneuver. On figure 0.1 different stages of the maneuver are depicted with number 1-4 correspondingly. As a result, most of enemy fire can be avoided. ............................................................. Figure 1. These special actions will be of several kinds: defense ones and attack ones. Player can "purchase" them during customization of the mech. Actions will be implemented the very same way as in 3d fighting games: with the help of combos. Pressing a combination of keys, a maneuver can be triggers. Meanwhile, player can still control direction of movements in Fighter/Battloid modes, aim in Battloid mode, do firing and trigger other maneuvers. Maneuvers will be accom¬panied by fascinating animation involving transformation. So far I have invented about 20 different maneuvers. To be short, the player has choice to make a tradeoff between 1. install the more equipment like weapons, armor, fuel, more powerful engine on the mech. As a result, less action points will be available to him. Consequently, the player can access less maneuvers. 2. Sacrifice some weapons, armor, fuel, extra engine power to make the mech more maneuverable. Hangar Customization of VFs will remind in lot of aspects Mech Warrior 4. Just replace Mech in your Head with a VF. All VF will have diffrent weapon layouts. For instance, on one VF you can install more rocket weapons, on another - ballistic weapons.

here you go To find it you need to write "Robotech 3D" in search, but something telling that you will never do you it))) Also, check this smbd's video. Really cool

From what I understood in your previous post, you need models for a mod. I can give some from my porject - no problem with that. Aslo, in my experience (I tried 3ds max, milkshape and blender), the best one is blender 1. It is free. Both 3ds max and amd ms3d are not free, unless you use pirate version. I might be wrong, but May is not free too. 2. In comparison to 3ds max that is around 1-2 Gb, blender is around 20 mb. That's really handy. 3. In comparision to ms3d blender has much more cpabilities. 4. Blender is the best suited for low poly modeling amoung these programs. MS3D is outdated right now. 3ds max is for professionals in my opinion. It has many features that you will never need (low poly modeling is a tiny part of them ). 5. My models are in blender 6. I am sure that one day you will realise that modding is not what you want. You will start wondering what technologies to use to make a game. Here it is - blender already has inside cool and easy game engine: physics engine, sound edition, scripts sistem, and I am not mentioning models and textures import. 7. I asked the same kind of question on gamedev forums long ago. Most votes were for blender. go to blender.org or chumbalum.swissquake.ch or autodesk.com and make your onw judgement.

Weekly update! Fisrt, we got new team member op4_delta, He submitted several stunning models They require some changes and texturing, but he definitely saved us lots of time and efforts VF-0S Two well known ships from Macross Zero Second, sv-51 getting better, though poly count is around 15k now Later, there gonna be a big post on game concept and all that

I bet it is gonna be as crappy as Max Payne movie, where none of the movie team seemed to haved played into the game My only hope is that they won't cut off on 3d graphics, so we can see 5-10 minutes of fascinating episodes.

1. You obviously did not see Jaw Ley work. http://macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=19810 2. It is a very good MEDIUM POLY vf, that is in my opinion absolutely useless. I want to advise the author either do very good low poly (For games, mods), or very good high poly. MEDIUM POLY, that u have now does not look very realistic/impressive. From a low poly one does expect much. If the texture is more or less OK, everybody takes it as it is, since low poly models are usually in games. It is a trade off in gamebusiness, because poly count is limited. High poly should make one wondering: "where did the author take that photo?". It must be inbelievably realistic. You know that it has been modeled, but you cannot resist the impression that it is a photo of a real thing. No doubt, medium poly looks much better than low poly, but if you look a bit close and pay attention to details - it is still a cg model. In other words - you cannot use it in games, poly count is already high. And you cannot use it in renders - level of details too low. So, use 400k polys instead of 40k.

Thanks! But the reason I am posting pics is not to get fame and applauses, or to show how good I am in such things I simply want this game to be done, since it is my long term dream. From my experience I infered that it was hard doing such things alone. Now we have some kind of a team + people who helpd the project at different stages, and i want to show these people that I am working. and that their efforts are not pointless. here is some update on my sv-51. 13000 triangles, or 6500 polys MY POLICY - NO PRERENDERS, ONLY HOW IT WILL LOOK IN REAL TIME transformation

I asked him to do that - put not only macross mecha, but other (quite popular here I must say) mechas. And, please, stop it - it is not RT comparison, it is Macross+Souther Cross + MOSPEADA comparison.

It looks very good but...it looks like a very good cg model for toy. Maybe it was your goal, but I would add some realism What's the poly count?

Weekly update! SHADERS, finally! This time I switched to the game and I was texturing some models for the first level of the game Also, I finally mastered GLSL materials, so this is how the game looks like (it is not a prerender!) The plave can fly, but gain there is not gameplay yet. I want to say to SS, that the YF-19 texture looks really good after I turned on GLSL materials!

So, what is the overall score for this model? And could you put scores on the front page of your blog or even better create a list of all models with their scores, so I don't need to open entries every time I need to know the score. Thanks in advance!

well, I have seen this one and it is definitely is not transformable. So, mine version is better even without a texture

great, but sv-51 is quite wide spread now. How about smth as rare as vf-4? I really need it for modeling reference

sometimes when I want to access forum I see white screen and this message " IPS Driver Error There appears to be an error with the database. You can try to refresh the page by clicking here " After some time, everything is working again. what the heck is that?