VFTF1

Yeah... I got the same notion into my head when I was building Force Impulse - the mecha is amazing... too bad the show isn't Anyway, nice Sword Impulse. My next SEED Gundam will be the Blue Frame Astray. Interesting you say the Justice is better than Exia. I have many times passed up the chance to have Justice, but I think I'm going to build Exia.... Can you elaborate as to why you think Justice is better? Also - I have noticed that the more recent a kit, the more advanced it tends to be - and so hearing Justice is better than Exia also sounds to me like "old kit better than newer kit." I'm curious - it this just on account of the Justice itself being more complex and compelling, or are their technical, design issues that are better despite the kit being older than the Exia? Interesting - please tell me more. See - what influenced my decision was the RX-78-2 Katoki version, which I previously built and was thoroughly dissapointed with due to the cop-out of an inner frame that it had - or really didn't have. Simply because they needed to fit the core fighter in there, the inner frame for the upper body was pretty much non-existant. I guess I just got scared that the inner frame of the Guncannon was equally unelaborate. Since it's the 30th anniversary of Gundam, and we've gotten v 2.0 Zaku, Gouf, Gundam, GM, and a new Guntank...I guess I'm hoping that we'll be graced with a Guncannon 2.0 as well... Pete

Yep. And Nia evaporating - and still choosing to marry Simon and Love him even though, as the anti-spirals would say "she knew there would only be despair." I do appreciate American movies that have morales at the end, or where a main character rises to a position of power and responsibility. It sometimes works in the context of a story, particularly in cowboy stories like the Man who Shot Liberty Valance, where the brainy lawyer learns (with the help of John Wayne) the value of a gun and goes on to become help the territory become a State and then gets appointed Senator (by the state legislature, which was how they did it until 1918 iirc).... But yeah... it doesn't always work - and too often it becomes a stereotype. Anime doesn't tend to give us stuff like that. There's always some interesting twist depending on the story, the characters... there's no simple formuale... Pete

Freiflug88 - very interesting and haunting story and posts. In general, very interesting topic. I agree with Taks about needing to be serious and present evidence - but on the other hand... let's be honest- none of us have any "evidence." Freiflug88 has personal experience - but it's always going to be a case of whether or not people believe him, and clearly HE believes himself. It's a delicate subject. I think to discuss it, you need to keep in mind that you're not ever going to have definitive evidence really. I am, however, certainly sympathetic to the notion that there is extraterrestrial life, and also I am actually hopeful that there is extraterrestrial life. I would like nothing better than to be like Haruhi Suzumiya in the opening to that anime - where a hand reaches down and takes her away on a magical adventure...or at least that's my assumption. Anyways - there's certainly no point in having a passionate fight over this subject because nobody is going to be able to prove anybody wrong since always the issue will be blurred. I think it's just more interesting to listen - to absord stories like Freiflug88's, to watch these kind of movies and think about them and the implications and to keep an open mind. Personally... let me think... No - I don't think I've ever had an alien encounter. If I did, then I must have had my mind blanked out because I remember nothing... I never saw a UFO.... But people tend to be scary enough. Give me aliens any day! Pete

Oh well that's great. It's nice to know that the character (Hikaru) who started off as a pacifist opposed to war was morphed by HG into Rick, who ended up understanding that you need to be willing to commit war crimes - not even just go to war, but commit war crimes - to win. Great job Harmony Gold. Really knocked it out of the ballpark there... See - this is all the more reason why I prefer Macross Pete

Actually - that's a great point VF5SS. I mean - technically, if we go by the cartoon alone then Rick and Lisa and the Macross saga crew are gone and never seen again. We do see them in the novels, in the 3 episodes of Sentinels and er..I guess we see Rick for a couple seconds in Shadow Chronciles... But yeah - the Robotech cartoon is pretty brutal about just chucking them - and it has no choice in the matter. VF5SS is right - it's way worse than the original Macross which at least tries to give us some thoughtful, well done retrospectives from time to time... Pete

Now that is very interesting - this part where you mention your "average VF-11C pilot" because there IS an "average VF-11C pilot" in Macross 7 who has very similar motivations to Gamlin at one point, but has an altogether different sense of what is going on around him... I'm talking of course of RAY. When Docker gets taken down, Gamlin visits in the hospital and draws inspiration to be even more lethal as a warrior. When Stephen is killed by Ray's passionate warrior spirit - he recognizes the tragedy of warfare. Maybe it's because Docker is technically not dead that Gamlin fights on instead of being broken? I dunno. But in any event - there you have it. Your average VF-11C pilot doesn't necessarily react like Gamlin... Pete

Well I think Gubaba is just doing it because he's working on her book. He'll dump Misa like a wet sock once she's served his purpose and move onward (or maybe back?) to the fertile ground of Nanase.... Although I speculate... one can never be sure of the mysterious ways of the The Gubaba Pete

You know, I was thinking just the other day, since I'm doing the whole watching M7 again together thread experienece...and we have Max and Millia in Macross 7 - now in SDFM TV they were more familial, whereas in M7 they're preoccupied with their work. So, I was thinking that Misa and Hikaru have it the other way around. If we ever did see them again - I would like to think that Misa quit her job and had babies, and that Hikaru pilots an Angel Bird and does stunts, valkyrie racing, and maybe runs a maintenance business or something. I so totally hate the notion that they are still soldiers, fighting the next war blah blah blah. The whole point of Macross was that Misa rediscovered her femininity. I know she was given a mission and given command of the Megaroad-1 - but does that necessarily mean she'll stay in command? I would hope that due to pregnancy, she would finally leave and sit at home for a while and be happy. I dunno...I just always really was happy with the ending of Macross and I would like to think that Misa and Hikaru grow old together and in love. As for Minmey- she just becomes what she has become in Macross - a legend. Seeing Max and Millia in M7, Roy in Macross Zero... these were nice touches - as well as all the ties that Macross Frontier had to Zero. All of this is good - but even in giving us a glimpse of the past or the future, the writers are VERY careful not to reveal too much, because they understand that overexposure can kill a good character. Pete

Heh - I almost fear you taking picks of the Sword Impulse Gundam...even though it's just a pink Force Impulse (must keep telling myself that) I'm sad I won't be able to come into possession of it for a long long time...but dag it does look lovely! Anyways. Here's my RX-78-2 version 2.0 ...again. This time he's happily got a clamp shoved between his legs and jammed into a stand: the heavenly dream of ALL mecha: I STILL need to finish his staff and his ball and chain and his bazooka. I swear - I HATE building weapons for Gundams. It's like...once the robot is done, I just want to move on to the next one... and that's what I'm going to do in this case. But I know that eventually I'll have to come back and build the remaining weapons. It's just - for now the laser swords, shield and rigle are enough I think. Very impressive Gundam IMO. And yes, I love to just call it GUNDAM. That's one of the things I so love about MSG. It's just GUNDAM. Nobody calls it RX-78-2. That only happens after so many different Gundams come out through the different series that you need to call them all by their number. But in MSG - it's just GUNDAM. And best of all - it's just a prototype! wooo! Pete

I've recently managed to strike some poses while cleaning up and reorganizing my collection... Sadly, either camera technology is getting more and more advanced or I suck a photographer... I dunno...I haven't been happy with the pictures I've been taking recently... but I did manage to snap this one - no biggie - but I kind of like it. And yes - it's a bit photoshoped to get that strobe light effect...at least...I hope that's how people see it...err...here ya go: Pete

Well, fans have also dropped the ball - there's been very little speculation. But then, how can you blame them? I mean - what are the chances that the next cartoon will feature two groups of Transforming intelligent living robots from the planet Cybertron who crash land on Earth and duke it out over something or other, and that one side will feature a leader with the name Prime and the other will feature Megatron? See - this is what happens when you so dilute the continuity that it explodes in your face, Hasbro. This is what's left. Either the new cartoon MUST become a tie in with the live action movie...like maybe they should make a Live Action Series? Like Terminator: Chronicles of Sarah Conor, only Transformers? OR the cartoon must make a fresh start but be a huge twist on worn concepts (kind of like Beast Wars was). Make a whole new cast of characters ...I dunno.. I'm gonna stop because already I feel the urge to write seven more pages... Pete

Well, as soon as Hasbro announces a new cartoon, I promise to stop ranting and give it a chance... Pete

Kawamorii apparantly stated that he does not want to revisit any of the old characters for fear of tampering with the excellence of how their arcs ended. I tend to agree with this. The love story from Macross was beautiful and it's over. In Robotech, aside from the changes that they make to Macross, one of the big problems with the Lisa/Rick relationship (and Minmey really) is that it just becomes a lame soap opera. A wonderful love story becomes distilled. Minmey becomes this Mother of the Universe figure and Rick and Lisa become just some boring people in love. I guess the idea with Macross was that the story is over - don't ruin it by continuing it beyond what was necessary to make it great. Pete

Yeah, I know I just have a habit of ranting about Transformers in this thread Hopefully it's mildly amusing Pete

EDIT -Although it didn't start out that way..this post has become my concise review of EPISODE 2 No need to be sorry. I need to re-watch it again as well. I saw it about a week ago, way before the Friday dead line...I'm so ahead! I need to slow down and get behind or let everybody else catch up... I feel so terrible since I should be keeping to schedule, but instead I get ahead, then get sick and write general posts about M7 instead of sticking to my own rules. And now I'm pointing out that Perceptor is also a stupid Minicon and wagering that half of this day and ages' TF fans will sooner recognize him as that... or am I being pessimisitic? Don't answer that. It's off topic enough as is ... Anyways... To say something about episode 2 - wait...screw it...I'm gonna TURN ON episode 2 RIGHT NOW and say what's on my mind... I'm watching and writing at the same time now... Opening scene: Basara is strumming on his guitar - working on what will become My Soul For You. he stops strumming and starts taking notes. And right here - how can you say that there's no interesting character development in this show?? I mean - come on - he's shown developing his music - the artistic process is shown... And we cut to Gamlin at the hospital - and that's really great...and Gamlin's memories of what happened to Docker - with Bassara's music in the background... Like two ways of life developing in parallel along with their consequences - so we're listening to Bassara working on his music while at the same time seeing what could be the negative effects of the interference of his music in the battles... Or is it the sad result of war alone? We see the futility of war in Gamlin's hospital visit contrasted with Basara's burning passion and dedication for music as a voice of love in a universe gone crazy. And then we cut to the bridge and there's more military stuff - but Bassara keeps singing. And then - after this comparisson of the artistic life to the military life - we cut to Mylene in her car arguing with her mom. It's a wonderful scene because mothers and daughters always hate eachothers' guts - women are really vile to one another like that, so it's no wonder that Millia would send Michael and his goons after Mylene. AND--- Here's another great part - we are introduced to this uncharted unregulated "slums" sector of Macross 7 where Bassara lives and Mylene flees to. ANd she's come to see Ray, but ends up DISTURBING BASSARA. Speaking of which - we keep going off about how persistent Basara is and how he doesn't care about anything but his music ... But actually - notice what happens in this episode - he's not bothering anybody. He's just working hard on his music -and this testy girl shows up pounding on his door and then brings her family troubles with her. That's so totally rude !! So who's being persistent? Suddenly Bassara can't work on his music in peace and quiet but has to confront huge body gaurds, the Mayor and take care of a whiney child who keeps battering at his door and making noise and has a little squeeky animal with her to boot. And notice what a TOTAL CONSIDERATE GENTLEMAN Bassara is in this scene. He COULD have said to Michael - oh, yes - that annoying little child is right here! Please take her away because I am an artist and need peace and quiet to work! But instead - he sticks up for Mylene, lies for her and gives Michael the once over. Only AFTER SAVING MYLENE does Basara immediately get back to his music. Now - we think that this is where he starts ignoring her? WRONG!! This is where Basara pours his true love heart out to her! The adults and bodygaurds are gone and he's got the cute girl to himself - so what's he supposed to do? Strike up a conversation? Um no! He's obviously going to sing in Mylene's presence in the hope that she'll be transfixed and love his music. But she - being an annoying little girl - starts babbling and arguing with him.. If she would just SHUT UP AND LISTEN TO HIS SONG - then MAYBE she'd learn. On this note - please notice that Bassara was upset in Episode 1 (and will be in episode 2) because the enemy didn't let him finish his song - and they weren't really listening either. They're not the only ones - since even most PEOPLE on the MACROSS 7 don't listen to his music!! Hell - not even MYLENE listens to his music!! He's strumming a song callled MY SOUL FOR YOUR and Mylene is asking "why do you sing? Why this? why that? why why why?" like a 2 year old douche bag! If she would just liten - she'd KNOW why he sings. So much for your stereotype of Bassara the oblivious. Oh - and now Ray comes in - and Bassara is AGAIN interrupted - but reacts like a total gentleman. And of course the conversation goes to Mylene and her family problems. Bassara might not be very good at comforting her, but at least he is certainly not oblivious - and he DID HELP HER IN PRACTICE. Anyways - then the enemy comes and Bassara's off to give his soul for everybody but whiny bratty little girly wirly Mylene is like ITSUKI ITSUKI ITSUKI (or whatever that word was) ("irresponsible!") and he's off and she's like "what about the Live concert?!" At least Ray realizes what he's doing... Anyways - now the military is launching again and the Bridge is full of activity. Diamond force launches and it's back to the routine. You know - if anything - the TRULY REPETITIVE THING IN THIS ANIME IS THE STUPID MILITARY STRATEGY. They just keep launching and getting screwed. And then we cut back to Bassara's room and at least RAY FINALLY APPRECIATES THE SONG!! Unlike bratty little whiney Mylene who has a lot to learn about life. And here- when Gamlin laucnhes - because now he's launching - notice HIS MOTIVE. Bassara is humming about giving his soul for others and about love. Gamlin thinks to himself that he will fight for the honor of Docker and Diamond Force. So again there's a contrast - a contrast between the artistic life and the military life (with music contrasted to the hospital with the wounded and sadness of the living then and now honor as a motive for fighting vs. the music that Bassara goes out to sing and the concept of My Soul for You. Now - the military DOES do something productive in this episode - namely they send out analysis crafts to see what exactly the enemy attack is life. Now... while Bassara is singing - cause he just began... I want to focus on the fact that he's a civilian and the fact that Gamlin shouts to him "MINKANJIN!" get out of the battle zone!! Now - remember the conversation in SDFM TV when Misa, Kakizaki, and Hikaru were captured and interogated by Boldoza? Remember when the Zendtradi were like "Min-kanjin?!" like "civilian? What the hell is that?" Well... Gamlin says "Minkanjin!" to Bassara in a way that EXPLICITLY suggests that civilians have their "place" - and it's not in a battle - that's where soldiers should be. And since the universe is full of war and conflict - then basically Minkanjins are supposed to sit around while the soldiers do the fighting - JUST LIKE THE PROTOCULTURE BELIEVED WHEN THEY BUILD THE ZENTRADI TO DO THEIR FIGHTING!! But in Macross - it was a MINKANJIN - Lyn Minmey - who turned the tide and transformed the universe and destiny of humanity. Because actually the civilians are the most powerful - they are more powerful than all the bullets and guns put together - but they aren't conscious of it. And Bassara through his music is going to remind them. In any case - as Ray says in the end - not even the people on M7 were cheering for Bassara. Thankfully - whiny bratty Mylene.. oh - stupid me!! I thought (as did we all watching it the first time) didn't go to Bassara to congratulate him or tell him "your music touched my heart" but to scream at him again USUTSKI USUTKI USUTSKI!! Man - come on!! This Basara guy does NOT get a break!!! HOW CAN YOU NOT SYMPATHIZE WITH THIS GUY BY THIS POINT PEOPLE!??! 1. He's sitting at home minding his own business in a slum far away from everybody not bothering anybody and a braty girl bangs down his door and interrupts him. 2. Then the bratty girl's mother shows up with 7 foot tall muscle bound body gaurds that would give Agent One a run for his money and they try to muscle in on Bassara! 3. When he's finally gotten rid of them and tries to go back to working on his music, the whiny bratty girl interrogates him! (this despite the fact that he was a total gentleman and helped her) 4. Then the enemy show up 5. Then Gamlin shows up and screams at him while other people are shooting at him trying to kill him 6. Then NOBODY listens to his music - not the humans, not the protodevilin, and NOT the star sex bomb cute girl character of the show Mylene! NOBODY! 7. And then he gets chewed out for being late to his concert! the end. And this show has no substance? And Bassara is just presented as a demi-god who waltzs on air and sings? And this episode is "just the same" as episode 1? And next episode all 7 of the above things are going to happen again with no changes? Nothing new added? This show is great! Bomba! Pete

Well - there's plenty of time to catch up because we're only on Episode 2 so far, and there hasn't been much by way of discussion yet because we've just got two episodes down... But there HAS been a general tendency to constantly repeat the refrain that the first few (8, 10, 13 etc) episodes are basically all the same and things only get going later - and I've been trying to challenge that assertion. I hope that as we progress in our viewing, we can bring that subject back up again with the benefit of having watched that beginning and re-think the premis of the stereotype. Pete why am I talking like Perceptor today?!

At the risk of giving too much away, I'm not jealous of the licking - but rather...the guiding. Hm. On that note - am I to understand that being a resin statue, gun-guiding, gun-licking Yoko needs to be pre-assembled before looking good? I hope they don't expect me to paint it. Yeah - PVC would be preferable to something you need to assemble... Pete

I know you guys are gonna all laugh at me - and I deserve it.... but honest to gosh - that picture is EXACTLY what comes to mind anytime I hear or read the title "Cowbody Bebop" I guess I need to go watch this anime... Pete

Well I did explicitly ask And yeah - after writing that post I remembered that it was with a J, which is why I KNEW I was making a mistake... but having no contact with the english language on a daily basis beyond MW sometimes makes my brain malfunction Pete (and no, teaching ESL doesn't count as "contact with the english language" - think of it more like reducing your speech down to the level that your 4 year old might understand that it's not good to poopy in his pants)

I think it would be more productive if he went to Washington DC and took out all the CIA people who financed the Mujahideen, who gave Saddam Hussein Chemicle Weapons and other military aid when he was on "our side" and then maybe also found the guys responsible for sending 70 thousand Americans to die in Vietnam while they helped the Kmere Rouge run cocaine through the Ho Chi Minh trail. This is actually why I liked Rambo: First Blood - because he was focusing his anger where it deserved to be focused: not on skinny illiterate impoverished farmers in Vietnam that could never be a threat to him - but on a complacent, ignorant society that sent him and his friends to a war that didn't need to be fought. Just a thought. Pete

Ah... this is the sweetness that Hasbro uses to rope you in...it's just a 10 buck toy...what's the big deal? I once thought as you do... But then I started to count. I noticed that I had several hundred of these "10 buck toys" "How enthusiastic should I be over a $10 toys? I'ts a pretty good, inexpensive figure and decent for a casual purchase" sounds so innocent. But let's translate it into the reality of being a Transformers collector: "How enthusiastic should I be over seven hundred $10 toys? They're pretty good, inexpensive figures and decent for a casual purchase." Oh really? Thousand of dollars of "casual purchases" later - we look in horror at our shelves and closets only to find mounds upon mounds of "pretty good" figures. Is that really what we want out of life? Do we really want things that are "pretty good" - in abundance? Or would it maybe be better to have quantitavely less things but have them all be up to snuff, quality wise? I guess I'm reminiscing because yesterday I finally got around to cleaning and firmly putting my collection on display on TWO SHELVES in a walk in closet. Yes - just two shelves. And those two shelves are packed full of excellence that did not come cheap and easy - quantitavely, there are probably no more than about 60 figures there. 60. There used to be maybe 600. But those sixty are all top of the line true gems that I think are worth more than a casual purchase. And I think to myself that this is preferable than drinking the Transformers Kool Aid... it's so easy to convince yourself that it's just 10 bucks here, 10 bucks there - no biggie. But IMO... it's how they get you hooked on terrible toys. It's a cycle that must be broken. It's time I stopped writing I guess Pete ranting against TFs for ...what is it...at least a year? Or maybe just a month?

Yeah - maybe I'm old hat - but no amount of S&M giggly boobs (or is that gigly boobs...how do you spell "giggly" - the word for gigle as opposed to "ha ha" / giggle...oh - I answered my own question...) Errr...no amount of gigly boobs and S&M or even cute fluffy green hair or anything will ever top the utter beauty and grace of Misa... what a girl! Pete

Gubaba - you need to create a link in your Sig that leads to a paypal account where people can donate a coupel of dollars to you every time you do things like this which surely make them happy. That is AWESOME!!! Pete

The debate gets livelier. I have already addressed the different way that RT treats sex as opposed to Macross, but now some more points beg themselves: 1. The Question of whether MF is original, and whether Macross remains fresh and original. This opinion that Macross Frontier follows the same formula and is pretty much a copy of Macross, and in fact that all the Macross franchises keep copying the same formula, down to minute details being similar, albeit subtley so, is, in my opinion one of those crusty stereotypes that apparently form around an anime after people stop watching and discussing it. It's just like the crusty stereotype regarding Macross 7 that the beginning is just planet dance and Bassara singing and that the whole anime is just Basara flying around and singing. As with every stereotype - there is great truth in it - the key here, though, is to not allow the stereotypes to overwhelm the living story that is being told - and that happens when the story is no longer unfolding before our eyes, but rather becomes a memory and we apparently start compartementalizing it, dressing the thing up until it's an easy platitude - a simple, crusty stereotype. This particular stereotype regarding MF being just "the same" as SDFM TV in a million respects and details was actually bandied about by those who did not like the anime as a primary argument as to why the anime was bad - because, to summarize - it was just a cheap shot of nostalgia - a redesign of the originals. According to this thinking Ozma was Roy, Alto was Hikaru, Michael was Max, Klan Klan was Milia etc etc etc. Of course, this is complete hogwash - as has been demonstrated in numerous discussions when a reall point-by-point comparisson of SDFM TV was made with MF. The fact is that there are only surface similarities - but to say that they are just copying the original formulae (beyond a very general and vague notion of "copying" that is enclosed in the very concept of continuity) is akin to basically saying that "it's all the same" because Alto's VF-25F has red lines on it - just like Hikaru's VF-1J. I can of course get in to the minute details and repeat all of the arguments, or at the very least search the forum for where they are presented (maybe I'll do that in a second...it would add some meat to the post) - but that's beside the point. All I wanted to do was knock down the firmness of this notion that Macross is repetitive in any fundamental sense. It certainly is not. Well - look at the quote from the FUNimation guy in the article I linked to when ranting about sex in Macross vs. sex in the Shadow Chronicles. [note: I dare say the article was written by somebody who must be spiritually related to HG, since just by virtue of quoting from the article, I'm apparently going to commit a capital offence since "Permission to republish Robotech wins award in print or online must be granted by the author in writing."... although.... I guess that by just quoting that, I have apparently commited murder and need to be jailed...] The CEO of FUNimation had this to say: "This is an exciting award for Robotech: The Shadow Chronicles," said Gen Fukunaga, president and CEO of FUNimation. "It is a series that has a tremendous fan following and it has the ability to introduce a much larger audience to the appeal of anime." The year that this was published was 2006. Well now - that tells us something. That tells us that in the year 2006, FUNimation and HG seemed to think that it was necessary to use a bootleg of three different anime to "introduce a much larger audience to the appeal of anime." This is curious. Wouldn't it have been better to make an original anime that was appealing? My point is - they seem to STILL consider that Robotech is supposed to be some kind of vehicle that needs to "show the appeal of anime" - and "anime" is something foriegn that nobody will ever be interested in unless intermediaries - middle men like HG - westernize the "anime" to make it "appealing." Now, perhaps there is some business sense to that quote - perhaps what he is thinking of is putting anime on prime time where currently things like...I dunno...Sponge Bob...or whatever cartoons kids watch these days are? But this misunderstands the medium, I think. It's kind of like noticing that Transformers The Movie made lots of money at the box office, and therefore taking the Polish science fiction movie Sexmission (about the last two men who survive in a post-apocalyptic world ruled by feminists where there are no men in existence any more, females rule the planet and grow themselves in genetic tubes), dubbing over it, changing the story to make it sound like a Western with John Wayne in it, and rushing it into theatres to try to get those stupid people who like the mass-appeal robot movie into more serious stuff. Why? There is a place for mass appeal movies and cartoons - in fact, all of us sometimes like to turn off our brains, eat some popcorn, enjoy some action and FX and relax. Just like kids don't always have to watch intelligent animation - and in fact, animation doesn't have to be for kids and often isn't nowadays. Anime is anime - there's no need to "westernize" it - and there's certain no need to produce a film with the intention of "broadening the appeal for anime." I mean - what does that catch phrase mean? I offer that it's completely thoughtless. Because - what? Are they hoping people will see Robotech and think - wow! Anime is great! I need to now go see Macross, Gundam, Ideon, K-On etc etc etc? Are they hoping that people will say "wow! This anime stuff is great! Bring us more HG!!" and then HG can go to China, buy the rights to a couple of half assed old anime, string them together and release them as Robot Battles! I seriously don't understand. A film, a book, a comic - an anime - should all be made for self-contained reasons. Sure - in 1985 it might have been feasable to say "nobody in America knows about the awesomeness of Japanese anime so let's bring over these three anime and make Robotech" - but in 2006? In 2006? In 2006 people are not ignoring the Shadow Chronicles because they don't find anime appealing. They are ignoring the SHadow Chronicles because they don't find IT appealing. Instead, they find ANIME appealing - anime like Macross. And anime is doing fine without companies like HG hacking it up. You know what they SHOULD do is just produce their own stuff. Call it Robotech even - and this idea has been mentioned a zillion times - but produce your own stuff. Call it "American anime" or whatever...I dunno... but then again - not every culture and country has to be masterful at doing the same thing. I like the uniqueness of Japanese anime and I completely don't mind it being a Japanese phenomena. Hm.. Yes. Pete

Ooo... another interesting point. First Taks makes one, now you. That's good. Brings life to the thread. This is worth considering because, I noticed that Shadow Chronciles got some award for best science fiction animation of the year from some place in Arizona...wait let me google it... Ok - yeah - here it is - best Sci-Fi at the Horror and Sci-Fi Film Festival in Tempe Arizona (http://animatedfilms.suite101.com/article.cfm/robotech_wins_award) Now - I'm not going to get into how insignificant this award is because, in all truth, if MACROSS won an award like this, we wouldn't be pointing out how insignificant it is - we'd be saying "that's nice" and "good for them" -- because a group of people liked Macross and decided it was worthy of recognition - independent of whether that group of people were significant in the "industry" as a whole. BUT - what I would like to consider is...why would anybody give them any kind of award? Even an "insignificant" one or at least a non-top tier one? And I wonder - how many of the judges at that event KNEW that Robotech was actually a bootleg of three different anime put together? I'm betting most of them were judging it on the merits of the story as it was, without any reference to its' past or the controversy surrounding Macross/Robotech. And concievably, I could see them being swayed by the "surprising" and dramatic plot point of Ariel the invid-who-looks-like-a-human-porn-star being accepted into human society. On this note - might I offer that it would be hard NOT to accept Ariel into human society and that all men dream of the chance to encounter an alien being who is meek and eager to please in order to prove that she is not evil, and also happens to be hot... at least Macross didn't tip toe around sexuality but instead had a lot of great fun with it - particularly as Milia goes (the scene where Max checks her out in his mind is priceless and to my mind, no body seems to be at all aware of how hot Ariel is in Shadow Chronicles. In walks this bodacious babe and everyone judges her on whether or not she's an invid and in the end - it's not her sex appeal that wins the REF over - no - it's her heroic actions. Ble! What a lot of hog wash! In Macross, it was Milia's sex appeal that won Max over - no doubt about it. Max didn't wait to discern whether she would "join" her enemies, he didn't consider whether or not Milia was heroic or not - all he cared about was getting some - and securing that fine ass for a life time via marriage. A base and low motive? BUT THAT'S THE POINT!! That's the point because it just goes to show that just like music and song and culture are inherent in people - even biogenetically engineered giants who live in a regimented military fashion - so too the sexual drive transcends all temporal political considerations and can bring even enemies together! That's how powerful sex is. Now if this is "moe" or "dirty" then it's more a testimony to the pre-pubecent level of thought governing supposed adults who make these kind of distinctions in animated programing. Because you see - Ariel DOES use sex appeal - like the majority of the Shadow Chronicles cast - she uses the most classic type of sex appeal to be found in American programing of this sort: namely implicit rather than explicit. The REF guys don't notice Ariel's tits and ass enough to really do much about it, but WE THE AUDIENCE are EXPECTED to notice them just enough to at least keep watching. It's the Megan Fox "eye candy" scheme. And before you say "but Japanese anime has eye candy too" or even "Macross has eye candy too" - I submit to you - and repeat - that Milia's sexuality is not MERELY there to attract audience attention - it's ALSO and FOREMOST there because it actually SERVES the plot of the anime by demonstrating that sex, like culture, supercedes political differences and breaks down barriers between ostensible enemies. And of course THAT is a prospect that seems t be TOO HORRIFIC for American audiences to grasp. MUSIC defeating war making is bad enough, but SEX?! Sexual attraction being more powerful than the desire to kill kill kill your enemy? Oh no! That's moe! Quick - get back to showing people shooting guns and slaughtering eachother! Pete