VFTF1

Um...going back to the M7 VF-100s... Contrary to what I posted earlier, now I'm all excited by the VF-19Kai. I hope Bandai makes Sound Force as VF-100s.... I think the M7 stuff might actually work better in 1/100 scale anyways given it's a bit more super robotish... In any event....looking forward to it. Pete

Argg...Mylene is so cute when she isn't wearing that cosmically clownish concert get up... Pete

Well - here's the problem: What would happen if the only thing that a 'legal' industry company had to do was to put some subtitles on a DVD? Gee...that doesn't cost too much, does it? What about all those dub voice actors, musicians, and geniuses like Karl Macek who would surely bring their creative brilliance to the process in order to transform a wierd foriegn work into something more palpatable? Of coruse - it makes no sense, really, in the age of the internet and globalism to do such a thing. What makes people remotely interested in anime is...the fact that it's ANIME. I really don't see the logic of saying "hey - there's a big interest in Japanese anime so let's bring it over, butcher it, dub it, change the story, change the names, change the dialogue, change the music and sell it." I mean - personally, I think that the demand is for the original stuff. All that's required are subs. So - to me - there is no future in the "import and adapt" industry. The future is what we see with our own two eyes - fans subbing stuff and foriegners being able to see it for free. Let me be more clear: Do Japanese people have to pay to watch Macross Frontier on TV? No. So why would non-Japanese people have to pay to see it on the internet - which is no different (and actually better than) TV? Money from an anime is made off of merchandising - selling tangible goods that, while they can be bootlegged, can't be acquired in any other form than through purchasing. As for the bootleg market - I don't like it - but there's no point in whining over that one either. There will always be people who want to have something with a designer label on it and not pay the price of the designer label. I think these people are silly. If you're going to buy designer clothes and accessories - buy the damn original. If you want to show of your bling - do it. If you don't have the money - go to Walmart. There's no shame in it. But I guess it's like a psychological thing where people are embarrassed NOT to have trendy labels and hope that nobody will notice it's bootlegged. Although usually - everybody notices. But whatever. The same goes for Transformers, Gundams and other stuff that is bootlegged. Ultimately - it's done in response to consumer demand for bootlegs. I would wager that only a fraction of the target audience actually gets FOOLED. I mean - come on - how many of you CAN'T tell an original Gundam from a bootleg? How many of you have accidentally bought a bootlegged VF-1 instead of an original? People who are interested enough in something to pay for it on a steady basis usually go to great lengths to learn about the stuff. My point is - this is the reality of the market. We can whine about it and bitch and moan about it - but it will be the same as the whining bitching and moaning of people who complained that cars would make trains obsolete, or that video killed the radio (good song by the way). Technology often progresses in ways we can't fathom. The battle against "piracy" is nothing more than an attempt by corporations to use government to protect their market share rather than letting the market solve the issue. Now, lots of publishers who are smart actually offer their stuff for free on the internet - as e-books and what not - because they wager that most people will just read fragments of the e-book and if they like it - they will buy the physical thing. What is the difference between this and going to Borders, taking a book off the shelf and sitting down to read it? I remember being in NYC once in a Forbidden Planet and the dude was like "no reading the comic books in the store. You need to buy it if you want to read it." Suffice to say I never went back there. How idiotic is that? If he were smart, he'd open a small cafe as part of the comic shop to let people read while sitting down and enjoying coffee or something. I understand a "if you spill coffe/damage it then you must pay for it rule" - but please - not letting you read comics? Face it. The internet is here to stay. People will scan, people will download - and calling it piracy is like saying that my friend who loaned me his copy of Moby Dick is a pirate or that Libraries engage in mass piracy for lending books for a fee. The debate about whether or not to bring anime to the usa and "alter it or not" is a dead debate. It's not going to happen - at least not in that form. There won't be companies bringing this stuff over en mass. It is and will continue to happen via the internet. There are niche markets all around the globe that were born for anime because of the internet - the markets are too small individually to be worth the efforts of a corporation - but since the internet costs nothing and googling and downloading is free - tens of thousands of people globally have been exposed to anime who would otherwise not have been. Now - a smart company will look at that and say: EXCELLENT! So much free advertising! Such broad appeal. The days where your demographic was limited to one country or one region are over. Japanese anime is popular as Japanese anime throughout the globe and there's no point in Americanizing it, Germanizing it, Swahilizing it. Why? There's American stuff and German stuff and stuff peculiar to each part of the globe out there and it's fine to see it as it is. People still caught up on this issue are akin to folks who back in 1919 might have sat around wondering "so...you think these "air plane" things will have any mass appeal?" or "so...you think these "car" things will ever truly replace the horse and buggy?" And companies who base their business strategy on whining about the internet are going to fail. They might win a couple of court cases even -but in the long run - there is nothing that can stop the development of this technology. It will shatter the old ways of doing business and thinking about the world. The only question is will people adapt or will they fight against what's happening? If the latter, then we're in for a rough ride. Pete

Macross will always be a mixture - it will always have slice-of-life, mecha, singing, battles, aliens, star ships, - the works. That's what makes it successful is having all of these elements rolled up in one. Pete

That's great actually, because there's nothing better to get for Christmas than the chance to watch the Sighs of Haruhi Suzumiya! Enjoy! Pete

Interesting. I also generally had some trouble liking the mecha art in M7 for the reasons noted above. But then again, it could also be due to the fact that the VF-1, which is not as complex as the VF-11B/C or VF-17 simply looks fine using "less complex" animation styles... or maybe it was because of Macross Plus. Seeing how the VF-11B looked in Macross Plus, you kind of expect them to carry that over to M7. Heh - in fact- it's almost like Macross Plus gave us great mecha anime and sub-par character anime while M7 gave us good character animation with sub par mecha animation. Only Macross Frontier managed to succeed on all fronts. It really is an awesome series... Pete

I agree. I actually don't want an "official" American release of MF or any other Macross show or really any anime for that matter unless the DVDs have the unaltered version with subtitles on them for people like me. And that also brings up another good point: Namely EVEN IF companies released westernized versions on DVD, there'd still be people (like me) downloading to get the original version because to me - it's interesting to see what the Japanese like and how they do things. There are plenty enough purely western/American cartoons. Not everything has to be tailored to the same standards. Pete

Heh. It would be "Ella Fitzgerald" .... Oh well - in any event- I'm happy to have found her Too bad there seems to be NO fan art of her Pete

I would rather see Photon made into a movie than RT. pete

Honestly- the notion that Robotech is going to get made into a live action movie EVER is just so so so cosmically far fetched in my mind. I mean - I have been very VERY wrong about a great many things in my life - so naturally this might just be one of them. But seriosly - I just can't fathom it. I mean - like...I can see it as a topic of conversation on a web forum. But I don't believe that anybody of any importance in Warner Brothers is sitting there, wondering "how can I make Robotech into a hit live action movie?" and that there are board meetings about this or anything of the sort. I know that a lot of stupid crap gets produced or at least gets a hearing in Holywood... but I dunno... this is just not something that I can see anybody taking seriously. At all. I could be totally wrong. But there it is. Pete

Like I PMed you - I'm just saying that you're expressing a political opinion (the art about government taking but never giving anything back) I personally actually AGREE with your opinion. But I just wouldn't want anybody to accuse you of getting political - which is not allowed by the rules. I personally think there's nothing wrong with what you said - but it could fall under the "no politics" rule. It's ok to talk about taxes on imports - of course that's part of the topic. But all I'm saying is that generalizing and saying government only takes and never gives back is political (and again -I agree with that opinion - but it doesn't matter whether I agree or not). Also - as I wrote in my PM - I think the "no politics" rule is good because usually people who normally would be friendly with eachother end up arguing and fighting over politics. And finally - I personally think that because politics is so corrupt and evil - then it's not really worth the time spent discussing it or venting over it anyways. Please don't take my comment as suggesting that there was something "wrong" with what you said. I'm not a mod or anything. I just noticed a little bit of politics in the post and wanted to point it out to you before somebody else did - as a way of keeping you on the safe straight and narrow Maybe I was being overly paranoid. It could also be due to the fact that I'm due back at my local tax office for ANOTHER two hour audit on this Thursday... Pete

Amen. But we better shut up and move it to PMs because there are rules forbidding us from going this route - and I support those rules, above all because the best way to smash the system is to IGNORE it and talk about anime girls and giant transforming robots instead - in other words - the things that really matter in life! Pete

I'd watch it! I loved Jem! Jem is outrageous...Jem is contageous...J-j-j-JEM! All they need is mecha.... Pete

Aw, you guys are clearly not cheap sentimentalists like me I fell in love right away. She's my new ideal of what a woman should look like Pete

To me, that sounds like a pretty shoddy reason to want Robotech for. I mean - can't Warner just develop their own giant robot/super robot/transforming robot franchise if they're really that hell bent on it? Makes little sense to me. If anything, it's more like the success of Transformers gave HG some talking points in trying to get people in Holywood to give them some money for an otherwise dead property. "Because hey - this will be like the next Transformers." And now if you say "next Transformers" people will think "oh - box office hit!" and it grabs their attention. But then they see the mess that Robotech is, and discover that it's not all that interesting or different from a zillion other sci-fi properties... Anyways - I don't believe in the fairy tail that WB thought "wow! look at the success of Transformers - quick - get on the phone to HG!" It was rather the other way around - HG trying to prop up their property as a valuable asset deserving the attention of a big studio because "it's like Transformers." Pete

She is neither She is the hottest bridge bunny in the Universe. She works on the Macross Riviera Pete

This is not character art, but rather a screen grab. However, I am firmly convinced (no pun intended ;P) that she does deserve some appreciation. The hottest bridge bunny in the Macross universe IMO. pete

In fairness - Macross 7 itself has alot of anti-M7 trolling - it goes with the territory. Pete

This looks like something I'd be into going to see at the theatre...er...theater...er...movie showing place... cinema? I hate living abroad for so long... Pete

But I get the feeling that VF2SS was talking about a "hate meme" (his words) and not anyone's particular hatred. And in this sense I have to agree, as I've started rewatching Macross 7 and hopefully this will come to be reflected in the "rewatching M7" thread. The point is that a meme is like a social convention or opinion that makes the round and gets to be accepted truth without anybody really ever checking - and this goes for the "M7 love meme" just as much as the "hate meme." I've said it before and will say it again: after years of debate on the subject, it seems that Macross fandom has settled on two versions: either you love and accept Bassara as the savior of the universe and his music as awesome - and therefore overlook any and all potential goofiness in M7 OR you exagerate that goofiness to make it sound like there's nothing else in the series except a red and yellow valk with some dude singing J-POP and making rainbow colored swirls shoot at Inhumanoids rejects. Both of these memes are - as the majority of memes tend to be - not completely accurate. Macross 7 is a far richer story, and Bassara is a far more complex and complete character than iether detractors or supporters give him credit for. This is why I think it is good sometimes to re-watch a series and verify people's opinions - and also, maybe people will see something new they haven't seen before. Pete on a personal crusade to broaden the range of debate regarding Macrss 7 and escape the confines of what has effectively become Suxorz vs Rulez!

Ok...ok...I guess you're right. I was even thinking of having a democratic election in the tradition of Eastern European democracy - where I'd ask if we could move on when everyone was asleep, vote yes, there would be 0 no votes, and the motion would pass with 100% approval... But yeah..you're right. It's just that there's this cute girl later on that I never noticed that I really want to oogle over...but...hm...fine...episode 1...episode 1... I shall remain patient and sign off for now. Maybe if I don't look at the thread for a couple days it'll grow? Besides...Friday IS just around the corner now. I mean - it's already Monday. That means Friday's like TOMORROW not counting the days in between. Pete

You're prediction is about 7 years late: http://www.robotech.com/news/viewarticle.php?id=61 Mind you, I didn't read any of the details, but clearly they were thinking about it. But then I guess there realized there were no pre-existing flash animation anime features to bootleg and it would require them to do some work, so the project got nixed. Pete

I do: it's because they didn't take Macross 7 Dynamite to heart!! BOMBA!! Pete (hoping that he isn't mistaken in thinking Dynamite was the one where Bassara's songs touch the heart of space whales?) Um...and to stay on topic: I don't want to see a sequel to the Shadow Chronicles!

I'm becoming inclined to pull a Bassara in terms of pacing - there's a later episode in which, mid-song, he suddenly decided "screw this - since nobody seems to be enjoying this song very much, I'll just switch to the next one!" and - bam! - starts singing a new song, forcing the rest of the band to go along with his selfishness.... So - would it be fair to say that we've exhausted the well of opinions about episode 1? Have we given it a fair hearing? Should we move on to episode 2? Or am I just being impatient? Pete

Ah - the ending of Frontier was close enough. Few seemed to believe that the Vajra were going to be turned by the power of song just as I predicted Pete