Roy Focker

I've been having major computer problems so I'm way too behind on this topic. I can't keep up. I'm afraid I'm have to surrender to fight another day. I will leave one last comment. I see someone posted a picture of Myung and said, 'is this how you look at your attempted rapist?' No but in that same scene on the Star hill, Myung looks like she about to jump out of her skin when Guld grabbed her by the shoulders and brought her close to him. She seems very afraid. In that scene she's making the right expression. Moments later when Dyson wants to fight Guld Myung between them and her expression is enough to make Dyson to back off.

So far have Toonz, Toonz and Toonz has beaten out Toonz for the top 3.

Okay my computer had a major fit on me (details too scary to go talk about) I lost every file on it. That includes all my Macross Pics and down loaded episodes of Macross 7 and Macross Zero I even lost my wall paper! Then I thought how can I turn this situation into something positive? I thought create a Wall Paper Contest. I'm looking to you to create my next wall paper. The winner will be allowed with my blessing to start any off topic discussion any where ever they want it and I won't close, move or delete it for at least two whole weeks. Imagine you starting a topic that I don't close for 2 whole weeks General Rules: 1. The Wall Paper must be 'Roy Focker' or his 'VF-1S' theme. 2. The dead line to submit a wall paper is 1 week from now. 2. I will pickwhat I consider to be the top 3 which will then go into a poll. 3. Posters from all over MW have 1 week to vote for the wall paper that I will use from that point forward. 4. The winner tells me which Off Topic that they don't want me to close for 2 weeks.* *Disclaimer. Remember Off Topic and an offensive topic are two different things. If your topic becomes something that would offend most people I will step in and close it.

This was already closed.

People: This is really enlighting but we don't want to go from talking about story that touches social issues to just talking about the issues.

Did you ever look at the toy section of the main MW site? You can pretty much look at pics of the Macross toys and all their parts.

Please don't assume that I'm not educated on the subject either. If we are going into actual social issues then we will be going too far off topic. We are both saying it was at least an attempted rape. I'm saying that the scene may not be an exact presentation of how the events occurred because the way the scene is presented. This leaves the chance that the events could have went farther. We can't say it couldn't of went farther because they would never forgive him because his attempt was already too far. I don't even think Myung or Isamu would of even overlooked his attempt. An attempt so violent that it might even of ended up with Guld killing her and Isamu. Guld's assault on her even if it didn't go any further would have been enough to keep both Myung and Isamu away from him.

We are talking about a fictional story where the rules of 'people would never do that in real life so, couldn't happen here either' don't always apply. The whole memory is coming from a man with a fragile mind in the form of disurbing dream like sequence. Even if we take the events as they were shown as the real events, Myung is still sleeping with someone who at least attempted to rape her. Even if he only attacked her and ripped her shirt that is still an attempt at very violent crime and shouldn't be excusable action either. I think Isamu would to beat the crap out of Guld even just for an attempt but apparently he and Myung decided to protect Guld. In the rules of real life they would notice that Guld needs some mental help after that event but instead they try sweep it under the rug. All three of those characters back in the day had emotional issues but kept each other functional together. I don't think any one of them was using reason or the rules of real life. Instead of getting Guld help when he snapped they just decide to hide it from him. That act of concealing it turn them all disfunctional to a point where none of them were hardly following the rules of real life.

See the last post in this closed topic http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...act=ST&f=4&t=83

Way 2 many TF topics. Closing the ones with the least # o' posts.

Sounds like you answered your own question.

What he said.

Even Fued is credited with saying 'some times a cigar is just a cigar.' Yet what other meanings could a ripped shirt mean? Can any of think of reasons why you would rip off a woman's shirt? The shirt wasn't 100% cotton maybe? You can tell by the animation that it's more a dream like seqence then a true flash back. We see other real flash backs in Macross plus (Isamu flying the glider, the three holding the planet). In those cases everything looks like the rest of the animation but the picture is a tad unfocused. Those flash backs are appearing in the story. Guld's is appearing in his mind. The film is different color, it is barely even animated. Look at the way the door opens to the room. There is marked difference between Guld's memory and the other flash backs. The scene in Guld's mind is very surreal. The point of the scene isn't meant to be an exact sequence of the actual of events but Guld realising that it was him.

I'm not saying we know that he raped her 100% but it highly suggested that things may have went beyond what you have seen. It's a dream sequence they are never meant to be take literally. Is the idea that Guld might some thing like that so damaging to people psyche that they totally refuse to accept it? Gee isn't that Guld did? Consider that the mirror wasn't originally there. In Guld's previous memory it was Isamu who did the 'deed'. At the moment of 'killing' Isamu's YF-19 a repressed memory comes out in Guld mind in the form of a dream sequence. He's seeing things through the eyes of the attacker. That attacker isn't Isamu but who is it? Finally in Guld's mind he imagines the 'mirror' which tells him he's the attacker. The mirror may never been there in the first place but it's in his mind to show him that the eyes of the attacker are his own. Once Guld figures it out in the dream sequence that there's no point in him eating a ham sandwich or showing raping her because he remembers that it was him. The whole point of the sequence was to reveil it was him and not the exact events of how they played out. The torn shirt is a clearly image of at least his intent to rape her. There can no other intent behind that act. I serious doubt that he was tearing her shirt because it was a Xmas gift that he wanted back. How far he got with the rape is unknown but anyone who studied anything on film doesn't need anything more graphic to figure out what is being suggested. It's a memory being played out as a dream sequence. They are often shown in film as being disjointed, dream like and more focused on images then on facts. If Isamu has a similar repressed memory but it's of him and Guld eating hotdogs together guess what's suppose to mean? 'Oh I know that he and Guld ate hotdogs for lunch one day right?' ' Yeah they 'ate' 'hot dogs' alright.' Images that are shown in a dream like sequence are not meant to taken literally. One can not look at dream like sequence and say 100% is fact. Some thing happen that day that was so bad that Guld repressed it and his closest friends decided to keep it from him. Guld convinced himself that is was Isamu, Myung saw Guld as victim as well, Isamu couldn't stand it and left. The 'event' was so bad that it made Guld want to kill Isamu and made Myung on edge when ever Guld touched her (notice the scene when touches her shoulders from behind and she nearly jumps). This was an event that could ruin Guld so much that Myung and Isamu went thought extreme lenghts to protect him. To believe that they went through all of this over just over a torn shirt is a bit naive. Something really bad happen that went beyond the images we saw. What it saw exactly was left up to the viewer but the torn shirt was pretty clear suggestion of Guld's intent.

Don't you remember Destroid is combo of the words Desroy+Droid. Calling it Destroyed has to be an Engrish mistake.

I'll tell you why it couldn't be Jason. Didn't people dail a 1-900 number to kill him off? People paid money to vote to kill that character. I didn't call (hell I didn't know who Jason was until I heard about it on the news) but I would call DC crooks who ran huge scam if they brought that character back from the dead. I never saw the orignal ad for the number but I doubt the character can ever return. Money was exchanged to kill him. Ingoring this at later date can bring a potential legal situation. Hell if paid money to kill him. I would want him to stay dead or a full refund with interest.

I still think people hate Macross 7 do to their perceptions of what Macross should be (Macross Plus). Macross 7 attacks your perceptions so much about Macross that you can turned off by it. I believe Kawamori did not intend Macross 7 to be your typical mecha anime. The vast majority of us were turned off at the start of Macross 7. Either you became a fan after watching more or your perceptions were so damaged that you turned off for good. I also blame reading about it first as shaping peoples opinion of Macross 7 before they actually see it. Once I had internet access I went to research all I could about Macross 7. As I read but faces of Valkyries, singing and monsters I started to convince myself that I wouldn't like it.

Why is the term 'symbolism' so hard to believe. Guld's memory is basically dream sequence. Look at the coloring of the animation and the speed of the footage (Looks like there's less cells) it's not meant to be a flash back of exact events but what currently happing in Guld's mind. The facts can still be fuzzy in Guld's memory. The mind may still be trying to protect itself. Guld doesn't need to see himself going further. The mirror could be a creation of his mind just confirming that was he doing the 'deed.' Mirrors have to be one of the most common clich'ed symbols. Next you people will be saying Hikaru really did have a magic bike.

Well I thought it was a joke that was in really bad taste. I thought was best just to delete before people started to get offended. If you couldn't figure out that it's offensive nature got it delete yourself well then Oh and besides it appeared to be mostly refering to Robotech so it didn't belong here anyways.

Exactly. You can not trust the Guld's memory as fact. It's more symbolism than anything else. For all we know there wasn't even a mirror at the actual event but when the repress memory came out then mirror appeared in Guld's mind for the memory. Even though an actually rape isn't seen it's pretty much suggested. I think it would be pretty graphic to show a 5 minutes rape scene when a torn shirt tells you what likely happen.

Danguard Ace and SuperOstrich have'nt turned mean yet because they're still virgins mods here. Plus we haven't given them their Mod bar mitzvah yet either.

Next time anyone gives a vague topic title like this I'll delete their topic. This one I'll just close.

Here we go again....

The longest thread is luxury better suited for a board with a smaller membership. I think we are just too big if it. Also the subject matter typically posting in it is something more suited for a chat room.

At least Bubba's got great taste in outfits. Oh yeah the Starwars kid old news ain't it?