Radd

I gotta agree with Keith on this one. That episode was pretty standard M7 fare, it just had more than the usual amount of SDF "fan service" than the normal episode.

Where did you get your information for the VF-XX?

I really dig the Nova Satori picture, aside from my usual complaints. There is one thing that bugs me, look at the armour on her arms, it's so thin as to look like spandex. That wouldn't be so bad except that where the armour gives way to joints and the like, her arms are impossibly skinny.

A fansub group has announced that they plan to tackle the entire series. They plan to devote all their resources to it after they finish up Galaxcy Railways and a couple other projects. This is a fansub group that's known for finishing what they start, too.

I haven't seen much 999. I've actually been avoiding it, hoping to see the tv series first, especially before the movies. The thing that impresses me the most about Endless Odyssey is the lack of CG, that Arcadia is drawn, not modelled! It doesn't hurt that Rin Taro is an absolutely incredible director, one of Japan's finest, in my opinion. You should check out the fansubs of Galaxy Railways, it's a wonderful show. I'm sure you'll love it.

I don't mind the 2050 design, I'd probably like it a lot on it's own, but it just does not say "Matsumoto" let alone "Yamato" to me. If Great Yamato loses the dish and the Christmas lights, I'd take it over 2050 Yamato any day of the week. I can stand the wings, if they're absolutely neccessary to avoid legal entanglements. Minus the wings, basically going with the older Great Yamato idea, and you've got an excellent ship design that is still different from the original. And for Heaven's sake, please animate it by hand and not use crap CG. Sadly, Matsumoto just does not have any luck with CG. In every Matsumoto production I've seen, the CG stands out like a sore thumb and really detracts from the show.

20 years later and the animation still looks more impressive than some of it's sequels, and a lot of anime features out there. Definitely an example that 'old' doesn't mean 'bad animation' compared to newer stuff.

Eva has excellent animation, like I said in an earlier post, for about 5 minutes an episode. Most of the animation is (well drawn) still frames, with maybe a mouth moving or something. Sometimes not even that much. But then, an Angel attacks and the Budget kicks in, and you get to see where they spent all their animation money. Macross 7 on the other hand, the budget is spent more on the character animation, and less on the mecha animation. That's not to say the character animation is spectacular, you do get scenes that are well drawn stills with a mouth moving, but overall the animation is more consistent, with much more character animation than Eva.

This I disagree with completely. When available, you should support the shows you love. Do you think the people behind them live a life of luxury? Perhaps studio execs and backers, but the actual creators don't live very well at all. Buying the merchandise is all well and good, but if the anime is not selling, it will be dropped by the studio making it, along with any chance of future toys and sequels.

Of course, bootlegs of unlicensed anime, especially that out of print even in Japan, can sometimes be the only way to discover something new, or to get a series that no one seems to be willing to pick up.

Fansubs. Plus I believe Bandai is mainly going after those who are selling bootlegs of stuff that they have licensed. They really can't go after anyone who's selling bootlegs of something Bandai doesn't have rights to. Of course, they can go after those who are selling bootlegs of stuff that Bandai Japan has rights to. In addition, this 'crackdown' seems to be centered entirely on those distributers who sold bootlegs at AX, not affecting bootleg sales online and whatnot.

I posted this in another forum, but I think it fits for the most part. That isn't the whole answer to Gundam's popularity, though. I kinda have to agree with Graham's sentiments, if Big West had continued to make Macross sequels it would have continued to gain popularity. I doubt it ever would have reached Gundam proportions, though. Gundam has a lot of the 'mob mentality' reason for popularity behind it. I also think that a part of Gundam's popularity is how it rehashes the same story and characters. People like to see more of the same, but different. People don't like change. At least in general most people are neophobes. Also, the more you appeal to everyone, the less you appeal to invididuals. "Jack of all trades, master of none" as the saying goes. Still, it's the casual fans that rake in the money for companies. The hardcore fans are always a minority.

I'm generally against bootlegs of anything you can easily get licensed in your own country, unless the distributer did an absolutely wretched job of it. That said, I agree with those who point out that these vendors had it coming when they decided to sell said bootlegs at a convention sponsored by the company they were ripping off, even if said company had been more lenient in the past.

I apologize, you misunderstood my arguement. Comapre SDF Macross to it's peers, and compare M7 to it's peers. When you look at it like that, M7 compares more favourably to it's peers, than SDF to it's own peers in terms of animation. However, I do not deny that both are lacking in that category. I'm not even saying it's ok and we should just accept the bad animation, but your argument sounded like the bad animation was a basis for disliking the show entirely on it's own, yet SDF was somehow exempt from being disliked for that reason. I'm afraid we will just have to disagree. I see in M7 a strong theme, and character developement that far surpasses SDF, DYRL?, and Macross Plus. I'm a sucker for character developement, and that's really what drew me into this series (and probably why Gamlin is one of my favourite characters). I can't argue your Nadesico comments as I've somehow managed not to see the series yet. Again, I was referring to my initial statement . 'Your argument sounded like the bad animation was a basis for disliking the show entirely on it's own, yet SDF was somehow exempt from being disliked for that reason.' I was going by the assumption that you think SDF is exempt from being disliked for it's animation due to it's other merits, whereas M7 had none to speak of, something I've already pointed out why I disagree. You are correct in pointing out that M7 is very different from Macross Plus and DYRL?, but I'd say it has just about as much in common with SDF, just emphasizing different aspects.

And this makes sense because...? It doesn't make sense to you? It makes sense that compare to the other animation of the mid-90's time, M7 was just severely lacking in comparison. Heck! For pure animation and designs category... EVA had an atrocious pseudo-"mecha", yet the animation was great. Gundam Wing blows the mechas of M7 out of the water on just designs alone. G-Gundam had an atrocious storyline and debasing of Gundam-mecha, yet as corny as the G-Gundam mechas were, the M7 mechas were even more cornier. Nadesico's a parody of Macross, yet the Aestivalis blows EVA, Gundam and M7 in terms of the mechas and story/characterizations. That never happened before. DYRL animation and designs still blows Zeta-Gundam and CCA off the water. M7 completely blew the lead that Macross-Plus gave the franchise in animation, designs, characters, and story-plot over the other anime-series of the same period. And for all the animation-mistakes and stuff of SDF-TV, it's still a way better story and characters to watch, follow, and emphatize than with First Gundam or any of it's peers (southern cross, mospeada, orguss, dunbine, etc), and even with the great Zeta-Gundam story. Can't really say the same with M7 in comparison to it's peers. It's all about the money. I tolerated it in SDF M cause the story was great, and there is a measure of great art. Same thing goes towards M7. Dunno about the money thing, but I only tolerate M7 because of Max and Miria. This is turning into opinion rather than fact. The fact of the matter is, the animation in M7 is a step up from the animation in SDF Macross for the most part. It is better drawn and has less crappy animation. Thsi is all relative, of course, given that M7 isn't what I'd call 'good' animation either. The idea DNA questioned was the idea that if we like SDF Macross because of the story, and are willing to overlook some bad animation because of that (yes we do poke fun at it, maliciously at times, yet we still love the show itself) but not willing to overlook bad animation, that is still better than SDF Macross's animation, and enjoy it's other merits. Of course, if you don't like the other aspects of M7 the point becomes mute and the lackluster animation is just one more thing to dislike and not overlook. But your posts read as if the animation was reason enough to dislike the show despite the show's merits. As for your comments on designs, well most of that is purely opinion, but some of it...Gundam Wing has better designs? Man, they lack any sense of style or restraint, and come off looking like Gundams designed by some 15 year old Gundam fanboy for his self insertion fan faction crossover with Voltron! That's my professional opinion. Hell, they strongly remind me of some of the Valkyrie designs I came up with when I was about 15, guns everywhere, invincible armour,engines everwyhere. I grew out of that. G Gundam. Shining Finger. That's all I have. Eva, my view is based less off opinion. Eva had great animation for about 2-3 minutes per episode and the rest of the episode was practically still frames. However, no one has ever claimed that animation was M7's strong point. The strong points are the theme and character developement, which it pulls off wonderfully, far better than pretty much any of it's peers that I can think of, except perhaps Eva which used failing social situations and festering psychological disorders which make it far easier to make a character look 'deep and well rounded' than a more realistic character who's flaws are not nearly so extreme. I'm not trying to change your opinion of the show, but I am trying to point out that there are reasons why some of us like the show. It's one thing to simply not appreciate those things, it's quite another to say they don't exist.

Along with some of the worst animation to come out of the mid 90's. No excuse for the low production value of the series. Eh... if that were such a big problem then we'd all hate the much crappier animation mistakes and quality in the original SDF Macross TV enough to never watch it, much less restore it. The animation in M7 never bothered me a bit. I can understand alot of the "I just don't get it/it's not my cup of tea", though. To each their own. I'm just glad I wasn't too put off by some comments enough to give it a shot. It ended up being a great show that I've watched 3 times now. I agree with Blaine here, I mean, some small snippets of SDF Macross were gorgeous, but probably the majority of the animation was worse than anything in Macross 7, which was low quality but consistant and at least well drawn for the most part.

http://www.excite.co.jp/cars/machgo/ That should answer some questions.

I'd love to see a super, loaded with specials extravaganza for something I actually like. I'm just not a huge Matrix fan. Of course, despite the label of 'heretic' it might impose on me, I've never made a secret of the fact that I did not see Reloaded as a huge drop in quality from the first movie simply because I never saw the first movie to be as wonderfull as everyone else did. Strasngely enough, this view of things causeed me to actually like Reloaded more than most anyone who adored the first movie.

That really would be awesome, especially if they used the even-slightly-higher quality of animation that was displayed in the opening sequence for Dynamite. And though I could easily love Haruhiko Mikimoto's style of drawing Mylene, Basara, and even Veffidas, I gotta wonder what Ray Lovelock would look like coming off of his pen. Hmm... Mikimoto did design all of the Macross 7 characters (correct me if I'm wrong or there's any exceptions), but I know what you mean. Mikimoto's actual illustrations for the characters often look much nicer than their appearance in the show (you see some excellent illustrations of Mylene in the end credits of the show). I also tend to prefere the characters out of their 'glam rock' costumes and in more realistic attire, but that's simply my personal preference.

Except for that time that HG tried to claim no one can release tranforming Valkyrie toys in the U.S. because they own designs like the VF-1 & the U.N. Spacy insignia.... Or the time that HG said no one can release Macross sequels in the U.S. becasue they own them all....no HG has never tried to interere with anything creative in Macross! Those issues don't involve creative rights. What you are talking about are distribution and merchandising rights. Creative rights is a very specific term with legal significance. I believe what he means is HG's claim that they owned all the designs of Macross, and the concepts behind Macross, creative rights, and used those claims to back up their legal threats about Macross derivatives and merchandise not directly related to the tv series. That could be construed as "HG trying to claim creative rights to anything related to Macross" and "HG trying to exploit Macross in a manner only the creators would have the ability to". However, I suspect you mean specifically in HG trying to create their own Macross derivatives, which is why I brought up mainly their comic books, videogames, and even the novels would fall into this category.

Man, and I still haven't seen Silverstreek anywhere.

2's a funny guy, he is, and I agree with the gist of what he's got going there. Heck, if my only experience with anime was Trigun and Inyuyasha I'd probably feel the exact same way. Hell, replace 'anime' with 'Naruto' in his rant and I agree 100%. Still, my view of anime is unchanged. It's not a genre. It's not something to be all lumped together. 90% of it is crap, just like anything else. Out of the 10% tthat's not crap, chances are not all of it's going to appeal to me let alone everyone. His rant on the way artists are treated applies just as well to anime artists, and artists in general.

I've never seen HG try to claim creative rights to anything related to Macross. SN did sue to get the design work issue claified, sure. But, I've never heard of an instance where HG tried to exploit Macross in a manner only the creators would have the ability to. Even when HG attmepted to produce the Sentinels they did what was necessary in order to avoid infringing on the original work. And even now, HG is producing an animation that is based on a work that they can exploit, Mospeada, and not Macross. Though I do actually agree with a lot of that, I'd argue that comic books are very much a derivative production in the same way as movies, tv shows, and whatnot. With the amount of storytelling in many videogames these days, I'd say that's a fine line as well. If I write a comic and a show is made from it, the show would be a derivative of the comic. The comic itself would be the source material, not merchandise like a toy or a t-shirt. Someone claiming otherwise is akin to a company that only has the merchandising rights to a show, and not the distribution rights, yet still sells DVDs of the show claiming the DVDs are merchandise. Writing a sequel, prequel, or a side story to something and then selling it as a comic does not change the fact that it is a derivative work, not merchandise. Of course, despite my reasoning, many people do disagree with me on that one. Again, I do agree that it seems HG went out of their way to redesign the Macross characters for their Robotech counterparts' appearances in Sentinels (though I believe some VF-1 Valkyries do show up somewhere in the animation, I might be misremembering that though). Everything I've seen and heard about this new series does lead me to believe that HG is trying to move as far away from Macross as possible and stick to MOSPEADA which they do have creative rights to, through Tatsunoko. In the eyes of many Macross fans, and I must admit I fall into this category as well, Harmony Gold simply claiming that they own the designs and concepts to Macross was not just stepping over the line, but prancing across it and doing a little jig over on the other side of the line.

Spoken like a true Cynic... wait, why am I getting this bizzare Deja-vu sensation? I'm realistic. Cynics like to say that, but they're about as far from realistic as your average idealist, just in the opposite direction. Saying that all business are just as bad as the next, that they're all out to screw everyone else over, is just like assuming every other human being, even your own boyfriend/girlfriend/husband/wife/whatever is out to stab you in the back the moment you're not paying attention.

and I think that's probably what does the series in for most of the people that hate it. Depending on your thoughts going in, it can be very easy to empathise with Mylene, Gamlin, and pretty much the entire populace of City 7 and the U.N. Spacey's view of Basara very early on. And with him as the focal point of the series that can easily drive away those who decide not to like the character. The slow change in peoples' attitudes that we see throughout the show simply would not come off as believable in a shorter timeframe. I find it amusing how perfectly this mirrors Macross fans' reactions to the show and Basara. I've known people to initially hate Macross 7 and Basara, but then they manage to sit down and watch the rest of the series, and by the end love it, and Basara. I disagree with Keith in my own belief that the introductory episodes could have been written in such a way as to lure in more of the SDF Macross and Macross Plus crowd, yet kept the overall theme and developement that culminates at the end. However, I've noticed myself that while I thought the earlier episodes were weaker on my initial viewings, since seeing the whole series start to finish I find myself rewatching those early episodes and enjoying them a lot more. I'd still like to see Mac7 get a DYRL? style movie treatment, just for fun (but I'd still rather see completely new Macross stories).