Mr March

I'm looking for some scans. High resolution scans, of the various Macross series/film/OVA logos/titles. The Super Dimension Fortress Macross logo, the DYRL logo, so on and so forth. I'm not even sure what I'm going to use them for yet, but I'd like to have them. If anyone can help me out, please don't be shy

The Basara/Mylene/Gamlin "love triangle" did exist to an extent, it just never went anywhere.

info600 That's entirely my point. I don't believe Alto is very feminine at all. Alto's personality is aggressive, hot-headed, competitive, stubborn and narrow-minded; by almost every mental benchmark he's very much a typical raging male teenager. It's the fact that he's extremely good looking and created in the "modern" definition of attractive (lithe, effeminate, etc) that I see as the fan hang up. Alto is basically the Brad Pitt or Johnny Depp of anime. It wouldn't matter if he swore like Quentin Tarantino, belched like Tim the Toolman and pronounced it "Kalifornyaa", he'd still be ridiculed just because of his looks VF-25 Messiah Well, that does narrow it down some. If the homages to Scott's and Cameron's Alien/Aliens are true, it may be "survey" simply because survey ships and teams were a prominent part of the background/off-screen story for that franchise. At least I know to drop the "large-scale" part cyde01 I live in hope you're correct

I meant "real" anime forums. Robotech.com doesn't count and I've never been there anyway. I've been to AnimeNation, AnimeSuki, AP, MAHQ, Megaverse, and a few others. There's some interesting opinions for sure

Newbie question: I've seen the subtitles describe the 117th fleet as a "large-scale survey fleet" OR a "research fleet". Does anyone know which is correct? d3v and Garou Kuroryuu I'm pretty much in the same boat. I'm an old school fan as well and Macross Frontier has done much to reinvigorate the franchise for me. I have a few complaints like anyone, but aside from Macross Frontier being aimed outside my age group and a pair of weak episodes (LOL ) I'm very much enjoying Frontier. As for beautiful male characters, that's pretty much anime. Most male characters are lithe, effeminate and idealized. The Japanese idea of a gritty male in Macross is Roy, which is pretty girly looking in my book. Most anime male leads are fair looking; most manly anime characters drawn brutishly are typically one-dimensional, like Batou, Guile, Jet, etc; the tyranny of the medium perhaps. Amaterasu in Five Star Stories or D in Vampire Hunter D were even more feminine than Alto will ever be and those characters were great.

We've yet to learn the final destructive effects of the Dimension Eater. If it actually destroyed Gallia 4 down to the core, then it would ideed by far more powerful than even a Zentradi main fleet or the Grand Cannon. Though admittedly, we've only seen a brief slavo from a Zentradi Main Fleet and not seen what could done given several hours or days of bombardment. But the Dimension Eater seems to do the most damage in the least amount of time

azrael Well, that settles it then. Richard Birla it is. Thanks! kresphy Yahoo! Thanks for the great pictures

dreamweaver13 Just the Macross fandom, not the franchise itself. I've no doubt Macross will likely continue onward for as long as it continues to make lots of money. But I can't shake the feeling that some oldschoolers are going to be dropping out of Macross after this, if they haven't done so already. Gubaba My rant was more on a sense I'm getting collectively from portions of Macross fandom here and elsewhere. Again, it's not really that big a deal overall, but it's a persistent prescence in most Macross Frontier threads. Perhaps I'm reading more into the complaints, but I am feeling as though some old Macross fans are pretty much throwing up their arms and writing it off. Ironically, I think it actually has little to do with Frontier. Frontier may actually turn out to be as great a series in the end asit is now, but I don't see that changing the opinion of some long time fans. I think they are done with Macross in every other way short of leaving the fandom. But that's just my take on it and my perception based on the reason why some are damning retcon when it's not. cyde01 As I said above, I'm referring only to portions of the old Macross fandom, not Macross itself. I hope people will stick around because they are happy with more Macross, but it looks like some are at the end of their patience. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's a vibe I'm getting from the nature of the retcon posts. For example: This post is a classic example. Putting aside the apparent frustration, it speaks to the issue of the larger Macross franchise. To some long time fans, they've lived with DYRL for over 10 years as an "alternate tale of Space War I as equally legitimate as SDF Macross". That's a long time to invest in a "known truth" as it were. Then 1995 came along and Macross 7 changed the status of DYRL?. Some won't accept that change and vehemently oppose it after a decade of being led to believe otherwise, while others apply more importance to that change than they should, especially given Kawamori's creative tendencies. So it seems like Frontier's additions or alterations are just too much to take for some who have already had enough. But that's just my impression. Strumvogel I've had my ups and downs with the franchise, but overall I've been happy. I wouldn't keep coming back if I wasn't. I've long since dropped some franchises which ran into the ground. But for me, Macross can be great when done right and I'm loving Macross Frontier so far. I'm sure we all have a few pet peeves when it comes to retcon, but I'm not writing off everything because of a few minor problems. Others might be feeling differently and that's pretty much the point of my little rant

You need to visit some other forums. There are lynch mobs in seance for Ranka's death

[mini rant] With all due respect, I think some are just way too eager to declare retcon. IMO, most of these debates aren't even about retcon; they are clashes between personal interpretations of Macross and really, who can speak to that? Where some see retcon I see bubbles being burst and an intense disappointment that Macross should dare be made different from each fan's Macross gospel Although no one has come right out and said it, I think after 25 years without another SDF Macross ship, some fans figure there shouldn't be another and might even feel entitled to that. Is it a self-centered opinion? Sure. Can we really blame some for their nostalgia after 25 years invested in Macross? Probably not. But that's human nature. I know several people, here and on other boards, have come right out and asked me how I could like Macross Frontier. I can't really answer them; they have to find their own answer. It's been my observation that a significant portion of the Macross fandom (actually, ANY long time fandom) is still and forever will be in love with only the original. Perhaps I've been fortunate to judge entertainment as it comes and just roll with the good and bad. But one man's junk is another man's treasure, so maybe I'm missing out. But as long as I can judge good from bad (SDF Macross vs. Macross 7, hehehe) I figure I'm doing fine I've often heard the phrase that film is a young person's game and I can see why that would apply even more so to anime. Pleasing an older fanbase won't work, especially when nearly every older fan vehemently defends their own Macross gospel even when Macross comes from the horses mouth (or hory froating head, as it were). I hope Macross Frontier succeeds at bringing in new fans cause I've a feeling this series is the third and final charge of old school Macross fandom. I think once Frontier is done, that'll be the end for some of us. We already lost many once Macross Zero fizzled and I think in the minds of some Frontier is the Macross franchise's third and final shot at redemption before they sign off. That might be a little presumptuous and maybe a bit melodramatic, but I do in many ways feel as though this 25th anniversary is going to be the end of an era in more ways than one. But perhaps that's all as it should be.

Well, bully for you

Shouta's got my vote. I'm going with Birla until the Macross Compendium tells me different

I think it's a great theory. I posted (either in this thread or another one) that the Vajra could very well be a benevolent race that is being used by Grace and her cohorts for some nefarious purpose. Though I didn't make the capitalist connection until you mentioned it. Now it makes a LOT of sense. The SMS, Alto uttering "capitalism" under his breathe in an earlier episode, the ever-present but heretofore "unspoken" role of the LAI corporation; it sure does make a nice unifying theory. We're definitely on to something here.

It's obviously one fact that has somehow slipped through the cracks, in my case. Perhaps it was stated or maybe I even knew about it at one point but have long forgotten it. At any rate, this can only be expected given all the different subtitled versions I've had to watch. But I'll make note of it now. The next update of the Macropdeia on the M3 is going to be legendary Speaking of which, do we have an official spelling yet for that damn Mr. Brilrer/Biler/Birla?

Ah, the plot thickens

The VF-27 gun definitely comes across as a converging energy beam cannon in both firing modes; one lower powered, rapid-fire mode for anti-fighter combat and a slow firing, high-energy mode for anti-ship combat. The forward guns on the outboard engines of the VF-27 remind me of the large beam guns on the VF-4 Lightning III. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the VF-27 was armed with only beam weapons and lasers.

The New Macross Class was like a fleet carrier. It's definitely designed as a command ship to be supported by a fleet of smaller vessels. It does have a big gun but the NMC is not a dedicated anti-ship vessel. In contrast, the SDF-1 Macross is a gunboat designed for intense anti-ship combat, just like the Supervision Army gunboat from which it was built. The Macross Quarter is like a combat frigate or combat cruiser with some carrier capabilities. If the SDF-1 Macross was a VF-1 Valkyrie and the Macross Quarter were VF-25 Messiah, the New Macross Class would be a Destroid Monster or VB-6 Konig I actually liked most of the UN Spacy ships in Macross 7. The designs were creative and I liked the stealth stylings. It was one of the only things Macross 7 got right, IMO.

Best source of official information has been and likely always will be, the Macross Compendium. Having said that, the VF-19 Custom being a performance testbed project with Basara isn't mentioned anywhere on my site, AFAIK.

LOL And how many times was the YF-21 thrown upon it's back in Battroid mode, but the 3-dimensional thrust vectoring nozzle vanes didn't have a scratch. All the Valkyries take a beating and keep on ticking.

Given the head cannon is a converging energy cannon, I think it very likely the weapon can fire off-axis. Max's VF-22S converging energy cannons were shown to fire with variable axis in fighter mode and it sure looks like the YF-19 and the VF-25 head cannons can do the same. Besides, angle of fire seems to bear little upon how much the cannon is used. Macross is notorious for glorifying the gun pod at the expense of almost all the other Valkyrie weapons. The head cannons are arguably the easiest to use, most accurate weapon on most Valkyries, capable of damaging any other mecha (SDFM, DYRL, M0), but they are ignored even when pointing forward and mounted in a movable turret As for damage, that's drama and necessity of the action. An animator wanted to depict a damaged Valkyrie and the easiest way is to snap off an extremity; it's not because the animators felt it important for the audience to be aware that head cannons are weak. The YF-21's arm snapped off to serve plot and show the YF-19 had a superior weight and leverage advantage, not because the animators want us to believe the YF-21 has weak arms.

The SDF-1 Macross wasn't even new, but a refurbished Supervision Army Gunboat and it was still in service some 30 years later (more if we count the video games). If it's anything like Zentradi technology, the Macross ships might function reliably for thousands of years. The SDF-04 Global might very well be several decades old itself, if it was built somewhere between 2012 and 2020. The SDF-04 Global might have been only 30-35 years old in 2048 when the Vajra attacked it and effectively ended it's career. That'd be about the same age as the SDF-1 last time we saw it in action.

It's just current circumstances. We so far know nothing about the Vajra nor who's behind them. What are the Vajra? Who leads them? Why did they attack the NUNS 11 years ago and now in 2059? What are their goals? In fact, the Vajra could be a totally benevolent species, being manipulated into a war with the SMS/NUNS by Grace and her cohorts. Or the NUNS 117th Research Fleet could have stumbled upon a Vajra hive and their "research" was interpreted as an attack. And like myself and others have said, the Vajra could still be a Macross Galaxy creation (done right or gone wrong). Or perhaps LAI made the Vajra. Quite frankly, the circumstances of this war in Macross Frontier could be anything at this point. All we know for sure are the events we see on screen and what the more "mysterious" characters are doing as chronicled in these episodes thus far. We all knew Grace was more than she appeared, but even I was surprised she was quite this insidious. Perhaps Grace, Brera and Brilrer know about the Vajra but are preventing anyone else from knowing about them. Perhaps Grace, Brera and Brilrer don't know about the Vajra, but see them as an opportunity to accomplish their own nefarious purposes. Who knows? Just have to keep watching and find out. If Macross Frontier turns out great, then all the answers we need to fulfill the plot will be revealed. If not, then we will have been screwed again by taking a chance on Frontier. That's the way it works.

Hehehe Very nice, Fly4victory. A classic pose.

Exactly! Neither Alto nor Ranka are aware of Grace's activities. So who else are they gonna blame for Gallia 4's destruction but the Vajra? And we're relying upon Leon to tell the truth? We're definitely in trouble, hehehe. Leon is either in league with Grace, Brera and Briler OR he's being used by them. In either case, there's no way that shifty son-of-a-BDI is going to come forward and help fill in the facts that Alto and Ranka might be getting wrong. So far he's done everything he can to help his co-conspirators cover it all up!

Given that this is the Macross World forums (hehehe), I'm assuming "weakest weapon system" means "it looks weak and fragile for gun", because the single head cannon on the VF-22 Sturmvogel II is actually one of the more powerful guns on the Valkyrie. It's specifically described as a fixed high-powered converging energy cannon.