bsu legato Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 I'm just curious...is there anybody here following the Dark Tower series? I just reread the first 4 books, and with Wolves of the Calla due out in November I had a hankering to chat about it. Anybody...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 i just read all four of them and am goign around the other Stephen King books to see where the story picks up, such as Insomnia, Black House, everythings eventual and Salem's Lot. These books are great, and i can't wait to see where King's going with it. Roland is one of my favorite characters in a long time!! great reads! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veifwan Es Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 A very appropriate avatar for this topic....I've always imagined Roland looking just like that. I'm very excited about the next 3 books....so far the series has been Stephen King's best work by far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkyrie Hunter D Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 It's been ages since I've read the first three books, and it's been two years since I read Wizard and Glass. I've forgotten a lot of details, but I do remember the books as being great reads. With the fifth installment finally coming, I think I'm gonna have to do some heavy skimming to get up to date with the story. However, I do remember the first line that started it all: "The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 It's been ages since I've read the first three books, and it's been two years since I read Wizard and Glass. I've forgotten a lot of details, but I do remember the books as being great reads. With the fifth installment finally coming, I think I'm gonna have to do some heavy skimming to get up to date with the story. However, I do remember the first line that started it all: "The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed". thats a great line. but i always loved the bits about "remembering the face of your fathers!" right before Roland, Eddie, Susannah or Jake popped a cap in someone!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiriyu Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 I've also read all the books in this series (and some of the ancillary stories) but hadn't heard that a new book was due out. The Gunslinger, in my mind stands out as a truly classic work. However, King's writing style and plot devices alter so radically in the later books that I've started to give up on the series. I think the main reason that the style of The Gunslinger is so different than the later books is that it existed as a germ in King's mind long before he ever wrote it down; that King had a very specific idea of what he wanted that story to be. The later titles, in my opinion, seem to be written a bit more 'on the fly', without the same kind of conviction, or the same dark overtones/mysticism. I'm sure I'll read the new one when it comes out anyway, just to be sure B) '....to the Dark Tower, Childe Roland Came...' or somesuch thing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted September 23, 2003 Author Share Posted September 23, 2003 Has anybody here read the revised & expanded edition of The Gunslinger yet? As Hiriyu pointed out, the original version of The Gunslinger was written long ago and doesn't necessarily jive with the later volumes. The new version has some interesting additions, including a small subplot that apparently pays off in the next book. I can't spoil it for you, since I have no idea what it is, but I can tell you it has something to do with the number 19. However, most significant is the changes made during Roland's palaver with The Man in Black, also known as Walter and one or two knew surprises that changes a lot of what we thought we knew about Roland's quest. I'm not certain I agree with this new change, but I'll wait to see how he addresses it in Wolves of the Calla. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatMoose Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 I remember reading a story way back in Jr. High that had to do with "Childe Roland". Can't remember what it was. It was written several hundred years ago, though. Cool story, always figured that's where King got the idea for the series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 I remember reading a story way back in Jr. High that had to do with "Childe Roland". Can't remember what it was. It was written several hundred years ago, though. Cool story, always figured that's where King got the idea for the series. its a poem by Robert Browning. thats where King claims he first go the idea. its a good poem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the white drew carey Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 (edited) It's been a while for me as well. I'm eagerly anticipating The Wolves of Calla. I'd have to disagree with Hiriyu, though. I think the stories get better with every book out, and Wizard and Glass is my favorite (for now ). What's your favorite cross-over? Mine is the one part in one of the Dark Tower books where Roland (or the narrative) mentions how he met two brothers who were searching for an evil wizard (surprisingly named Flagg- a recurring theme for Mr. King), which is an obvious reference to one of my favorite King novels, The Eyes of the Dragon. Edited September 23, 2003 by the white drew carey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunslinger Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 Wizards and Glass was my favorite book in the series. I just love the part in the bar when everyone is geetin the drop on everyone else. Jonas thinks he has everything under control when Roland sneaks him from behind. Cant wait for the next one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted September 23, 2003 Author Share Posted September 23, 2003 What's your favorite cross-over? I think mine was Insomnia. I remember when I first read it years ago, and it slowly dawned on me that the story was Tower-related. I screamed at my then-girlfriend "Oh my God, this is a freakin' Dark Tower book!!!" In hindsight, it's not such a big deal since lots of King books have Tower connections, but it was a cool revelation at the time. Mine is the one part in one of the Dark Tower books where Roland (or the narrative) mentions how he met two brothers who were searching for an evil wizard I'm not sure if we're done with those two just yet. There's three books to go, and King has intimated that they might just crop up again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 mine is Black House. i loved the Talisman and i loved the character of Jack Sawyer. since hes now a more or less permanent member of the territories, i think he and Roland will meet up somewhere. a comment Jack makes in Black house caught my attention. in one part he thinks to himself of his shooting abilities, and how when standing still, he couldn't hit anything, but on the move was always one fo the best. that makes me think Jack is a Gunslinger of our world. Father Callahan will be coming out in Wolves of Calla, so maybe the will deal with what happened to Ben Mears and Mark Petrie from 'Salems lot....its gonna be sweet! my favorite of the books was the Waste Lands. good stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skull Leader Posted September 23, 2003 Share Posted September 23, 2003 I had a deep affinity for the ZZ Top song "Velcro Fly" after reading "The Wastelands"! I also started using the phrase "Hurts like a mad bastard" ever since I read one of them... can't remember which one it was in though I really love the Dark Tower series.... The Talisman and Black House were my two favorite crossovers, but yeah, around 2/3 of Stephen King's novels have something to do with the Dark Tower series ("The Stand" being one of the prevailent of those... I didn't think much about that until Randall Flagg appeared in "The Wizard and Glass" then it all started to make sense) I've been meaning to go and read the updated versions, but I'm far more anxious to get my hands on book V. "The Drawing of the Three" was probably my least favorite of the series thus far, but I understand that it's just as pivotal as the other books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shade Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I'm just surprised and/or disturbed that he's actually finished writing all of it. I'm not surprised and/or disturbed that he has a guest appearance as himself later on. Too bad his publishing company is going to space out the releases. I'd happily pick up all of them at once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dna Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 One of the few books I've bothered to keep up with. Did you read the short story that appeared in one of his collection books? With the Sisters of Mercy or some such, supposed to take place before The Dark Tower book. Not required reading for the story, but a decent little side quest for the character. Nuns made of bugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 One of the few books I've bothered to keep up with. Did you read the short story that appeared in one of his collection books? With the Sisters of Mercy or some such, supposed to take place before The Dark Tower book. Not required reading for the story, but a decent little side quest for the character. Nuns made of bugs. that was the Little Sisters of Eluria from Everythings Eventual. they also make a cameo in the Black House. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiriyu Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I'd have to disagree with Hiriyu, though. I think the stories get better with every book out, and Wizard and Glass is my favorite (for now ). I respect your opinion, and I wholeheartedly agree that the later books make for more entertainment by way of story telling. King is definitely a killer story teller, and Wizard & Glass is substantially a great story. What I mean to say, is that the original work was of a much darker, edgier character than the latter, and King seems to be moving further and further away from his original conception of The Gunslinger; this I lament. The original book was not so much an exercise in story-telling as it was a kind of mysterious noir abstraction, a narrative for its own sake.... At least that's my opinion. Thankee Sai! [bows Comically] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the white drew carey Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 One of the few books I've bothered to keep up with. Did you read the short story that appeared in one of his collection books? With the Sisters of Mercy or some such, supposed to take place before The Dark Tower book. Not required reading for the story, but a decent little side quest for the character. Nuns made of bugs. that was the Little Sisters of Eluria from Everythings Eventual. they also make a cameo in the Black House. It also appears as The Dark Tower: The Little Sisters of Eluria In the fantasy anthology Legends. The book itself also features short stories set in the Discworld (Terry Pratchett- one of my favorite authors), The Sword of Truth (Terry Goodkind), The Wheel of Time (Robert Jordan) and Memory, Sorrow and Thorn (Tad Williams- which is my favorite trilogy ever... even over LOTR) BTW- Here's a scan from the first page of Legends... you figure it out. I think it embodies the whole fantastical feel of the Dark Tower... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the white drew carey Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I'd have to disagree with Hiriyu, though. I think the stories get better with every book out, and Wizard and Glass is my favorite (for now ). I respect your opinion, and I wholeheartedly agree that the later books make for more entertainment by way of story telling. King is definitely a killer story teller, and Wizard & Glass is substantially a great story. What I mean to say, is that the original work was of a much darker, edgier character than the latter, and King seems to be moving further and further away from his original conception of The Gunslinger; this I lament. The original book was not so much an exercise in story-telling as it was a kind of mysterious noir abstraction, a narrative for its own sake.... At least that's my opinion. Thankee Sai! [bows Comically] Ahh... I see what you're getting at now. And I agree with your statement. But as a whole, I see The Dark Tower as anything else that takes time: It grows. Every novel of The Dark Tower (to me) has shown a different aspect of Mr. King's writing. I like them as they go on, probably, because the characters develop as well as the story itself. Wizard and Glas brought in a perspective not unlike most of ours: of a young man and his friends who are impulsive and are extremely idealistic. I felt it brought much more character into Roland because it shows him not only as the cold hard man he has become, but that he was once also young and compulsive. Something he has either let leave, or forced, out of his life. Something which we see begin to grow again throughout The Gunslinger intil now. He is learning that, maybe, his mission is not the only thing that matters. He is learning to care again. Now will that frakk him up in the end? Possibly... Who knows? But I think the story, as a whole, gets better with every new edition. And that's a lot to say, in this day and age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 but remember Drew, he also told eddie and Susannah that he would leave them if it meant reaching the tower. yes, he did go out of his way to save jake, but i think it was as much for Roland as it was for Jake that he did that. Roland cared about people too, like Susan, Alain and Cuthbert, and maybe Roland tries to be a hardass about his quest, since he knows everything he cares about is goign to be lost sooner or later. King himself has said that not all the characters will reach the Tower. thats gonna suck, since i have grown attached to all of the characters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted September 24, 2003 Author Share Posted September 24, 2003 Thanks, WhiteDrew. I'd always wondered where that image was from! One thing that will probably piss a lot of you off, is how King changed some of the language in his expanded & revised Gunslinger. Notably, he's removed nearly every single adverb. There were several spots in the original where King would flip adverbs with subject and verb, e.g. "onward, he plodded." These have all been changed so they read straight, e.g. "he plodded onward. I liked the original overuse of adverbs. It gave the 1st volume that unique, timeless feel, as if you were reading some ancient manuscript. Most confusing is the new revelations on the character Walter. I don't want to spoil it for you, but I suggest you read on anyway, since it will likely become important in the remaining 3 volumes... Spoiler.. spoiler.... Ok, so in the original version of the story Roland catches the Man in Black, who reveals himself to have been Walter, a former member of Marten's cabal. Walter, who seems to have been using Marten, tells Roland how he is the furthest minion of the Tower. His master the Ageless Stranger, aka Maerlyn, aka Legion, serves the keeper of the tower, the Beast. Pretty straightforward, right? NOW, Walter reveals himself to be....Marten! When Roland's father Steven was murdered, Marten pretended to flee to the Good Man's forces, but secretly remained in Gilead as Walter. Walter/Marten still serves that being known as the Ageless Stranger, but his master in turn now serves "The Crimson King." Ok, not such a big deal...but what about the end of Wizard & Glass when Roland's Ka-tet meet Flagg in the emerald castle? Roland immediately recognizes Flagg as Marten! So...Walter was really Marten all along, and now Marten was really his own master Flagg? Huh? However, it isn't explicitly stated that Flagg = Marten/Walter. There IS one way around this, however. Flagg has often been described as looking different to each person who sees him. One person may see his own father, another person may see Jim Morrison. Part of his "Legion" nature, I suppose. This description also fits Walter, as he is described in his cameo in Wizard & Glass. So....perhaps both Walter and Flagg have this ablility, and when confronting Roland at the end of W&G Flagg decided to appear as Roland's long ago nemesis Marten in an attempt to shake him up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatMoose Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I wonder when the kid from Insomia is going to show up, since apparently he is integral to Roland succeeding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I wonder when the kid from Insomia is going to show up, since apparently he is integral to Roland succeeding. when Ralph Roberts saved his life, he still had some 18 years to go before he would save someones life, and the person they save would be necessary in Roland's quest. I think that person will be another breaker type person, like Tyler Marshall, who Jack saves in Black House. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted September 24, 2003 Author Share Posted September 24, 2003 Dammit, now I have to dig out my copy of The Talisman so that I can read it and then move on to The Black House already!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the white drew carey Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 I really can't wait until The Dark Tower is finished, and then I can go back and read all of Stephen King's novels to see how many are connected to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted September 24, 2003 Share Posted September 24, 2003 Dammit, now I have to dig out my copy of The Talisman so that I can read it and then move on to The Black House already!! its worth it! i think those two are some of Kings best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 So.....anyone bought Wolves of Calla?? it came out today!!! I'll be getting it tomorrow. i hope it kicks ass!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted November 5, 2003 Author Share Posted November 5, 2003 Please, anybody who reads WOTC, please use "spoiler" tags before posting anything about DT:5. :asian: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowerV2 Posted November 5, 2003 Share Posted November 5, 2003 Holy cow.... there's a reference to the book IT in the Dreamcathcer Novel......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 Holy cow.... there's a reference to the book IT in the Dreamcathcer Novel......... sure is. and theres a reference to IT in Insomnia, and a reference in Insomnia to the Dark Tower.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syngyne Posted November 6, 2003 Share Posted November 6, 2003 I got Wolves last night and was up until midnight reading it. I had to force myself to stop else I wouldn't wake up in time for work today. And I still managed to read a little more this morning. I like it so far, it's nice to be back on the main storyline again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted November 11, 2003 Share Posted November 11, 2003 Would ye hear, i beg!! Just finished Wolves of the Calla today!!! Man, where to start. well, i don't wanna spoil anything, Say thankya, but i liked this one. it kicked ass, plain and simple! I think this one has been my favorite of the bunch. i can't wait til next year for the Song of Susannah. Anyone else finished this one yet?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsu legato Posted November 11, 2003 Author Share Posted November 11, 2003 Sounds like you enjoyed it, Isamu. Enough to update your signature, anyhow. I don't have a copy yet, but next paycheck I think I'll have to plunk down the cash for a copy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted November 12, 2003 Share Posted November 12, 2003 Sounds like you enjoyed it, Isamu. Enough to update your signature, anyhow. I don't have a copy yet, but next paycheck I think I'll have to plunk down the cash for a copy. it is SO worth it. you'll enjoy it Bsu!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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