magnuskn

Well, I think this image is interesting as in that it shows ( if it is meant to be taken in context with the second movies plot ) that we are getting a really new story, instead of a rehash of the second half of the TV series.

Oh, so this logo is already known to be the bird-humans? Hm, which "faction" would that belong to?

Since your words triggered one half page of anti- AxS fan and anti-AnimeSuki bile, I thought it necessary to comment on it.

Yeah, but I expect something better from you than labeling Sheryl X Alto fans "those people". Those a pretty laden words.

Oh, look, prejudice.

I came to Macross and BattleTech over Robotech. For many years, Robotech was the only thing I knew about the Macross universe. For that alone, I owe a big, big debt of gratitude to Carl Macek. RIP and bon voyage, sir. May you find peace and contentment, whereever you may be now.

Here in Germany, co-workers are, well, as personal as they and you care to be, which I prefer much to keeping everybody at arms length.

Why should you not try to introduce co-workers and friends to things you like? Unless they have no interest in your private life and want to be left alone, of course. But if they ask, why not?

Indeed. In most cases it seems they follow, although they expand on some aspects and we get much more into the head of Alto. And some seriously yaoi-looking stuff between Alto and Michael. There are some new minor characters, like Colonel Aegis Focker of the 727th Independent Special Command VF-X Ravens and Lt. Gen. Kim Kabirov in command of the Earth Macross 13 fleet. Kim Kabirov if you remember is one of the original bridge operators of the SDF-1 Macross. ( Information from ReddyRedWolf from AnimeSuki ). You can find the accumulated info on the Macross Light Novels thread on AnimeSuki. I'd guess condoms solved the problem.

I must have missed that part where Sheryl and Alto sent her a photo of their lovemaking, let alone told her.

What, you read this incredibly sweet scene and the first thing you think off is "Poor Ranka!"?

That selfsame night. Here's a summary by AlaAlba from AnimeSuki, who did a translation on the fly:

Not exactly "movie" news, but since there is no general thread for the Macross light novels, it seems that in novel three ( of four ) we got confirmation that, YES, Sheryl and Alto did make love. Hooray!

Yeah, same here. Which, btw., automatically disqualifies us as persons of interest for Sheryl. One mayor turn-on for her in regards to Alto was his recalcitrance to treat her as something special. Which was quite justified, as he was all by himself a mayor star already when she wasn't even widely known and he therefore would most probably be immune to being star-struck.

Besides the "Yaaaarrhhh!" screaming during combat, Alto calms down a lot after about episode nine, when he and Michael reconcile. Well, he gets still pissed at Brera, but who wouldn't? Anyway, Alto is not emo at all. His complaining about his situation is kept to a bare minimum, as to establish that, yes, he has problems with his family. Any bouts of self-justification are normally triggered from outside forces ( Michael at first, then Yasaburo later on ), which simply indicates that he is not exactly comfortable leaving the tradition of being the next Ranzo behind, but determined to make his own future.

I'll only address the series, since the movie has not been available to us non-Japan-traveling shlubs here. First off, at the start of the series Alto clearly has problems integrating with his friends. He has been one year at least in the school with Michael and Luca, gets constantly teased by Michael and has the problem that people at the school call him "Princess", due to his hair cut and general feminine looks. It is made quite clear that he resents this questoning of his masculity. Interestingly, he did not try to change that by cutting his hair into a more manly style, as would have been expected in such a situation, implicating that he a.) is far more secure in his masculinity than his irascible behaviour would indicate and b.) although he severed his connections to his family, he still respects tradition enough to not so drastically renounce his past as to try to purge any reminder of it. Over the course of the series, it becomes clearer and clearer that, even while he easily gets into testy interaction with them, he is very loyal to his friends and goes to great pains to protect them as good as he can. This expands out towards him accepting the responsibility of acting for the greater good for the whole of Frontier, a place he personally hated before, due to it feeling opressive to him. A problem many had with his character is the fact that we do not get into his head, outside of things he tells other characters. So, due to his stoic character, many missed that his character advancement was mostly done by his actions. As with the other characters in Macross Frontier, we are shown, not told. Only that Alto was not as out-going as the other characters and therefore his development was more difficult to spot.

Discussion is giving foundation to our opinion with facts, so that we can be sure that we are not talking out of our behinds. So, if you don't care about facts, I don't care to argue with you. But if Renato feels like it is worth his time to have this discussion with me, he will provide some of the reasons behind his opinion and maybe I can change his mind a bit. He can just as well change my mind somewhat, although I think the foundation of my opinion is solid. As to the pointlessness about argueing about opinions... this is an internet messageboard, right? We are all wasting some of our free time on, on the face of it, pointless debate, which could be better spent trying to foster the next generation of Macross fans, or somesuch.

Since you haven't yet really given a reason as to why you dislike Alto, could you do so? I got some ( hopefully ) pretty good counter-arguments ready, since I've been defending him from various people over the last months. Although Seto Kaiba already gave a good defense of him, I think I got some more arguments to make as to why he is in reality a very good protagonist. You realize that he is just making up his opinion upon the opinion of another, who differed drastically from the reviews of several other people, right?

I might pass by when I find the time. Which is where I fundamentally disagree. I had some big discussions about this over on Animesuki, because I think Alto is a very good protagonist, compared to many other mains in mechas shows of the last years. Yeah, so he isn't flashy about his feelings, but he has some real depth. Not every protagonist needs a emotional breakdown to go ahead in their character development... Alto did it quietly and efficiently.

About every review of the movie I've read prior to yours has been positive ( not glowingly so, but everybody enjoyed the movie ), so yours really stood out. I personally disagree about Frontier having less developed characters than Macross 7, but I am no big fan of M7, due to the vapidness of Mylene and arrogance of Basara. And other stuff, but let's not get into that. As I haven't seen the Frontier movie I am not qualified to make statements about how good its character development was, but I think that two of the three mains in Frontier were were well realized. Ranka was a big mess, but I think its still debatable about how much on purpose the fail of her character arc was.

Well, that is a hell of a negative review, quite different from what everyone else was saying. I guess we'll have to see, but if I read Macross Frontier hilariously described as a "already vapid (mostly in terms of characters) TV series" from a Macross 7 fan, I know I can expect heavy bias against the movie.

That'd have to be Dick W. Butcher for the intended audience.

Oh, okay. <facepalm> Shadow Chronicles really is from the ninth layer of hell, isn't it?

OMG, I am just on page two of the other thread and my brain already hurts because of the sheer amount of stupid of the RT people. Oh, well, at least it is entertaining seeing you guys crush Mr. Capslock into grimy paste.

I'll look it up, thanks!