Zinjo

Armentage I'm sure there's a Kawamori thread somewhere for you to lurk in... Makes me wonder if you are so quick to flame the old guard about a 23 year old TV show too? Anyway, I too appreciate the Mac II mecha and particularly the fresh premise it took. However, after enjoying the collected works of the Macross universe (yes even Mac 7 ), I now wished the Marduk were the Supervision Army since there are so many similarities between the two. I would also like to see what the "full" story would have been because it is obvious (to me anyway) that the show was meant to be more than only 6 episodes. Too many story threads seemed rushed or incomplete. It may not be the best Macross series out there; "Macross Plus" and "Macross Zero" come to mind for that distinction, but it is good in it's own right considering it was based entirely on the series and the DYRL movie. Macross 2 had a story with immense potential and damn fine looking Mecha and I still enjoy it, even with it's flaws.

Damn! Now I am going to have to look at those eps again...

A Zent gunship can be seen in the battle scenes from DYRL.

I believe the White Drew Carey has found this anecdotal SD evidence. 389843[/snapback] You mean those AREN'T the hooks??

Considering the ASS-1 was one of the smallest ships in their arsenal, it makes a person wonder what the full scale cruisers looked like.....

The bridges resemble the SDF-2's bridge from the designs.

I like the foot art! Too bad it was never done in the series..

I guess I really should look at this from the standpoint of a MOSPEADA fan, they've not had it quite as good as Macross fans have (whereas most diehard macross fans look to disown Harmony Gold as having ever had anything even remotely close to do with anything Macross-related, MOSPEADA fans kind a see it as a back door to maybe spark things back up in Japan)... kinda ironic, eh? 389494[/snapback] Well I did hear rumours a while back, that HG proposed it as a sequel to Mospeada to the Japanese studios (kinda ironic since Megazone 23 was initially developed as the Mospeada sequel). Don't know if that is true or if the studios were even interested.

Well yes! Just like every woman in UN Spacy are required to wear Mini-skirts.

After tracking down my source, Azreal is correct in that there is no definitive visual or written sources to back up my comments. The site I referenced states the comments on this subject was conjecture based on articles presented in the Macross Compendium, thus my comments on SA cap ships are purely speculative as well.

There is every reason to believe there are Supervision Fleets in the Galaxy. In Mac 7, at no time are we lead to believe any Supervision ships assist the PD in the series, eventhough the PD are responsible for the formation of the SA. We know that the population, crews and ships from the Megaroad 13 fleet had been assimilated into the new PD army on Varuata. Most likely the SA fleets were engaged in battle with other Zentreadi fleets elsewhere in the Galaxy, completely unaware that the PD had reawakened.

That Misa costume is AMAZING!! Nice work!

I tend to believe that it is possible that the males were used for straight up slugfest battles and the females were brought in for special missions requiring speed and stealth. Basically the males were cannon fodder while the females were special forces.

From what I understand, the SA are the army the PD's created to conduct their war on the Protoculture Stellar Republic. Initially they were mind controlled Protoculture and Zentreadi forces. When the PD were imprisoned by the Protoculture forces, their army continued to fight directly with the Zentreadi and control over the Zentreadi Army was lost by the protoculture government. The battles between the two armies almost completely wipe out the people of old Stellar Republic (it is believed that there are a few autonomous Protoculture worlds, outposts and fleets still in existence somewhere in the Galaxy). Essentially, after the PD were imprisoned the Supervision Army kept fighting the Zentreadi, even after the mind control wore off. They have been fighting ever since for over half a million years. http://macross.anime.net//story/chronology...0000/index.html The SA army capital ships are said to resmble the ships the PD had from Mac 7, but not as advanced. Apparently the knowledge to build the PD versions of the ships was lost when their masters were imprisoned on Varauta. So most likely the Meltrandi ships of DYRL are similar in design to the SA ships, but not necessarily the same (they bear a surprising resemblance to the the PD ships of Mac 7, with their angular shapes, etc... Makes me wonder about actual the design of the Macross though--should it have been as organic looking or not.)

Lucky bastage... Still waiting for mine...

Yeah I saw the flaw in my post after realizing that the uniqueness of the numbering system in Mac 2 is the additional letter denoting the crafts primary combat role from your previous post. I always liked the idea of the "AGA" Gerwalk, as I thought it was taking the idea of the SK's Armored Gerwalk design and making it a weapon system in itself. However it's lack of any gun pod(s) or any real gun systems aboard seemed to make it far less effective than it could have been as a type of gunship design.

True; in neither "This is Animation Special 5" or the "Entertainment Bible 51" is an actuall Alpha Numeric designation given to the Metal Siren. It is always referred to by name. Not a bad listing, however the VF-0 never had an actual name AFAIK. Though it is also concievable that these fighters could have a VF/A designation as opposed to the regular VF designation. The VF Series were multi-purpose and multi-role fighters, whereas the VF-2s (or VF/A-2s) are more specialized and seemed designed as interceptor and attack fighters. The most specialized would be the MS that is clearly designed to attack capital ships as well as enemy fighter craft. I would propose that the crafts could be designated: VF/A-2JA ICARUS VF/A-2SS VALKYRIE II VF/A-3MS METAL SIREN The designation would also identify them as a newer generation of Specialized Variable fighters not directly associated with the original VF series. IMO

That'll teach you to stop listening to Keith's stories...

Nice work. However the VF-1's battroid form was the same height as the average Zentreadi soldier (they were made to be). The Zentreadi mecha actually dwarfed the VF-1s, eventhough the series never really showed it that well.

I think you have it backward. If anything, with verniers in the shoulders and the rounded tops of the pilot areas, Gundams are starting to look more like valkyries. 386255[/snapback] Umm, noooo, the Gundams have always looked like that. They are busier now than they used to look, but the design is still essentially the same, since the early 80's. Also the Gundam picture is a mecha from a show that came out 2 years BEFORE Macross Plus which is the show that first featured the YF-19 pictured above.

Well, there is the little bit about completely dropping the Protoculture and the Supervision Army, and replacing them in the story with the Marduk as the force behind the Zentradi. 386197[/snapback] Considering the story, why would there be a need to bring up the Protoculture. Hell even in Mac 7, it didn't pop up until half way through the series and that was because it was integral to the story. As for the the Marduk replacing the Supervision Army, I tend to agree with you there. If the writers knew then what we all know now, I have no doubt the "Marduk" name would have been used, and the Supervision Army Kawamori describes in Mac 7 would have been the ones attacking instead. SK established that microne sized Protoculture citizens were just as brainwashed into fighting the Civil war as the Zentreadi were. So it is no real stretch to write a story about the decendants of these Protoculture still commanding their Zentreadi soldiers as the Supervision Army.

Macross II is considered to be a Macross alternate future story that is outside the Kawamori/Studio Nue Macross stories. Some "Kawamori fans" hate the show because it was done without the man's blessing, while others are accepting of it, eventhough the story telling is a bit flawed. IMO the story precepts are solid and well conceived, but there will be times when you wonder how they got from one point to another (I suspect the OVA's were meant to run longer than 6 eps.). So the series is not part of the "Official Macross Continuity", yet it is a Macross story. As for contradicting Mac 7, it doesn't story wise, as Mac 7 takes place several hundred light years from Earth and approximately 35 years earlier, but certain aspects of the show do contradict the established storyline. The Earth never uses old Zentreadi warships as buildings in the SK timeline, emigration fleets are never mentioned in Mac II, etc... Essentially the contradictions are mostly visual and few technical bits, because the show predates all the Kawamori productions except DYRL.

Uhm, yeah, but uh, Kawamori designed that Gundam, too. 385965[/snapback] Thanks for emphasizing my point... *Note Macross II pre-dates Macross Plus by about a year, so the fighter mounted pinpoint barrier system and even the 360 degree cockpit view was not made canon yet. So to imply that such advancements "should" have been in Macross II, is a bit erroneous.

I suspect a better comparison would be this Gundam from Gundam 0083 Stardust Memory (which came out in 1991) to the YF-19. If we are to compare the SK designs of the 90's to Gundam.

A production side note is that having the valk look similar to the F-14 also allowed them to hide it's transformation capapabilities at the start of the show in SDF Macross. The opening credits never show the Valk transforming. it was meant to be a surprise to the viewers.