wolfx

can confirm until we see the reverse side...although with a single engine, its gonna be pretty ackward in battroid...

i mean the feet may have their own mni thrusters but you then have a big ...ummm backside thruster hanging downward!

Thruster will transform into a flamepod and will spew out napalm.

Btw, anyone noticed the logo on the tail fins? That's not NUNs. A new faction?

Given that we previously heard that Delta is only set a few years after Frontier (I forget how many), it's not surprising that the airframe and basic transformation of the hero VF will likely be similar to Frontier-era / Macross 30 era VFs.

Anyway, from what we can see of the design, it's pushing all the right buttons for me so far.

I just hope it's a military VF, in a conflict / war based story.

I really don't want see a Macross anime about racing VFs, basketball playing VFs or sky surfing VFs.....yuk!

Graham

Frontier is 2059. Delta is 2067 based on the first post of this thread. So its only 8 years.

As for war based story, yes please.

No hippy pacifism via power of song, no eco-preservation undertones. Considering the world's current affairs, i wonder if it might have themes of terrorism, racial discrimination, refugees, etc. Maybe enough human worlds are colonised and some worlds decide to go to war with others over limited resources.

I'm over the forward-swept wing fad. It worked well enough for the YF/VF-19 I suppose, but I didn't really care for it in the VF-9 or the YF-29. Just my personal tastes though.

Am I alone in saying I'd rather see some kind of SW1 side story (much in the same vein as Gundam's 08th MS Team)? Or a story that took place during the reconstruction?

You're not alone. I've been dreaming up a SW1 side story following a rag-tag squad of Destroids + Valks engaged in guerilla warfare with the occupying Zentran garrison forces. It features retro-fitted military hardware and valks going hand-to-hand with Zentradi soldiers in jungle settings. Takes place somewhere after the Macross folds away from Earth (the ones left behind on earth) until its eventual return.

Unfortunately the only way we'll ever see such a side story is via visual novels, manga, or video games or stay in the realm of fan-fiction.

One thing is for sure. The "Hero Valk" 's air frame and basic transformation will be very similar to Frontier-era valks. Not sure if that's a good thing. As much as I loved the Frontier-era valks I was hoping for a whole new revolutionary valkyrie with new transformation scheme. But really I' m not sure how would Kawamori improve on it.

Anyway, anyone wanna start naming the Valks?

To continue the Arthurian theme:

VF-34 Lancelot?

VF-37 Mordred?

XD

Yodobashi Camera, is not a mall in any respect. It's primarily a electronic and appliance store. Most Yodobashi Cameras are nowhere near the scale of their two flagship stores in Akihabara and Osaka. All but those two are allot smaller and the further you get away from Tokyo or Osaka the chances of them even having a toy section is slim (declining birthrate = no toy department in rural areas).

Yodobashi Akiba obviously has a floor with a toy department; which does not occupy the entire floor. Within it is a nested hobbyists area ("specialty hobby shop"), and ever since it opened in 2005 said "specialty hobby shop" has gotten smaller every time they rearrange the department. Within the hobby section, the robot anime toys are probably the lowest stocked items out of everything (PVC figures, trains, model kits, model kit accessorizes, Yokai Watch) unless it's made by either Bandai (Gundam SUCKS, yeah you read that right) or Takara Tomy (ahh, does Robots in Disguise ring a bell), their products are usually brightly displaced in their very own isle with POP materials posted everywhere.

In the case of Arcadia, when a product is released it's brought in straight from the delivery truck on a wooden pallet and usually dropped off near the check out line. They don't even bother to put the product on the shelves. Why? Most often then not, they only get enough to stack waist high and that's still being stacked on top the very pallet it was dropped off on.

This mall you speak of knows very well on release day only a hand full of customers will be rushing in to get their Valk (usually limited to 1 each). Yeah, I call that a "specialty" hobby shop section located on a toy floor primarily for children.

I've known not one, but a few who have worked and still work at HLJ, I've been in the office and walked the warehouse.

In the old days HLJ would stock allot of Yamato Valks, so much in fact they would eventually have Urban Camo Fire Sales (ahh the memories) and still have left over stock. That era has long ended. With 1999 and Amiami getting in the export game (a very grey area) after HLJ and now Big in Japan, Otakumode, and soon Hobby Stock, none of them are ordering 50 to 100 units. These online shops in this day an age are not concerned with guaranteeing stock or your order fulfillment at the pre-order stage, they pretty much are battling to keep their existing customers or attempting to steel their competitors with price cuts.

Your comparison is not only flawed, but downright ludicrous.

Since you still have friends working in the HLJ, perhaps you could help get some numbers of how many Arcadia Valks vs Bandai Valks are actually stocked by HLJ? Just a ballpark figure would do. If it truly is below 50 and is more in the 10-20 range, then i'd be very surprised and my opinions would be obviously ludicrous and flawed. 50-100 isn't that big a number of stock for an online retailer to sell to all of Japan plus the export market. As you mentioned, during the golden era of Yamato, I'm guessing HLJ probably stocks 100-200 units easy. And that was also when there was less competition from other online portal. I agree that this era has long past. But really, 50-100 units of Arcadia valks per online retailer is also ludicrous by today's standards? How do they break even with the steel molds required to build it?

I've read a couple of days ago on the TFW boards that the initial run of the MMC Feral Rex Combiner (a 3rd party Not Predaking) was 6000 pieces. Since Feral Rex is one of the most popular 3rd party items (that are also a niche inside the niche of adult Transformers collectors but with a much wider appeal) if not the most popular combiner set (according to a TFW poll) I would assume that the first run of VF-0D could be a 6000 units max.

So going by that if your assumption of 50 to 100 units are correct there would be 60 stores that have offered the VF-0D to customers if we assume every store ordered 100 units. I assume the number of stores would be higher since not every store would order 100 units (especially not the ones in Hong Kong like angolz and hkcollectibles) but lets stay to the number of 60 shops.

Now is it reasonable to assume that this many shops actually offering Arcadia products? From what I gathered in this thread it would be hard to come up with even that number since Arcadias products are not sold on a regular bases in brick and mortar stores.

So from the information presented in this thread I would assume that the initial run of the VF-0D was (much) smaller than 6000 units.

I know it is dangerous to make such assumptions since we don't know specifics and I can only extrapolate data from the information (not facts) presented on Macross World and other boards so this hole post might be in vain.

Interesting to know that Feral Rex is 6000 units on initial run. I believe there was a second run which means there is more demand for it despite the premium pricing. But the distribution channels for a 3rd party item like Feral Rex is more limited than a Arcadia Valk. Based on your assumptions of 100 units sold per shop there needs to be 60 at least of said shops. I doubt we can come up with 60 shops either for the 3rd party TF market which is a niche within a niche. There's fewer major players who have lesser reach and customers than HLJ etc. Which means to say that there is a large number of specialty stores that sell within the 5-10 units range each since Feral Rex is being sold like hot cakes.

Not Arcadia specifically. It was generally applied to all items.

And yes should be same across the board for major hobby stores. 50-100 is a general range. It's not specific.

Wolfx: what is your source that "major" hobby stores are ordering on consignment? And ordering specifically 50-100 units each?

I know someone who was working in HLJ who provides some insight on how procurement is done.

As a supplier its generally known that major stores will only list your product if you can supply a certain amount of stock. They aren't gonna list you if you are just gonna give them 1-10 units.

I'll try to sum up what i've said in the past few posts:

Arcadia's Macross is sold in major hobby stores (i.e.: HLJ, Amazon JP, AmiAmi, 1999 etc). These stores order stocks by consignments which can be anywhere from 50-100 units and they do export overseas to the international market. This is hardly a small "limited number" claimed by a few people here who are giving the impression that only smaller brick and mortar specialty stores stock up on Arcadia stuff, and even then they might only order 1-10 units each. The take home from all this is, Arcadia produces more Valks than you think.

With that said, we can make a comparison to other smaller companies producing smaller number of toys which are NOT sold in major hobby stores who have better quality, better pricing, and are made in a China factory as well.

Conclusion: If factory pricing is what drives these valks to be priced so high, Arcadia has to change its factory which can produce the same expected level of quality if not better for a cheaper manufacturing price. This article is hogwash as far as I'm concerned, and that 65-78% scrap rate is totally unacceptable to anyone in the manufacturing business.

It's great for those who are into Combiner Wars, I've never look into it and. They just look weird to me, it looks as if the G1 characters got mutated.

They are great playable updates to the old scramble city combiners. Costs a fraction of 3rd party, and with a bit of investment in 3rd party add-ons, they can look like collector-grade combiners too. I'm happy the kids of today and the kiddults are getting these

You probably should put those others into the group as well, because they're aren't niche. No, TRU doesn't sell Macross, because it's a niche product sold at niche stores. The collectors market is niche by definition, that makes the store niche as well. Niche fandom, market, item and store. Guess what, some of the Yamato/Arcadia/Bandai Macross toys are also listed on Amazon right now, does that suddenly make them mainstream because they're on the BIGGEST website on the planet? No, and everybody knows who Amazon are.

I would think yes. Thanks for proving my point. Do you know how much product a supplier needs to provide to Amazon be listed on Amazon? And just to pre-empt you, no, i'm not talking about a hobby store or individual's account on Amazon. I mean Amazon selling the product themselves. I rest my case.

BBTS is niche dude, even if they sell some widely circulated things like Marvel Legends and Transformers. The store itself isn't know to the greater majority. Toys R Us, everybody knows Toys R Us. BigBadToyStore... only a small minority, even if it is a majority of collectors, still makes it niche.

Dude. Why don't we put Target, Hamley's and Walmart into your list while we're at it if you wanna talk about TRU. Does TRU even sell any Macross toys, Bandai or Arcadia, for that matter? How about 3A Toys? I was talking about niche in the collector's market. If BBTS is niche, what is Captured Prey and PlanetSteelExpress? Black Markets? (hmm...maybe one can say so considering all the unlicensed stuff)

Anyway semantics aside, i think i've put my point across and it wasn't to argue which retailers are considered niche and which aren't. It was merely to illustrate which toy stores sell valks, which don't, and how big their respective sales volumes are.

What about the stuff that you can't even get at local comic shops? That's the category that these products fall into.

Nevertheless, as your definition of niche vs. main stream is quite... unique, we'll leave it at that.

Dear other readers: hopefully you've gleaned something from this side discussion on the distribution and retailing of these products, no matter what your definition of limited distribution (aka niche) is, or not.

My point was you can't get them from local comic/hobby shops (niche), but you can get them from HLJ, Amiami and 1999 (mainstream). The volume and availability is better than comic shops. Its easily accessible and these companies have consignment by crates. Not just 1-2 pieces imported by specialty shops. Granted an Arcadia release probably has 2 pieces per crate, I'm sure HLJ has stocked about at least 10 crates if not more. My local hobby store doesn't bring in any Arcadia stuff. But HLJ does. This means Arcadia (to me) falls in the realm of mainstream distribution channels and they are quite easily available. Amazon is mainstream, right?

Regardless of what i meant by niche or not, generally the point i was trying to make was, Arcadia valks are sold by these big online retailers which stock more product. 3P TF aren't, and are mostly sold by smaller/specialty retailers that stock up way less. Going by that, i'm assuming 3P TF is more niche than Arcadia valks....and their production numbers are equal to if not less than an Arcadia valk.

The point of the distribution conversation is quantity. I would guess Arcadia is making production runs of like 1000 pieces on these VF-0 products. If they made 2000 you'd be able to spread the costs twice as much. That's why Bandai is able to price so much better, they're probably doing production runs that are multiples of what Arcadia is doing. If the molds cost $200K to make, at a production run of 1000 you'd need $200 each just to recover the cost of the molds. There are probably fixed set up costs at the factory also that get spread out over the unit run. The variable costs of actually building each toy, painting, and shipping is probably a small percent of the overall costs.

So when you guys try to draw your comparisons try to think of the number being sold. Does a 3P Transformer sell more than a VF-0 toy? I'd guess most do. So, if their molds cost the same but they make twice as many then you should expect the cost to be around half as much (okay, a little more than half as much due to variable costs). For traditional transformers, they probably make five times as many so the cost should be like 20% (again, plus the variable costs).

I don't have any numbers. But going by availability alone, its much easier to get an Arcadia valk than a 3P transformer as they are being sold by larger online retailers where the latter isn't. Lets not forget, a 3P transformer company (who share toy designers amongst each other) is much smaller than Arcadia. Some even have to resort to Kickstarter or preorders to fund their projects.

Did you try talking to their live staff? Make a new account maybe?

I've used them awhile and had no problems. Even got my Soul of Proplica Dominator fixed via their customer service, but that was because Bandai was able to fix it for me.

Finally! Got my UW-02 with upgrade parts. The upgrade parts really help in the overall aesthetic. Will take combined mode later on when I get back from work.

I've never seen Yamato/Arcadia toys at Yodobashi Camera. Maybe they're limited to one particular branch?

The other establishments are all mail order. 2 of them have only a single store. And they're all extremely niche retailers.

For Yodobashi, its the one in Akiba. Also their online website has some for sale too. The others are major online retailers that serve Japan and international customers, comparable to BigBadToyStore stateside. To me, if these websites have Arcadia products, they are hardly niche. Only reason why BigBad doesn't carry Macross is because of "you-know-who-and-why". Also Amazon Japan carries them. Point is they aren't so niche as how some people mentioned. Niche to me is like stuff you can only get in comic shops, small-time distributors, kickstarter projects, etc.

No, they're not. They're only sold in specialty hobby shops.

It's the Bandai and Hasegawa stuff that gets sold in some of the major stores, if that. And even then, it's an EXTREMELY limited selection at best.

Arcadias are sold in Yodobashi Camera (a huge mall) , HLJ, 1999, and Amiami they are major enough for me. For comparison, you won't see these places selling 3P TFs do you? These places are hardly "specialty" hobby shops. Hence the comparison.

Anyway, seeing that the discussion has gone on for a few weeks now and we can see that there are generally 2 camps. Those who support Arcadia's prices and those who don't. For the record i'm with the latter, not because I can't afford it, but because I can't justify the price with the purported "quality" they seem to promise with their products. Those who support Arcadia's prices, are missing the elephant in the room, which is despite them having purported high QC processes with high scrap rate, sadly their products do not reflect that such stringent QC is in place. And people will make the comparison with other companies that make high-end transforming robots based on manufacturing costs and practices alone.

Its unfair to say they are caviar and bananas and should not be compared to each other. Hardly. More like domestic beers vs craft beers (sorry, best example i can think off at this time is beer XD). They both are still beers, and I don't mind drinking either on a hot day. They both cost different due to the difference in production volume and also the niche one of them serves, but that doesn't mean I'll accept and drink a beer that has soured, especially when its a craft beer which purportedly has been made with utmost care and thus the tolerance towards QC issues are less. That's my 2 cents.

Interesting argument Wokfx.

But is it possible that other manufacturers/factories might not be able to produce the "quality" expected? Cheaper may mean less quality amongst these factories..

I don't collect TF's so I can't speak to their quality output from third parties..

I collect some 3rd party TFs...and i can vouch that their quality are top notch, especially from known companies like MMC. They may have a few rare lemons but even those will get replacement parts easily without question. They are also proactive in getting customer feedback by showing prototypes and quite open to fixing the final release if people comment about proportions and colours. Granted I think not many of these toys have much if any tampo printing on them. But their price point does make you want to compare with Arcadia.

You have to factor the fact that Arcadia uses top Manufacturers... the rising cost of of those manufacturers and materials, outbidding people that want the same scheduled manufacturing, the cost of running a business in Japan, packaging (including designers and packing).

Just look at the cost of similarly sized third party transformers with similar quality and then imagine a lower production number . Yes, the people that buy Third Party Transformers do outnumber Macross fans that buy high end product and then imagine if those people pay licenses. In fact compare those 3P transformers toys and then imagine how many times they get to reissue them and then rerelease them in different colors without changing the mold.

License costing aside and based solely on manufacturing numbers alone, where are you getting the numbers that 3rd party TFs number more than Arcadia valk's production numbers? To note that 3rd party TFs are not sold in any major outlets and mostly only distribute from specialty hobby shops, but Arcadia is sold in all major (Japanese) outlets and online stores.

I have friends who have factories and are in the manufacturing business, and although not comparable to a high-end transforming toy, they doubt this story when I told them about it. Basically a huge majority of the manufacturing costs boils down to the number of parts. More parts = more injection molds = more costs. More parts = more complex assembly line = more costs. A valk has comparable no. of parts to a high-end transforming toy thus a 3rd party transformer comparison. People kept saying that Arcadia is a small company, which is also comparable to a 3rd party transformer company.

Taking that into consideration, i'm of the opinion that their factory is charging too high a cost and taking Yamato, and now Arcadia, for a ride. They should get a new factory. If 3rd Party Transformer companies can change factories for every other release fairly easily without imposing costs on customers, i don't see why Arcadia can't. This eliminates Mr K's argument for not changing factories due to re-training costs.

Overlord is a must get. Gonna prepare for it to cost a bomb though.

The problem I have with this whole interview is Arcadia is justifying their prices due to their supposed high QC standards. And they are serving a small niche market, i.e.: high-end collector's product. But the question is, as Renato (i think) , mentioned in the podcast, is it quality? Did they deliver their alleged high standards of quality? Never got an Arcadia valk so I can't personally comment. But based on the feedback i'm seeing in the forums, it doesn't look like they are delivering even on the QC. This makes their asking price less justifiable. If i'm going to pay premium prices, i will be expecting premium merchandise which should be perfect as far as I am concerned. For example, when I buy stuff from Hot Toys, Side Show Collectibles, Sentinel, Mastermind Creations, etc, I will know that I'll get something that I will be extremely satisfied with and worth every single cent I'm throwing at them. With Arcadia, i'm still not getting this level of consumer confidence. And thus unfortunately i'm still not one of their customers.

My 2 cents.

Why is MG Rex's head on everything?

Is anything sacred anymore. Next they'll make a chibi rex-head robot.....

http://www.hlj.com/product/meg81961

Nooooooo!!!

Check this out.

We don't have Walmarts here. I should be fracking pissed about this, right?

This hasn't been released in my country yet, but quite sad to hear that it only has 5 points of articulation. I thought I could put her together with my ep3 clone trooper collection.

http://www.jeditemplearchives.com/content/modules.php?name=JReviews&rop=showcontent&id=2296

I've only watched up till Bakemonogatari season 2. What am I missing? Hanamonogatari and Tsukimonogatari? (5 and 3 episodes respectively?)

These went under my radar surprisingly. Must've been busy with work.

I wasn't really making any argument for the 29 becoming a CF fighter, especially with the rarity of the fold quartz. Not sure anyone was.

Was just speaking about the apparent uselessness of the 30 since it lacks firepower for extended engagements compared to its predecessors. Once it blows its container load of missiles, all it's got left are the head lasers and gunpod.

It's only got one very specific specialized ability and that is to break through fold faults. I don't really see that as useful in general every day use.

So yeah, if there's anything that is likely to replace the VF-171, it would be the 25 due to its multi-role adaptability, as long as it's not deemed as too much of a hero valk. Or they might finally decide that some cheaper variant of the 19 will be for the masses like the EF, which Isamu's is actually a custom variant of, VF-19 EF/A. (Thus bringing this discussion back to the 19 )

Long ago, I read that the YF-29 , (i assume like the YF-30), if anything is just a temporary "Frankenstein" of VF-25 parts and was supposed to be a "one-off". Its original intention was to act as an anti-vajra fold relay fighter to project Ranka's song to the Vajra. It never was meant to be mass produced or past the prototype stage. Then when Macross 30 came in I don't know what happened with that supposed explanation and can't find it anywhere anymore since there is now an Isamu, Ozma and Rod custom. Lol.

Seeing that both YF-29 an YF-30 are supposed to be specialised anti-vajra fighters, seem unlikely they will see mass-production. And the fold quartz that come from Vajra corpses will be rarer since the Vajra disappeared from the galaxy after the events of Frontier. The VF-25 being the new mainstay fighter would be most likely.

Sorry now back to the 19.

lol gender bent Amy and Ledo as ANN image.