Mit
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"RedWolf" and "Seto Kaiba" - thank you for information ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Questions about the "Unification War." According to the technical information in the development of "SV-51" participated "Sukhoi" (Russia) / "Israel Aircraft Industries" (Israel) / "Dornier" (France); the development of "Octos" participated "Daimler Hyperspace Corporation" (Germany) / "Rubin Central Science Bureau for Marine Engineering" (Russia) ... and this is the military equipment "Anti-UN" So, where to start, how flowed and the completed "Unification War"? And what kind of coalition war with each other? Is there any information about this?
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Well, "azrael" indicated that the maximum speed "Cheyenne" as 112 kilometers per hour - when he meant another, then I'm sorry Yes I know this series. But I really do not like this design, let me explain why. 1) it moves on an air cushion, ie, it can not use in the rarefied atmosphere, or in the absence of air 2) in the tank mode, he can only use a single beam gun 3) put forward his feet, he loses much of its speed and agility, but gains in firepower, so that is probably the turret mode 4) in the robot mode, it can be used again, only one beam gun In general, the design turned out stupid I am a bad artist, but I'll try, somehow, to write a short "lecture" on alternative history of armored vehicles in "Macross" ... a separate topic In the meantime, I gather information and develop theoretical aspect With "Spacebattles Forums", there seems to be very creative people gather, just themselves invented (?) тhese names *Tired sigh* ... It seems that you do not understand the meaning of reading Patrol robots are adequate for their role of police equipment and, as transformers, were quite cheap and easy...And if such could be done to the police, there is no problem with the creation of the army of models, more reliable, with decent weapons and armor. Speaking of which, where, during the attacks enemy VFs, were "Destroyers" and "Valkyrie" guarding "City-7"? Once again, "Octos" was good in his field of battle, and more than amphibious capability is not required of him... In space, there are many planets with plenty of water Well, the "In-50C Loto" at a height of 12.2 meters has a crew of three pilots and carries eight commandos and with arms weigh a maximum of 22.1 tonnes... "Terminus" type from 13.7 to 14.2 (2.6-2.7 in car mode) meter in height and weigh from 21.3 to 23.3 tons. They also, in the car mode, can reach a maximum speed of 260-300 km per hour What? That is, do you, "Octos" could not act on the sandy / muddy coast or in the jungle? Here are just a "Macross Zero" has been used successfully on the coast and in the interior of the island... The point is "leakage", so "VF-0" and could, not for a long time, dive into the water As a result, we got terribly expensive and complicated "a jack of all hands", the same bad coping with all tasks For planetary garrisons, especially in the worlds richest water surfaces, suitable This is not true. In the "Macross Zero" infantry led fire on "Octos", and in the "Frontier" fighters in power armor destroyed "vajra" during a sweeping operation... So it all depends on the talent commanding officers And what's the problem? Distance defeats the purpose of "9M133 Kornet" 100-5,500m (Kornet-EM 8,000 m (anti-tank), 10,000 m (thermobari)), and "FGM-148 Javelin" has an interesting feature of striking targets in the most vulnerable area of target... For the rest, like the warhead capacity, has over technology
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By the way, is there any information about the Navy at all? I mean, for immigrant fleets have a more or less detailed information, but what about the intelligence, research; merchant and passenger; military and other fleets?
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And how did they shoot underwater? Under the "operate in space" you mean the role of anti-aircraft guns on the deck? Once again, "Octos" carries out its tasks and perform them well... Nevertheless, they were built and were carrying military service, and if they had not been on the island, it is only a problem of command Аgain RAW? I can say only one thing, this submarine was not over tech weapons... "The warheads of the missiles are equivalent to a 1,000lb bomb's explosive filler... and it usually takes two or three to get through a Valkyrie or Destroid's armor." However, "Octos" and his weapon is created using the same technology as the "Valkyrie" with "Destroyer" Apparently you have not played - in 4 game tasks have to destroy the rebel "Destroyers", which protects one of the bases It's so updated and redesigned, it is a new model - it is possible to draw an analogy with the Russian T-90, which is a deep modernization of T-72B, called "T-72B advanced", but in 1992 was adopted already under the symbol T-90 But have proved effective in operations in the colonies and on the asteroid, i.e. his role coped That is, you can build a cheap transformer? If you can create a cheap "Valkyrie", why not create a cheap variation tank? If you look at the scheme of transformation "D-50C Lotto" or "Mon Soono", you will see that it is many times easier than the "VF-9 Cutlass" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBgRVF-ww2k As part of the firepower: "D-50C Lotto" - 2 x Beam Burner and 2 x 12-tube Missile Launcher, 2 x 120mm Cannon or Mega Machine Cannon or Machine Gun "Hussar" - in addition to the anti infantry machine guns and Gatling gun mounted - quartet of large rotary cannons or twinned Heavy Rocket Packs (24 or 48 rockets) or Light Field Gun or twinned guided missile launchers "Mon-Soono type20" - laser cannon x 1, missile pod (can mount regular or homing missile) x 2, shoulder-mounted cannon x 2 and assault rifle x 1 ...very well even in comparison with "Destroyer" Here are just a model of the family "VF-24" and in the "frontier" and "Delta" by using this technology play a leading role; and instead of the new drone successfully developing brand new "VF-171EX Nightmare Plus" ... Paradox...
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Versatile possibilities of "VGPV-07 Chiron (Variable Ground Patrol Vehicle)" were not required because he was acting within the "Sity 7" and other vessels; air cover and patrols were engaged in near space "VAPC / VSPC-07 Odonata (Variable Air Patrol Craft / Variable Space Patrol Craft)"... https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7383/13422117494_e69089f343_o.jpg https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7075/13422116914_e6c8751e9a_o.jpg https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7311/13421752655_aef6745873_o.jpg https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2830/13421752405_75f326f828_o.jpg https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7002/13421871773_cccfdbed62_o.jpg ...тhis combination was quite effective and cheap, since they used the city police. "Octos", but as "Valkyrie", was worth more than the "Destroyer", but quite acceptable for further proceedings, in fact, well-known rule is that "the more order, the lower the price!". Moreover, nothing forbids to improve the design, making it simpler and more reliable... In fact, the real benefit is there in a smaller profile (enemy fire will be more difficult to hit the target), greater stability (which allows you to use more powerful weapons), less wear extremities (ie, a continuous operation), the ability to tow a variety of other goods, and so on Well, "Octos" was equipped with reaction engine, but its creators did not have to suffer, thinking on while simultaneously combine in it the possibility of aero-space plane (by the way, and "VA-3M Invader" can independently go into orbit?) and waterproofness together with ballast, corrosion protection and resistance to high pressure + special configuration that folds the main wings down and the rear horizontal stabilizers rotate forward to assist in underwater maneuvering. "Octos" obviously easier and cheaper out Hmm ... Anti-tank guns, maybe? By the way, the Marines appear in the frame and in the "Macross Plus" (protection of military facilities) and in the "Frontier" (here they are already equipped with exoskeletons) - it seems that the local military still believe the infantry needed However, with small Vajra these linear rifle perfectly managed, so that for a particular purpose should be the appropriate weapon, that such anti-cyborg rifle... http://www.macross2.net/m3/macrossf/exgear-nuns/exgear-nunsgun.jpg Concerning reservation - one of the favorite arguments against Meca is the vulnerability of their joints and sensors - in the case of "Destroyer" and even rocket launchers ... Just need a suitable Infantry Tactics And do not forget about the Marines of zentradi That is, the models produced after the war were also improved. Apparently the shortcomings of these machines were not so great Thanks "Mr March" By the way, could you refresh the page, "Cheyenne"? Speed is really a problem ... or not? "Cheyenne Mk II", like, develops a maximum of 112 km per hour, despite the fact that 50 years younger and is equipped with wheels ... And what does it mean? "Octos" attacked "the base" of UN forces after the main battle began, and if the "Cheyennes" and their pilots were not ready at the time of the attack ... well, their training is poor ... Why did you decide so? The first clash happened between them in the water - VF-0 shot from his 35mm gatling gun pod in emphasis and even something was damaged, but the combat capability "Octos" it is preserved... The second time was in ruins - VF-0S Phoenix shot off "leg" and undermined one rocket launcher at the second "Octos" his Mauler laser cannons ... and then he exploded (strange, but shooting from the laser to the body was useless) Somehow it seems a little on the absolute superiority of the "Valkyries
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However, the "Destroyer" is still widely used and successfully upgraded, despite the ground-based robots "useless" ... And among them already twice been examples of ground transformers For these inland areas came to variational tanks, but so far for this are "Destroyers" By the way, even in the era of space war in "Macross" submarine needed for hydro-planets, though they seemed to have decided and crossed atmospheric space fighter with submersibles, and the result was "VA-3M Invader" ... Frankly, such a solution is even more doubtful than the convertible "Octos" I am afraid that the "Macross Zero" does not agree with you, though there were already "Valkyrie" and "Destroyers" but the infantry still play a role... By the way, why did you decide that the antitank grenade launchers can not be adjusted against the "Destroyer" or automatic grenade launcher (caliber 30-40 mm) useless against zentradi? So what? It changes something in the fact that "Octos" had energy conversion armor? In its technical data "Macross Mecha Manual" this information is not specified, and therefore would be happy to link... In the meantime, to protect "Octos" I can indicate its amphibious capabilities... It is ironic, given how easy it is "Cheyennes" died under fire "Octos" in "Macross Zero" Like the "Defender", "Monster", "Phalanx" and "Spartan". He specializes in landing operations on the coast, and with its role as "Ostos" copes perfectly I guess the "energy conversion armor" can provide a high level of protection for small thickness (if I remember correctly, the armor "Valkyrie" at the aircraft thickness correspond to the modern tank), and thus allows, among other things, to reduce the overall weight of the combat vehicle and the load on its structure The main thing is that they continue to build up despite the high cost and other costs, and thus in this sense was And a small remark to sink the transport with "Tomahawk" need only a couple of "Octos" Alas, I can not double-check your data, and is forced to use only the materials available to me ... But in this debate, all the time you are operating terms, such as "useless" and "do not need" - this can not be called a valid argument For example: ------------------------------ You - in the "Macross" is not necessary ground equipment I - but it uses "Destroyers" (and even tanks, according to the intro "VF-X 2") You - all of them older models I - but that "Cheyenne Mk II" is a new model ----------------------------- You - for analogue "D-50C Lotto" in "Macross" no suitable targets I - But there asteroid base, like the one shown in the "M7 Dynamite" + various space stations ---------------------------- You - they are too expensive I - But even the poor planetary garrisons using variational fighters "Sutlass" You - "Valkyrie" is still being squeezed, "Ghosts" I - But thanks to the inertial control "Valkyrie" can compete with the "ghost" (if I remember correctly, then tests YF-24 was able to successfully bring down two robots) Etc. and so on Well, in this case, you prefer to be called "City Police Patroid" a joke, not a precedent Interesting idea, thank you
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By the way, are there any data on the total population in the Earth, in the colonies and migratory fleets at the time of "Macross Frontier"?
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You can formulate this thought more specific? What do you mean? Just do not write again, "we have already talked about this" So, "Octos" effective on the coast, that is, to a certain specialization battlefield as "Destroyer" for anti-air and anti-space defense, artillery support and close combat. The only difference between them is that "Octos" is a transformer ... If you compare "Octos" and "Tomahawk" in figures, you get a very interesting picture: 1)"Octos" mass: fully loaded 55.15 metric tons, "Tomahawk" mass: 31.3 metric tons (fully or not unknown), considering about the same dimensions, "Octos" can carry 5 or 6 marines; 2)compare power generators will not work due to lack of data on "Octos", but we know that his performance enough to operate energy conversion armor; 3)"Octos" performance:Destroid Mode: walking 45 kmph, rolling 95 kmph, Submarine Mode: 40 kt, 45 kt maximum (74.08 kmph, 83.34 kmph max.); operating depth 250 meters (375 meters max.); "Tomahawk" performance to walking unknown, but he can jump (нeight and distance unknown) 4) "Octos" armament - guns: 1 x 12.7mm dual beam machine gun turret, 1 x Bifors 57mm multi-use rapid-fire cannon, 1 x anti-personnel machine gun turret; bombs & missiles: 1 x missile launcher with 8 missiles, 2 x torpedo launchers, utilized in submarine mode; optional armament: 1 x machine gun, mountable from cockpit when cockpit hatch is open (In principle, heavy weapons from commandos also possible to deduct) "Tomahawk" armament - guns: 2 x Mauler PBG-11 liquid-cooled electrically-charged particle beam gun, 2 x Ramington M-89 12.7 mm air-cooled MG, 2 x Astra TZ-III gun cluster with each cluster featuring the following: 1 x laser gun, 1 x 25 mm MG, 1 x 180 mm grenade launcher, 1 x flamethrower; bombs & missiles: 2 x Bifors close-in self-guided rocket launchers with 12 rockets per launcher (24 rockets total), 1 x Erlikon anti-aircraft self-guided missile option pack with 6 missiles As can be seen from this comparison, even against the backdrop of an extremely rearmament "Tomahawk", "Octos" looks pretty good for a specialized combat vehicle, in addition, it can interact with the infantry to the level of transportation, besides, it has one important advantage "energy conversion armor " And finally, the most important - "The U.N. Forces continued production of the Octos, producing some 28 units until Space War I when the production line was destroyed." - in other words, the variation submarines were appreciated and further production was interrupted not by the "financial and political considerations", but destruction, "Space War I" Simply put, you ignore the "official" if it is inconvenient for your point of view? Therefore, I find the description of variations of the tank by Kawamori, referring to the book and asked about that - I found the right image? - that's all. I never said that this war machine must necessarily belong to the universe of "Macross", I was interested in the concept of such a mechanism in terms of Kawamori - and that's why I want to find a picture for a description Thank you for your work, but the fact that it is a sketch of "Gabriel" is indicated in the upper left of the page in English
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Have you ever read what they write in messages? This picture I took from this book - there I have it in electronic form ... And I have, more than once, argued objected ... No offense, but you're boring The fact that in the "Macross" focuses on the "Valkyrie", does not mean that other types of transformers can not be used at all - at least, variational submarine has already appeared on the screen, as well as convertible Destroyer In the end, use the sketches and designs for inspiration is not prohibited
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Hey guys, I've found a description of variations of the wheeled tank by Kawamori Has anyone seen this picture? Or, I apologize for the audacity, it can draw on the basis of the description? I looked at the book and found only this, but unsure --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- By the way, we even have a sketch Kawamori transforming boats http://i.imgbox.com/aawpal5c.jpg
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Yes I know. Just being a newcomer in the forum I have not yet figured out where and what topics ... But thanks for the link
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Hmm? I could try to write something like "test notes" about how there and realized the idea of transformable tanks in an alternate version of "Macross", but is obliged to inform about my terrible English ...
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By the way, I heard that all the film adaptation of "Macross" are a kind of interpretation of real events in the universe "Macross", which means all the movies / OVA / anime series is the same canonical ... Is it believable? If "yes", then what would be the "event" really?
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Well, I will wait for the results of your creativity Speaking of which, you are a genius ... Judging from the development of the discussion, all over again repeats the same arguments as in the topic on "MechaTalk" and, as a result, no one nothing will convince and will cover the topic ... So, I suggest to change the format and to reflect on "what might be transformable tanks in the universe of "Macross"? In the end, fan fiction on the original project "Valkyrie" enough, so why not design the mecha-tanks?
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And still "little known"... But thanks for the info
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It was pretty rough, please do not consider other people's narrow-minded idiots just because they have a different point of view The "Eureka 7" tank mode used for high-speed movement on areas with low "trappa", so it is quite necessary, for the "Mon-Soono" tank mode is also used to compact during transport... In the case of "D50C Lotto", a tank mode is needed for the transportation of special forces in the earth's gravity +/-, but the robot mode is suitable for the urban environment (etc.) for firing at the enemy in terms of having multiple obstacles https://patrickgrade.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/93.jpg http://orig13.deviantart.net/3824/f/2012/139/3/d/d_50c_loto_by_progv-d50bv6w.jpg By the way, is not the only, here, for example, "Hussar Tank-Strider" from "Heavy Gear" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBgRVF-ww2k&feature=youtu.be The most interesting thing in the scheme of transformation - is very similar to the principle of transformation "D-50C Lotto" and "Mon-Soono" - it seems the easiest option So in fact we have to fight not only with zentradi... However, in-universe it doesn't make sense for a civilization as paranoid and as competent as the NUNS to completely skip out on their ground forces. This is especially the case with VFs where they are known to have fairly low ammo and cannot fight in extended battles for too long until the quantum beam guns came into development. About the same "Destroids" - their specialization has played a cruel joke with them, for example, Cheyenne II, which is virtually all four original Destroid types rolled into one: 2x converging beam cannon2x heavy electric gatling cannon 2x 4-tube medium range missile launchers 1x AP chaingun Thrusters on shoulders & back for space movement/jumps/hovering High speed mobility Rollers (for speed and conserve feet) While being SMALLER then any one of the original production models... The universalization and unification in action - we must save money... Best roles for them would be just as we see in MacF, where they can either be 'fixed' turrets, standing inside a semi-protected tube that locks them in place while also partially providing armor around them, or as roving 'mobile' turrets, using the magnetic rollers to safely adhere them to their ship's hull (plus judicious use of their thrusters at key moments, likely an automated feature). That would be for space usage when they're outside a hull.Inside a hull, like inside a colony ship or one of the larger open-area craft (SDFNs, any Zentradi/Meltrandi vessel), or down on a planet, leave them in tank mode until things reach near melee range, and they'd get the advantage of a much smaller and more compact shape, hull-down tricks to hide behind cover that even a Battroid couldn't dream of getting behind without seriously compromising the amount of weapons it could use (think of D.D. Ivanov's attack on Roy when D.D. was in the canyon - all he could fire was his gunpod, while the rest of his SV-51's armament couldn't be utilized). The tank mode could at least use all its armament while still being near completely covered. Addtionally, as likely has FAR less need for pure speed, as the tracks would require a helvalot less power then the thrust needed to keep a VF in the air, it could devote a very large percentage of it's power into maxing it's energy conversion armor. So much so that by Mac7 era, you really should be able to mount at least one PPB on it, and keep the PPB active as long as the VT was turned on, no matter which mode it was in.
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I beg your pardon, "little known" in comparison with the same "zentradi" ... By the way, I am not familiar with the "Macross the Ride" - Japanese Kanji I don`t know and English translation has not found it - so get acquainted with the local characters of the race "zolans" there is no possible ... About the same Michel and Jessica Blanc from "Macross Frontier" there is some problem in the identification, because they lack one of the distinct racial features "zolans" - multi-colored hair on the head, and the sources, again, are not available ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for the information about this exciting race If you do not difficult, could you tell us more about the individual representatives of the people?
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Well, you can always say that it is because Aerospace fighter need wings to fly in the atmosphere and as fuel tanks, for example... However, you are right that it all-just aesthetics - not so long ago I opened a couple of branches discussed at / m / dedicated to the issue of variation tanks in "Macross" and another about transforming tanks "D-50C Loto" from "Gundam." So, in a branch of "Macross" anons aggressively argued that this technique is not necessary; and in branch "Gundam" persistently argued the validity of the existence of such ones Somehow it seems to me that if in the first "Macross" instead of "Destroids" would show mecha-tanks, that would protect them no less strongly than now reject Hmm? My idea is based on "Mon-Soono" from "Eureka-7" is transformed as a replacement for "Destroids", and thanks to the plug-in module and the handle-shaped manipulators, they are easily adapted for any combat mission, when fighting on planets and identities within the "Islands" + thanks to the rocket engines can be applied in a limited space in the capture of military facilities. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v662/SKGundam/Mon-SoonoType20vehicle.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v662/SKGundam/Mon-SoonoType20.jpg There are lighter models for exploration and patrols http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/eurekaseven/images/3/31/ScudBikeVehicle.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20150127045647 http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/eurekaseven/images/e/eb/Scudbike.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20150127045536 and heroic unit http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v662/SKGundam/505Kaivehiclecopy.jpg http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/eurekaseven/images/6/68/505.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20120527183834&path-prefix=pl Because, "unification", is easier to use a universal platform which has some common features with the technological "Valkyrie" than to produce and deliver many different techniques out there somewhere That's just a fact does not prevent the mass production of a series of "VF" after a destructive war ... By the way, as well as a cost "Destroid"?
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I propose to talk about the very little-known race in the "Macross" universe - zolans. What is known about their origins? When and under what circumstances they have come into contact with humans? Any features of their culture? Details physiology - for example, why they have dual coloring of hair on your head? and why males such thick hair on his hands? and much more...
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So, we finally gave a star map of "Macross", albeit in a small resolution. Can anyone identify the fleets and colonies, and do the listed star systems?
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Hello ladies and gentlemen. As a fan of "Macross" of the universe, I have long been concerned about a difficult question (I apologize in advance for my English )... The symbol of the saga for a long time and deservedly became a transforming fighter "VF-1 Valkyrie", but a very promising idea of a new generation of combat (and not only) machine, for some reason, bypassed the attention of ground equipment ... In the original "Macross", ground robots are represented by numerous "Destroids", large bipedal with an extensive arsenal of mechanisms, but limited running performance ... Actually they puzzled me at first view - why, have are excellent variation`s fighters, they did not create ground equipment of this type, the same tanks, for example? I should note that the use of technology transformation would give the land a robotic technique many advantages, such as changing the height profile, the ability to use a wheeled platform for rapid movements on relatively flat terrain, the mode of transport for maximum compactness, combat flexibility and versatility humanoid form and more... Although, if you look at history, the "Macross Zero" contains real transformable submarines "Oktos" http://www.macross2.net/m3/macrosszero/octos.htm In "Macross 7 PLUS" is a variation technique used by the police, but against the general background of comedy happening they seem rather a joke ... In general, if you take the components of "Robotech", the original model of variational tanks there are ... "Spartan" - http://www.robotechresearch.com/rpg/mecha/sc/vht_1_hovertank/vht_1_hovertank.htm "Hoplite" - http://www.robotechresearch.com/rpg/mecha/ref/veritech/vht_2_hoplight/vht_2_hoplight.htm "Centaur" - http://www.robotechresearch.com/rpg/mecha/rdf/veritechs/centaur/VBT_Centaur.htm ... but originally belonging to another "universe" just does not correspond to the total number of techno-design in "Macross" As a result, there is a paradoxical situation where the "Macross" originally using convertible model was not able to create anything other than spectacular "Valkyrie", but the "Gundam" UC managed to create a very impressive transformer tank http://gundam.wikia.com/wiki/D-50C_Loto In my opinion, something similar to a series of "Terminus" or "MonSoono" (from "Eureka 7") as variational wheeled tanks, it would fit in the "Macross"... http://eurekaseven.wikia.com/wiki/Mon-soono http://www.mahq.net/mecha/eureka7/tr1/r505.htm (I already asked a similar question on "Mechatalk" - http://www.mechatalk.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=16578 - and exchange of views came out quite interesting, but I would like to know your opinion on this idea...)
