Killer Robot

I figure they wouldn't make a big deal about "natural" pork and "real" eggs on Frontier if they couldn't more cheaply and easily synthesize something close but not exactly like the real thing. At a guess, I'd imagine Zentradi ships were outfitted with equipment, quite possibly related to the micloning tanks, that would make assorted foods out of base organic materials. That at least would explain why the Zentradi in SDFM were occasionally seen eating vaguely recognizable food products. Though it does seem odd that natural foodstuffs would be worth remarking about on Frontier, when the fleet seems so heavily geared toward agriculture and strict biosystem-type recycling.

It seems reasonable to assume that full sized Zentradi at the least have muscles and bones proportionally far stronger to human tissue. Land-based creatures of Zentradi size could, and in fact have, existed, but not of human stance and proportion, especially in motion. Large animals tend to have much stockier builds and thicker bones, as well as more careful and less fluid motion to make up for the stress the increased mass puts on their frames. They similarly are similarly less able to take high G-forces, or relatedly to survive long falls. This is in the real world, of course, and Zentradi lack these issues: clearly the nature of the PC enhancements is behind it. Given that Zentradi miclones don't appear to have the superhuman strength/speed/toughness those enhancements would imply, it can be presumed to only be active at their full size: on the other hand, such enhancements might be duplicated in modern cyborgs, for tough but humanlike tissues. As for macro-kids, presuming they grow to adulthood in the same timeframe as human kids, they would only need as much food proportional to macro-adults as human children need proportional to human adults. Which is certainly a lot, but no more than that of having Zentran colonists in the first place. I'm a little puzzled by the constant assumption I see in this or other threads that it's somehow wasteful or impractical to have full-sized Zentradi in space, when the shipbuilding technology in use was originally developed specifically to sustain Zentradi fleets. It's important to remember that the Zentradi were not miclonized to save on food bills, but rather to better culturally integrate them with humans and to subdue human fear of being destroyed by giants like the protoculture was(especially after Kamjin's and other high profile rebellions showed the damage restless Zentradi can do). It's also important to note that fleets are not constantly sent out because Earth and Eden are crowded, but to ensure that the human race will be too widely spread to be entirely destroyed by a single war or disaster. The post-war resource which is most scarce and difficult to preserve is not food or water or energy, but human(or Zentradi) life itself. Granted, Frontier had issues sustaining its Zentradi colonists after the one battle, but that was only once it was a badly damaged fleet with failing life support. Even then, macronized Zentradi only gave Frontier better resilience against such disasters: a fleet of Frontier's size that had used that Zentran space for the larger number of miclones that would have comfortably fit in it would have had no such belt-tightening option as Frontier did, hastening the resource crunch at the end and perhaps dooming the fleet.

I think it says something about Brera's outfit that even Sheryl can't make it look good.

That's about what I figured too. Given there seem to have been strict rules against males and females ever being on the same ship, the chance of a pair of them meeting up in empty hangar bay and "playing medic" would have been greatly reduced. I expect that when it was required that males and females be in closer physical proximity than their own ships it was strictly regulated that it be when armored up, like that case with Milia's delivery to the Macross. Realistically, if the Zentradi were adult and functional it's a better question why they seemed unfamiliar with the idea of sexuality entirely since one would expect the sort of opportunistic same-sex encounters found in real-world segregated environments. I think there might have been general other factors in the fleet environment that kept Zentradi from really developing such behavior without further cultural exposure, and can't expect perfect realism of psychology in a space opera kids' show anyway, especially on such topics.

I didn't dislike Klan but I was left unsatisfied. I wanted to see a window into the life of a full-blooded Zentradi both proud of her lineage yet raised in human culture, and while that showed up now and then it kept getting buried in 'lol now she's a little girl' distraction. To their credit, they made some genuine tension out of it past the pedo-baiting, but I was a lot more interested in her background than her medical condition.

It didn't work long, it didn't work well, but it was clearly physically possible and seen by Max as better than nothing. In many scenes, the size of a looming Zentradi relative to a human or other item of known size can easily be argued as a stylistic choice made for dramatic effect, not to be taken as perfectly to scale. On the other hand, while Max stealing an enemy uniform in his mecha was clearly done partly for comedic effect, it wasn't quite to the point of a slapstick, pull-a-hammer-from-nowhere sight gag either. It was a concrete and scripted element that would have worked differently if the scale was greatly different, and as such it should be assumed to be physically plausible that a common Zentradi and a VF-1 battroid might be of similar size. My main point published numbers or onscreen size comparisons that don't directly affect story events are of lesser weight to those that do, especially when they would render scripted events improbable or impossible.

I haven't seen the "Pretty Kitty" one, but I've seen the other two and the Sheryl art. I think the big difference is that Sheryl's image and presentation was very mature and sexual from the early promotional art, wheras Ranka was played as a sweet young schoolgirl in both overall look and stage presence. Given that, officially produced erotic art of Sheryl is business as usual, wheras that of Ranka is pretty jarring.

Mishima's plan was pretty simple: Capitalize on times of crisis to hide his assassination of President Glass, settle a new world, and gain total power over a whole world , beloved by his people for leading them to the storm to a paradise of blue skies and fold quartz. What he didn't know was that Grace was trying to lead Frontier into a trap, letting them get killed to help establish the Vajra to the rest of humanity as a threat which they could only confront through fold implant technology that she and the Galaxy conspiracy could in turn take control through. Though actually that was in part a modified plan, since the Gallia IV incident was supposed to also make Sheryl's high-profile death and the near or complete destruction of Frontier as the angry Vajra came after the fleet. Okay, you've partly got me there on the last. I get the general gist of Grace's ambitions, but the fine details, especially with how her plans had to be revised over time with like the discovery of Ranka and intended discarding of Sheryl, make much of her plotting feel like the "Step 2: ????, Step 3: Profit!" variety. Maybe someone else can help you there. But Mishima was after a basic power grab where he'd capitalize on and then solve a fleet-threatening crisis, never dreaming that Grace really just wanted to sacrifice the whole fleet to gain galactic domination.

It's also my take that one has to assume a happy medium, but it seems to me that the given numbers for Regulds and Q-Raus that only work with the smallest size references for Zentradi, much like the Ultraman-sized Exedol and flashback Veffidas in 7, represent the extremes from which the medium must be derived, rather than the medium itself. For another approach, Max's VF-1 fitting handily in a random Zentradi's uniform was not only onscreen, but plot-important in a way that exactly by how many meters Kamjin's Glaug towered over Hikaru's VF1J, or exactly how much Minmay sticks out from either side of Kamjin's hand, wasn't. I'd give first weight to something like that, and assume that any numbers or "style" animations that would make that act, or similar ones where scale served a strong plot purpose, impossible must be mistaken. Mind, this still leaves a lot of things open.

Nene appears to be markedly taller than her in macronized form. On the other hand, Nene appears to be pretty huge micronized too, so that doesn't rule out Klan being above average.

According to IMDB Arihiro Hase died in 1996, after the release of both Plus and 7. Though Kawamori's general policy not to revisit the same protagonists(save for alternate take movie versions like DYRL) once the plot is put to bed might be seen as the remaining element to his then policy of not wanting to revisit the same setting at all.

That's not exactly fair phrasing: they made Plus, 7, Zero, and Frontier to make more money too. As I understand, the main reason Studio Nue was not involved was that Kawamori was not interested in doing sequels at that time - a stance which he reversed for Macross Plus only when he couldn't find funding for his (originally non-Macross) plans for a series about two test pilots. Macross II despite its own problems had shown there was an immense demand for a Macross sequel, so it became easy for him to secure funding so long as he made a Macross story about two test pilots. From there, it appears he decided sequels weren't so bad after all. Mind, it's certainly reasonable for Kawamori/Studio Nue to not care about or acknowledge Macross II and its events and designs, but II is no more a cheap money grab than any of the sequels.

I don't just mean scaling against mecha, but also scaling against humans, which happened in SDFM, in limited cases in Macross 7(movie, Dynamite, and also somewhere in Encore and the Plus segments), and also on multiple occasions in Frontier. If Zentradi:human is 5:1, one would expect a human next to a Zentradi to look significantly though not enormously larger than an 10-12" 1:6 doll like a Barbie or original format GI Joe next to a human. At 1:5 scale a human on a Zentradi's shoulder would stand higher than the Zentradi's head, one in a hand would be nearly twice as long as said hand and at least three times that hand's width, and one on the ground would not be as tall as the Zentradi's kneecap(heeled shoes excluded), but could likely reach up and touch its bottom. On the contrary, animation from at least the later part of SDFM, as you say, and the subsequent TV series in addition, have made the human look smaller than that. At a guess I'd say that animation more commonly shows a scale factor of 7 or 8, however inaccurate it might be to official numbers.

Zentradi have always had a problem with scale. In theory the rank and file Zentradi were 5 times the size of humans from the start, but the animation has never matched that consistently and especially by 7 and Frontier they seem larger than that.

Just the same problem YJK describes was much of why it took me multiple attempts stretched over several years to watch more than ten episodes into Macross 7. Like Morpheus said, I got to like Macross 7 once I got past that slow and unfamiliar start, from the standpoint of generally interesting cast, fine little bits of comedy, and a plot that was enjoyable once it got moving 15-20 episodes in. Unlike Morpheus said, I never grew to like Basara: I more realized I didn't need to. Mylene is as viable as the story's lead and much more its narrator(since the audience is never really placed in his head, so to speak), so I found it more comfortable to just assume he was a powerful plot device/fan favorite associated with the focal character, like KOS-MOS from Xenosaga only with more singing. Now, that might be a valid critical viewpoint or it might be an exercise in self-delusion, but it helped me enjoy the series. My main point is that while a lot of people will make out Macross 7 "Basara's story", there's a big cast and another and maybe more sympathetic lead. On the other hand, Dynamite 7 is basically nothing but Basara going out alone on his personal quest, so it's another case entirely.

More aptly, look at any military camp where there's food to eat and the shells aren't currently flying: you'll see joking, playing games, enjoying the company of friends, enjoying the occasional package from home and looking fondly back and forward to better times. In short, you see people going about their lives, and as much as possible enjoying the respite they have. They're stressed, and a lot of the laughter is a venting of that stress; they're certainly different people than when they signed up; and some of them may snap under eventual pressure, or carry deep scars for life. Also, certainly, under unrelenting all day and everyday pounding, they'll be worn down, among other things because they're not getting that respite of normality: from what SDFM seemed to show, even the Zentradi got their time to go to the barracks, get a drink, and shoot the bull with their buddies. The common fictional approach of "in wartime everyone swiftly deteriorates into broken shells of their former selves" is as much an oversimplification as stories where everyone is bravely unmoved from the start, and in a series like Macross with such a central message that while war might not always be avoidable there has to be more to life than bleak fighting for survival, it would be even more out of place. Frontier was somewhere in between: people were traumatized and as the story went on and things got more desperate they showed more stress and episodes of good cheer became both fewer and more commonly strained or affected. It might not have been the most detailed and realistic possible portrayal, but I found it both believable and prominent.

Be kind. If her skill with chopsticks says anything about her knowledge of Japanese custom, it's a wonder she managed to put her kimono on right side out.

And probably never seen any Macross before. Macross is always the series where the day is won by the power of song and big guns. If anything, Frontier was unusual for not having a character constantly saying he hates soldiers, the military, and fighting.

I could add that Exedol said early on that the ancient battle instructions said not to interfere with miclone worlds, before he was overruled because humans had the Supervision Army vessel the fleet had been chasing as well as apparent sources of reaction weaponry and ship repair methods. From there, it was the Zentradi just digging themselves into a hole of curiosity and cultural exposure. If word got out about the destruction of an entire fleet, that's all the more reason for any other commander to take it as an object lesson about why it's so important to stick to the manual.

I'd say Plus and Frontier are better references to look to for battroid fighting than SDFM anyway. However successful the VF-1 was, at the time it was deployed variable fighters, were not a mature technology and had not been meaningfully tested in combat against purely alien-derived designs, the Zentradi themselves included. In addition, the pilots and commanders were in a new situation throughout SW1 and were writing their tactical manual as they went along half the time. In light of that, I see Hikaru's first experience fighting a Zentradi commander hand to hand as no more representative of mature variable fighter piloting than the fiasco of the Macross first attempting to take off from Earth and fold past the Moon was representative of capital ship tactics: the equipment and the humans alike were untested and unprepared. I think it wouldn't be likely to see the full potential of variable fighters in all modes before post-SW1 designs were deployed and the experiences of the first generation of Valkyrie pilots and the Zentradi tactical manuals were formalized into a new doctrine.

On the contrary, there's still a lot of tactical value to be gained from a submarine launch even if carriers are needed for recovery. Given a submarine can get much closer to the objective unobserved before launching aircraft it not only allows for greater element of surprise and overall stealth, but it still gives as much as twice the effective range of a traditional carrier launch and return, when the submarine can sneak up to the objective undetected and the fighter doesn't have to use a large percentage of its fuel to reach the combat zone. Ideally, your submarine launches fighters then hides in the depths, your fighters do their job and fly off to a waiting carrier, and the enemy can't counterattack because your ships are either out of sight or out of range. The carrier takes care of maintenance and refueling of the fighters, then has a later rendezvous with the submarine to reload, and you're ready to go again. This takes more time and effort than a fully functional submarine carrier, but if the latter isn't technologically feasible it's still a useful option

Long ago Kawamori said in an interview that the "true events" of Space War 1 were somewhere between the television and film tellings. However, since that interview it has been established that DYRL was an in-setting movie released in 2031, with events condensed and altered to push a message of cultural preservation and vigilance against the dangers other Zentradi fleets still posed to human civilization. Since Macross 7, it appears that the canon of the setting has been like the TV plotline(e.g. Zentradi vs Supervision Army rather than Zentradi vs. Meltrandi, human-sized Max and Milia) with the visual style of DYRL (e.g. Zentradi with pointed ears and more inhuman-looking officers, Zentradi flagship design, etc.). Since exact events of SW1 have been touched on only vaguely in more recent series though, there's a lot of speculation. Perhaps the upcoming manga retelling of Minmay's story will help settle the issue, if I understand correctly.

That's really a critical point. Choosing the right gun for a task is a complicated matter, since important concerns include not just caliber but muzzle velocity, rate of fire, type of target and expected engagements, and weight of weapon and ammuninition. Further, the final decision of which is best even for a given task is highly subjective and often heavily debated. The US military's 50 year use of a one size fits all policy for aircraft guns is more the exception than the rule, and driven largely by pushes for standardization and low emphasis on guns in modern US fighter design compared to in the Macross future: one might better look at the wide profusion of rounds used in other military applications or in small arms of any sort, and the fierce arguments over which is better for what use. If total standardization is not a primary goal, large changes in gunpod design over time are no surprise. A second consideration is that of environment. With how much of weapon ballistics is based on interaction of the bullet and the atmosphere, a fighter that is going to mostly be used in space is going to have entirely different options for weapons design. One that might be used in atmospheres markedly different than Earth's will have different design considerations as well. Obviously VFs are all going to get guns that can be effective in atmospheric use, but if space combat is more common than atmospheric that's going to color the final choice of design. Just as an addition, here's a comparison of .22LR ammunition, which was designed in the 19th century for hunting small game, with the .223 Remington, designed in the 1960s and the basis for the 5.56mm NATO round used in many modern military rifles. The caliber is nearly identical, but obviously that's about the only thing that is.

I have to agree on that. The musical direction was excellent overall, and that first episode, or for that matter the seventh, set the pace. When there's a song playing to a space battle in Frontier, the animation and the music link up. In 7, or when it happened in SDFM, while the music was good and all it felt like most of the time you could have dubbed in any of the performer's other songs to a given scene without substantially changing the end product. I'm not sure if it's my favorite, but it's a real tone-setting song for the series and contributed to me getting into the series despite early misgivings.

Even in Frontier, only the Pixies look to have bigger ears than the Zentradi in Plus and 7. Bilrer, Elmo, the soldiers on Gallia 4, and the shoppers at Folmo mall all seem to be really in line with Guld or the Zentradi in 7.