Macross Artworks

[Mecha-Artistry]

Hi,

I'm just wondering do a lot of people in this forum post their favourite Macross artwork here?

If they do, what types of Macross artworks would they prefer to draw?

Does it take a while for you to get better drawing Macross mecha compared to others say Gundam Seed destiny for example?

I mean does drawing Macross mecha be somewhat easier than Gundam Seed series?

[sketchley]

Ok... I'll bite.

1) of the few that actually make Macross art, they post some here. Though, in honesty, I don't know what you're saying when you say "favorite Macross artwork". Do you mean self made, or made by others?

2) In my case, it's finished pictures inclusive of backgrounds.

3) Drawing anything decent (or anywhere near what the original artists drew) takes practice, irrespective of the source.

4) I've never drawn Seed Destiny mecha, so I have no clue. I have found that Macross VFs are generally easier to draw than mecha from the original Gundam series. Mind you, I've spent years more time examining and studying VFs than I have Gundams.

If, as I'm guessing from your questions and UserID, you plan to draw Macross VFs, keep in mind the design philosophies: Gundam = heavy and armoured, VFs = delicate and aerodynamic.

[Phil K]

There are two schools of mech drawing. The school of do anything to make it look cool (ex. Go Nagai, Pat Lee), and the meticulous draftsmen (Katoki, Kawamori). The make it look cool group will play fast and dirty with the proportions and perspective of a mech to get it into uber dynamic poses like those you saw in Destiny. Draftsmen type artists will try to ensure, even for transforming mechs such as valkyries, that all the parts and gadgets are where they're supposed to be and detail perfect.

Now, the trick of Macross mecha is the be aware at all times that the robot is pretty much a fighter jet you chopped apart and rearranged. The best way to get better at drawing them is to buy a couple Air Power magazines (or Jane's All the World's Aircraft) and just practice drawing the pictures inside. A battroid is easy to draw. The Fighter and GERWALK are harder .

Finally, it's pretty important to draw some sorta skeleton or rough sketch before hand to work out all the perspective before you commit (cleaned up pencils, inking, coloring). The folly of many newb mech artists is to not work out what the pose and the perspective is.

I have one or two tutorials up on my site, maybe they'll help you too.

[the white drew carey]

Ummm, yeah. What Sketchley and Phil K said.

I guess it's all about the effort. If you put more time in Gundam Seed instead of Macross, it's going to be easier, and vice versa. The thing with Seed is that the Gundams are more about dynamic poses, and clutter for clutter's sake. To me, they're not very impressive designs, even for Gundam. Atleast with something like the S-Gundam, they've designed it pretty complicated, but they also make everything look like it belongs.

Edited July 16, 2007 by the white drew carey

[Mecha-Artistry]

Hi all,

1) of the few that actually make Macross art, they post some here. Though, in honesty, I don't know what you're saying when you say "favorite Macross artwork". Do you mean self made, or made by others?

Sorry for not making this lot clear. What I mean with that is the mecha/robots side of Macross artworks. You include things like various Zentraedi, VF and Destroyer units. And the like. So yeah. Basically it's the mecha side of the Macross universe.

If I were to best describe my personal interests, I do fancy and enjoy drawing mecha. They are far more exciting to draw than compared with the simple anime characters. Especially in the bishoujo genre. I've been around in various anime and manga sites and, personally, I felt they are totally overated.

Do correct me if I am wrong, but there's little appreciation for drawing mecha on the web, isn't it? And I'm trying to collect best resources that I could gather, not only in getting to know how to draw them, but also to include some very interesting background of its genre origins.

That really fascinates me.

Sketchley, when you said you've studied VFs for years more than you did with Gundam, are you saying that's how long you take to learn to draw VFs?

Realistically, how long will it take for a newb artist to become not only just good at drawing mechs, but also drawing them professionally and be the top artists? With so many good books you can find online or purchase (such as 'How to draw Manga' series for eg), surely they will help you to get up to speed in drawing them well.

At least I do.

[the white drew carey]

Realistically, how long will it take for a newb artist to become not only just good at drawing mechs, but also drawing them professionally and be the top artists? With so many good books you can find online or purchase (such as 'How to draw Manga' series for eg), surely they will help you to get up to speed in drawing them well.

Well, I find the "How to Draw Manga" books to be a little basic. It's simply a hard thing to judge how quickly someone will advance their skills... Do you have a natural talent for drawing, or do you find yu have to practice and practice to get better? It also depends on the effort you want to put forth. A little effort will take you longer, and a lot of effort could make it faster.

If you want to draw VF's, I suggest you pick up Kawamori Design Works, and Macross Perfect Collection. Those two books will give you some of your most valuable reference material.

[sketchley]

Sketchley, when you said you've studied VFs for years more than you did with Gundam, are you saying that's how long you take to learn to draw VFs?

Realistically, how long will it take for a newb artist to become not only just good at drawing mechs, but also drawing them professionally and be the top artists?

Nope. I could draw VFs from the first day that I saw them; just not very well. Years studying means extensive time looking and trying to figure out how they transform and fit together. I draw my own manga, and examining how other people achieved a particular look, effect, or whatnot, is part and parcel with the territory.

How long does it take? That depends on two things: what you draw, and how much practice drawing it you do. Basically, if you don't practice multiple illos per day, then you're not getting anywhere fast. (Illos can be anything from doodles to finished pieces.) Mecha come in a variety of shapes, sizes, forms and whatnot. Some of them are easier to reproduce, and others are much, much harder. For me, VFs come easy, whereas a lot of the Gundam mecha (outside of the original series) are difficult, and those in 5 Star Stories are downright impossible.

The key to becoming a professonal is this: are people going to buy your work? (Or are they going to buy it to sell it to others?) If you can't figure out what it takes to make an image sellable, then you'll never become a professional. This is the time that you and other buddying artists have to take a step back from the actual lines and paint that compose mecha, and ask critical questions like why do I (and/or other people) like this mecha/series/whatever? (I don't got no answers, so don't ask.)

Some other things to do is to take some art classes. The afformentioned books are good for refreshing ones memory and learning a few tricks, but if you've never had a fellow artist, or better, a teacher, critique your work, you'll probably stay at the level of fan artist, and not grow the thick skin needed for professional work and the abuse that comes with it. Just read some of the terrible, and oft rude comments leveled at Shoji Kawamori in these forums!

[Mecha-Artistry]

It's simply a hard thing to judge how quickly someone will advance their skills... Do you have a natural talent for drawing, or do you find yu have to practice and practice to get better? It also depends on the effort you want to put forth. A little effort will take you longer, and a lot of effort could make it faster.

Yes, I agree. And I don't have any drawing talent to begin with. I have been practicing to draw some of my own mecha works for some time now so yes my effort certainly pays off.

If you want to draw VF's, I suggest you pick up Kawamori Design Works, and Macross Perfect Collection. Those two books will give you some of your most valuable reference material.

Thanks for that. I'll take a look.

How long does it take? That depends on two things: what you draw, and how much practice drawing it you do. Basically, if you don't practice multiple illos per day, then you're not getting anywhere fast. (Illos can be anything from doodles to finished pieces.) Mecha come in a variety of shapes, sizes, forms and whatnot. Some of them are easier to reproduce, and others are much, much harder. For me, VFs come easy, whereas a lot of the Gundam mecha (outside of the original series) are difficult, and those in 5 Star Stories are downright impossible.

Sorry. I'm not familiar with the term 'illos'. Can you briefly explain to me what it is?

Drawing hard mecha? Hmm... That would be a very interesting challenge... Do you think it's fair to say that if you know how to master drawing hard mecha such as 5 Star Stories and Gundam (that is if you do master them), will help to earn your title as a professional artist?

After all, we're not talking about simple black-and-white artworks here using ordinary pencils and pen only in order to accomplish that, if you know what I mean.

Some other things to do is to take some art classes. The afformentioned books are good for refreshing ones memory and learning a few tricks, but if you've never had a fellow artist, or better, a teacher, critique your work, you'll probably stay at the level of fan artist, and not grow the thick skin needed for professional work and the abuse that comes with it.

You mentioned art classes. Where can you find them that talks specifically about mecha? Are there a lot in the USA? (I'm writing from New Zealand BTW so I'm not too familiar with the territory there). In fact are they really good ones out there which helps to provide very critique on your works and motivate you to succeed drawing better long term?

[sketchley]

Sorry. I'm not familiar with the term 'illos'. Can you briefly explain to me what it is?

Basically, if you don't practice multiple illos per day, then you're not getting anywhere fast. (Illos can be anything from doodles to finished pieces.)

Illos, aka illustrations.

Drawing hard mecha? Hmm... That would be a very interesting challenge... Do you think it's fair to say that if you know how to master drawing hard mecha such as 5 Star Stories and Gundam (that is if you do master them), will help to earn your title as a professional artist?

No.

If you learn how to draw the human body, and make dynamic poses, then you're well on the way to being a professional. Another thing you must do is to create your own stuff; be that new art based off of existing designs, or entirely new designs of your own creation.

Here is an example: http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/58294071/

(I drew it for inclusion in a fanzine about a decade ago.) The key elements to it are: storytelling, dynamic energy, a sense of movement, focal point(s), and the appearance of weight in the mecha. I don't consider myself a professional just yet, but I do consider that all professionals include those key elements (and more!) in their art.

After all, we're not talking about simple black-and-white artworks here using ordinary pencils and pen only in order to accomplish that, if you know what I mean.

Actually, if you can accomplish that with ONLY black pen on white paper, you've got what it takes. Colour, shading, tone, etc., or only extras, and shouldn't be the crutches used to support bad line-art.

You mentioned art classes. Where can you find them that talks specifically about mecha? Are there a lot in the USA? (I'm writing from New Zealand BTW so I'm not too familiar with the territory there). In fact are they really good ones out there which helps to provide very critique on your works and motivate you to succeed drawing better long term?

You misunderstand. Not classes on mecha per se, classes on art in general. The basics are the human body and it's mechanics, shading, reproducing textures and so on. A healthy dose or awareness of graphic design definitely won't hurt either. The classes referred to are available anywhere with a competent educational facility.

I'm not a United Statesian, never went to school in the USA, and have never lived there. You'll have to ask some of the residents or citizens of that country if you plan to go to school there. (I don't recommend it, as their current visa system is rather arcane, and they are rather xenophobic to foreigners, especially if one is non-white.)

Some food for thought: what makes or breaks a good mecha series, is the characters. The storyline and mecha are secondary. Mecha by and large only serve the needs of the plot, and to become a professional, you need to be able to modify mecha designs as the directors and producers want and need (and not necessarily in the direction that you initially envisioned for the design.) In general, less-lines are better (case in point: the Macross Zero mecha are butt-ugly and terrible. Without colour, perhaps without movement, they are nigh-impossible to decypher. On the other hand, the Macross 7 mecha are the best VFs penned to date; as they are complex in their symplicity. Another angle to look from is: if you have to drawn hundreds of them per day, thousands per month, which would you prefer to do?) And (holy badly organized paragraph here!), in general, unique, heretofore unseen elements incorporated into mecha designs generally are the most successful. (Again, stessing a non-mecha related background of studies. Check Masamuni Shirow's work, as the inclusion of insect designs into his mecha is very clear. The way he incorporates those elements is also very different from other artists who have drawn insect-like mecha.)

[Mecha-Artistry]

Hmmm...

That's pretty cool.

Thanks for those thoughts.

I'll definitely check them out.

Seems like drawing mecha is not simply about knowing how to draw plain shapes, boxes, squares, circles etc and mesh them all together isn't it?

It does require some of intensive studies in its own right.

[eugimon]

Hmmm...

That's pretty cool.

Thanks for those thoughts.

I'll definitely check them out.

Seems like drawing mecha is not simply about knowing how to draw plain shapes, boxes, squares, circles etc and mesh them all together isn't it?

It does require some of intensive studies in its own right.

well, if you want to draw them well. But sketch is right, if you want to learn to draw mecha that looks realistic, you need to learn how to draw realistically. That means knowing the basics of light and form. I'd recommend taking some drawing classes, figure drawing (learning to draw the human body), and then illustration, drafting and some industrial design classes.

Draw from life as well, if you want to learn how to draw mechanical details, draw motorcycle engines, and car under carriages, and whatever else you can get your hands on. Learn to render the paint job on cars if you want to draw 80's style mecha with shiny/glossy paint jobs. Or go pick up some military type magazines and look at how armor is applied to real world war machines if you're going for a more modern design.

Just draw a lot, and post up your pics. We have more than a few artists here who can give pointers. Oh, and grow a thick skin, art critiques can and will be brutal, if you decide to do this as a profession. I knew professors who would walk in on critique day, tear down the ones she felt weren't passing and tell the students responsible to apologize to the rest of the class for wasting our time. haha. Seriously, this happened, not to me, but I was in the room.

[Mecha-Artistry]

Just draw a lot, and post up your pics. We have more than a few artists here who can give pointers. Oh, and grow a thick skin, art critiques can and will be brutal, if you decide to do this as a profession. I knew professors who would walk in on critique day, tear down the ones she felt weren't passing and tell the students responsible to apologize to the rest of the class for wasting our time. haha. Seriously, this happened, not to me, but I was in the room.

Is that right?

Well I'm sure that will help a lot tremendously.

Looks like I need to get myself busy a lot to draw more and prove that I may have what it takes to be a good mecha artist.

I just need to ask whether you know how much does a professional artist usually gets to earn if he/she manages to sell his/her artworks? I mean do you have any real-life cases where successful professional mecha artist earn a good living like this?

I just wonder what's the major criteria that an aspiring artist need to do to polish his/her skills in drawing mecha so he/she can be on the way to reach his/her potential as a professional mecha artist such as toning and shading techniques etc?

[sketchley]

I just need to ask whether you know how much does a professional artist usually gets to earn if he/she manages to sell his/her artworks? I mean do you have any real-life cases where successful professional mecha artist earn a good living like this?

I just wonder what's the major criteria that an aspiring artist need to do to polish his/her skills in drawing mecha so he/she can be on the way to reach his/her potential as a professional mecha artist such as toning and shading techniques etc?

There's no, one, cover-all answer. I have also not heard of something called a mecha artist until this thread (though, that does not mean that such a thing doesn't exist.) I have heard of mecha designers. There are plenty of those (especially in anime); though I don't know how easier or difficult it is to learn about their wages. My guess is that they are essentally freelance artists, as they (appear to) work from project to project, and not necessarily with the same studio or production company. I think looking at graphic artists would be another guide to potential income.

The major criteria is one and only one thing: will people buy it?*

I don't have anything else to add to what has already been said (aside from less talking, and more arting!).

* This is from both the artist to the production company, and also the production company to the public.

Edited July 20, 2007 by sketchley

[Mecha-Artistry]

Nah.

That's pretty cool.

That's all I pretty much need to know.

Thanks