Mercurial Morpheus

All the more reason to be proud to be one of her original fans. Oh, and not all look better with the loose hair and no glasses. Those can work quite nicely.

Decided to say "screw it" and voted Ranka this time, as I've liked what they've been doing with her and know that she'll need it. up to episode 21 in consideration. First time I've voted for a lead.

Interesting to see all the Grace votes this time. I remember when I was the only Grace fan ;; (on that note, finally got around to adding her to the avy.)

If it hadn't been for Krull though, you might not have had the Rambo chance. hence Krull works in mysterious ways.

The power of the Glaive....

It's not the case due to the disproportionate numbers of their bashers, though in the general terms, it's fine.

Personally, I've always hated the term "moeblob". Especially since it's always misused and brought up only in things like this.

Krull is one of my childhood favorites, right up there with Bill and Ted, The Last Starfighter, the Star Trek films and Star Wars and Back to the Future trilogies, and the classic Disney films. Loved the Glaive, the music, and so on. It's tops on my list of "Why do I not own this film?"

So a new DVD is out? Sounds like they cut some of the extras from the old release.

Wow, there's a term for it. Thanks DeeBot! Though to be honest, I couldn't care less who wins. There's far more interesting things in the show.

I find your ideas intriguing, and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

Nice Simpsons reference. That made my day.

I forgot to mention that I also agree with what you've said.

Heck, it did today. I was as amazed to here Bill Melendez was still around as I was saddened to be informed of this fact by his recent obituary.

My dad informed me that Col. Potter is still alive. I figured he'd passed long before I was even born.

I've been meaning to reply here, but am not sure how. It appears to be so easy to get burned in MF discussion.

For the show itself, I sort of have to agree. MF is an odd one for me. Never before have I so clearly enjoyed watching some only to reminisce about how flawed it is in the character department shortly after it's over. Which is odd because I watch shows for characters. I like the characters of MF, but i can't really say I'm all that attached to them yet, or at least, not as much as I should be. The show's doing something right, since I'm still watching it, and I even cried a few times in the recent episodes. I just can't pin what it is that's doing it. It's sort of like Code Geass R2, so messed up at times, yet still geniusly epic and awesome.

As for character debates, I agree with Final Vegeta and Gubaba that things have gotten out of hand, particularly in the Ranka bashing. Not that I agree with aimless Sheryl bashing either, but it's far less common, particularly since she's the fan favorite, for whatever reasons. I have no problem with character bashing in general, as many characters I love are hated (Mitsuki Hayase) and I've also hated insanely popular ones (TV Alucard), but only ones that, you know, are reasoned and make sense. The title of this thread alone is a great example of how messed up some perceptions can be. It's the use of sophisms and strawman that FV pointed out, and the theory that to support one character, one must bash the other that Mike_S brought up that irk me, and make discussion on the subject rather frustrating. It's ridiculous. If you're going to hate Ranka, or Sheryl even, do so becuase of what they are, not because they're not what you think they should be or that you have to view everything they do negatively . You don't like childish starting characters or think her leaving is bad, fine. Though also recognize that it's largely perception and opinion.

Also, don't criticize one for a trait that applies to the other. Nothing is more confusing than seeing people bash one character for having traits the other one supposedly doesn't have, even though they actually do. It's a bit too much black and white and the pot calling the kettle black. While i agree with Mike-S that celebrating the good in your favorite is great, ignoring her foibles to do so is not. If you're going to love them, love them, not some idealized version you bring up just because it makes it easier to trounce the other girl. I like Ranka, but will admit that she can be too shy, and little conclusion jumping, and maybe more immature than she should be. But i like her because she grows despite and beyond it. Maybe she can be annoying or selfish, but a lot of the complaints about her seem to come at the cost of recognizing that she tries to grow past them and do the right thing. A lot of people have hated her from the get go, so this talk of just now the Ranka hate begins, is a bunch of huey. Heck, i didn't like Ranka much in the beginning, and yet she's grown on me.

I like Sheryl, but I'll admit that she tends to be impulsive, and rather untruthful to herself, and I've never liked how underhanded so was early in the triangle. Yet these are qualities some either ignore, sanctify, or even like about her, so who am I to argue. I still find her past intriguing, and like her in her flawed state, and find her not nearly as strong as she's made out to be, and that kind of character appeals to me. I'm not going to act like she's this well written Goddess, nor am I going to let said poor writing keep me from enjoying her good moments. Though i do wish they'd done more in 19/20 with her. I'm also not going to say that Ranka isn't flawed either.

Both are pretty interesting characters, though not without their faults. In fact, ignoring the foibles and making Sheryl out like some Perfect Woman that always selfless and caring, or a total bitch that's all about her, while also being baldfaced lies, is just plain boring. The same as acting like everything Ranka does is selfish and reprehensible, or she's just naive and doesn't know any better is a lie and lame. A lot of the arguments against them are well argued, but a lot also tend to villanize one while sanctifying the other. They fully ignore the character development, or in some cases, when applicable, overstate it, and either does the character a great disservice, or gives them way more credit than due. The atmosphere it creates is one of, "you're either with us, or against us", and it makes a fan/non-fan of both rather anxious to voice an opinion. It's gotten to the point where I have to wait for a week to pass before discussing an episode.

Applause to LowVis on his troll piece.

MF is a good show, and a treat to watch, I just wish the core characters didn't relay so much on heavy reading into to fully appreciate. Ranka's probably the easiest, which is probably why I've enjoyed her development the most, with Alto a nice second. Shame Michel had a near pointless death.

As usual, take this with a grain of salt, as it's that time of night when I really don't have the want to post an airtight argument or state myself clearly.

Actually, I thought the latest twists involving Marianne and the whole showdown were quite awesome. As messed up as R2 is, it still entertains and has great moments.

And when was Marianne ever sweet? She was a non-persona and a plot device for most of the show.

Guld, by a mile. If for some very strange reason you voted for Michel, go back and watch Plus again. Especially the movie version. Man, I just don't know how you could vote for anyone over Guld here.

Guld is very much my second, if only in the movie version.

Also, thanks for finally explaining GAR.

My only disagreement with you was a relatively subtle one. Sure, she can be self centered and downright childish, especially earlier in the series, though in my opinion I think you overexaggerated those traits just a tiny bit.

Really? How so? I agree wholeheartedly. You might have mistook me. I was merely meaning that of course, part of her reasoning was that she was tired of being used, which could be viewed as selfish. I forgot to imply that i think she's outgrown a lot of those aspects. I was merely rebutting against the statement that Sheryl didn't have them herself when she very much does. Though all in all, I think it worked nicely.

Might I add that the pun in the poll should be

"Kill, Klan, Kill"

and

"Kill Klan, Kill"

Well said, and thanks for saying many of the things I wanted to say all this time, though frankly, there are some points where I must disagree.

It's amazing how ungrateful humans can be, and Macross Frontier managed to portray this so way both in terms of drama and realism. I can personally vouch for my last sentence based on my own life experiences. People tend to forget your good deeds as quickly and remember all perceived wrongdoings well. Ranka's singing has given the edge to Frontier's forces numerous times, and in episode 20 we see how quickly hearts turn when people perceive the situation as Ranka failing them, even when it simply wasn't true as proven by her unintentionally provoking the Vajra into greater violence via her own pain.

If it wasn't for Grace's DE, Ranka would have saved so many more lives and hearts from unnecessary death and suffering.

Ranka has definitely figured out that she's practically a homing beacon for the Vajra at the moment and like it or not, her "selfish" reasons for leaving are in the end of the day selfless in nature, since the only way for her to solve both her and Frontier's problem was to stop homing the Vajra to Frontier and resolve her own personal turmoil (recovery of painful pass memories, etc.). What's so wrong with this?

As a very old and wise green fellow once said:

"Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger, Anger leads to hate, and hate leads to suffering."

Macross is in it's own way a battle between the light and dark side.

I sense much fear in you, Ranka haters.

PS: I am on neither Ranka or Sheryl's side, but I simply find it impossible to hate Ranka and her pet when they both have one thing in common: no intentional harm was done to anyone.

So, wait, how are you disagreeing with me? I said it was a mix, but I never said there was anything wrong with it.

I particularly side with the line about good deeds going forgotten. A classic saying, "Whenever I'm right, no one remembers. Whenever I'm wrong, no one forgets." The bad is always more pointed, always sharper in the mind than the good, as it's often the lesser, so iut sticks out more. Not that that particularly applies here. Most just make their minds up about a character and stick to it through thick and thin. Ranka could literally morph into Sheryl, and the people who hate her still will.

I'm also on neither side, though I have admitted that Ranka is much better written. I still like Sheryl though, for the most part.

i really am surprised at how much hate ranka got from this episode.

to me, the developments in this episode are a crucial turning point for the series. ranka just happened to be playing the part of the pivot.

i agree she tends to be self-centered, immature, shortsighted. but that's just how the writers have intended her character to be so as to be a contrast to sheryl. if anything, they may have overplayed the juxtaposition just a little bit. one thing is clear though: the writers are getting to you.

Except that both characters share those three qualities, hence there's no contrast in that way. The key contrast is their positions and outward projections, not necessarily their inner qualities. They're more alike than most would admit, if you read into them, particularly Sheryl, writing permitting. Still, I agree about all the hate Ranka's getting. Personally I think her actions are a mix of selfishness and a nagging thought that this is the right thing to do. She knows she has a connection, she knows through Ai-kun that the Vajra aren't all they're made out to be, and she knows she's just being used. I'm sure she also thinks getting another Vajra off Frontier is a good thing for Frontier, and she might have even come to assume that she's attracting them given the affect of her song. It's clear she's thinking of finding the best way for both species. To suggest that she's sided with the Vajra and forsaken Frontier is f-ing ridiculous, and short changes her quite a bit. Frontier is all gung-ho on extermination now, when it's becoming apparent to her that things aren't so black and white. If you can't change from within, try from without. I also think Brera could be acting independently. Her development is actually been quite astounding and much clearer then even Sheryl's (whose had some good and bad moments like Ranka as well) , yet it sounds like she's being condemned for it (I say sounds as I think I don't want to read this whole thread going by some of these comments). Looks like she's damned if she does, and damned if she doesn't. Macross Fanboy, wow, way to take things purely at face value, if even that, but to each their own I guess.

Ahh, so it wasn't just me. Good job keeping it to just two days. Though it sort of helped cement thoughts on F a bit.

Damn spoilers.

Went with Roy TV. The man was shot up badly, but still made his engagement and even strummed a little guitar, all with gapping holes in his back. Though Guld Movie is awesome as well.

It probably was the latter, between Sheryl and Alto. If they even got that far...

Thanks. I picked up Miss DJ at a Streetlight Records years ago. It was one of the most soothing CDs to listen to on a night car trip heading home.

Interstellar Flight is Seikan Hikou, Ranka's dance song.

Ahh. I only knew it's romanji name. I like that one too, though it got a tad overplayed.

I'm liking the new stuff too. Though the score is still the highlight. Very romantic in style. I'l forgive the PotC rift.

All I've got to say is this :

"Alto, for the love of GOD, please do the right thing and don't go loli on us by picking Ranka!!! Be a man and pick the chick with tits and ass...PICK SHERYL!!"

That is all.

-Kyp

Yeah, because a girl's body is the best measure of her worth. To hell with everything else Alto for Shallow Hal, 2008! ^__^ Granted, Ranka does look a tad young, but still encouraging on looks...

Interesting episode. It wasn't the Sheryl episode it's labeled as, rather a nice blend between all three. Thanks to recent debates and how little they actually capitalized on episode 18, I no longer know what to think about Sheryl. Ranka seems to finally get the inkling about Breara. Points to Klan and Michel for slapping some sense into two of the leads. The cliffhanger was a tad generic, but worked well. I liked the use of the first opening for a standalone ending.

Episode 20 should be epic.

This isn't related to the episode, but the Lion leak in the first post: Does anyone have a working copy of the single? IZArc can't extract the files.

Edit: nevermind, winrar worked( but I don't like winrar )

Try 7zip. It's the best, and it's free. I've never even heard of IZArc.

"Is it just me or does SK freaking love the bay area or what!?!? "

yeah. it was awesome that it actually sort of looked like Pier 39 (despite some rearrangement) I'm still waiting on the inside of Galaxy to be some futuristic take on my hometown of San Jose.

I haven't watched the latest episodes released. The slow schedule is causing it to be lost in the jumble. Still, I'm enjoying the heck out of it. i agree that one sort of needs to be a fan, or just like episodic things to really enjoy this. Though i agree that a two parter would be nice.

Speaking of it, what does our own Duke Togo think of this. I'd think his opinion would be paramount on the matter.

Depends on the codec. VirtualDubMod (must be Mod, the regular one can't handle mkv at all, unless that's changed without my knowledge) isn't so hot at handling h.264. MKVtools is the best bet here. Guides at Doom9.org and even AMV guides at animemusicvideos.org can help.

Or you could just PM me and say "Hey Az, I have a link for the leaked single. here ya go: blah blah blah". Or you can spend 10 seconds on 4chan looking for it like I did.

BTW, leaked copy of the single is in the first post.

Thanks! My usual methods failed me.

Still waiting for subs (though most points seem to have been leaked for me. Oh well.)

Agent One has returned! Saints be Praised!

I still haven't heard this "Interstellar Flight" (or at least think I haven't). I realise I haven't answered the thread's question. My favorites for Ranka is Aimo, all versions but a capella the most. Nyan Nyan and Ninjin are quirky. She needs some more veriety. I also prefer her What 'bout my Star to Sheryls vocal wise. Sheryl's just too high in it for my liking, though i like the background. Sheryl fast - Infinity, Sheryl slow - Diamond Crevasse (particularly after reading the lyrics).

The score I'm liking a lot. Particularly "Frontier 2059" and the battle music. I'm glad Yakk Deculture fixed "Frontier 2059" in the opening.