knoted

Awesome2 ! Heh, initially... this Dark of the Moon toyline seemed underwhelming, but I'm warming up to it quickly now. Despite size decrease, even lesser paint apps and Mech Tech, this toyline is really fun. DOTM Megatron proves to be quite elusive around here, but I must have him. The new tankertruck mode looks brilliant and the integration of his MechTech weapon as a part of the tanker is genius.

I Love this little Dark of the Moon SS mold !

Yuck ! J20 Looks waaay to elongated for a stealth plane. For 'aesthetics' I'll stick to F117, F22 and F35.

How tall does this one stand in battroid mode ? 6 inch ?

Looks awesome. Best 1/100 yet. I LOVE the small poseable feet. Battroid mode proportions & style look exactly my taste.

Just like in the movie, his clavicle joints provide his arms with extra extented range of motion. Which is pretty damn practical when slashing in close quarters combat. :

That looks great. I'm jealous.

As a topic on its own : I don't see the issue with goat legs that much. Pretty common style since, what...Regulds, ED209 etc. I got the new deluxe Ratchet btw. Got rid of his giant feet ( which were like giant kibble in hummer mode ) Other than that, this is a really neat mold.

I got out of Transformers temporarily, because of stuff like G1 Micromaster Overload. Imo, very lame stuff. Oh well, the past is the past and the past is dead, unless popular demand revives it.

Still, I rather have one single G1 Optimus Prime, than 100 Binaltechs/Alt's. To me, they feel too "samey" ; perhaps if those lines ventured into other vehicles than only cars. But hey, that's just me speaking for myself.

That's a bit of a fallacy. A person can list several reasons for being wowed by a design. They may or may not list those reasons, after saying " Wow, that looks great! ...Because ; reason #1, reason #2, reason #3, etc. " Saying " Ugh, more goat legs " is a specific complaint which rules out any chance of change of mind ; and it's often used ( not necessarily in these forums, mind you ) as a denigrating generalization towards an entire toyline and its fans. A smile or a grouchy face may not be aimed at a person either, but everyone knows that everyone likes to see more smiles than grumpy faces. It's too easy to play the underdog role just because the styling of recent toylines doesn't cater to classic taste preferences. It's like saying " Oh noes, they don't make ' em like they used to anymore " and then act like being stepped on the toes when someone tells 'em the reality, that one can't turn back time. I'm not here to aim for individuals either, but I do think it's noteworthy to register and figure out the reasons behind those complaints. Also, ...listing a taste preference is not the same as dislike list.

fixed. Silly whining about movie styling deserves a silly comparison. Having said that, Personally, when it comes to Transformers I like most TF Classics, G1 84/85, and Movie TF's. I'm not too fond of the 'new' TF's in the 1986 movie and most TF's from 1986 to 2006. When it comes to Macross/Robotech, I like the VF1 best, Mospeada's Legioss close 2nd place and the MODAT 5/Garland 3rd place. I can't say I'm really digging the elongated shapes of the VF0, VF11, VF19 and VF25.

Well, with him, it's super obvious, but read through the threads and you'll find a whole lot of similar the good ol' days people. The explanation of VF's having constraints is a reasonable one. This does explain though, why those "the good ol' days people" feel right at home with the mere marginal changing nature of VF styling (which is inherent to its nature of transformation scheme) So yeah, it is kind of sad to see people bash lines such as ROTF, when it's pretty clear they're just bashing it for disliking the aesthetics....as if each and every TF line before the movie lines was great. It's so easy & low to bash a line for obvious rotten apples like leader class Jetfire, the bike sisters and the non transforming Devastator ; because overall, the ROTF toyline is a step forward in the right direction, regardless of whether you like or dislike the aesthetics. G1 was great, but don't deny that Hasbro put an end to die cast parts, rich chrome apps, realistic intricate mold details and rubber wheels after 1985. Or do we want to go back to good ol' times like these? :

I think you must be really fond of design aesthetics of the past.

not for this specific Jetfire, but the usual attitude towards the TF's in general, throughout the entire TF thread. And the outcries about things supposedly being "better" in the ol' days. and that's why I find the VF1 and VF22 the strongest designs.

I agree ; ROTF Jetfire is horrible when it comes to that. Imo, it's because of the Leader class electronic gizmo's; hampering the guys at the engineering design dept. The only great Leader toy in the ROTF line until now, is OP. Well, it's a personal choice ; are you more forgiving towards a concept which isn't really striving for much innovation ... or, are you more forgiving towards concepts which do an incredible amount of transformation scheme variety while having to cope with a multitude of varying jet modes ? I mean, wouldn't it be fresh to have a VF which, for a change doesn't have its jet engine & thrusters for legs ? The only variation I see in Kawamori's designs is that those robo limbs and canopies are growing thinner and longer with each next version ( and a lot of Japanese motorcycle design influences ).

exactly like I said it isn't. But a lot of people are talking about it as if it is as realistic fighter jet while it's not and at the same time bash a TF. It boils down to this : the VF concept which is basically unchanged in all its versions. It has become the ultimate excuse to what is still basically robot kibble. Saying that it's part of the established design philosophy, doesn't change that fact. But through this narrative/story explanation it works on people as suspension of disbelief. Still, I am of opinion, TF jet design & engineering has done a whole lot more innovation than Kawamori.

So, you acknowledge plain logic, but decide to disagree with it anyway. Ok, that's your call. My point is this : when it comes to this "kibble" issue, I see a lot of people bashing the hell out of TF's, when, despite their diversity of altforms and clearly striving to attain some extent of realism in their altmodes, they cut VF's a whole lot more slack, disproportionally and unfairly. With each VF, it's robot legs & feet being the jet engines/ thrust nozzles over and over. And aside from "blending in" fairly nice by means of the visual style of the outer plating ; That concept doesn't do a whole lot of effort to conceal those robo limbs, nor is it innovative. Sure, ROTF leader class Jetfire is a really bad example with those faux pas legs, but by fair comparison, new TF molds such as deluxe Dirge, deluxe Mindwipe, voyager Starscream achieve a lot more than Valkeries, when it comes to transformation scheme innovation and varying jetstyles ; while doing the best they can (within lower budget constraints), to hide the robot limbs from obvious sight. But...plse, don't mind me, go on bashing TF's for some minor kibble while thinking a VF1 fighter is a realistic F14 jet.

Nope. The entire Valk legs, feet, arms and gunpod head. Many Macross fans don't realize it consciously anymore, but from VF0 to VF25 the battroid legs and arms are as obviously in sight, just like the TF limbs of leader Jetfire. The only subtle difference is the styling of the VF outer plating is similar to the rest of the VF ; but it is just as much ROBOT KIBBLE, as with ROTF leader class Jetfire. In 25 years Macross, Kawamori has done zero to conceal the robo limbs and the concept of having the legs/feet as boosters is certainly a zero innovation policy. That's also why Yamato can produce high end toys ; they can focus on one single concept, albeit with marginal variations. In that pic you are not looking at a realistic F14 fighter jet. The VF toy engineering doesn't have to take realism into account ; while often, HasTak does have to strive for altmode realism for a million different vehicles. But people have grown so attached to the visual style, that they don't even "see" the robot kibble in VF designs anymore, even though it's there in plain sight for over 25 years already, but at the same time, those same people complain about Transformers having a bit of robot kibble even if HasTak has to come up with a 100 different transformation schemes.

but but, what's this in the encircled areas ?

And that's OK, nothing wrong with liking him on his own merits. However, he is prone to arguments which bash the ROTF line in general. Sure, in a lot of ways we can see the designers put a lot of love in the mold. It's just a bit of a shame that the electronics hamper the engineering. At voyager class he would have been out of scale, but I think the potential for something awesome would have been bigger.

yeah, you should avoid throwing people off needlessly. Looking at a boxed toy is not the same as actually having it in your hands and transforming it/ posing it. Your description clearly read, as if you had that hands-on experience with the toy, which in fact, you didn't have. Still, the same principle applies...you chose to only give the one of the shittiest ROTF toys, a closer look, not the better ones ; thus, you fooled yourself into thinking you're openminded to it, but you're pre existing opinion was even more cemented than ever. You feigned having an open mind to this toyline. This results in being stuck in an endless loop of idea that G1 should copy paste itself infinitely. Yamato is so good at VF's because they're basically, all marginal variants to the same mold concept. So, perhaps see some ROTF toy reviews on youtube, but make sure they're the ones which are generally acknowledged as really good molds : - voyager Mindwipe - deluxe Dirge - deluxe Ratchet - voyager Starscream ( main jet shape is superb, merely has hands sticking out at the rear ) - voyager Bludgeon - etc. Stay away from : - leader Jetfire ( now THAT is a robot stuck underneath a jet worse than Silverbolt ) - voyager Scavenger/Demolisher ( probably too odd for you ) - any of the bike sisters

I'm usually not that fond of inverted wings, but that redesign looks really good imo. I'm not surprised though, many people here dislike it.

Thanks ! That's awesome stuff.

Well, imo you were asking for it then. Clearly, you bought the shittiest of ROTF example to cement your pre existing opinion about the line. So, to me, this purchase example is really a non-argument to me.