Kamjin 639

It'll be like our lil' Norcal MW meets of the last few years all over again...

I didn't realise there were so many Macross fans around the Bay Area! If you guys are thinking about getting together before/after the concert at Yoshi's, let's get the discussion going here. There's the calm-minded IZAKAYA Lounge right around the corner at the Hotel Kabuki which is good for a drinkingly good time, so I'll put that as the first suggestion.

What i really want to know is, is what happened to Edgar?

:lol:

Most of the "where to get" questions have been answered already, but if you're asking the same questions I asked when I first got into import gaming (on CD systems, heh heh) then maybe this can help.

I know a lot of people who are into the flip-top stuff, but honestly, if you're considering playing import games, go for a modchip. It kinda sucks to ship your system out for a week or so and it makes some people jumpy to think that someone else might rip them off, but it's worth it to have the peace-of-mind to not have to have a fight with your system every time you want to play a non-local game. I had my PS2 modded a few years ago and not once have I had an issue with backup, import, local, or PS1 games of any kind. On the other hand, I've known a few guys who have wrecked their PS2 laser eyes swapping stuff.

why do you want to know, got another pie you want to throw, captain cream puff?

I've just got questions about taking a modern-day classic Japanese animation series and infusing it with a "feel" that was not there when it was originally made, thereby threatening how close the result will come in quality to the original.

Oh...and I still think Utada and her pop tunes are spoiling EVA.

Wait...who gave them permission to make Wevangeliwon as lame as modern animé?

What? Christopher Lambert isn't good enough anymore?

I seriously sat-through that whole movie, going "There can be only one...Beowulf!"

ありがとうぜ、マリ。

飯島真理とファイヤバンバーは一生にで歌いますか？その事は豪快だって！

チケット売り切るは良くないぜ・・・ 　さ。　未来の時に、アメリカのマクロスのファンはコンサートを上げたいっス。

アニメエクスポ２００８面白いっか？

エディット：

日本青年館はシートを９７０回があって？まずいだろうー・・・

そして、マクロスのコンサートは大抵小さいっか？

The added insinuation is that "would the importing company give the music the respect it deserves?"--and unfortunately, precedent doesn't stand well for affirming that idea. I still get shudders from Ishtar's English singing voice in Macross II, and Macross: Clash of the Bionoids pretty-much decided to cut-out half of the music instead. My opinion is that expecting this kind of treatment for a non-Japanese version of a Japanese production is flawed for two major reasons:

1) Japanese animation is exported and dubbed as a cheaper way for broadcasters (and now DVD sellers) to make money as an alternative to producing their own animated series. To expend more money than is necessary to get the job done is in direct conflict with this premise of "less work for the same money."

2) I might be just a purist on this one, but dubbing (in any form) removes the original soul of the series. Especially for something like Macross--where the music effectively is the soul of the series--to dub it out would not be acceptable even if it was good.

For those reasons, were Macross or any other Japanese animation to have it's music dubbed-out--well, if it did happen, due to economic considerations--it wouldn't be the same. Did ADV redub the Macross opening and ending themes, as well as Lynn-Minmay's songs for their recently-released English dubbed versions?--I haven't seen it, nor do I know the answer, but I can take a wild guess and say 'no, they didn't,' and it's precisely for the reasons I listed above.

Why shouldn't people who do things that are utterly ridiculous (in every sense of the word) be subject to ridicule?

As I get older, I grow less fond of ridiculing others. There's a meanness to it that is unbecoming. Yet, in some cases, it's just utterly deserved. This is one of those cases.

I'm glad I can be a source of entertainment to one of the Administrators around here.

I just wanted to say this to Kamjin 639, I hope you realise I say this stuff in a very understading manner ( no more arguments here )

Thank you for your advice. It's definitely a sound change from the ridicule people are enjoying effecting right now, and I appreciate it very much.

In other words, you work a low-paying job while calling yourself a writer on the internet and spend your meager pennies on a Greyhound bus to Los Angeles to throw a pie in the face of a man who makes cartoons for a living.

That is correct. Freelance writing is a difficult field to work-in, especially for someone relatively new to the field. However, I do what I can. I'm doing my best not to be confused by the fact that, for some reason, you think I'm somehow bad because I'm not well-off financially. Why be so cruel?

We've got a "revolutionary" here who throws pies in the faces of people over an anime. . . yet he's here to announce that other message boards consider the membership here to be "jerks." Lovely.

I didn't say it, man. It came from here...

http://macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=22860

On a side note, a guy at the registration booth told me that macrossworld is full of a bunch of jerks. haha

And he's totally right, too.

:rolleyes:

But what kind of pie would be the official pie of MWCon? I vote banana cream!

Didn't Max and Milia have a cake shaped like the Macross?--I'm not saying that it'd be used for a projectile or anything, but that would be really awesome if we could get something made like that. If I recall correctly, the main body, head, Dedalus and Prometheus, and the legs were actual cake whereas the arms were faux in the form of sticks or something.

I realize that you were joking but by me inviting you, that means I have to reassure other people that you're gonna be ok. So I asked you to not joke about it...if you were serious about a neutral face to face which what would seem like the whole point to your stunt is then don't be a Tom Cruise.

Indeed, you are correct that "a neutral face to face" would be a wonderful end to this whole incident. I'm very sorry if I offended you or made your job any harder with my comeback--I hope you can understand, I'm writing replies like every few minutes!--So know this for sure: If indeed I come to Macross World-Con and Tommy Yune (or another Harmony Gold-affiliated person) then be sure that I'm not going to do anything out of the ordinary. What happened at Anime Expo was not the start of some "war of physical aggression" against Harmony Gold; I would very much enjoy the opportunity to show that this is the truth.

Dude, I extended an invitation to you. Dont act like an idiot. Pies may not be considered "dangerous" but its pretty farting insulting. I can see that your too much of an idiot to take this to a serious level like I hoped you would. You're confusing me for some of the people here that just want to argue. You want to argue with me I'll take you up on it.

I was joking about the wedgie thing because Keith was joking about the wedgie thing. But seriously, I'm very happy to take you up on your invitation and am honoured by your generosity. Calling me an 'idiot' is over the line, but hey, if we're gonna go there, we can. I'd prefer not; there's no benefit in it. But if it's about "people here that just want to argue," then maybe the people who "just want to argue" should understand that they need to lay off for a while so I can get some sleep tonight?

Scared nuthin', I'll bust out my guitar & at you!

Only as long as it's a Jamming Birds backup-band guitar!

don't joke about doing stuff at MWCon.

Oh, I forgot. You guys are scared of pies. Now you're scared of wedgies, too. Man, you must've had some distressing events happen to you when you were younger. How about considering an appointment with a Realist?

So what if he doesn't give you a straight answer his fans? That is his choice.

Yes, it is. And people are judged by their actions. Tommy Yune won't answer questions straight-forwardly, therefore he is either deceptive or unwilling to afford common respect to fans who look to him for insight or confirmation of the validity of loving the Robotech franchise into the future. Saying that something "is his choice" doesn't change the fact that he made the choice (over and over again) and is liable to be judged by it.

I actually do think you went about this all wrong. Perhaps a wedgy would have gotten your point across more clearly

Not a bad idea. Maybe at Macross World-Con?

taking the picture with him at the end instead of saying, "no thanks, I think Shadow Chronicles sucked and so do you" made it seem like you lost your conviction at the end.

Like I've said NUMEROUS TIMES: I don't hate Tommy Yune. If he wanted to take a picture of the scene, I wasn't about to be a jerk and not allow him that indulgence. I got pictures, he got pictures. He looked to my camera, I looked to his camera. It was about mutual respect despite disagreement.

I think that everyone fails to understand this premise or, alternatively, enjoys believing that there's some kind of blood-vengeance deal going-on between old-school Robotech fans and Tommy Yune. The guy might make some bad decisions, but he's still a human being and I'm still willing to be a gentleman about it. I pied him, sure, but I didn't slam it in his face with such fieroscity that it left a bruise or a scar; I also didn't use any other kind of "attack" which may have inflicted bodily harm. The entire purpose of the act was not to hurt Tommy Yune or his own conscience but to invoke self-reflection and hopefully give him something to finally realise that Robotech fans HAVE BEEN PUSHED to emotional extremes thanks to his and his partners' decisions on how to handle the franchise. I have also noted several times that it is his choice alone whether or not he wants to use this opportunity to do such a thing.

There was no loss of conviction because there never was a desire to "whoop his ass." It was always about taking the next step from the dialogues which, to that point, had never been openly and believably respected. I did what I felt was right from beginning to end, achieved the goal I set-out to achieve, and let Steve Yun take the picture because, hell, if they want pictures to remember that it happened, it better helps the chances of their reflecting upon the incident and asking the intellectual question "What could have driven this to occur and why was I selected as the target?"

Simple.

EDIT ADDITION:

You had a opportunity to have a open one on one dialogue with him about your concerns. What a waste.

*cough* Do you guys even read my posts?--I already addressed this question in my last post. Read it: Tommy Yune doesn't answer questions straight-forwardly, so the purpose of an interview is nullified by his own decisions. It's not a 'waste,' man. What is a waste is people repeating the questions already asked and answered because they're either a) too self-involved to consider what's already been said or b) too lazy to read.

Since the Yune's took root at HG, they've always practiced their own special brand of information control & lack of originality, I'm pretty sure it was in their resume's ...But to be disgruntled because they're not open to your idea's when it's their idea's that are being contracted seems a bit silly.

For the last time, Keith (because I've said it twice already): What irks the majority of non-Yune-aligned Robotech fans as well as myself is that they're unwilling to admit fault to anything. Barring outright 'bowing of heads to the ground many times over' after a big mess-up (and we've seen a few by now), they should at least be respectful enough toward the loyal fans to openly say that there's room for improvement ON THEIR END. In concession, I've heard Tommy Yune and company say a few times that they're willing to work on improving the next episode of Robotech, but c'mon, who doesn't say that?--It would be like Ford Motors coming-out and saying "Our previous car was awesome so on the next one we're really not gonna try to improve it."

This kind of "faultlessness" flows through Tommy Yune and his posse's attitudes like a never-ending river of bravado. Again, were they willing to show that they know they themselves could improve, many fans would be less disinterested with their handling of Robotech. Unfortunately, everything points to the fact that they don't care what they do to Robotech as long as they have fun doing it.

I would think that, given the chance to lead a new Macross series, any of the dedicated Macross fans here would think long and hard about how to make the series both worthy of the original series and new and exciting. Many of us don't get that from Mr. Yune; we tend to see his work as ecclectic as "Buster: The Amazing Bear" to "Speed Racer" and in turn, wonder if, without a willingness to say "I haven't quite got the right feel for Robotech yet," he's a good guy for the job.

EDIT ADDITION:

I don't think you realize your actions resulted in serious breaches in security.

Actually, serious breaches in security resulted in my actions.

You may think this is funny, but it is not, especially this day and age.

It is if you're not a super-uptight security freak who feels that he needs guards and hired-help to protect him as he goes-through life. If you're afraid of pies, that's your phobia and you should probably see a psychiatrist so that you can safely walk through the bakery section of the supermarket without having a coma-inducing panic attack. However, if you're capable of looking at a pie and realising that, yeah, it's fluffy and it's soft like yo' momma's breasts, then you're still capable of laughing in "this day and age"--which is good, considering all the paranoid freaks out there who listen to the news and decide that it's not safe to step outside when it's sunny or drink diet cola or eat monosodium glutamate or vote using punch cards or walk on the street in the dark.

It's funny. It's more funny now that you brought it up.

I found it interesting how much smoke you blew up his skirt before you pied him. "Tommy's an overall good guy and doing his best"...That didn't quite equate to "The Shadow Chronicles sucks = Tommy Yune sucks = Let him know that he sucks" to me

Just because someone is "an overall good guy" and "doing his best" doesn't mean that I approve of what kind of "overall creative director" or "the things he's doing" is going-on. Let's respect diction a bit, shall we?

You had the pefect chance to do a legit interview on video but you didn't use it as a forum to bring your issues to the table.

Of course not. Anyone who's ever talked to Tommy Yune in-person with the potential to be recorded for posterity knows that he's a spin-master. I seem to recall how, at Anime Expo 2005, despite my direct insinuations, he shrugged-off the fan-debate over whether or not Marlene/Ariel's voice actress in the original series, Melanie MacQueen, would be reprising her role in The Shadow Chronicles. He turned a question by me this year from 'Would you please address the split that The Shadow Chronicles is causing in the fandom?' into 'Everyone loves Robotech' and 'There's always gonna be a split.' Anyone who's dealt with the guy knows that he never answers tough-questions straightforwardly. This interview, were it to be conducted as you suggest, would not have been any different, nor would it have revealed anything new.

I hope that clears things-up. I realise it's hard--especially if one has never been to one of these things before--to envision what it's like to get the same answers all the time, but hell, it's true...almost a 'tradition' since Mr. Yune took the stage.

Just curious, have you ever "pied" anyone else that you felt "deserved it" in your life?

I once "pied" a guy in my language class who said that pies weren't funny. We actually both had a great time, and when the school janitor showed-up (at the teacher's request) we told him to lay off and let us do the work. He thought it was actually quite admirable at how I would go through all the trouble to do such a thing, and we spent the clean-up time just jovially talking about how, sometimes, the simplest things work better than their more "advanced" counterparts.

Really intelligent guy. It's funny how you brought that up, because I wonder where he is right now...

I hate to say it, but it really is kind of a "duh" situation in this case. HG has always been like that, hell, go ask battletech fans how they feel on the matter

Again, I realise the differences in this matter. What has happened, though, is that Harmony Gold effectively isn't just blocking-out Macross or Battletech, but blocking-out all chances for their own franchise, Robotech, to advance, save for an overly-cautious plan of "we're gonna make feature films and that's it." Doing it to others is commonplace in business (though not morally excusable) but c'mon, doing it to yourself?

I guess I'm still just not getting it, as the writing & story in SC seems pretty consistent with what was done in the original rewrites for Robotech, no better or worse.

It has nothing to do with the quality of The Shadow Chronicles. It's all about being open and honest with the fans. Harmony Gold has refused to do this, despite numerous pleas from a devoted and heartfelt fandom. I may not like The Shadow Chronicles, personally, but I found enough decent material in it to make an alternate cut to the feature which I have openly offered to the public, so one can't logically believe that this entire event was motivated by some crazy fan over the basis of continuity conflict. It was about being human, humble, and willing to talk. Again, hopefully this can lead to something which all the talk of the past was never able to achieve.

"Macrossworld: Where they'll rip you a new apeface, but won't assault you with a pie."

The irony is astounding, isn't it?

In all seriousness, no insult or ill-intent implied. Exactly what was it that made you finally decide to hit Yune with a pie. I realise you may not be happy with the direction that "The Shadow Chronicles" has taken, but at the same time, it's the first real attempt at a "true" Robotech production ever. Even Sentinels relied on stock footage, & some Macross "inspired" (as loosely as they did come) designs. Who's to say any of your dissagreements over the outcome of SC are any worse than cobbling together a show out of other shows with some bad dubbing & re-writing thrown in.

Your reasoning is sound, and I am fully aware that the much-beleaguered Robotech franchise should be happy to gain a new series after so many years. The problem isn't that it happened, nor is it that The Shadow Chronicles was more-than-a-little bad, it is (and has been) in the methods of Harmony Gold as a whole with their handling of the Robotech franchise during the entire period in which The Shadow Chronicles was under production and to this date--that is to say, since around 2000.

Macross fans have a long-standing dislike for Robotech and how Harmony Gold has repeatedly prevented Macross goods from reaching American (and other non-Japanese) soils, but supposedly, Harmony Gold protected this so as to advance the line of Robotech--their own original product. So while the feeling I am expressing may be 'duh, loser' to you, it's a relatively new thing to the Robotech community--namely, that Harmony Gold controls Robotech and effectively has chosen to neither advance Robotech nor Macross in a decent manner. Their "cleaning-up" of the admittedly convoluted Robotech chronology was admirable, but they effectively destroyed a whole lot of the franchise while replacing it with nothing. Their repeated delays for The Shadow Chronicles' release were always accompanied with stock phrases like 'quality assurance' and 'making it as good as possible' and when it was released and neither of those were apparent, they had no humility in admitting their shortcomings. Toys get announced but either never come-out or come-out and are overpriced as well as horribly made compared to the same toys/models released in Japan but restricted from being released here. Books get delayed without notice and without apology. Deals with companies--including distributors--are never inherent signs of progress. All of these things would be, I must say, forgivable as long as Harmony Gold would let their fans know what's going-on, but unfortunately, they never do, and it is this dishonesty and secrecy-for-the-sake-of-pride which brought me to this point several days ago, more than anything else.

Every Robotech fan and his children know that Harmony Gold doesn't speak openly. Too many have politely asked, in the past, for them to change their ways and just tell the truth. (It's freakin' true. Robotech fans love their franchise so much that, even if it's a bad thing, we're not gonna go away. We love it; we have for years; people buy their crap even when all of the above is common knowledge.) I don't hold anything against Tommy Yune or his staff for the direction which they have chosen to take the Robotech continuity, as Robotech already has a million-and-a-half chronological conflicts; what I and many others resent is that, despite open criticism, they've never been willing to say "Okay. It wasn't perfect, or even near perfect, but we'll try to make it better in the next one." That I could accept and use it as a marking-point off of which to maintain the faith that the people now at Harmony Gold care more about making a good Robotech series than indulging themselves upon a power-driven joyride at the expense of my favourite science fiction series.

Because they never listened to words, I decided to try something different. 'Extreme'?--Sure, I won't deny it. But at least it was different, and instead of beating a dead horse ("Talking it over like civilised men," when in fact, it has long been the people at Harmony Gold--save perhaps Tom Bateman--who made no pretenses of listening) I figured it was worth a shot.

We'll see what happens next.

Sincerely yours,

Kamjin 639

You guys and your agreements with these wussy interpretations of assault are funny as hell.

Hey Kamjin, if youre serious about coming to MWCon contact Kiririth on the convention thread. I dont mean that as an invitation to an ambush or anything, but if you're willing to come as a fellow civilized fan...then of course by all means come.

Regardless of what my detractors might want to pretend, I'm not some monster who walks around, using my super x-ray heat-sensor lock-on technology to pie people in the face every 5.6 seconds. I'm certainly a civilised fan in how I conduct myself amongst others and this Tommy Yune incident should, of course, be looked-upon as an 'extreme' rather than a 'norm.' Doing a bit of investigation might help; anyone who's ever met me at a Robotech-related event could testify that I simply like to get-down into in-depth conversations and enjoy the atmosphere which can only be fully cultivated within a room full of people who love the same things, and so, I'd love to come.

My ability to travel, however, is limited. While I would love to come to this year's Macross World-Con, the effort required for me to make it happen demands that there be a very specific reason to go. As I noted in my previous post, if Tommy Yune is going to be there and we can effectively use the convention as a mutual place of interest where we may settle our differences and openly discuss the topics-at-hand, then I would make every effort to see it happen. If Mr. Yune is unable, unwilling, or otherwise not going to attend, then I unfortunately cannot justify the interruption of my normal work/education routine, if you would please understand.

I don't know if Mr. Yune is aware of what is going-on in this thread. If one of the organisers of Macross World-Con is able to reach him, then I humbly ask that you let him know how I feel about this potential for future engagement. I would be very much interested to see it happen.

Sincerely yours,

Khyron_Prime/Kamjin 639

Well, it takes guts to come in and explain your actions... for that I have to commend you. But you have to admit that many people will see what you have done as "unnecessary" and "overboard". IMHO you accomplished nothing. You embarrassed a man who only wanted to entertain you with his artwork. For some reason you took his attempts to entertain you personally and assaulted him in a public place. It's one thing to "not like" something and batty about it on a message board, that is "normal". It's normal to complain... everyone complains about everything. But when you take that step, that step from normal everyday run of the mill complaint to something like this you cross a line.

Again, I find it humourous that people will batty and moan about things all day long (and this is, according to your position, alright) and yet actually doing something to express it beyond the realm of words is not. I'm not trying to be mean, but seriously, anyone who thinks like that needs a serious ideal-check; bastardising action in this day and age--hell, ANY day and age--is bastardising the chance for advancement. I lay no claim to having accomplished anything, but at least I was willing to try something different. Many people just do the same things over and over again and frankly it's boring as hell.

Let's get this straight: I didn't 'assault' Tommy Yune. I threw a pie in his face. If you believe that to be 'assault,' then you haven't been in too many fights in your lifetime, and need to seriously reconsider where the line between 'harmless' and 'damaging' is drawn. Harmony Gold might be good at covering things up, but I think that if Tommy Yune were rushed to the hospital, we'd have heard of it by now.

Yes, MWers are Jerks. Then again one man's opinion is another man's "being a jerk"... at least we don't go around smashing pies in people's faces.

I'm well aware of this fact by now, and in future interactions, I'll make sure not to hurt any of your delicate skins by inflicting major damage with pie-throwing. I may be tempted, however, to bring baby bottles to introduce to your mouths, just to ensure that you get your nutrition for the day.

Agreed. Maybe if ya write a letter to him, he'd be willing to sit down and listen to your qualms. "Hey i'm pie guy. Remember me? Sorry bout that pie thing. But srsly.....what's up with Robotech yo?" or something.

Sound advice. I believe I heard that Tommy Yune may be helping-out with Macross World-Con in some way, and I am willing to make the journey out to your guys' convention in order to have a public meeting with the man, should he be there. I've long wanted to indulge my 'other half' by visiting the Macross fandom, and this would be an opportune chance. If anyone knows what the deal between Mr. Yune and Macross World-Con is, then please let me know so we may be able to set something up.

Sincerely yours,

Khyron_Prime/Kamjin 639