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Finished the season finale, best new series on streaming this year IMHO. More so than House of the Dragon, Rings of Power, etc. 

I do have a gripe, though minor, about ANDOR and its there is no alien characters among the main cast. This is the same issue I had with ROGUE ONE too. They made it so inclusive but forgot the aliens as main characters, lol.

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1 hour ago, TangledThorns said:

I do have a gripe, though minor, about ANDOR and its there is no alien characters among the main cast. This is the same issue I had with ROGUE ONE too. They made it so inclusive but forgot the aliens as main characters, lol.

Spoiler

Ya no aliens in the prison either ,building relays or whatever for the Deathstar dish . Within that context , i can see the Empire is very "human" centric. Somewhat xenophobic. No alien Storm Troopers, ever. It's just taking for granted. As far as the overall story, there's plenty of background aliens. But none that carry on  

 

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6 minutes ago, Bolt said:
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Ya no aliens in the prison either ,building relays or whatever for the Deathstar dish . Within that context , i can see the Empire is very "human" centric. Somewhat xenophobic. No alien Storm Troopers, ever. It's just taking for granted. As far as the overall story, there's plenty of background aliens. But none that carry on  

 

It's clear as day how the Empire views non-humans just by listening to Dr Mengles talking about the sound clip of Children (alien or otherwise)...

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4 hours ago, TehPW said:

Luthen is a former Jedi (long ago disgraced), that crystal being the crystal placed in his walking stick...

That would be absolutely the worst possible backstory for him.  Full stop.

That would be enough to make me stop watching.  One of the things keeping Andor accessible and interesting is that these are ordinary people who are dealing with the Empire's oppression in their own ways.  Whether that means keeping their heads down and living with it, rising up and doing something about it, or even taking the Empire's side out of the belief that the law and justice are one and the same.  These are people making choices.  They have agency in their stories.

Spoiler

I know this is going to be an unpopular opinion, but IMO Force users are 100% the worst, laziest thing about Star Wars.  They're flat characters because the Force exists as a self-enforcing moral absolute to them.  Users of the Light Side are noble and selfless Hero-Saints and users of the Dark Side eat babies.  If they stop being selfless they'll be chowing down on children within the week, like Anakin.  Did something good at the last second?  Fate just forgot they were responsible for decades of genocide, oppression, and laser sword murder and they go to Force heaven... like Anakin.  They have no agency, because the Force has a plan for them and it is not taking "No" for an answer... and they not only know it, it's a fundamental part of their belief system and training.  There are no real stakes in their stories either, because they're being railroaded towards a predetermined outcome by an omniscient and omnipotent power.  It makes them incredibly boring.

Ordinary - but very angry - private citizens Cassian Andor and Luthen Rael are ten million times more interesting as characters than any Jedi or Sith Lord because they are not puppets of fate.  They have more moral options than Sainthood and Absolute Evil.

 

3 hours ago, TangledThorns said:

Finished the season finale, best new series on streaming this year IMHO. More so than House of the Dragon, Rings of Power, etc. 

I do have a gripe, though minor, about ANDOR and its there is no alien characters among the main cast. This is the same issue I had with ROGUE ONE too. They made it so inclusive but forgot the aliens as main characters, lol.

It's not surprising, IMO... the Star Wars galaxy has always felt pretty human-centric.  Aliens were mostly comic relief or secondary characters at best.  It's also really hard to make a seven foot two shag carpet who talks entirely in untranslated barks and growls or a hydrocephalic fishman into characters the audience can relate to easily.

Though, in hindsight, it does make sense that the Empire's deep-seated racism would even extent to its mass incarceration too.  Narkina 5 is supposed to be a nicer prison, where conditions are allegedly more humane.  The prison population is 100% human.  One can only imagine how much worse the alien prison population has it because they're second-class citizens at best.

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41 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

The prison population is 100% human.  One can only imagine how much worse the alien prison population has it because they're second-class citizens at best.

They’re probably used for food. I bet there’s a huge bounty out for Admiral Ackbar since he’d probably taste great steamed with a bit of butter 

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Nah, breaded and pan fried.  Those Mon Calamari are quite delish with a squeeze of lemon and dipping sauce.

I think the excuse with Narkina 5 is that who knows how an alien physique would tolerate the built-in shock floors.  Better to keep the species in that prison relatively the same so you don’t have to customize or recalibrate the floors for different species.

We did see a few aliens in Saw’s camp.  And there was that one black masked alien during the Rix Road skirmish.

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Featured alien characters wouldn't work with Andor's tone. Star Wars has problems when it comes to alien characters. Most of them either speak a language nobody understands, or they give them an accent of some racial stereotype. Then then will use them as comic relief.   

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2 hours ago, Roy Focker said:

Featured alien characters wouldn't work with Andor's tone. Star Wars has problems when it comes to alien characters. Most of them either speak a language nobody understands, or they give them an accent of some racial stereotype. Then then will use them as comic relief.   

Yeah... nobody wants the return of a minstrel show-like comic relief character ala Jar-Jar Binks, and giving Cassian an alien buddy he had to translate for would not only slow the plot down a bit it'd make him feel like a low-rent Han Solo (like the Han Solo in Solo).

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3 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Yeah... nobody wants the return of a minstrel show-like comic relief character ala Jar-Jar Binks, and giving Cassian an alien buddy he had to translate for would not only slow the plot down a bit it'd make him feel like a low-rent Han Solo (like the Han Solo in Solo).

More like Dumpster-Dive Han Solo. That didn't even seem like Han to me; not the same mannerisms or much of anything save the outfit.

More to the point though: after seeing what SW does with aliens (case in point: prequel Trade Federation bosses), I think they would do well keeping them in only  as needed and sparingly at that (BSG-R avoids that luggage by nit having any to begin with, but that's another franchise). GIven the Empire's disdain (at best) for non- homo sapiens, that can work just fine for this period.

On another note: Cassian needs to be his own character, not a clone of another established previous one. Adding an alien sidekick is just going to make it that much harder sledding  for the character and the show overall.

 

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2 hours ago, pengbuzz said:

More to the point though: after seeing what SW does with aliens (case in point: prequel Trade Federation bosses), I think they would do well keeping them in only  as needed and sparingly at that (BSG-R avoids that luggage by nit having any to begin with, but that's another franchise). GIven the Empire's disdain (at best) for non- homo sapiens, that can work just fine for this period.

At least in the films, Star Wars has always restricted the roles of alien characters to sidekicks, supporting characters, and background extras.  

I suspect that has a lot to do with Star Wars opting to make its aliens more physically alien.  Star Trek can get away with making alien characters regulars in its main cast because its favored approach to aliens is the humanoid "rubber forehead alien".  The light prosthetics and body paint they use minimally obscures the actors faces, so they can still emote like a normal actor.  It's relatively easy on the actors, unless they develop an allergy to the materials.  More "alien" aliens require either digital post-production animation or heavy makeup and prosthetics that are extremely time-consuming, expensive, and hard on the actors.  I've heard it said that actors who play those roles tend to ask for more money in casting because of how time consuming, unpleasant, and claustrophobic working in heavy prosthetics is.  

Easier by far to keep aliens in the background "for local color" and leave the action to the humans.  

(That and Star Wars made a lot of its more recent aliens kinda racist... the Trade Federation, Jar-Jar, Watto, etc.  I'd really rather not see something like that again.  Another one of those would make it two steps forward and three steps back in terms of representation.)

 

2 hours ago, pengbuzz said:

On another note: Cassian needs to be his own character, not a clone of another established previous one. Adding an alien sidekick is just going to make it that much harder sledding  for the character and the show overall.

Yeah.  Cassian and Andor in general benefit heavily from defying the usual Star Wars formula in favor of more nuanced storytelling.  I'd hate to see them compromise that.

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3 hours ago, pengbuzz said:

On another note: Cassian needs to be his own character, not a clone of another established previous one. Adding an alien sidekick is just going to make it that much harder sledding  for the character and the show overall.

He may not get an alien, but there was the emo robot and he eventually gets a sassbot 

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1 hour ago, TangledThorns said:

One of my favorite scenes in the series. Stellan Skarsgård killed it, one of his best performances in his career and a under rated actor IMHO.

That being said, I suspect Luthen is a Jedi survivor too and could explain why he has a network of rebels. Kleya is probably his padawan.

 

 

 

Either that or he’s a sith and Kleya is a weird Leia clone apprentice 

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Though they've toyed with "Gray Jedi" and Rogue Jedi , it hasn't happened much in the live action world. I mean, what's Asoka? She isn't pure "Jedi" hasn't been for a long time. This is the facet of SW that has always grabbed me the most. The middle area between the dark and light. It's more vast and diverse than expected. 

6 hours ago, electric indigo said:

Andor x RATM

 

That's awesome! 

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I'm still hung up on Kenari, largely due to one line of dialogue...

Spoiler

Upon starting a full rewatch, the ship which crashes on the planet in episode 1 is revealed to be crewed by people which appear to be wearing CIS uniforms. However, in episode 2, Maarva states that the natives just killed a Republic officer. I feel like this can't be just a dialogue screw up. I really wonder if she had a hand in bringing down the ship after discovering that it was a Republic front for chemical weapons. Her transport certainly didn't appear to be armed to the point of taking down another ship, but appearances can be deceiving. I so badly want to know more about the story behind what happened with Kenari. I wonder if it will somehow fit into the larger galactic "push" to tip systems toward the Rebellion? (e.g. Palpatine's dirty laundry being aired showing that he played both sides of the conflict.)

I guess we won't know for sure for at least another two years. Ugh.

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2 hours ago, Axelay said:

I'm still hung up on Kenari, largely due to one line of dialogue...

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Upon starting a full rewatch, the ship which crashes on the planet in episode 1 is revealed to be crewed by people which appear to be wearing CIS uniforms. However, in episode 2, Maarva states that the natives just killed a Republic officer. I feel like this can't be just a dialogue screw up. I really wonder if she had a hand in bringing down the ship after discovering that it was a Republic front for chemical weapons. Her transport certainly didn't appear to be armed to the point of taking down another ship, but appearances can be deceiving. I so badly want to know more about the story behind what happened with Kenari. I wonder if it will somehow fit into the larger galactic "push" to tip systems toward the Rebellion? (e.g. Palpatine's dirty laundry being aired showing that he played both sides of the conflict.)

I guess we won't know for sure for at least another two years. Ugh.

Yeah, I was a bit thrown by that too... though more because there was some timeline problem there.  

It seems that Andor did a bit more retconning of Cassian's background than it first appeared to.  His homeworld being listed as Fest was retconned to being a cover story, but it looks like his birth year changed a bit too.  The official website says that Cassian was 9 when he was taken off Kenari and that the flashbacks occur before the start of the Clone Wars.  Rogue One material says Cassian was 26 when he died.  With the Clone Wars starting 17 years before the series and 22 years before Rogue One, Cassian would have to be at least 31 for that timeline to work.

If it was prior to the official outbreak of the Clone Wars, Maarva may have been mistaken about who the crew actually were.  Maybe she assumed they were Republic because they were crewing a stolen Republic ship or something of that nature.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Okay, I'm very, very late to this party.  I just got D+ tonight (well, last night) and I started with Andor.  Rogue One is the only good thing Disney has done with the IP so this is the place to start.

 

I'm just 3 and a bit episodes in and did the casting director look at Chernobyl and say, "Get me everyone who worked on that?"  'Cuz I recognize 3 actors so far in pi episodes.  Also love the little drop of an "increase in construction materials to Scarif."  Love the worldbuilding, even if the first 3 episodes were so.  Frickin'.  Slooooooooooooow.

 

I don't need to sleep, right??? :D

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4 hours ago, derex3592 said:

@CoryHolmes - No, you DO need sleep, especially watching Andor!  It is a SLOOOW burn but the ride is totally worth it!!! 

Yes, this show is a slow burn. Especially the first 3 episodes. It will pick up after that with a couple more slow episodes inbetween but just sit it out.

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7 hours ago, CoryHolmes said:

I'm just 3 and a bit episodes in and did the casting director look at Chernobyl and say, "Get me everyone who worked on that?"  'Cuz I recognize 3 actors so far in pi episodes.  Also love the little drop of an "increase in construction materials to Scarif."  Love the worldbuilding, even if the first 3 episodes were so.  Frickin'.  Slooooooooooooow.

Yeah, it's slow... but take it slow with Andor.  The story's broken up into story arcs of 3 or so episodes, which are largely self-contained but build in the same direction.  If you're going to do multiple episodes, groups of three is the way to go.  

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Just finished Episode 4, and I'm faaaaar more interested in Mon Mothma and her (seemingly?  Kindasorta is?) douchebag of a husband.  I want more politics of this era!

Despise Siyrl?  Syrial?  The corpo cop who's DEFINITELY a douchebag.

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