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New Macross TV Series in 20xx (sometime this decade)


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On 1/30/2017 at 5:17 AM, Seto Kaiba said:

If I were you, I wouldn't hold my breath for this new Macross series to go back to the way things were done in the 80's.  Macross has never been a franchise that cared overmuch for nostalgia, so I'd expect the franchise to continue to move forward... and that means some of the periphery demographic of older fans is going to get left behind.

Hopefully this still applies to Delta and we get something completely new and different.  It was several months ago that Delta aired.  Fans have had 128 days (and counting) to reminiscence...3000+ long hours of nostalgia for the show...it's time to move on and move forward.  ^_^

Edited by Oihan
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On 1/30/2017 at 8:17 AM, Seto Kaiba said:

If I were you, I wouldn't hold my breath for this new Macross series to go back to the way things were done in the 80's.  Macross has never been a franchise that cared overmuch for nostalgia, so I'd expect the franchise to continue to move forward... and that means some of the periphery demographic of older fans is going to get left behind.

Really?

Mac Delta pretty much follows the same formula as SDFM and Mac F

1. Unknown enemies attack

2. Boy saves girl in valk

3. Boy joins military / military organization

4. Random love triangle stuff thrown in

5. Boy grows into a hero character, idols use power of music to end conflict.

add to that Having a Jenius descendant as a main character, fighting Zentradi in opening episodes and doing their flight training in VF-1 Exes (for the sake of having VF-1's) and then doing the good old Max and Milia fighting style for Hayate and Mirage?

The opening episode of Mac F was like a nerd dream, especially that modern footage of megaroad-1 taking off. Let's not even get into Ranka doing a cover of DYRL, the patron of SMS having a minmay locket or Ozma naming his formations after Fire Bomber songs. New Fans would not have a clue what any of these things meant.

 

Edited by Duymon
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Know what would be a twist for a new Macross series.  No Jeniuses in it but instead have a Ichijyo character.  And have this character be all, "I don't want to talk about it" by everyone around him/her constantly asking him/her about Megaroad 1/Hikaru/Misa.  

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28 minutes ago, Dangard Ace said:

Know what would be a twist for a new Macross series.  No Jeniuses in it but instead have a Ichijyo character.  And have this character be all, "I don't want to talk about it" by everyone around him/her constantly asking him/her about Megaroad 1/Hikaru/Misa.  

And that character's name would be "Shoji" Ichijyo. 

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7 hours ago, Duymon said:

The opening episode of Mac F was like a nerd dream, especially that modern footage of megaroad-1 taking off. Let's not even get into Ranka doing a cover of DYRL, the patron of SMS having a minmay locket or Ozma naming his formations after Fire Bomber songs. New Fans would not have a clue what any of these things meant.

 

True, true.  But even new fans could appreciate the depth that it brings to the characterization - hints at a larger background that's unrelated to the plot of the current series.  I think 'world building' would be another way to describe it, if MF was the first Macross series.

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10 hours ago, Oihan said:

Hopefully this still applies to Delta and we get something completely new and different.  It was several months ago that Delta aired.  Fans have had 128 days (and counting) to reminiscence...3000+ long hours of nostalgia for the show...it's time to move on and move forward.  ^_^

Well, thus far Macross's creators are opposed to direct sequels and recurring antagonists, so it seems a safe bet we're done with Walkure and the Kingdom of the Wind... or the world's most agonizing Earth Wind and Fire joke.

 

9 hours ago, Duymon said:

Really?

Mac Delta pretty much follows the same formula as SDFM and Mac F

To be frank, what you listed there is almost a perfectly generic plot outline for any mecha series in which the main character isn't already in a heroic (para)military outfit at the start.  Swap "love triangle" for "love interest" and take out the bit about idols and you've got a framework for anything from Evangelion to Gundam.  

Mind you, that's not what I'm talking about... nor are the occasional continuity nods and homages we get to remind the audience that this is part of a bigger franchise.  What I AM talking about is that Macross is not a franchise that likes to tread old ground.  Discounting the movies that tell an alternate version of the story from a series, the nature of Macross's main theme is such that we don't get recurring antagonists in the franchise.  By the end of the story they're either dead or they've seen the error of their ways and stopped the fighting.  They haven't had a battle with a Zentradi Army Main Fleet since the original series and DYRL?, sentient virtuoids like Sharon Apple are illegal, three of the seven Protodeviln died and the other four buggered off for parts unknown leaving their slave army behind to be de-brainwashed, Anti-Unification Forces had already disbanded before the First Space War wiped the survivors out, the Vajra buggered off to another galaxy after reaching a mutual understanding with humanity, Havamal was decimated, and the Kingdom of the Wind is reeling after Roid's de facto coup d'etat and having lost a good chunk of their forces including three of their seven top aces and is probably well on its way back to being an economically and politically irrelevant hick planet so far out in the space boonies that you can hear the banjos from orbit.  It's largely the same with main and supporting characters.  Outside of Max and Milia, it's SOP to have characters never appear again once their story arc is over.  Isamu is a rare exception, and they don't even show his face onscreen.  Obviously there are practical reasons for it, but every new series offers up a new main fighter for the protagonists too, so barring the occasional continuity nod we don't have any two story arcs that share the same VFs either.  The same is done to themes.

Macross's creators love to reinvent the wheel... they take the same basic tropes, but stretch them over a story in a different shape every time, which helps keep things fresh.  It makes Macross less predictable, at least in pre-production, since we don't have the Gundam-esque consistency of being able to ask "So what are we calling the space Nazis this year?".

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11 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

To be frank, what you listed there is almost a perfectly generic plot outline for any mecha series in which the main character isn't already in a heroic (para)military outfit at the start.  Swap "love triangle" for "love interest" and take out the bit about idols and you've got a framework for anything from Evangelion to Gundam.  

Yeah, Macross has simiarities to those but what makes it macross is the concurrent origin stories of a male pilot, female idol singer, transforming robots and the power of music. so.... don't really see where you're trying to go with that....

11 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

What I AM talking about is that Macross is not a franchise that likes to tread old ground.  Discounting the movies that tell an alternate version of the story from a series, the nature of Macross's main theme is such that we don't get recurring antagonists in the franchise.

I would probably say the reason you don't get recurring antagonists is probably because they got utterly defeated by the power of music .....

11 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Macross's creators love to reinvent the wheel... they take the same basic tropes, but stretch them over a story in a different shape every time, which helps keep things fresh.

Wait... so actually do you agree with me that Macross follows the same formula over its TV series (except Mac 7).....

11 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

 It's largely the same with main and supporting characters.  Outside of Max and Milia, it's SOP to have characters never appear again once their story arc is over.

So do you care to explain Macross zero? Doesn't that sort of set the precedent that the franchise can revisit past characters in the macross universe? They didn't even make any really new mecha they just made precursor versions of the mecha we already loved in SFDM.

So... with the existence of Mac Zero how is it unreasonable for fans to hope that maybe someday the franchise can do other side series that fill in other time-gaps in the Macross Universe without necessarily moving the timeline forward?

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1 hour ago, Duymon said:

So do you care to explain Macross zero? Doesn't that sort of set the precedent the franchise can revisit past characters and events within the macross universe? They didn't even make any really new mecha they just made precursor versions of the mecha we already loved in SFDM.

So... with the existence of Mac Zero how is it unreasonable for fans to hope that maybe someday the franchise can revisit other gaps in the Macross Timeline? 

 

I'll bite: it's not totally unreasonable, but the likelihood is very low.  In short, Zero didn't do very well financially.  For the same reason we can look at it as a precedent that it's possible, the financial backers of Macross can look at it as a financial risk to be avoided.

 

The other thing to keep in mind is that Kawamori-san is a very creative person, and tends to avoid things that limit his (or his production team's) creativity.  Thus the frustrating line: every Macross series is true onto only itself.  Every series sort of happened in a *real* Macross universe, we're just watching THAT universe's creative dramatization of those events.

So, if Kawamori-san wants to and can find a way to work around any restrictions set up by the series before and after the gap in the Macross timeline, then anything is possible.  Personally, I wouldn't hold my breath for it.  Historically PS (etc.) games filled some of those blacks.  But that part of the 'rule book' was rewritten with the popularity of Frontier and the games it spawned...

 

I'm not happy about those circumstances, either.

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29 minutes ago, sketchley said:

I'll bite: it's not totally unreasonable, but the likelihood is very low.  In short, Zero didn't do very well financially.  For the same reason we can look at it as a precedent that it's possible, the financial backers of Macross can look at it as a financial risk to be avoided.

Fair Enough. I wasn't really one of the people clamoring for another Macross Zero anyways, I just wanted to point out that the precedent did exist.

 

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10 hours ago, Duymon said:

Yeah, Macross has simiarities to those but what makes it macross is the concurrent origin stories of a male pilot, female idol singer, transforming robots and the power of music. so.... don't really see where you're trying to go with that...

The point was that what you're describing is a very general, very generic set of basic tropes common to most mecha shows... not revisited plot elements or recurring characters/factions/etc.

 

10 hours ago, Duymon said:

Wait... so actually do you agree with me that Macross follows the same formula over its TV series (except Mac 7).....

At the very, VERY basic level you described, yes... otherwise, not s'much.

 

10 hours ago, Duymon said:

So do you care to explain Macross zero? Doesn't that sort of set the precedent that the franchise can revisit past characters in the macross universe? They didn't even make any really new mecha they just made precursor versions of the mecha we already loved in SFDM.

So... with the existence of Mac Zero how is it unreasonable for fans to hope that maybe someday the franchise can do other side series that fill in other time-gaps in the Macross Universe without necessarily moving the timeline forward?

Macross Zero is actually a good example of what I was talking about in terms of minimal recurring material and an unwillingness to revisit old factions and themes.

Roy Focker's secondary character status is the ONLY carryover material in the entire OVA... everything else was all-new:

  • The OVA does not revisit any familiar settings, taking place as it does entirely on the newly-introduced island of Mayan and the oceans surrounding it.
  • The OVA's themes about preserving nature (I guess?) never come up in another Macross title.
  • The OVA is not set during any previously documented era in Macross in-universe history, given that the Unification Wars as depicted in Super Dimension Fortress Macross ended the previous year. 
  • The OVA's antagonist is not featured in any previous Macross series, and ceases to exist in-universe shortly after the OVA's events, so they never appear again.
  • The OVA has only one recurring character from a previous series (Roy Focker), and only one character from the OVA is ever mentioned after the OVA (Mao Nome, and only then as a posthumous character that IIRC didn't have a speaking role).  All other characters are all-new and are not seen or mentioned again after the OVA.
  • The OVA has no recurring mechanical designs from a previous Macross series, the closest being the HWR-00-Mk.IP Monster which is different enough to be obviously distinct from the Mk.II in Super Dimension Fortress Macross.
  • The OVA's macguffin/plot coupon is never acknowledged again after the events of the OVA, except in a dramatization filmed a half-century later after the events were declassified, which has no bearing on the conflcit in its native series.

Basically... Macross Zero demonstrated that Macross's creators will go back to earlier dates on the calendar IF they can set the story up in a way that it's as close to completely separate from any previous Macross story as possible so they're not tied down by existing material.

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Despite the fact that we have never had a season 2 of any Macross TV series before, I'm still hoping the new Macross TV series will be a continuation of Delta. The characters were all likable and the mecha designs were great and I think they deserve more screen time. 

Also hopefully a bit more emphasis on mecha combat compared to season 1 would be nice as well as more character development and screen time for the supporting characters.

I'm not asking or expecting to have non-stop mecha action, but at least give us a minimum of 3-5 minutes of mecha action per each 20 minute episode and no more than 2 episodes in a 26 minute season that don't feature mecha.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

The point was that what you're describing is a very general, very generic set of basic tropes common to most mecha shows... not revisited plot elements or recurring characters/factions/etc.

 

At the very, VERY basic level you described, yes... otherwise, not s'much.

 

Macross Zero is actually a good example of what I was talking about in terms of minimal recurring material and an unwillingness to revisit old factions and themes.

Roy Focker's secondary character status is the ONLY carryover material in the entire OVA... everything else was all-new:

  • The OVA does not revisit any familiar settings, taking place as it does entirely on the newly-introduced island of Mayan and the oceans surrounding it.
  • The OVA's themes about preserving nature (I guess?) never come up in another Macross title.
  • The OVA is not set during any previously documented era in Macross in-universe history, given that the Unification Wars as depicted in Super Dimension Fortress Macross ended the previous year. 
  • The OVA's antagonist is not featured in any previous Macross series, and ceases to exist in-universe shortly after the OVA's events, so they never appear again.
  • The OVA has only one recurring character from a previous series (Roy Focker), and only one character from the OVA is ever mentioned after the OVA (Mao Nome, and only then as a posthumous character that IIRC didn't have a speaking role).  All other characters are all-new and are not seen or mentioned again after the OVA.
  • The OVA has no recurring mechanical designs from a previous Macross series, the closest being the HWR-00-Mk.IP Monster which is different enough to be obviously distinct from the Mk.II in Super Dimension Fortress Macross.
  • The OVA's macguffin/plot coupon is never acknowledged again after the events of the OVA, except in a dramatization filmed a half-century later after the events were declassified, which has no bearing on the conflcit in its native series.

Basically... Macross Zero demonstrated that Macross's creators will go back to earlier dates on the calendar IF they can set the story up in a way that it's as close to completely separate from any previous Macross story as possible so they're not tied down by existing material.

So basically, each series is a stand-alone "vignette" of a period in time for Earth and the UNS/NUNS. All in the world of Macross, but "stand-alone" in the way they are supposed to be viewed?

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4 hours ago, treatment said:

I say they will do Ship girls idols for this new tv-series.

Possibly in Megaroad-class and Valkyrie-class categories at first.

Then Nupetiet, Bodole, Laplamiz class and others in between...

:p

The Megaroad class ship would be a total babe.

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On 2/2/2017 at 10:40 AM, Einherjar said:

They should build on the mystery behind Lady M and her possible franchise spanning influence Berger speculated about.

Assuming she exists at all... and isn't just a corgi in a control room somewhere.

 

 

11 hours ago, treatment said:

I say they will do Ship girls idols for this new tv-series.

Possibly in Megaroad-class and Valkyrie-class categories at first.

Then Nupetiet, Bodole, Laplamiz class and others in between...

:p

... considering how phallic the Zentradi ships are, what makes you so certain it'll be ship girls...?

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Another wish popped into my mind regarding a new Delta series. I wish Mirage's valk would now have an emblem. As it is it feels bare compare to Messer's and Arad's. As to what that emblem would be, I have no idea though.  But I want it to be bad-ass looking like the shinigami.

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Really by now the Jenius family should have its own emblem or crest that appears on a VF to warn the enemy "Take notice, you are flying against a Jenius... might as well just give up now."

Course... this is Mirage we're talking about... but maybe it would boost her confidence some?

 

In that light though, if this is a sequel of some form, I do want to see more focus on Mirage. She got none in Delta... stilted in the love triangle by design almost, given no development in her efforts to become a better pilot amidst the gargantuan expectations her name carries (which IMO was actually a rather cool plot element that went absolutely nowhere). Given she claims in the finale she is done overthinking her flying she might be able to discover her latent Jenius skills now. I'd like to see some of that.

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6 hours ago, Master Dex said:

In that light though, if this is a sequel of some form, I do want to see more focus on Mirage. She got none in Delta... stilted in the love triangle by design almost, given no development in her efforts to become a better pilot amidst the gargantuan expectations her name carries (which IMO was actually a rather cool plot element that went absolutely nowhere). Given she claims in the finale she is done overthinking her flying she might be able to discover her latent Jenius skills now. I'd like to see some of that.

 

Yea have Mirage as the main character continuing the work of Delta Platoon while Hayate and Freyja fly off on a Basara-esque journey to unite the galaxy through song (and dance)

Edited by Raptor One
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Thinking about it there is an opportunity to show all 5th Generation VF to date. Earth's VF-24, Frontier's VF-25 and YF-29, Galaxy's VF-27, Surya Industries VF-31. If you are asking why the VF-27 it has been seen in post Frontier media with Macross 30 and Macross E. As for the Sv-262 Draken III it is too much identified with Windermere to me. Though I wouldn't mind seeing Sv-154 Svard as it and the YF-24 are the only ones we never saw their transformation though we can extrapolate given the VF-25, and the LV-47 from Macross Design Works.

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  • azrael changed the title to New Macross TV Series in 20xx (sometime this decade)
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