Macross Δ (Delta) Mecha/Technology Thread - READ 1st POST

[d3v]

I would be looking to ships that already have a model built that they can stick there without a ton of hassle. The only time we've seen a Meltran ship outside of DYRL is Fleet of the strongest Women, I think. That makes it a very unlikely candidate. I'd think more along the lines of something they've got laying around. My money is on an Uraga, which kinda fits the two pointy bits and shape.

Alternatively, they DID build a model of the Meltran gunboat and that's why the Valk dancing backgrounds in this episode were really low budget.

It looks to be hand drawn though.

[JB0]

I was only somewhat aware of that. Pretty interesting - I think I'll do some reading.

Old pacemakers used them.

They don't anymore because there are chemical batteries that last a decade, and if it is in there much longer they like to be able to upgrade your components.

I did have to do a targeted search to check the gunfire resistance(and I'm pretty sure it is limited to handgun rounds).

[Babyyea]

Wow guys !!! Amazing the photos are shared. Thank you very much

[Babyyea]

[Product9]

I did have to do a targeted search to check the gunfire resistance(and I'm pretty sure it is limited to handgun rounds).

You're probably on some watch list now

[Master Dex]

I was only somewhat aware of that. Pretty interesting - I think I'll do some reading.

RTGs are a lot safer than many might think.. but also the fact they are used for deep space missions more than anything else is not because of any danger it is because they are reliable and solar panels have a distance limit before they aren't as feasible.

In fact, take my word for it in detail, I wrote a blog post about it years ago back when I had a blog (now defunct): https://kimbody1535.wordpress.com/tag/rtg/

[JB0]

You're probably on some watch list now

In all fairness, I probably already was. The burden of curiosity, I suppose.

Hello, NSA monitor. Yes, I know you're there. I hope you are having a good day. Enjoy your coffee.

[seti88]

Does the 31 have AAMs and AAAMs as weapons loadouts?

[d3v]

Does the 31 have AAMs and AAAMs as weapons loadouts?

31_display.jpg

Hard to say whether that's correct, or simply an error from recycling the interfaces from Frontier.

That said, the interface is scaled much better now. Even in the Frontier movies, they were scaled wrong and bits of it (including the weapons loadout) were cut off by the art. That said, it seems that part of it has gone holographic.

EDIT: Comparison shots from Frontier (movie 1) and Delta (episode 4).

Aside from the thrust/output gauges for the engines now being holographic, you can clearly see how they were scaled wrong in Frontier, with bits of the interface cut off. Also, I'm guessing the two gauges being holographic now has to do with how they'd be cut off if they weren't.

With these changes, it seems to be less of a quick recycling job and more or less trying to fix these small issues from Frontier. That said, we still can't tell if the loadout stuff is indicative of anything.

Edited May 4, 2016 by d3v

[Mr March]

Might be just putting a random ship there just to add a bit more detail to the scene.

That said, I think that rear "spike" is simply the ventral protrusion of the gunboat.

Most likely.

Yeah I thought about that. Cold have been the same for the ventral fin on the Uraga or New Macross/Battle Class, etc. But IMO the angle isn't right for that kind of skewed view and the rear "spike" is too large and extends much too far rearward to be a ventral fin. Maybe a 1080 shot would reveal more details.

[seti88]

Hard to say whether that's correct, or simply an error from recycling the interfaces from Frontier.That said, the interface is scaled much better now. Even in the Frontier movies, they were scaled wrong and bits of it (including the weapons loadout) were cut off by the art. That said, it seems that part of it has gone holographic.EDIT: Comparison shots from Frontier (movie 1) and Delta (episode 4).Aside from the thrust/output gauges for the engines now being holographic, you can clearly see how they were scaled wrong in Frontier, with bits of the interface cut off. Also, I'm guessing the two gauges being holographic now has to do with how they'd be cut off if they weren't.With these changes, it seems to be less of a quick recycling job and more or less trying to fix these small issues from Frontier. That said, we still can't tell if the loadout stuff is indicative of anything.

seeing that the 31 primary loadouts seem to be guns and boomarangs, that seems to be quite an obvious error. Thanks for interesting display comparisons though. The display projections are much clearer, interesting to see how the usefulness holographic projections are.

If only they existed in real life, it would change car dashboards!!

Edited May 4, 2016 by seti88

[azrael]

Hard to say whether that's correct, or simply an error from recycling the interfaces from Frontier.

That said, the interface is scaled much better now. Even in the Frontier movies, they were scaled wrong and bits of it (including the weapons loadout) were cut off by the art. That said, it seems that part of it has gone holographic.

EDIT: Comparison shots from Frontier (movie 1) and Delta (episode 4).

Aside from the thrust/output gauges for the engines now being holographic, you can clearly see how they were scaled wrong in Frontier, with bits of the interface cut off. Also, I'm guessing the two gauges being holographic now has to do with how they'd be cut off if they weren't.

With these changes, it seems to be less of a quick recycling job and more or less trying to fix these small issues from Frontier. That said, we still can't tell if the loadout stuff is indicative of anything.

There's a lot of word soup on-screen so I really won't pay that much attention to what's on screen. If you look at that screenshot of Messer, you see

couleurs supplémentaires

rose-coral bleu-cyan

That looks like someone pulled stuff from the French Microsoft Office.

If it's something important, they will make a screen that will be specific, otherwise, it's word-soup on screen.

[tout-puissant]

That little blob of a ship is not likely anything special.

And while the evidence suggests that Ragna could have been initially settled by the Macross 1 fleet (or perhaps just a part of it, since the the one shot in the Macross 7 intro segment shows FOUR Battle/City ship combos of two distinct designs), there's enough leeway to interpret it as any of the other early NMC fleets. We don't know for sure when they started building CIty ships with the clamshells, or if EVERY ship after Macross 5 (at the earliest) had them; so it could concievably be anyone from Macross 1-4 within reason.

http://www.macross2.net/m3/macross7/newmacross/newmacross1.jpg

Now, why would two ships potentially launched years apart end up within a few hundred light years of each other at roughly the same time? That's not THAT much of a stretch... Macross 5 and 7 were in the same neck of the woods after all, and then Frontier and Galaxy ended up together as well. In both cases they were separated by two fleet designations and at LEAST a couple years between launches.

Coming back to Ragna and Windermere, they could have launched years apart but their courses and the length of their stopovers would bring them together at about the same time. Alternatively, the Megaroad could have passed Ragna, seen the native population as nice and friendly, and marked it for a visit by the next available colony while they moved on to Windermere which was better suited to their tastes (or something). A next fleet to launch from Earth / Eden figured on cutting out the "wandering space for decades" thing and booted it straight for Ragna.

Mark

[eko.prasetiyo]

so where the battle part? we only saw the city island part. perhaps the clamshell just been jetisoned in orbit or before landing?

[Seto Kaiba]

And while the evidence suggests that Ragna could have been initially settled by the Macross 1 fleet (or perhaps just a part of it, since the the one shot in the Macross 7 intro segment shows FOUR Battle/City ship combos of two distinct designs), there's enough leeway to interpret it as any of the other early NMC fleets. We don't know for sure when they started building CIty ships with the clamshells, or if EVERY ship after Macross 5 (at the earliest) had them; so it could concievably be anyone from Macross 1-4 within reason.

Just a side note, the Macross-1 fleet is the only one noted as not having the shell.

[grigolosi]

It's little tales like this that really ought to crop up in Macross sometime... the trials and travails of the deck crew who have to keep those Valkyries running. A wild child like Hayate Immelman or Isamu Dyson would probably drive the deck crew into paroxysms of fury in prolonged operations...

Oh yeah especially when it comes to over g's on the frame. I know the limits for VF'S are way high but I imagine a pilot like Isamu could do it. Even worse though would be the guy's like Alto who smash up their bird by blindly charging in head first.

Edited May 4, 2016 by grigolosi

[seti88]

There's a lot of word soup on-screen so I really won't pay that much attention to what's on screen. If you look at that screenshot of Messer, you seecouleurs supplémentairesrose-coral bleu-cyanThat looks like someone pulled stuff from the French Microsoft Office.If it's something important, they will make a screen that will be specific, otherwise, it's word-soup on screen.

The words on the right were quite specific tho. Gun, chaf(f), aam, ready. Will put it down as they used a vf-25 template for a 31 heh.

Edited May 4, 2016 by seti88

[Seto Kaiba]

The words on the right were quite specific tho. Gun, chaf(f), aam, ready. Will put it down as they used a vf-25 template for a 31 heh.

Well, it's got guns, it's probably got a countermeasure dispenser somewhere, and we know it has at least six internal micro-missile launchers... seems like that covers all those.

[tout-puissant]

Just a side note, the Macross-1 fleet is the only one noted as not having the shell.

Granted, if it's written somewhere it's likely to have been the intent at the time. But who knows for sure, it's not the first time something in print was later contradicted by visual evidence - or as noted above, the shell could have been jettisoned or lost along the way. Since we don't see an NMC for sure, and since the City ship here looks both different and smaller than the ones in the picture I linked, I think that it could easily NOT be Macross 1, as much as I'd love to have that consistency maintained.

Mark

[BChoinski]

Doubtful, IMO... it takes a lot more doing to send matter (and energy) from our universe into super dimension space than it does to draw heavy quanta from super dimension space into our universe. I suspect that, prior to the 4th Generation, reactors were simply keeping the fusion reaction at a low-enough level that most of the energy could be harnessed by the HamiltonX-Ash4 PGS and the MHD, and what was left could be either harnessed to preheat reactant or vented through exhaust or traditional cooling systems. It isn't until the 4th Generation and the introduction of thermonuclear reaction burst turbine engines that we start hearing about them having heat-dissipation problems that necessitate either larger heat sinks or throttling of the reactor itself.

It's little tales like this that really ought to crop up in Macross sometime... the trials and travails of the deck crew who have to keep those Valkyries running. A wild child like Hayate Immelman or Isamu Dyson would probably drive the deck crew into paroxysms of fury in prolonged operations...

So is the fuel in the tanks just there for the fusion engines, and perhaps for propellant we draw mass from SD space an expel it?

[d3v]

Granted, if it's written somewhere it's likely to have been the intent at the time. But who knows for sure, it's not the first time something in print was later contradicted by visual evidence - or as noted above, the shell could have been jettisoned or lost along the way. Since we don't see an NMC for sure, and since the City ship here looks both different and smaller than the ones in the picture I linked, I think that it could easily NOT be Macross 1, as much as I'd love to have that consistency maintained.

Mark

That's too many extra details that would need to be explained though.

Occam's Razor would lead us to the simplest explanation, that it is likely Macross 1.

[Master Dex]

So is the fuel in the tanks just there for the fusion engines, and perhaps for propellant we draw mass from SD space an expel it?

I don't know about that SD space thing you mentioned. Sounds like a Star Trek tactic more than a Macross one. That being said the consensus based on Seto's data seems to be the fuel in the VF is for the reaction engines entirely. In atmo, it combines with the air for exhaust, in space, it is used solely on its own in and incredible amount.

[tout-puissant]

That's too many extra details that would need to be explained though.

Occam's Razor would lead us to the simplest explanation, that it is likely Macross 1.

I can respect that viewpoint and disagree with it at the same time. I'm the type to take visual evidence over one mention in a book written long before Frontier or Delta came out, and try to rationalize it rather than dismiss it as an animation error / inconsistency (so yes, I think the erronious VF-1 with three head lasers in the original SDF Macross IS a thing, despite NO literature backing it up). IMO, Macross 1 is absolutely a possibility but far from a firm yes. We can discuss this for hours without a firm conclusion either way - that's what makes us nerds for this thing, after all!

Mark

[grigolosi]

Well, it's got guns, it's probably got a countermeasure dispenser somewhere, and we know it has at least six internal micro-missile launchers... seems like that covers all those.

You are spot on with that Seto. It specifically shows CMD (counter measure dispenser) on the screen along with oxygen, ECM, ICM and few others I am not sure about. I am trying to discern whether the the large gauges are engine RPM's for sure. I enlarged the screen but the wording under left and right is still really blurry. The 3 smaller gauge displays are still blurry also.

[Seto Kaiba]

So is the fuel in the tanks just there for the fusion engines, and perhaps for propellant we draw mass from SD space an expel it?

The fuel in the tanks (slush hydrogen) is there to feed the compact thermonuclear reactor in the engine... it's the plasma that the reaction produces that becomes the propellant in space flight. The heavy quanta (matter which exists in both dimensions, but has impossibly vast mass that resides principally in super dimension space) produced by the engine's fold carbon coil is maintained by a Gravity Inertia Control system and is used both to initiate the fusion reaction via compression and for containment of the reactant and the plasma the reaction creates.

Heavy quanta is nasty stuff, mind... properly excited with a fold resonance effect, all of its mass can drop into realspace and its own gravity will trigger it to rapidly fuse with itself in a fairly violent manner. That's how dimension beam weapons (SD energy cannons, converging energy cannons, they have a bunch of different names) work. Dimension Eaters simply use a kind of the stuff that has even greater mass, so instead of fusing its mass causes it to drop right back into the super dimension (taking anything inside its gravitational field with it).

[Product9]

That's too many extra details that would need to be explained though.

Occam's Razor would lead us to the simplest explanation, that it is likely Macross 1.

Wouldn't Occam's razor lead us to the explanation with the fewest assumptions?

Which is probably the lack of continuity since it's been pretty well established there isn't any...

Not having any canon is kind of frustrating, isn't it? Well, what we lack in Macross canon is made up for by the sheer number of Macross Cannons I guess

[Seto Kaiba]

Wouldn't Occam's razor lead us to the explanation with the fewest assumptions?

Well, yes... and that would tend to point the finger squarely at Macross-1, being the only fleet ever positively identified as using a New Macross-class without a shell.

Mind you, there's not a ton of possible alternatives for this one. Macross Chronicle indicates that it was only the earliest of the New Macross-class ships that didn't have the defensive shell, and we know the ships in the Macross-5 fleet had them... which means it has to be a pre-Macross-5 ship. We know that it can't be Macross-3 or Macross-4, as those established the colonies on Eden 3 and Sephira respectively.

That leaves Macross-1 or Macross-2.

[Product9]

Well that sounds like the fewest assumptions to me.

I wonder if they'll verify it at some point.

[seti88]

Well, it's got guns, it's probably got a countermeasure dispenser somewhere, and we know it has at least six internal micro-missile launchers... seems like that covers all those.

That was my original question, does the 31 have missiles?

I had thought all the 31 had were the overhead gun, the left/right tonfa's and boomarangs.

So;

1) If there are micro missiles where are they located?

- Does AAM and AAAM's qualify as micro missiles?

2) Should there be a mention of the tonfa's statuses..(guns or beams?)

3) Presumably the loadout should show the status of the boomarangs too...

Nit picking i guess, but all in the name of clarifying loadouts on the 31..

Edited May 5, 2016 by seti88

[Product9]

Do all of the -31s have the drones? The -262 has missiles approximately where the -31's drones come from, so maybe that's an option.

And what does AAAM mean? Anti-Air-to-Air-Missile?

Then, presumably, they will have to be loaded with AAAAMs, and then AAAAAMs, and then.....

[Graham]

The 31 has three micro-missile launcher ports in each lower leg.

So for armament that we know of there is:

· 2 x shell firing arm cannons.

· 6 x micro-missile launchers (3 per leg).

· 1 or 2 head lasers (depending on variant).

· 1 x beam(?) cannon mounted on weapons pod (detachable for use as handheld gunpod).

· 4 x wing hardpoint stations (2 per wing).

· 1 or 2(?) folding knives (mounted in arm shields).

[Graham]

Counting 12 multi-drones in the left side nacelle and 13 multi-drones in the right side nacelle (as viewed from the rear).

[seti88]

So thats where the missles been hiding in the legs! Completely forgot abt those panels...

The drones probably would be equal on both legs, unless there is a weird reason they dont need to have 1 more on the left.

Appreciate the loadout summary graham!

[d3v]

Probably just obscured by the angle.

[Beltane70]

Or one's out for maintenance/repair.