Mommar Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 (edited) "He's fast and she's weird." That was the dumbed-down comical response after Cap made a "huh?" face when she explained what their powers actually were. Edited May 5, 2015 by Mommar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted May 5, 2015 Author Share Posted May 5, 2015 Joss Whedon on Fighting With Marvel Over 'Avengers: Age of Ultron': "It Got Really, Really Unpleasant" (Original podcast here: https://soundcloud.com/empiremagazine/avengers-age-of-ultron-spoiler-podcast-joss-whedon-and-paul-bettany) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 I've listened to it. it's not nearly as dramatic as all that. But the podcast does underscore how even some of the most powerful and commercially successful creative forces have to often fight tooth and nail to get quality on screen. I know legions of Marvel fanboys want everyone to believe Marvel Studios is a benevolent, underdog force for good, showing up the old evil, established Hollywould studios, beating them at their own game. The truth is Marvel is just as much a bureaucratic monster as the other studios, only difference is they are doing their business right for the new era of filmmaking while the other studis are stumbling around. That's all. At the end of the day, the fight between commercial interests vs. creative ones rages ever on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeszekely Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 I've listened to it. it's not nearly as dramatic as all that. But the podcast does underscore how even some of the most powerful and commercially successful creative forces have to often fight tooth and nail to get quality on screen. I know legions of Marvel fanboys want everyone to believe Marvel Studios is a benevolent, underdog force for good, showing up the old evil, established Hollywould studios, beating them at their own game. The truth is Marvel is just as much a bureaucratic monster as the other studios, only difference is they are doing their business right for the new era of filmmaking while the other studis are stumbling around. That's all. At the end of the day, the fight between commercial interests vs. creative ones rages ever on Or, in this case, is it a fight between creative interests and creative interests? Without debating whether or not Marvel is "just as much a bureaucratic monsters as the other studios" (I'm sure it is), it is a fact that Marvel's got Kevin Feige in charge of the overall MCU, and that Feige has plotted out the course of the MCU to something like 2022. I see a lot of the studio interference that's been hurting Sony with Spider-Man or the Warner Bros. with DC as execs making stupid decisions they're not really informed enough to make, like, "Hey, Marvel built this big cinematic universe with their heroes, so we can make a jillion dollars too if we copy that even though we don't have a plan beyond 'copy Avengers'." And, with respect to Whedon, I don't see that as the case here. For whatever reason, Feige and co. were uncomfortable with Hawkeye's secret family (frankly, although the family and the farmhouse were in the Ultimate Avengers, it seemed way too out of the blue in the film for me, too), although they ultimately relented. Likewise, maybe Whedon didn't care for the cave, but Feige and co. obviously felt it was important to their over-arcing plan. If Whedon's not privy to that plan, it's understandable that he might be more dismissive of the scene. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Or, in this case, is it a fight between creative interests and creative interests? Without debating whether or not Marvel is "just as much a bureaucratic monsters as the other studios" (I'm sure it is), it is a fact that Marvel's got Kevin Feige in charge of the overall MCU, and that Feige has plotted out the course of the MCU to something like 2022. I see a lot of the studio interference that's been hurting Sony with Spider-Man or the Warner Bros. with DC as execs making stupid decisions they're not really informed enough to make, like, "Hey, Marvel built this big cinematic universe with their heroes, so we can make a jillion dollars too if we copy that even though we don't have a plan beyond 'copy Avengers'." And, with respect to Whedon, I don't see that as the case here. For whatever reason, Feige and co. were uncomfortable with Hawkeye's secret family (frankly, although the family and the farmhouse were in the Ultimate Avengers, it seemed way too out of the blue in the film for me, too), although they ultimately relented. Likewise, maybe Whedon didn't care for the cave, but Feige and co. obviously felt it was important to their over-arcing plan. If Whedon's not privy to that plan, it's understandable that he might be more dismissive of the scene. Oh, for sure. I mean, keep in mind we only ever get part of the picture from interviews like this. And we all know the situation is more complex than the generalizations that I've laid out. But we can't really ever know the specifics of the business and creative processes in their totality. We only get hints, shades and fragments even reading, listening and watching all the publically made content about these films as we can. I just like to pull back from the deification of these personalities and companies because it so often leads to more harm than good. I know people love their heroes and their hero worship, but Marvel is an organization of people like any other. And no one is worthy of that mantel or the worship, only admiration or respect. As much as I may like Marvel, Valve, HBO, or Halliburton (lawls), they do dumb crap and make bad moves like anyone else. Same as directors, no matter how much I like them. I'm mostly on board with what Feige and Marvel are doing, but I have my reservations and criticisms. They will have to always work hard to maintain trust. I hope for the best. Guess will all be there to see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocombatpilot Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 well, who is responsible for turning Black Widow into the Hulk's pet! And I'm using the word "pet" to be nice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mechapilot77 Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 well, who is responsible for turning Black Widow into the Hulk's pet! And I'm using the word "pet" to be nice! other way around you mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Togo Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 (edited) Ok, finally saw this today. First off, no Star Wars teaser, but instead got a Batman v Superman trailer. TOTAL FAIL. Anyway, the movie, it was definitely entertaining--and even good--but not as good as the first one. It seemed like a much longer movie crammed into a smaller space. Ultron as a character was silly. His personality seemed way out of place. For the entire cast, many of the quips and jokes seemed off; right intent, but wrong line or delivery. Also, the dream sequence stuff was silly and unneeded, we know who these people are. And what was with that shoehorned Banner/Widow romance? Dafuq did that come from? Oh, and didn't Tony Stark "quit" at the end of Iron Man 3? And he quits again here? Well, until Civil War, lol. But hey, I liked it, though. And I kept getting this vibe from it like Marvel was showing DC how to do a proper Superman movie, if you catch my meaning. Edited May 5, 2015 by Duke Togo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Sounds like the producers are just ticking off the boxes that a sequel to a monumental blockbuster MUST contain. Bigger explosions, check. More snarky lines from that character, check. Fate of the city/world/universe in danger, check. Unlikely, contrived romance between two characters, check... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangard Ace Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Best delivered line was, "he hates you the most." So deadpan, so off the cuff funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Sounds like the producers are just ticking off the boxes that a sequel to a monumental blockbuster MUST contain. Bigger explosions, check. More snarky lines from that character, check. Fate of the city/world/universe in danger, check. Unlikely, contrived romance between two characters, check... I disagree, given the method and nature of the interaction between Natasha and Banner I think the romance makes perfect sense. Everything else is either exactly as it has been in every Marvel movie or exactly what happens in EVERY Avengers thing ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogze Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) I liked the movie, fun although suffering the same flawed ending as the first in my opinion, but the characters were entertaining and there was some fun action packed scenes too. But I just can't believe all the hate Whedon is getting for his work on Twitter https://storify.com/Astojap/wehdon-twitter-hate Edited May 6, 2015 by Frogze Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vifam7 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 (edited) Can someone explain to me the whole cave scene with Thor? Where is that cave supposed to be and what tie-in does it have with the other movies? I don't remember anything about such a cave from the other Marvel movies. Then again, my memory of the Thor movies are kinda weak. Or is this something we're all supposed to know from the comics? Edited May 6, 2015 by Vifam7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanedaestes Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 It's actually part of a longer scene that was cut. AoU is like a three hour movie that got drastically cut down. That scene is one of the major hits, luckily they said their will be a directors cut coming to Blu Ray this fall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 It's actually part of a longer scene that was cut. AoU is like a three hour movie that got drastically cut down. That scene is one of the major hits, luckily they said their will be a directors cut coming to Blu Ray this fall Marvel has never released an extended cut of anything, Joss Whedon said there will be no director's cut and this is the movie and the "they" who says there's an extended version was taken from an advert put out by Amazon.uk (who aren't known for getting facts correct.) Right now there is no luck and going by past Marvel movies you will not be getting an extended movie, just bonus clips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanedaestes Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Ah my mistake but that's the reason the season never felt right in the movie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeszekely Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Can someone explain to me the whole cave scene with Thor? Where is that cave supposed to be and what tie-in does it have with the other movies? I don't remember anything about such a cave from the other Marvel movies. Then again, my memory of the Thor movies are kinda weak. Or is this something we're all supposed to know from the comics? The cave has nothing to do with any of the movies, although I vaguely recall something like it in the comics. What it is, in this case, is setup for Thor 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Focker Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 And they never explained how Tony became Iron Man again. In the end of the 3rd movie all of his Iron Man suits/drone were nearly or totally destroyed. His heart was fix. Start of this movie he's Iron Man with no explanation? Wouldn't it have made more sense if during the first third of the film he was just Tony trying to make Ultron and after Ultron went bad he had no choice but to become Iron Man again? How much money does Iron Man have? Even the richest 1% would be hurting for cash after all these destructive movies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Obviously the problem is with how dumb Iron Man 3 was... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric indigo Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 With the comics rebooting all the time, don't expect the movies to make too much sense in sequence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 What's tge mystery? He just lost his house and suits, not his money and blue-prints. Looks like he fully moved into Avengers tower, built more suits, and whatnot. Likely the fall of SHIELD would be enough to make him actually wsnt to suit up again. His heart being fixed isn't a factor in being Iron Man, he perfected Arc Reactor texh in Iron Man 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Togo Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 What's tge mystery? He just lost his house and suits, not his money and blue-prints. Looks like he fully moved into Avengers tower, built more suits, and whatnot. Likely the fall of SHIELD would be enough to make him actually wsnt to suit up again. His heart being fixed isn't a factor in being Iron Man, he perfected Arc Reactor texh in Iron Man 2. Because he's essentially done at the end of 3, and he comes back with no explanation. Then he's done again at the end of Ultron, but we already know he's back for Civil War and Infinity War. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Tony Stark gets done a lot. He was done with the military contract in the first movie and switched his attention to the Iron Man project. In part 2 he was done with Stark Industries completely and gave it to Pepper. Even if he got the "farm house" with Pepper, he wouldn't be able to sit there enjoy it... you know he'll be in the barn making more armor and spying on everything his allies and enemies are up to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Because he's essentially done at the end of 3, and he comes back with no explanation. Then he's done again at the end of Ultron, but we already know he's back for Civil War and Infinity War. SHIELD fell, Hydra was around screwing with alien technology, much explanatiom do you need? And as for the second "done," that seemed to have a lot more to do with being an Avenger than being Iron Man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Togo Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 SHIELD fell, Hydra was around screwing with alien technology, much explanatiom do you need? And as for the second "done," that seemed to have a lot more to do with being an Avenger than being Iron Man. Except he's not done being an Avenger, because Infinity War. And you can't go from him being done at the end of 3 to showing up in Ultron without a single word. You shouldn't need headcanon here; it was sloppy storytelling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gakken85 Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 (edited) I thought they were hinting at the eventual nano suit. But I think the end of 3 fleshes with the beginning of Avengers 2. He is trying to get out so he makes Ultron as a protector to bring peace in our time - insert movie. Ok, finally saw this today. First off, no Star Wars teaser, but instead got a Batman v Superman trailer. TOTAL FAIL. Anyway, the movie, it was definitely entertaining--and even good--but not as good as the first one. It seemed like a much longer movie crammed into a smaller space. Ultron as a character was silly. His personality seemed way out of place. For the entire cast, many of the quips and jokes seemed off; right intent, but wrong line or delivery. Also, the dream sequence stuff was silly and unneeded, we know who these people are. And what was with that shoehorned Banner/Widow romance? Dafuq did that come from? Oh, and didn't Tony Stark "quit" at the end of Iron Man 3? And he quits again here? Well, until Civil War, lol. But hey, I liked it, though. And I kept getting this vibe from it like Marvel was showing DC how to do a proper Superman movie, if you catch my meaning. Totally agree on Ultron. I was let down and confused at how nonthreatening and stupid he was. It was like a rogue robot they forgot to turn off with Tony Stark quips instead of a deadly psycho world killer. It felt like nothing was at stake and they had to do this ridiculous island floating plot just to get peoples dicks up. Can't we just see a bunch of people die and a really good fight sequence? Also there was way too many montages and exposition scenes to set up all the events. It didn't flow like the first one. I hope DC understands they can really differentiate themselves by making their movies more mature, but I doubt that will happen with the quest to make more money at PG-13... though I'm not sure why that works. When I was a kid I saw all the R rated movies. Edited May 9, 2015 by Gakken85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrentonx Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Saw this over the weekend and loved it. I'll catch it again in the coming weeks but right now I feel it is about right up there with the first Avengers movie in 2nd or 3rd place for Marvel movies. Guardians is still my number one. There were a few places I got lost (Thor's jacuzzi'o'fortune) but I was not disappointed with what I got everywhere else. The little down time moments are my favorites in all these movies and I think those moments really differentiate Marvel from DC films. They're just plain fun. Hulkbuster scene was awesomely done and I was really happy with what they did with Vision. The hammer scenes were great and the audience lost it when Vision picked it up. So cool! I really liked Ultron and his mannerisms are pure Stark. Anyway I'm gonna go see it again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troyness Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Saw it. Loved everything Hulk, thought that was done well!, That whole-"mind the language" thing wasn't funny the 1st time ,nor the 2nd or 3rd. I thought the Natasha/Banner romance was believable. ....but this back story of Hawkeye was a joke! What modern woman with children is gonna wait in the wilderness for a man that is happy to thro his life away at any moment? What if she wants to go to the shops for milk?...can't do it!,...Do they have milk cows in their backyard? Or if they're meat eaters..a slaughterhouse? Is she up at 6am plowing fields for fruit & veges?....Or is she happy to malnourish her children with tin food? What's her highlight of the year going to be?..Awaiting for home renovations?...Are the kids home schooled?...Am I missing something or was it obvious that her character was written by a man? What is Hawkeye gonna do once he's run out of arrows?..Side flip over metal robots until his thighs give out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 So I guess you're not a fan of the Hawkeye backstory, lol... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troyness Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 So I guess you're not a fan of the Hawkeye backstory, lol... Did that come across, I was trying to be subtle Lol. Other super powered characters stopped breathing in & out in AoU..but he's still alive? His tribute at the end of the 1st Avengers movie should have read : " Nice guy,with mental health issues.He only had a bow & arrow...we tried to tell him!!" He should have turned up in AoU as a taxidermi only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 (edited) Saw it. Loved everything Hulk, thought that was done well!, That whole-"mind the language" thing wasn't funny the 1st time ,nor the 2nd or 3rd. I thought the Natasha/Banner romance was believable. ....but this back story of Hawkeye was a joke! What modern woman with children is gonna wait in the wilderness for a man that is happy to thro his life away at any moment? What if she wants to go to the shops for milk?...can't do it!,...Do they have milk cows in their backyard? Or if they're meat eaters..a slaughterhouse? Is she up at 6am plowing fields for fruit & veges?....Or is she happy to malnourish her children with tin food? What's her highlight of the year going to be?..Awaiting for home renovations?...Are the kids home schooled?...Am I missing something or was it obvious that her character was written by a man? What is Hawkeye gonna do once he's run out of arrows?..Side flip over metal robots until his thighs give out? Owning a farm doesn't mean you don't also own a car and can't drive twenty to forty minutes into town to buy supplies. People do it all the time these days. Not to mention they do have a tractor, so perhaps she does do farming while Hawkeye is away. It isn't inconceivable that a woman would enjoy living in the country and farming, it's just what the mother of my roommate in college did while her husband was away in the city as an undercover DEA agent. Edited May 13, 2015 by Mommar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troyness Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 It looked pretty isolated to me, we will have to agree to disagree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 It looked pretty isolated to me, we will have to agree to disagree. Like I said, twenty to forty minute drive. Things can look pretty barren and still have some accessibility. There's lots of places that look barren here in New Mexico. If you drive by some of the wineries south of Belen it'll look like there's nothing around for miles but ten minutes north and you're at Walmart. They also don't need to spell out or sell every little aspect of a situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troyness Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Fair enough,you win this round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrentonx Posted May 13, 2015 Share Posted May 13, 2015 Yeah, in a movie that features a flying city island, that farm situation was not unbelievable at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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