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Agree with what you said Myk. If you're a fan of Benedict Cumberbatch you can check out his sherlock holmes BBC series with the hobbit actor, whose name escapes me at the moment.

Didn't even know about that-thanks for the heads up.

On another note, anyone else here think that the mother of the sick child in the beginning of the movie, Nanzeen Contracter, was the hottest girl in the whole film? I thought she was adorable in 24 but now she's a little older and sexier; the boob-job certainly helped too...

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Didn't even know about that-thanks for the heads up.

On another note, anyone else here think that the mother of the sick child in the beginning of the movie, Nanzeen Contracter, was the hottest girl in the whole film? I thought she was adorable in 24 but now she's a little older and sexier; the boob-job certainly helped too...

I dunno I thought that short haired blonde helmswoman from near the end of film was cute and hot.

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Are we past spoiler point now? Cuz I can't do those on huge phone...

Over all. I loved it. A few things here & there were rough. Liked the new take on the bad guy. Heck, if everyone assumes that's what you're gonna do, might as well meet them head on!

Moths of Prey looked fine in context. Engine room/shuttle bay looked more reasonable this time.

My big ?: if they removed the torpedo fuel in exchange for the "cargo", then how were they supposed to fire them at Kronos?

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Saw it a second time tonight with the gf who hadn't seen it. Anyone else notice the models in Marcus' office?

Ooh!

http://toynewsi.com/news.php?itemid=20454

While awesome from a collectible standpoint, it strikes me as odd that the "History of Starflight" exhibit in his office would include the Vengeance (I rather like the satire review calling it "Killerprise"). Wasn't that supposed to be like, a secret project that nobody knew about? It did offer a nice easter egg early on in the movie, however, and in my first viewing I did catch it in a "hey isn't that the big nasty thing from the trailers" sort of way.

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Are we past spoiler point now? Cuz I can't do those on huge phone...

I hope so. In fact I'm lifting it.

Benedict Cumberbatch is Khan - Feel free to hate me. It has been 10 days since the movie came out. That enough time. If you're a major Star Trek fan who didn't want to know about any spoilers you would have already seen the movie by now.

What I liked is how they found a reason to get Chekov off of the bridge and away from having a chance meeting with Khan. Because if you remember in the original series Chekov wasn't there for the first season but it was assume he must have been board during the time to meet Khan off camera because Khan knew who Chekov was in Star Trek II Wraith of Khan.

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Enterprise doesn't fit the continuity of the JJverse unless you ignore their Mirror-Mirror 'Defiant' and Borg episodes.

Next Generation fits the JJverse if you remove the episodes "Relics", "Yesterday's Enterprise" and the movie "Generations"....but you still have to ignore "All Good Things" for Next Generation the series to fit with Next Generation the movies.

Or rather like Captain Harlock don't try to tie all the individual works together but enjoy them seperately.

I'm merely saying Enterprise is the only TV series that takes place before the "Kelvin" incident that launches the alternate timeline. But you are correct, ST 2009 negates the most interesting part of Enterprise that ties it to TOS.

I agree that, for the future, the only way to enjoy Star Trek is the Captain Harlock Method .

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Because according to Star Trek quantum reality theory all possibilities exist. Data mentionned that theory in a TNG episode : ''Quantum reality, or quantum universe, was the term used to describe the alternate timelines in which all possible outcomes for any event take place. Each quantum reality was its own separate parallel universe characterized by a unique quantum signature which could not be be altered. All matter resonated on a quantum level with this signature within the universes. Before 2370, the existence of different quantum realities was considered only a theory in quantum physics. Under normal circumstances quantum universes remain separated from one another by barriers. (TNG: "Parallels")''

Link : http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Quantum_reality

Data's explanation of quantum reality:

,

''"Many worlds" in Star Trek

Some serious problems with Star Trek time travel can be solved once you accept the "many worlds" theory:

  • "City on the Edge of Forever": When Doctor McCoy jumped through the time portal, the other crewmembers on the planet's surface perceived the sudden disappearance of the entire Federation. Supposedly, he changed the past so that the Federation was never created. But that is impossible because the other crewmen still existed. They still had memories of the Federation. They still had Federation uniforms and Federation weapons. The "many worlds" theory neatly explains this problem: McCoy and all of the people on the planet's surface were all transported into a timeline (or parallel universe, whichever you prefer) in which the Federation never existed. The original timeline is not destroyed, thus explaining why they still remember its history, but they can no longer perceive it or return to it. When Kirk and Spock jumped back to "fix the damage", they caused everyone to jump into another timeline, in which the Federation was founded again, but with slightly different events surrounding Edith Keeler's death. This is not the same as "going home", but as far as they're concerned, it's good enough.

  • "Star Trek First Contact": When the Borg jumped into the past, the crew of the Enterprise perceived the disappearance of the Federation's entire history. This is impossible because they still exist, and they still retain all of their memories, equipment, history files, etc. Data suggests that they were somehow "shielded from the changes in the timeline", but he doesn't even attempt an explanation of how this is possible. The "many worlds" theory provided a neater explanation: they were dragged into a new timeline by the Borg sphere's "temporal wake", and when they stayed in the wake long enough to perform a similar jump, they ended up in yet another timeline. In this new timeline, they tried to "fix" events so that they unfolded more or less as they remembered (albeit with an orbital bombardment of Cochrane's launch facility which didn't occur in their original history). Note that the "many worlds" theory also explains the biggest conundrum of STFC: why the Borg fought their way to Earth before performing the time-jump, instead of making the jump from the safety of their own territory. The answer is that a time-jump would move the travellers to a divergent timeline but it would have no effect on the original timeline. Therefore, it would do the Collective no good. You might ask why they performed the jump at all if this is the case, but the Queen's attack had failed and she was facing imminent destruction. A jump into a divergent timeline would not change history in her original timeline, but she may have found the prospect preferable to simply being destroyed by one of Picard's quantum torpedoes.

  • "Yesterday's Enterprise": History seems to change when the Enterprise-C appears two decades away from where it was supposed to be destroyed in battle. But the original timeline is not gone, and in the new timeline, Guinan can actually perceive that the Enterprise-C belongs to a timeline other than her own (she can even perceive some of the history of that timeline). This perception manifests itself as a disquieting sensation that something is "wrong", but that's an oversimplification. After all, how can a timeline be "wrong?" With countless timelines in existence as seen in "Parallels", why would one be more "right" or "wrong" than another? A better explanation is that Guinan perceived enough of the Enterprise-C's original timeline to know that she thought it was better than the one she was currently in. We jumped to a divergent timeline when the Enterprise-C arrived and we jumped to another divergent timeline when it departed.

Although the "many worlds" theory may have been discredited in real life, it seems to be the only way to explain Star Trek time travel as we've seen it on the show. It explains causality paradoxes in "City on the Edge of Forever" and STFC, and it also explains why time travel is not being used to solve problems, because it means that time travel doesn't really change anything. It only moves the traveller into an alternate universe where events unfold more to his liking. An interesting consequence of this explanation is that we've really been following a group of characters as they move from timeline to timeline, so we haven't stayed in a single universe throughout the series run of Star Trek.''

Link : http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Trekkie.html#TimeTravel

JJ Abrams's Star Trek is set in a alternate quantum universe where the timeline has never been fixed since all the possibilities exist As simple as that.

wow, that's real nice, and makes everything much clearer. Thanks for sharing
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Actually, I think technically the Worf episode was one of the few cases he might have truly gotten back to his own reality, just because they did all the quantum signature mumbo jumbo. But even then, the fact that he split off into a different reality caused a new reality in and of itself. The only "real" one would be the parallel where he never split off at all. :p

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Just saw this tonight.

I really enjoyed it from start to finish.

Only thing I would have changed:

keep Kirk dead at the end and let him come back in the next film, They really missed an opportunity there to give the movie more impact. They could have had him read the speech about bolding going from a letter or something

The alternate reality with the Old Spock as a mentor really paid off in this film. You can see where things could have gone, but it still feels fresh.

Also, ROBOCOP KICKS ASS! haha.

Edited by Gakken85
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I dunno I thought that short haired blonde helmswoman from near the end of film was cute and hot.

Yes she was, too bad we didn't see any more of her. And, no disrespect intended but what the hell was up with the 'Ops officer though? :wacko:

Are we past spoiler point now? Cuz I can't do those on huge phone...

Over all. I loved it. A few things here & there were rough. Liked the new take on the bad guy. Heck, if everyone assumes that's what you're gonna do, might as well meet them head on!

Moths of Prey looked fine in context. Engine room/shuttle bay looked more reasonable this time.

My big ?: if they removed the torpedo fuel in exchange for the "cargo", then how were they supposed to fire them at Kronos?

Lol, good point. Maybe Robocop was hoping that once the Enterprise was stranded in Klingon space they would've been destroyed before they had a chance to see the torpedoes were altered.

Ooh!

http://toynewsi.com/news.php?itemid=20454

While awesome from a collectible standpoint, it strikes me as odd that the "History of Starflight" exhibit in his office would include the Vengeance (I rather like the satire review calling it "Killerprise"). Wasn't that supposed to be like, a secret project that nobody knew about? It did offer a nice easter egg early on in the movie, however, and in my first viewing I did catch it in a "hey isn't that the big nasty thing from the trailers" sort of way.

Sorta' reminded me of the scene in ROTS when Anakin walked in on Palpatine while he was studying blueprints of the Death Star...

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Why were Khan's people in the torpedos??

You didn't see it yet? Or is this a rhetorical question?
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He says he was trying to smuggle his people out of harm's way. Well, I'm guessing that he was hoping the torpedoes would be taken onboard the Vengeance or some other vessel where he'd be able to revive them and then proceed to sieze that vessel. But, we all know that Marcus must've discovered his plan and forced Khan to escape by himself. If I were Marcus though, I would've just disposed of Khan's people, as cruel as that may sound...

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Yeah, so I loved the film but the people in the torpedoes makes absolutely no sense to me still... like on any level... even with Khan's "I put them there to keep them safe." What? How does anyone working with Khan on these torpedoes ever say "You're right, what we really need to do is add a frozen person and this thing will be done!" One would also assume that if the frozen people are Marcus' bargaining chip to get Khan to help him then he'd ya know, keep an eye on the frozen people? Marcus also knows Khan did this. How did Khan convince Marcus that the torpedoes would be stealthier and explode more with a popsicle on board? Also, torpedoes get shot at people and blow up. Shouldn't Khan have just shoved them in a cargo container and set them a drift until he could hatch a plan to go back and get them? Kind of a stupid plot device but if one ignores that (which unfortunately is incredibly central to the plot) great movie.

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Yeah, so I loved the film but the people in the torpedoes makes absolutely no sense to me still... like on any level... even with Khan's "I put them there to keep them safe." What? How does anyone working with Khan on these torpedoes ever say "You're right, what we really need to do is add a frozen person and this thing will be done!" One would also assume that if the frozen people are Marcus' bargaining chip to get Khan to help him then he'd ya know, keep an eye on the frozen people? Marcus also knows Khan did this. How did Khan convince Marcus that the torpedoes would be stealthier and explode more with a popsicle on board? Also, torpedoes get shot at people and blow up. Shouldn't Khan have just shoved them in a cargo container and set them a drift until he could hatch a plan to go back and get them? Kind of a stupid plot device but if one ignores that (which unfortunately is incredibly central to the plot) great movie.

Yeah I know it sounds stupid. I guess I'll just say that Khan was THAT GOOD at maneuvering his hidden agenda but ultimately got caught by Marcus. There's no other way to excuse this particular plot device lol...

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I don't see what the problem is, makes perfrect sense.

The problem wasn't just getting his people out of there and onto the Vengeance. It was getting them out of there and onto the Vengeance without being picked up during scans. Likely he told Marcus that the torpedo's were using some super dangerous and or illegal substance like red matter or whatever the f^ck, and needed the extra shielding to avoid scans. Meanwhile he jams his crew in them, plans to revive them once aboard, and scamper off with the most badass ship in the fleet. His only mistake was thinking Marcus stupid enough not to check.

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"Perfect sense?" WTF?

Did Khan hand build each torpedo without any help? Where were his frozen friends? Conveniently stored in the same area with the torpedo making equipment? How would he convince ANYONE EVER that frozen people should be put in torpedoes. Whose scans was he trying to avoid? Why did Marcus allow it after he found out? Were there only 72 people on Khan's ship? Why would Marcus put 72 torpedoes on the Enterprise? Was Kirk supposed to fire that many at Kronos? Also, why is an uninhabited area of Kronos built out like there world's biggest factory? Okay... maybe the missiles wasn't the only bizarre plot element.

Edited by jenius
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Folks, as Roy mentioned, the spoiler ban has been lifted. That is unless you live in:

Belgium

Finland

Denmark

Netherlands

Portugal

South Africa

Turkey

France

Italy

Czech Republic

Israel

Brazil

Spain

Greece

Venezuela

Argentina

Japan

In which case, stay the hell away from this thread until it appears in theaters.

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My opinion varies on Kirk's death. On the one hand, I'm glad they didn't take the same route with the mirroring of TWOK. Then we'd have another resurrection movie next to bring Kirk back, blah blah - we're already retreading old ground. On the other hand, TWOK was all about Kirk's lifelong obsession with cheating death and escaping the consequences of his actions. In STID, Adm. Pike actually berates him for this very attitude @ the beginning of the film. Yet, at the end, he literally cheats death by way of Khan's blood.

Now, they did a good job of addressing the emotional transition from the 09 Trek to this installment. Perhaps this experience will alter Kirk's attitudes in further movies, make him more humble, as it did in the originals. Or it might just make him worse... I guess we'll see. While on the whole, I didn't mind the reworked TWOK ending, this is the sticking point for me.

Quinto's "Khhaaan!" paled in comparison to Shatner's. Maybe it was just the lack of the echoing through space. Maybe it just felt too forced. Not enough palpable rage, though.

OK, the other thing I'm having trouble with is that big "gallery" portion of the ship with the balconies & walkways. Where the hell was that? The center of the saucer? The neck?

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Just saw it a few days ago, awesome. I'm a fan of everything Star Trek (except the animated series - never got around to watching that) and I think there were a lot of nice nods to everything that came before.

They could have held off on re-launching the Enterprise and done a refit version for the next film, but I guess that will have to wait til after the 5 yr mission is done.

Yeah, I agree with what someone else said earlier, they should try to figure out a way to prepare for V'Ger, breed a few humpbacks and prepare for the Borg.

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Well now spoilervile is no more. I read it that the torpedoes would have been fired at Kronos and obviously not full of explody bits would just crash and the magic blood would fix the injuries of Kans men and they would get all medieval on the Klingons. one they had killed them all or made enough of a mess the Klingon command would have started a war with the Federation. Marcus wins, he conned Khan as much as Khan thought that he was conning Marcus.

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My opinion varies on Kirk's death. On the one hand, I'm glad they didn't take the same route with the mirroring of TWOK. Then we'd have another resurrection movie next to bring Kirk back, blah blah - we're already retreading old ground. On the other hand, TWOK was all about Kirk's lifelong obsession with cheating death and escaping the consequences of his actions. In STID, Adm. Pike actually berates him for this very attitude @ the beginning of the film. Yet, at the end, he literally cheats death by way of Khan's blood.

Now, they did a good job of addressing the emotional transition from the 09 Trek to this installment. Perhaps this experience will alter Kirk's attitudes in further movies, make him more humble, as it did in the originals. Or it might just make him worse... I guess we'll see. While on the whole, I didn't mind the reworked TWOK ending, this is the sticking point for me.

Quinto's "Khhaaan!" paled in comparison to Shatner's. Maybe it was just the lack of the echoing through space. Maybe it just felt too forced. Not enough palpable rage, though.

OK, the other thing I'm having trouble with is that big "gallery" portion of the ship with the balconies & walkways. Where the hell was that? The center of the saucer? The neck?

Agreed. In this movie Kirk doesn't learn a damn thing about the burdens and responsibilities of everyone's lives under his command, because he sacrifices himself instead of having to finally deal with death in the form of his best friend.

Quinto's "Khan" just sucked. His voice cracked and wavered as he yelled, and I just don't like a Spock that's more emotional than his........"girlfriend."

I want to see how they're going to deal with the miracle blood-thing; like someone has said earlier, no one ever has to die in their stories again...

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