Dynaman Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Nero was bad enough, since you only really knew what happened if you read that comic book prequel. You must have forgotten the whole Mind Meld scene between Kirk and Spock Prime, and Nero saying flat out what his beef was to Pike. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sketchley Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 You must have forgotten the whole Mind Meld scene between Kirk and Spock Prime, and Nero saying flat out what his beef was to Pike. I haven't read the comic, but I gleaned a lot of information =that should have been in the movie= from the Wikipedia article. Namely the Borg modifications to Nero's ships and the clarification of exactly what Spock was attempting to do. Don't get me wrong, I like the characterization in the movie (which is probably why I don't mind seeing it again), but the other aspects of the movie? Forgettable, at best. Alas, the movie isn't that great, because it's not really about something. (Eg: ST2 was about aging, death and new life. That revenge thing? Sure, it was the movie's plot, but that's not what the movie was REALLY about.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobizon Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Star Trek Into Darkness: A Very Close Look At The Teaser Trailer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmegaD3k Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) I just stumbled upon this on BBTS: http://www.bigbadtoy...803&mode=retail Take a look at the two preview images: http://www.bigbadtoy...ge/PLM10803.jpg and: http://www.bigbadtoy...ge/PLM10803.jpg There are quite a few differences between the two. Not only is the structure of the ship different, the marking is also more prominent in the one at the bottom. Here’s a pic showing the 2009 movie design (above) and this alternate design (below): Could they have accidentally leaked the new Enterprise design? Or am I just seeing things? XD The ship in the trailer is much closer to the one in the bottom pic: Look at the scene where the ship exists the water. The Nacelle has that dent in the back, as shown in the toy (but it's not there in the 2009 design). Edited December 7, 2012 by OmegaD3k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronocidal Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) You must have forgotten the whole Mind Meld scene between Kirk and Spock Prime, and Nero saying flat out what his beef was to Pike. Mind meld =/= another movie's worth of explanation over what the crap happened. Not to mention yeah, the entire borg-esque mining vessel thing. At least with the original Khan, you KNEW why he was upset with Kirk, and no one had to spell out the plot in a comic book to explain it. Really though, the thing that drove me nuttiest about that entire plot.. Yes, your planet was just destroyed. You have acquired A FREAKING TIME MACHINE. You could fix it.. but no. You decide that instead of using your new-fangled time travel ability to set things right, you go nuts and decide to set things wronger by going back in time and destroying the planet of the person you thought was responsible... WHICH STILL MEANS YOUR PLANET DIES IN THIS NEW TIMELINE TOO. Seriously. Edit: And nope, already not the same ship as in the teaser trailer. Looks like someone took the 2009 movie version and dressed it up in TOS markings, but we know from the teaser those markings aren't on the nacelles, and they're already shown to be the TMP-onward style of markings. And the ship is still freaking hideous. Edited December 7, 2012 by Chronocidal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the white drew carey Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 (edited) You have acquired A FREAKING TIME MACHINE. Ummm... no they didn't. Being sucked into the black hole was an unintended consequence that threw both the Narada and the Jellyfish into the past. They had no control over when they went to and, most likely, nor would they be able to replicate the results enough to control their temporal destination.* I mean, did you even really see the film? Because there was never an implication that they could go scooting around time willy-nilly. *of course, this is completely ignoring the fact that controlled time travel has been done quite often in the 'Original Timeline' previous to the events of Star Trek (2009). Edited December 7, 2012 by the white drew carey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXO Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Posters of people's backs are in this year Oblivion: I love the designs for this movie though.... looking forward to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechaninac Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Ummm... no they didn't. Being sucked into the black hole was an unintended consequence that threw both the Narada and the Jellyfish into the past. They had no control over when they went to and, most likely, nor would they be able to replicate the results enough to control their temporal destination.* I mean, did you even really see the film? Because there was never an implication that they could go scooting around time willy-nilly. *of course, this is completely ignoring the fact that controlled time travel has been done quite often in the 'Original Timeline' previous to the events of Star Trek (2009). You're right, they had no control over being thrown back some, what?, 80 years or so. But, and here is where Nero's motivation falls apart -- and where it's clear the writers did not think through the massive logic chasm in the story--; Nero and his crew end up in the past and they know it, when Romulus and Remus still exist, with information that could lead to mitigation efforts to spare the heart of the Romulan Empire, and its entire population, from the Super Nova's shock-wave, or if that proved undo-able there was enough time to evacuate all planets that would eventually be destroyed. Even assuming that Nero had gone absolutely bat-guano-crazy after the shock of the loss of his family/world and got so twisted by his need for revenge on Spock that he could not recognize the gift of fore-knowledge the Universe had bestowed him to change the future, what about his entire crew? Were they all such imbeciles that they'd just follow his lead unquestioningly?... It makes no sense once you shine a critical light on the entire premise. You also bring up a good point about previous time travel in Star Trek, and 'old' Spock was involved in every single incident not related to TNG and beyond. Here is a logical being, with intimate knowledge of temporal physics, who just witnessed his planet being consumed from within by an artificial black hole and decides to just accept it without even making an attempt to go back to before the Narada arrives above Vulcan to try to prevent the planet's destruction, the near extinction of his race, and the death of his mother (his younger parallel self's mother, but still...)... it's illogical. This is why time travel stories tend to fall apart so badly. The writers get tunnel vision in their use of the plot device in the narration of the story without any consideration for all the paradoxes and inconsistencies that can be created. It's not that time travel hasn't been handled well in Star Trek, it's use in The Voyage Home and First Contact were decent enough, but JJ's version was problematic at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TehPW Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) Have you considered that maybe its his morals that is preventing him from taking action (or the possiblity that others are not actively ensuring he does not)? He's is a former Star Fleet Officer, obligated to follow the law, even if the law hasnt been drafted yet LOL. And yes he knows how to get back but he's also how old? The Anwers seem so clear when your young and retarded. It's alot harder when you grow older.... and Spock is reasonably old by the end the Nemesis's timeline... As for Nero & crew NOT engaging with dialog with all things Imperial Roma, lets delve into how Romulans act: Just a little passionate. Can you image the &^%$ storm having Nero's Bugboat park in orbit? The Preator would crap his pants at the very least. Calling the Romulans high strung is not quite like calling a European Soccer game (or its drunk fanbase) mild and calm in comparision. Nero didnt contact the local Roms because he knew it would cause more harm than good because Romulans freak out in acqusations first LONG before they actually think. Nero's plan consisted of destroying the Federation, period. He knew he had the firepower (if properly used) to win. But he was stupid, thus eventually he did fail. would you prefer the ending from The Myst, instead for ST 2009? Edited December 8, 2012 by TehPW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyryder Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 I just stumbled upon this on BBTS: http://www.bigbadtoy...803&mode=retail Take a look at the two preview images: http://www.bigbadtoy...ge/PLM10803.jpg and: http://www.bigbadtoy...ge/PLM10803.jpg There are quite a few differences between the two. Not only is the structure of the ship different, the marking is also more prominent in the one at the bottom. Here’s a pic showing the 2009 movie design (above) and this alternate design (below): Could they have accidentally leaked the new Enterprise design? Or am I just seeing things? XD The ship in the trailer is much closer to the one in the bottom pic: Look at the scene where the ship exists the water. The Nacelle has that dent in the back, as shown in the toy (but it's not there in the 2009 design). That looks so much better. Looks like they've changed the shape of the neck, and extended the back of the secondary hull. I think it looks even better than if they'd just moved the hull backwards. It solves almost all of the proportion issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechaninac Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) Have you considered that maybe its his morals that is preventing him from taking action (or the possiblity that others are not actively ensuring he does not)? He's is a former Star Fleet Officer, obligated to follow the law, even if the law hasnt been drafted yet LOL. And yes he knows how to get back but he's also how old? The Anwers seem so clear when your young and retarded. It's alot harder when you grow older.... and Spock is reasonably old by the end the Nemesis's timeline... As for Nero & crew NOT engaging with dialog with all things Imperial Roma, lets delve into how Romulans act: Just a little passionate. Can you image the &^%$ storm having Nero's Bugboat park in orbit? The Preator would crap his pants at the very least. Calling the Romulans high strung is not quite like calling a European Soccer game (or its drunk fanbase) mild and calm in comparision. Nero didnt contact the local Roms because he knew it would cause more harm than good because Romulans freak out in acqusations first LONG before they actually think. Nero's plan consisted of destroying the Federation, period. He knew he had the firepower (if properly used) to win. But he was stupid, thus eventually he did fail. would you prefer the ending from The Myst, instead for ST 2009? Spock's age is not that relevant since Vulcans can live up to some 200+ Earth years. And what kind of morals can rationalize the death of billions when one knows there is something he could do to at least try to prevent such devastation; that's not moral, its evil. And Spock hadn't been Starfleet in decades by the time he attempted to intercept the shock-wave with the red matter device, and being a former officer did not deter him from going over the heads of the Federation and Starfleet when engaging in "cowboy" diplomacy in Unification, so he knows how to stretch and bend and break the rules when his logic so dictates; except, apparently, where his home world is involved... then it's c'est la vie. Sure... causing the Praetor to freak out from having a Romulan ship from the future approach Romulus would be far worse than the eventual destruction of at least two populated planets with who knows how many billions of lives... and who says that they would just pop into orbit; they could drop out of warp well outside the star system and approach at impulse while broadcasting an identification signal on all frequencies to give the era's Romulans time to prepare. If Nero's motivation was to destroy the Federation, then what better way to do so than to go into Romulan space, announce his presence and origin, and share his 24th century technology with the 23rd century Romulans in order to give his race a clear advantage against all the quadrant's races? Romulans may be passionate but they were also shrewd, calculating, and methodical even, specially, in Kirk's era; and once the shock wore off and they had a chance to verify Nero's account, they would jump at the tactical and strategic possibilities presented by a starship from the future. Ultimately, an entire fleet of ships incorporating reverse-engineered systems from the Nerada would be far more effective a weapon against Starfleet than just one single vessel. Never played Mist so the reference is lost on me... Edited December 8, 2012 by mechaninac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Considering how different the enterprise looks from all the other classes in that universe, I can't imagine there'd be another class similar enough to be confused with it. Certainly not for the coming out of the water scene. MAYBE for crashing into it. BTW was it ever said the new one is Constitution class? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sketchley Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) Nero and his crew end up in the past and they know it, when Romulus and Remus still exist, with information that could lead to mitigation efforts to spare the heart of the Romulan Empire, and its entire population, from the Super Nova's shock-wave, or if that proved undo-able there was enough time to evacuate all planets that would eventually be destroyed. Even assuming that Nero had gone absolutely bat-guano-crazy after the shock of the loss of his family/world and got so twisted by his need for revenge on Spock that he could not recognize the gift of fore-knowledge the Universe had bestowed him to change the future, what about his entire crew? Were they all such imbeciles that they'd just follow his lead unquestioningly?... It makes no sense once you shine a critical light on the entire premise. Now this (trying to alert one's planet about a future disaster) would have been a much more engaging movie. Sure, it might have shades of the film "Déjà Vu" (2006, Denzel Washington), but at least it would be firing on more cylinders than just the characters one - and the movie would have actually been about something... Edited December 8, 2012 by sketchley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 BTW was it ever said the new one is Constitution class? No, they were too busy bombarding us with Beastie Boys music, blinding lens flare, a green-skinned buxom red-head and other forms of shock and awe to get into details like ship classes and such. I'm guessing the days of quasi-technical manuals and other techno bits are gone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 a green-skinned buxom red-head Possibly the best part of the movie, sadly. Or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TehPW Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Never played Mist so the reference is lost on me... The Steven King Novel turned Movie is waht i refered to LOL. Good points i suppose... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VF-15 Banshee Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Just explain everything with "this is Stupid Trek for the Stupid General Public." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronocidal Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Sorry if I was mistaken, I thought Spock's ship actually was specifically a time machine.. could be I was reading what the happy meal toy description of it was though. Either way though... yeah. Averting a planetary disaster seems plenty reason to mess with time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Possibly the best part of the movie, sadly. Or not? Rachel Nichols is quite the interstellar dish; she's like, 5'10"! What I wouldn't give to fly my Excelsior into her Starbase... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hingtgen Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 She was unquestionably the best part of GI Joe: Rise of Cobra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taksraven Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 This whole thread now. LOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronocidal Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 I'm guessing the days of quasi-technical manuals and other techno bits are gone? Nah, just go find a floor plan for a brewery, and you've got Main Engineering covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 She was unquestionably the best part of GI Joe: Rise of Cobra. And the last Conan movie! This whole thread now. LOL. Success! Nah, just go find a floor plan for a brewery, and you've got Main Engineering covered. Ha ha, I know right. What restaurant brewery was that, anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VF-15 Banshee Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Budweiser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renegadeleader1 Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Just explain everything with "this is Stupid Trek for the Stupid General Public." Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home? You can't get much stupider than having a russian wander around mid 80s San Fran yelling at people about where to find something "nuclear". Then there's the phaser left behind that no one seems to care about, Scotty giving away a formula for future materials shrugging it off with hand wavium, and the stupid hope that whales as a species now that there are three(remember one was pregnant) of them in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 I just stumbled upon this on BBTS: http://www.bigbadtoy...803&mode=retail Take a look at the two preview images: http://www.bigbadtoy...ge/PLM10803.jpg and: http://www.bigbadtoy...ge/PLM10803.jpg There are quite a few differences between the two. Not only is the structure of the ship different, the marking is also more prominent in the one at the bottom. Here’s a pic showing the 2009 movie design (above) and this alternate design (below): Could they have accidentally leaked the new Enterprise design? Or am I just seeing things? XD The ship in the trailer is much closer to the one in the bottom pic: Look at the scene where the ship exists the water. The Nacelle has that dent in the back, as shown in the toy (but it's not there in the 2009 design). There is no dent in the back...it's just the other nacelle. That picture was around when the first movie came out IIRC. I think it was just an early prototype for the toy. The pylons and markings are deffinately different though and agree look better, too bad it was on the final design. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Train Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 The blue-shirt blonde's totally fake scream @ :40 ruined everything ... I'm wondering what the small craft flying overhead @ :10 seconds were, really sleek shuttles or perhaps fighters. Star Trek pew pew needs some spicing up in my opinion. In one of the DS9 battles, I recall Sisko's CO ordering fighters to flank the dominion fleet, and I was like woahh... cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikElvis Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) What I wouldn't give to fly my Excelsior into her Starbase... Oh come on!.!.! Excelsior?!?! Lets be realistic here. Defiant at best! Edited December 8, 2012 by ErikElvis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fly4victory Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 The blue-shirt blonde's totally fake scream @ :40 ruined everything ... I'm wondering what the small craft flying overhead @ :10 seconds were, really sleek shuttles or perhaps fighters. Star Trek pew pew needs some spicing up in my opinion. In one of the DS9 battles, I recall Sisko's CO ordering fighters to flank the dominion fleet, and I was like woahh... cool. Oh no! The hot blonde was faking it, that will put a dent in your hull! The fly over looked like F-14s hopfully they are only atmospheric craft. Liked that small fighters were absent in the Star Trek universe and all the battles were capital ships. The two fights in Wrath of Khan were the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electric indigo Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home? You can't get much stupider Yes you can: http://www.stardestroyer.net/Nemesis/Pictorial-1.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anime52k8 Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 >snip< You shut you're mouth, heathen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myk Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Oh come on!.!.! Excelsior?!?! Lets be realistic here. Defiant at best! In all honesty I think "photon torpedo" would be generous, lol! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommar Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 The fly over looked like F-14s hopfully they are only atmospheric craft. Liked that small fighters were absent in the Star Trek universe and all the battles were capital ships. The two fights in Wrath of Khan were the best. Nah, they were wedge-shaped but definitely nothing like an F-14. And Star Trek always had some sort of small Shuttle Craft that could double for fighters at fly-overs pretty easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mog Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Yes you can: http://www.stardestr...ictorial-1.html You bring up that even-numbered turd, Nemesis? I'll raise you "What does 'God' need with a starship?" Despite my mocking, I still personally like my Trek with a heavy dose of DS9, the Defiant, and its large set of well-developed cast and recurring characters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fly4victory Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Why does God need a starship? Besides the barrier really wasn't much of a threat, ion storms in TOS were rougher. I just think Spock would have asked first not Kirk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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