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1 minute ago, ManhattanProject972 said:

Are the Grand Cannons still active even after all this time?

Probably not.

Of the five Grand Cannons that were planned, only Alaska's Grand Cannon I is known to have been completed and brought online.  Grand Cannon I was, as we all know, badly damaged in the orbital bombardment by the Boddole Zer main fleet and only managed to fire once.

Grand Cannon II's construction site in Australia was destroyed in an Anti-Unification Alliance attack shortly after the Tsiolkovsky incident in 2005.  It was never completed.

The incomplete Grand Cannon III in Africa and Grand Cannon V in South America served as shelters during the Boddole Zer main fleet's attack, but they were incomplete at the time and probably were damaged further (possibly beyond repair) in the bombardment.

Grand Cannon IV in the Lunar north pole region is the only real candidate for a postwar completion, though the resources to finish it probably wouldn't have been available when rebuilding Earth was a top priority.  The nearby Apollo Base in the Mare Tranquillitatis survived the war basically intact and its adjoining colony is still inhabited, so it may have been finished at least for its command center.

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Adding to that, the orbital defense satellites we saw in Plus would seem to imply there's not any terrestrial Grand Cannons at that point in time, since a GC would tear all kinds of holes in that satellite network.

... 

Also they didn't use one on the vajra at the end of Frontier, despite showing them making a clear and impressive threat on the Earth.

 

All circumstantial evidence, admittedly, but suggestive nonetheless.

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16 hours ago, JB0 said:

Adding to that, the orbital defense satellites we saw in Plus would seem to imply there's not any terrestrial Grand Cannons at that point in time, since a GC would tear all kinds of holes in that satellite network.

Not necessarily a deal-breaker since Grand Cannon systems were meant to be weapons of the last resort... but then, they were originally intended to be used in conjunction with an orbital fleet that filled the same role as the defense satellites.  

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57 minutes ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Not necessarily a deal-breaker since Grand Cannon systems were meant to be weapons of the last resort... but then, they were originally intended to be used in conjunction with an orbital fleet that filled the same role as the defense satellites.  

So based on that train of thought , most ,if not all,of the defense  satellites would have to be destroyed ,(including any fleet ships in orbit ) before something like a grand Cannon would be deployed?

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Soon, it is gonna be on a new release with a new Ranka song and a duet of them as well.

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I wrote that before coming home from work, here is more info about the single release: https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/interest/2018-07-21/macross-frontier-sheryl-ranka-release-1st-new-single-in-7-years/.134512

As said it comes out Sept 26 and has the new songs "Good Job!" and "Ranka to Brand New Peach" (it's what the site says..) as well as "Gooorgeous."

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  • 2 weeks later...
30 minutes ago, kajnrig said:

What is the canon spelling of Lynn Minmay? I think I'm getting it mixed up with Robotech, but do Macross ever deviate from the above spelling? Linn Minmei? Lyn Min-mei?

"Lynn Minmay" is the official spelling that's used in the original Super Dimension Fortress Macross TV series and all subsequent works, as well as in pretty much all the merchandise (even in-universe, like Hikaru's poster of her that Misa turns upside-down).

The only deviation I can recall is in Super Dimension Fortress Macross episode 5 "Transformation", on the sign on Minmay's bedroom door.  Since she's living in her aunt and uncle's place over the Nyan-Nyan Chinese restaurant, the sign on her bedroom door fittingly uses the Chinese romanization for her name: "Minmei".  (The letter addressed to her from "Olion Records" she shows to Hikaru in that same scene is addressed to "Miss Lynn Minmay", though.)

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Gonna try to cover two birds with one stone here. 

Concerning Macross Plus and Macross Zero, did either one of those OVAs have a pre existing manga or hobby magazine story or feature?

I'm pretty familiar with all of the content and merchandise after the fact, but what (if any) stiories or , specific mecha designs were  out there before these became animation magic?

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1 hour ago, Bolt said:

Gonna try to cover two birds with one stone here. 

Concerning Macross Plus and Macross Zero, did either one of those OVAs have a pre existing manga or hobby magazine story or feature?

I'm pretty familiar with all of the content and merchandise after the fact, but what (if any) stiories or , specific mecha designs were  out there before these became animation magic?

I don't think either really, but I'm not the expert on that (he comes in later, lol, we know who I mean).

I do know however that Macross Plus was not originally a Macross title. Kawamori was writing a story to be something different (just happened to have transforming jet robots too I guess), but either couldn't secure funding or something else and basically agreed to make it a Macross thing to get it made, and everything else related to any sort of canon (not that SK really worries about such things) was filled in after the fact. This is why M+ ends up being so unique in Macross stories... it wasn't written to really be Macross at all.

Edited by Master Dex
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18 minutes ago, Master Dex said:

I don't think either really, but I'm not the expert on that (he comes in later, lol, we know who I mean).

I do know however that Macross Plus was not originally a Macross title. Kawamori was writing a story to be something different (just happened to have transforming jet robots too I guess), but either couldn't secure funding or something else and basically agreed to make it a Macross thing to get it made, and everything else related to any sort of canon (not that SK really worries about such things) was filled in after the fact. This is why M+ ends up being so unique in Macross stories... it wasn't written to really be Macross at all.

Haha! Ya, I think I know who you mean..

How could Kawamori San possible write something even remotely about transforming jet robots and not feel the tug of Macross destiny!?

I don't think either, as well..but I'm very curious. 

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10 hours ago, Bolt said:

How could Kawamori San possible write something even remotely about transforming jet robots and not feel the tug of Macross destiny!?

I don't think either, as well..but I'm very curious. 

Well this was before M7 (though only just slightly) which was his true return to Macross in his eyes. Before Plus was Macross II which didn't involve Kawamori at all. So he'd been out of the franchise since DYRL basically. It was just that one show and a movie at the time, not this massive franchise we see today. 

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13 hours ago, Bolt said:

Concerning Macross Plus and Macross Zero, did either one of those OVAs have a pre existing manga or hobby magazine story or feature?

I'm pretty familiar with all of the content and merchandise after the fact, but what (if any) stiories or , specific mecha designs were  out there before these became animation magic?

Macross Plus started its development shortly after Macross: Do You Remember Love? came out, as a non-Macross project with the working title of Advanced Valkyrie.  The plot was basically Macross Plus's minus the crazy AI angle, but the mechanical designs for the project were not the ones that went into the final OVA.  Bandai ultimately withdrew their support of the project, and when Shoji Kawamori was invited back to Macross around the 10th anniversary Advanced Valkyrie was one of the two pitches he made for his next Macross feature.

The designs he made for Advanced Valkyrie would be adopted into Macross in a rather scattershot manner, with the VA-3 coming into the franchise via Macross Dynamite 7, and the VF-9 and VF-3000 coming in via the video games of the late 90's and early 00's.  Many of the rest were only formally adopted into the Macross universe with Macross Chronicle.

 

11 hours ago, Bolt said:

Haha! Ya, I think I know who you mean..

How could Kawamori San possible write something even remotely about transforming jet robots and not feel the tug of Macross destiny!?

I don't think either, as well..but I'm very curious. 

Because he didn't want to do sequels.  After Flash Back 2012, the animated realization of material originally planned for the final episode of Super Dimension Fortress MacrossMacross was over and done with as far as he was concerned.

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I watched Macross Frontier as the episodes were released way back in 2008. Aside from SDF Macross and Macross Plus, it's really the only other Macross content I have enjoyed. That said, after watching the show I remember being very confused as to what actually just happened. The link between Ranka and the Vajra and the subterfuge with Grace and the Galaxy Fleet....it was all a bit much and to this day I don't really remember what the heck actually happened. (The surfing Macross Quarter probably rendered me dumb-struck, wrecking any chance of comprehension I could've managed).

Anyways, fast-forward to last week and I finally got around to watching the two Macross Frontier movies. I watched them both and was like "Okay....I'm pretty sure this is NOT how the show did it". Sure enough, I went back and watched the last episode (of the show) and it is completely different.

I am pretty dang confused now, so I'm asking for help. I know that the Macross movies are basically "retellings" of the original shows, so I won't get too hung up on the difference in the Macross F movies vs show. However, if someone could point me to a website/blog post/forum thread that gives a basic overview of the story for Macross F, specifically the whole Ranka/Vajra/Grace/Galaxy Fleet thing, I would REALLY appreciate it.

I really enjoyed Macross Frontier...but I wish Macross would get back to the simpler storylines of SDF Macross and Macross Plus. At least those I could understand.

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1 hour ago, ShadowVFX said:

I watched Macross Frontier as the episodes were released way back in 2008. Aside from SDF Macross and Macross Plus, it's really the only other Macross content I have enjoyed. That said, after watching the show I remember being very confused as to what actually just happened.

In before the merge into the Newbie and Short Questions thread...

That said, this isn't a question we get very often.  Frontier is usually lauded for the strength of its writing.

 

1 hour ago, ShadowVFX said:

The link between Ranka and the Vajra and the subterfuge with Grace and the Galaxy Fleet....it was all a bit much and to this day I don't really remember what the heck actually happened. (The surfing Macross Quarter probably rendered me dumb-struck, wrecking any chance of comprehension I could've managed).

So... to summarize the plot here:  (I don't think this really merits spoiler tags since the series is ten years old, but I'll do it anyway.)

Spoiler

Back in 2048, the New UN Government's 117th Research Fleet under Dr. Mao Nome was destroyed while on a mission to study a recently-discovered insectoid alien species in the galactic core known as the Vajra.  One of the fleet's leading researchers had made some headway in understanding the way the Vajra's collective consciousness worked as species-wide faster-than-light communication network and theorized about ways to apply this principle to humanity as a way of achieving the ancient Protoculture's ambition of eradicating internal conflict in their society.  She deliberately infected Ranka's mother, Ranshe Mei with the bacterium that was found to be the core mechanism behind the Vajra collective consciousness while she was pregnant in order to produce a test subject who would be able to natively communicate the same way the Vajra do.  Other, later test subjects included Mao Nome's orphaned granddaughter Sheryl Nome, who was infected with the (lethal) bacterium as a child.

Botched tests occur, the Vajra destroy the fleet in an effort to liberate what they think is a Vajra that's being held captive (Ranka).  Ranka is, of course, traumatized to such an insane degree that she develops amnesia, and is taken in by one of the New UN Spacy fighter pilots who had been unable to defend the fleet: Ozma Lee.

With the support of the Macross Galaxy emigrant fleet, a flying laboratory where the General Galaxy corporation conducts R&D on bleeding-edge technology, Grace O'Connor plans to implement a galaxy-wide cybernetic human hive mind that will link all of humanity into a collective consciousness, thus eliminating internal strife.  The fleet plans to hijack the body of a Vajra Queen to serve as the nexus of their implant network, developing a new variable fighter to oppose the Vajra and converting their fleet's population into cyborgs who can be mind controlled to further their agenda.  With Ranka having fallen off the radar due to her adoption, the false queen test subject (Fairy 9) that was the center of Grace's plan was Sheryl Nome, whom Grace raised to become an idol singer (as the Vajra communication is roughly analogous to song).

 

In the present day of 2059, hit idol Sheryl Nome's tour takes her to one of the other emigrant fleets nearing Vajra space, Macross Frontier.  The Vajra, picking up on the fold waves emitted by Ranka Lee because she was host to the v-type bacterium, detect her songs as Vajra communication and stage a raid on the fleet to try and rescue her, as they assume she is a Vajra.  (At this point they don't seem to understand that humans are intelligent, since the two species are so wildly different.)  This leads to the Frontier fleet deploying its latest generation fighter to repel the attack, the death of one of the PMC test pilots, and a student from the fleet's top vocational school (Alto Saotome) taking over his fighter in medias res to rescue Ranka from the Vajra who are trying to rescue her from him.

 

Alto is successful in saving her, which leads to the Vajra trying several more times to rescue her, which becomes a war between the Macross Frontier fleet and the Vajra hive (from the humans perspective anyway).  During the kerfuffle, the Macross Galaxy fleet discovers that Ranka is in fact still alive and living there, and move to reclaim her to be their artificial Vajra Queen to help them take over a genuine one.  They also do a lot to stir up anxiety towards the Vajra among the Frontier fleet's citizens and government to ensure that the Frontier fleet will unwittingly make things easier for their takeover plan by occupying the Vajra's attention.  Ranka, meanwhile, discovers that the Vajra aren't actually hostile when she finds a hatchling and keeps it as a pet (Ai-kun), leading to her fleeing the fleet with a Macross Galaxy pilot to make contact with the Vajra on her own in the hopes of securing peace, at which point the Macross Galaxy fleet is able to seize her.  SMS goes rogue and discovers the wreckage of the 117th Research Fleet and the implant network plan that Grace was pursuing behind the scenes.

 

Having taken a pounding, the Macross Frontier fleet concludes that the only inhabitable planet in range is the one the Vajra hive is currently on and decide to force a landing there before the artificial environment in their ship can break down completely due to battle damage.  This leads to them finding Macross Galaxy's forces parked in orbit and Grace taking over the body of the hive's queen to create her cybernetic human hive mind and force everyone to join it by using the Vajra as her soldiers.  SMS returns in a big damn heroes moment to reveal Grace's big plan to essentially make herself and the Galaxy fleet executives the higher-tier entities in the hive mind and thus de facto rulers of the galaxy, as well as naming some traitors inside the Frontier fleet who'd collaborated with her on it.  Grace's plot is foiled when Ranka breaks free of the Galaxy fleet's mind control and is rescued by Alto, freeing the Vajra from her control... at which point they join the Frontier fleet in opposing the Macross Galaxy fleet.  The Macross Galaxy fleet is routed, the Vajra Queen's head is blown off (disconnecting Grace and destroying her fold network) and Alto shoots her with a big damn railgun while the colony ship lands on the Vajra planet.  The Vajra finally understand, via Ranka and a terminally ill Sheryl's songs, that humans are intelligent and resolve to bugger off and leave humanity to its own devices, and the entire hive vacates the planet to go to another galaxy.

Trying to keep it short and roughly in-continuity, but it should make things reasonably clear.

 

 

1 hour ago, ShadowVFX said:

Anyways, fast-forward to last week and I finally got around to watching the two Macross Frontier movies. I watched them both and was like "Okay....I'm pretty sure this is NOT how the show did it". Sure enough, I went back and watched the last episode (of the show) and it is completely different.

Yep, like Macross: Do You Remember Love? did for the original series, the Macross Frontier movies are a fairly different riff on the plot.

 

 

1 hour ago, ShadowVFX said:

I am pretty dang confused now, so I'm asking for help. I know that the Macross movies are basically "retellings" of the original shows, so I won't get too hung up on the difference in the Macross F movies vs show. However, if someone could point me to a website/blog post/forum thread that gives a basic overview of the story for Macross F, specifically the whole Ranka/Vajra/Grace/Galaxy Fleet thing, I would REALLY appreciate it.

You could read the plot summaries on MAHQ, I guess?

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27 minutes ago, Bolt said:

Well summarized !

There are a few plots and twists in Macross F that didn't get enough attention (for me), so thanks for filling in the gaps!

At some point, I wanna polish my translation skills to the point that I can tackle the audio dramas... I have copies of the Macross Frontier ones, and I've heard they contain some fairly interesting stuff that isn't in the show, like Grace coming to the realization that she's started to genuinely care about Sheryl after looking after her for 11 years and having to edit her own personality in order to continue using Sheryl as a tool.

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16 hours ago, Seto Kaiba said:

In before the merge into the Newbie and Short Questions thread...

That said, this isn't a question we get very often.  Frontier is usually lauded for the strength of its writing.

 

So... to summarize the plot here:  (I don't think this really merits spoiler tags since the series is ten years old, but I'll do it anyway.)

  Reveal hidden contents

Back in 2048, the New UN Government's 117th Research Fleet under Dr. Mao Nome was destroyed while on a mission to study a recently-discovered insectoid alien species in the galactic core known as the Vajra.  One of the fleet's leading researchers had made some headway in understanding the way the Vajra's collective consciousness worked as species-wide faster-than-light communication network and theorized about ways to apply this principle to humanity as a way of achieving the ancient Protoculture's ambition of eradicating internal conflict in their society.  She deliberately infected Ranka's mother, Ranshe Mei with the bacterium that was found to be the core mechanism behind the Vajra collective consciousness while she was pregnant in order to produce a test subject who would be able to natively communicate the same way the Vajra do.  Other, later test subjects included Mao Nome's orphaned granddaughter Sheryl Nome, who was infected with the (lethal) bacterium as a child.

Botched tests occur, the Vajra destroy the fleet in an effort to liberate what they think is a Vajra that's being held captive (Ranka).  Ranka is, of course, traumatized to such an insane degree that she develops amnesia, and is taken in by one of the New UN Spacy fighter pilots who had been unable to defend the fleet: Ozma Lee.

With the support of the Macross Galaxy emigrant fleet, a flying laboratory where the General Galaxy corporation conducts R&D on bleeding-edge technology, Grace O'Connor plans to implement a galaxy-wide cybernetic human hive mind that will link all of humanity into a collective consciousness, thus eliminating internal strife.  The fleet plans to hijack the body of a Vajra Queen to serve as the nexus of their implant network, developing a new variable fighter to oppose the Vajra and converting their fleet's population into cyborgs who can be mind controlled to further their agenda.  With Ranka having fallen off the radar due to her adoption, the false queen test subject (Fairy 9) that was the center of Grace's plan was Sheryl Nome, whom Grace raised to become an idol singer (as the Vajra communication is roughly analogous to song).

 

In the present day of 2059, hit idol Sheryl Nome's tour takes her to one of the other emigrant fleets nearing Vajra space, Macross Frontier.  The Vajra, picking up on the fold waves emitted by Ranka Lee because she was host to the v-type bacterium, detect her songs as Vajra communication and stage a raid on the fleet to try and rescue her, as they assume she is a Vajra.  (At this point they don't seem to understand that humans are intelligent, since the two species are so wildly different.)  This leads to the Frontier fleet deploying its latest generation fighter to repel the attack, the death of one of the PMC test pilots, and a student from the fleet's top vocational school (Alto Saotome) taking over his fighter in medias res to rescue Ranka from the Vajra who are trying to rescue her from him.

 

Alto is successful in saving her, which leads to the Vajra trying several more times to rescue her, which becomes a war between the Macross Frontier fleet and the Vajra hive (from the humans perspective anyway).  During the kerfuffle, the Macross Galaxy fleet discovers that Ranka is in fact still alive and living there, and move to reclaim her to be their artificial Vajra Queen to help them take over a genuine one.  They also do a lot to stir up anxiety towards the Vajra among the Frontier fleet's citizens and government to ensure that the Frontier fleet will unwittingly make things easier for their takeover plan by occupying the Vajra's attention.  Ranka, meanwhile, discovers that the Vajra aren't actually hostile when she finds a hatchling and keeps it as a pet (Ai-kun), leading to her fleeing the fleet with a Macross Galaxy pilot to make contact with the Vajra on her own in the hopes of securing peace, at which point the Macross Galaxy fleet is able to seize her.  SMS goes rogue and discovers the wreckage of the 117th Research Fleet and the implant network plan that Grace was pursuing behind the scenes.

 

Having taken a pounding, the Macross Frontier fleet concludes that the only inhabitable planet in range is the one the Vajra hive is currently on and decide to force a landing there before the artificial environment in their ship can break down completely due to battle damage.  This leads to them finding Macross Galaxy's forces parked in orbit and Grace taking over the body of the hive's queen to create her cybernetic human hive mind and force everyone to join it by using the Vajra as her soldiers.  SMS returns in a big damn heroes moment to reveal Grace's big plan to essentially make herself and the Galaxy fleet executives the higher-tier entities in the hive mind and thus de facto rulers of the galaxy, as well as naming some traitors inside the Frontier fleet who'd collaborated with her on it.  Grace's plot is foiled when Ranka breaks free of the Galaxy fleet's mind control and is rescued by Alto, freeing the Vajra from her control... at which point they join the Frontier fleet in opposing the Macross Galaxy fleet.  The Macross Galaxy fleet is routed, the Vajra Queen's head is blown off (disconnecting Grace and destroying her fold network) and Alto shoots her with a big damn railgun while the colony ship lands on the Vajra planet.  The Vajra finally understand, via Ranka and a terminally ill Sheryl's songs, that humans are intelligent and resolve to bugger off and leave humanity to its own devices, and the entire hive vacates the planet to go to another galaxy.

Trying to keep it short and roughly in-continuity, but it should make things reasonably clear.

 

 

Yep, like Macross: Do You Remember Love? did for the original series, the Macross Frontier movies are a fairly different riff on the plot.

 

 

You could read the plot summaries on MAHQ, I guess?

Thanks for your replies. It was very helpful to read. Not sure why my post had to be merged here. It's not like my question was asked previously (or if it was, it sure wasn't easy to find via Google searches and MW forum searches). I assume it's because I have a low post count (even though I've been on this forum for a decade). Now if someone uses Google to find out wtf happened in Macross Frontier (like I did), they're not going to find anything since this is now buried in this thread. Oh well, not my problem I guess.

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39 minutes ago, ShadowVFX said:

Thanks for your replies. It was very helpful to read. Not sure why my post had to be merged here. It's not like my question was asked previously (or if it was, it sure wasn't easy to find via Google searches and MW forum searches). I assume it's because I have a low post count (even though I've been on this forum for a decade).

Nah, it's because this kind of straightforward question tends to get answered very quickly... so all questions of that type get merged here to spare the topic space for the really meaty questions we can dig into for tens of pages.

 

39 minutes ago, ShadowVFX said:

Now if someone uses Google to find out wtf happened in Macross Frontier (like I did), they're not going to find anything since this is now buried in this thread. Oh well, not my problem I guess.

Nah, the Google bot spiders this thread several times a day.  So do Bing, Baidu, Yahoo, and a couple others.  The keyword search on this forum software is also particularly robust.

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No, they do, I believe it’s not as effective as the VF-25’s or 31’s, but it’s there. You’re right though, the Windermereans are more naturally G-resistant than average humanoids anyway. 

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7 hours ago, ManhattanProject972 said:

Do the Sv-262's have inertia dampeners? 

With the Windermereans being more naturally resistant to G-forces is it really needed? 

And if it didn't have one, 

  Hide contents

how the heck was Mirage able to pilot one the way she did with out passing out?

 

It's that Zentraedi blood, no doubt.

I mean, also what Sildani said, but also alien blood, too.

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7 hours ago, ManhattanProject972 said:

Do the Sv-262's have inertia dampeners? 

Yes, the Dian Cecht SV Works Sv-262 Draken III has an Inertia Store Converter of excellent quality and performance.  

Its Shinsei/LAI ISC-TO21G Inertia Store Converter is the highest-rated ISC system thus far, able to buffer 30.8 G's.

 

Quote

With the Windermereans being more naturally resistant to G-forces is it really needed? 

They may be physically stronger and have faster reflexes than the longer-lived humanoids of the galaxy, but their insides are as squishy as the next guy's and their cardiopulmonary and respiratory systems aren't that much different from a human's.

Yeah, they absolutely needed it.

Even the Meltrandi, who were designed to be resistant to high g-forces, needed an inertia capacitor system in their Queadluun-Rau battle suits.

 

2 hours ago, Sildani said:

No, they do, I believe it’s not as effective as the VF-25’s or 31’s, but it’s there. You’re right though, the Windermereans are more naturally G-resistant than average humanoids anyway. 

Not sure where you'd have got the idea that it isn't as effective as the VF-25's or VF-31's... it's slightly better than the YF-29's.

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1 hour ago, Seto Kaiba said:

Yes, the Dian Cecht SV Works Sv-262 Draken III has an Inertia Store Converter of excellent quality and performance.  

Its Shinsei/LAI ISC-TO21G Inertia Store Converter is the highest-rated ISC system thus far, able to buffer 30.8 G's.

Well damn, if the 262's were so damn powerful and the Windermerean people having super reflexes, why did so many of them get shot down like fodder in the movie.

I guess proper training goes a long way.

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3 hours ago, ManhattanProject972 said:

Well damn, if the 262's were so damn powerful and the Windermerean people having super reflexes, why did so many of them get shot down like fodder in the movie.

I guess proper training goes a long way.

The show implies it is pretty much just lack of skill for anyone that isn't an aerial knight. It's shown a lot that NUNS pilots, historically cannon fodder, can beat them easily. This is why Windermere needed to use mind control. 

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2 hours ago, ManhattanProject972 said:

Well damn, if the 262's were so damn powerful and the Windermerean people having super reflexes, why did so many of them get shot down like fodder in the movie.

I guess proper training goes a long way.

The Sv-262 has a state-of-the-art Inertia Store Converter and its flight performance is above average for a 5th Generation main VF, but it's overspecialized as an atmospheric dogfighter to suit the traditionalist tastes of the Aerial Knights and Windermere IV's got very few (if any) pilots who have actual combat experience due to their short lifespans.

Having the latest fighter with the best specs doesn't give you that much of an advantage if your pilots don't have the experience and training to leverage those specs.

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I coulda sworn we had said in the Valkyrie Fun Facts thread that the 262 didn’t have as good an ISC as the 25, due to greater Windermerean resilience. I may have been off my meds though. 

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3 hours ago, blackconvoy_D01 said:

Huh? I thought the 29 was still the best of the best 

Well in terms of colony-grade fighters overall performance yes (Obviously anything the Federal NUNS fields is always gonna be tops, whether it be VF-24 or anything else they full spec). This is one thing another fighter beats the YF-29 in, but it does not mean the YF-29 is immediately less capable than the 262. Seto points out well that the 262 is way too overspecialized for aerial use. The YF-29 can work in all mediums to a crazily high powered degree even if it's ISC can't budget quite as much G's, lol. Good pilot will deal with it.

2 hours ago, Sildani said:

I coulda sworn we had said in the Valkyrie Fun Facts thread that the 262 didn’t have as good an ISC as the 25, due to greater Windermerean resilience. I may have been off my meds though. 

Could it be you were thinking of how we discussed the Drakken's Fold Reheat system is like a poor man's Fold Wave system that the YF-29 and VF-31s have? Has no bearing on pilot resilience but that much is a true thing at least.

Edited by Master Dex
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